Since it needs no further introduction, I give you the MPS masterpiece:

ehr400
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Britton, MI US
1/4/2013 11:14am
Plus you have to figure in where the top mount for the shock is located on the frame with respect to the Aluminum frame the shock came from. I am sure the location is different height wise.
125
Posts
374
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12/19/2012
Location
ZW
1/4/2013 11:26am
well, i guess at a minimum you can get the forks and triples on there. then you have a brake that will actually stop the bike, and triple clamps that might not be as choppered out as the old CRs were.
ehr400
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2613
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Britton, MI US
1/4/2013 11:46am
I would say the forks and triple clamps would rigid it up quite a bit. Never really liked the ergos of the steelys. I wish they would have progressed the 500 with the same frame/ geometry up to the '96 CR lineup. One of the best bikes I ever owned. '96 CR250
AJ
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921
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Lowell, IN US
1/4/2013 11:57am Edited Date/Time 1/4/2013 12:02pm
Who built the bike Robbie Maddison or whoever that was that jumped that record jump a few years ago? I'd trust that company.
AlisoBob wrote:
That was a S/H, built nothing like the production bikes they sell to the public. Its interesting that he never jumped it again and switched to...
That was a S/H, built nothing like the production bikes they sell to the public. Its interesting that he never jumped it again and switched to 4 strokes. It was a incredible bike.
Bob,
Its more interesting that after all theses years you tend to still spread rumor innuendo and out right misinformation intentionally. It wouldn't possibly be because you are friends with someone trying to compete with SH bikes would it?

You've had a huge axe to grind for a decade,about a product you don't own or care to own, why is any psychiatrist guess?

Overall any company getting into any forum debate ts a no win situation.
We have been making customs bikes since 1998, thousands of units around the world,
and have the reputation for quality that translates into our bikes resale value being the best
for an off road motorcycle of any manufactuer world wide.
That's really the only statement needed.


but i will clear up this fact.
(and I've told you this before on other forums you frequent)

Robbie Maddisons world record 500AF bike,(when he set the 350 some ft record in Australia)
is the same bike he jumped countless times and that he also jumped the football field on ESPN for their Red Bull New Years Eve deal a few years ago.

That world record bike, was ordered by Red Bill per Maddo, as a stock Service Honda 500AF
It had absolutely nothing down to it any different than every other regular customers of that same year and model.
Robbie went on to have it ported and of course suspension work done by his own mech and sponsors.
Then went out and set world records on it.
http://www.worldrecordacademy.com/sports/longest_motorcycle_jump_world_…


https://youtu.be/rjOYKpMeAUk

https://youtu.be/XGmYn24Eq6M


Notice those different jump dates ?
and i barely looked, there are plenty more, plus countless practice jumps..
.
Later on Maddo , wanted another 500AF, for a jump over the Corinth Canal.
He wanted white plastics and the the frame powder coated in metallic blue.

It was all very last minute and we did not have time to build one and get it to Greece by the jump date..
but i did have a customer that had ordered two bikes exactly like that, and had canceled one
(this customers wife or son had gotten ill I believe?)

So Robbie (and Red Bull) happily took that one.and jumped the Corinth canal.
On a bike built for just any regular customer,again nothing done special.

https://youtu.be/Rw1fxd_AkIw

Bob Higginson - I'm not anonymous here, and if you want to diss a product by intentional misinformation neither should you or your agenda be, along with your pal paul. .

As often as this happens to you, you might try not opening your mouth so wide and your foot wouldn't fit so easily.

The Shop

scooter5002
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Location
Nanton Alberta CA
1/4/2013 11:59am
Forks slide right into the triples, easy peasy, no mod required. CamP had to shim his, mine fit like the OEM Kayabas. The triples are probably a mil or 2 narrower, based on more thread sticking out of the "nut" end of the axle. If a guy was on a super tight budget, I'd buy the post 01 front end off E-Bay and ride happily ever after. Average fork prices range from 2 to 3 hundred. Axles and front wheel, away you go.
AJ
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Location
Lowell, IN US
1/4/2013 12:03pm
three9zero wrote:
Wow that sucks man.......I guess AJ from service is the way to go.....I have 3 friends/customers with his bikes and they stand the test of time...
Wow that sucks man.......I guess AJ from service is the way to go.....I have 3 friends/customers with his bikes and they stand the test of time, and abuse.
Thanks
jtomasik
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12899
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Location
Golden, CO US
1/4/2013 12:04pm
Thanks for throwing in, AJ. I hated sitting here watching your company take a beating without someone more reputable speaking up than just a simple AF owner like me (although I probably know a lot more about structural design, analysis, and manufacturing than many of these small shop guys). I'm just a single data point, which doesn't say much, regardless of my experience.

Bob, ya' lied about Madison's bike with the intent to deface Service Honda. Flat out. Pretty fucking nasty. Integrity is a huge thing to me. People like you disgust me. Not saying it to be mean. I am saying it because it's the truth.
scooter5002
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Nanton Alberta CA
1/4/2013 12:11pm
AJ, I'm glad you showed up, and it's fair to have your voice here. You have that right. HOWEVER, I've been informed by management to restrict this to an MPS thread. Bob has received the same notice, albeit it via PM. I've started this thread because people need to be warned about MPS' work. Yours does not fall into that category. If this escalates, this thread will get clipped, defeating the purpose of the original mission.
jtomasik
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Golden, CO US
1/4/2013 12:14pm Edited Date/Time 1/4/2013 12:14pm
AJ, I'm glad you showed up, and it's fair to have your voice here. You have that right. HOWEVER, I've been informed by management to restrict...
AJ, I'm glad you showed up, and it's fair to have your voice here. You have that right. HOWEVER, I've been informed by management to restrict this to an MPS thread. Bob has received the same notice, albeit it via PM. I've started this thread because people need to be warned about MPS' work. Yours does not fall into that category. If this escalates, this thread will get clipped, defeating the purpose of the original mission.
It's likely my fault he's here. My apologies to AJ for dragging him in to this, if I did.
yota
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Crystal River, FL US
1/4/2013 12:18pm
125 wrote:
if you have a chance, try putting the shock, swing arm and linkage from your 04 on to your steel CR500. Let me know if it...
if you have a chance, try putting the shock, swing arm and linkage from your 04 on to your steel CR500. Let me know if it fits.
ehr400 wrote:
I believe the diameter of the swing arm bolt is different size from the newer frame to the steel frame. Also I think the shock overall...
I believe the diameter of the swing arm bolt is different size from the newer frame to the steel frame. Also I think the shock overall length may be different too.
125 wrote:
shock length shouldnt matter if you switch all the linkage and swing arm over with it. Swing arm pivot would be the only dealbreaker.
not gonna happen.
fencepost
Posts
1189
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Location
T.O., CA US
1/4/2013 12:20pm
AJ, I'm glad you showed up, and it's fair to have your voice here. You have that right. HOWEVER, I've been informed by management to restrict...
AJ, I'm glad you showed up, and it's fair to have your voice here. You have that right. HOWEVER, I've been informed by management to restrict this to an MPS thread. Bob has received the same notice, albeit it via PM. I've started this thread because people need to be warned about MPS' work. Yours does not fall into that category. If this escalates, this thread will get clipped, defeating the purpose of the original mission.
Yes, and the original mission was for Mr scooter5002 to say the same thing over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over. Three years running. He's saving babies with this thread dont you see? You've made your point. Give it a rest dude.
scooter5002
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Nanton Alberta CA
1/4/2013 12:20pm Edited Date/Time 1/4/2013 12:25pm
AJ, I'm glad you showed up, and it's fair to have your voice here. You have that right. HOWEVER, I've been informed by management to restrict...
AJ, I'm glad you showed up, and it's fair to have your voice here. You have that right. HOWEVER, I've been informed by management to restrict this to an MPS thread. Bob has received the same notice, albeit it via PM. I've started this thread because people need to be warned about MPS' work. Yours does not fall into that category. If this escalates, this thread will get clipped, defeating the purpose of the original mission.
jtomasik wrote:
It's likely my fault he's here. My apologies to AJ for dragging him in to this, if I did.
That's totally fine, jtom. I've seen AJ and Bob go at it on banned, and those two have differing opinions. Bob sounded off here, AJ has the right to defend himself against ANY accusations, baseless or otherwise. That gutless wonder George couldn't face the fire, apparently. If anything I would suggest we start a new thread and AJ and Bob can discuss this openly, without risking this thread. I had no prior knowledge Bob was coming over, and as you can see, he just joined up here. He didn't even know about this site until I mentioned it a few months ago. THIS prompted his joining Vital.
CR500Rider
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Location
San Antonio, TX US
1/4/2013 12:21pm Edited Date/Time 1/4/2013 12:23pm
Lol. Exactly. My steel frame was HUGELY improved with putting the Showa Twin Chambers from my 04 on the front end. The overall performance was that...
Lol. Exactly. My steel frame was HUGELY improved with putting the Showa Twin Chambers from my 04 on the front end. The overall performance was that much and then some, with the ally frame. I qualify it as I hung on to the steely, I ride the ally frame. Although in the mid 90's, I definitely rode the bitch. However, I was in my low 30's.
125 wrote:
if you have a chance, try putting the shock, swing arm and linkage from your 04 on to your steel CR500. Let me know if it...
if you have a chance, try putting the shock, swing arm and linkage from your 04 on to your steel CR500. Let me know if it fits.
ehr400 wrote:
I believe the diameter of the swing arm bolt is different size from the newer frame to the steel frame. Also I think the shock overall...
I believe the diameter of the swing arm bolt is different size from the newer frame to the steel frame. Also I think the shock overall length may be different too.
The swingarm bolt is the same size on CR500s unless you have the earlier engines like my 87'.. I don't remember the exact year it changed.
scooter5002
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Nanton Alberta CA
1/4/2013 12:24pm
fencepost wrote:
Yes, and the original mission was for Mr scooter5002 to say the same thing over and over and over and over and over and over and...
Yes, and the original mission was for Mr scooter5002 to say the same thing over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over. Three years running. He's saving babies with this thread dont you see? You've made your point. Give it a rest dude.
You are entitled to your opinion, I have mine. As stated elsewhere, if you don't like it, don't read it. Wink No gun to your head forces your participation here.
jtomasik
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Golden, CO US
1/4/2013 12:36pm
That's totally fine, jtom. I've seen AJ and Bob go at it on banned, and those two have differing opinions. Bob sounded off here, AJ has...
That's totally fine, jtom. I've seen AJ and Bob go at it on banned, and those two have differing opinions. Bob sounded off here, AJ has the right to defend himself against ANY accusations, baseless or otherwise. That gutless wonder George couldn't face the fire, apparently. If anything I would suggest we start a new thread and AJ and Bob can discuss this openly, without risking this thread. I had no prior knowledge Bob was coming over, and as you can see, he just joined up here. He didn't even know about this site until I mentioned it a few months ago. THIS prompted his joining Vital.
Eh, shouldn't really concern me anyway. When I get another 500, it'll be from Service Honda. I'd love to Super Moto one of these things. Almost bought a used CR500AFX from a buddy. It was a steal, but I spent that money on another boat...lol. Anyway, a Supermoto 2-smoke 500 would be a blast. It'd be cool to chew up big bore street bikes with the thing. Check these out:

https://youtu.be/RJTuQrSbAfw


https://youtu.be/PIqrF47v92Q
AlisoBob
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Aliso Viejo, CA US
1/4/2013 12:43pm
jtomasik wrote:
Thanks for throwing in, AJ. I hated sitting here watching your company take a beating without someone more reputable speaking up than just a simple AF...
Thanks for throwing in, AJ. I hated sitting here watching your company take a beating without someone more reputable speaking up than just a simple AF owner like me (although I probably know a lot more about structural design, analysis, and manufacturing than many of these small shop guys). I'm just a single data point, which doesn't say much, regardless of my experience.

Bob, ya' lied about Madison's bike with the intent to deface Service Honda. Flat out. Pretty fucking nasty. Integrity is a huge thing to me. People like you disgust me. Not saying it to be mean. I am saying it because it's the truth.
No, I didnt lie.

AJ clearly stated Madison had his own motor and his own suspension on the bike and I have photos somewhere that I was sent of the bike showing that extra gussets were added to the bike. I'll dig them out.

Added up, that equals a custom bike, not a S/H off the show room floor which is what I stated. Theres no lie there.

Regading AJ and Service Honda.... here's what I'm saying in a nutshell.

AJ has been doing it longer than anyone, and Service Honda is the biggest name in the business. You would think that they would have the edge on everyone in regards to quality, innovation, and to keep their "lead" on everyone else.

Nope.

AJ is a hell of a nice guy, I've never heard anyone speak a cross word about him unlike George at MPS.

All I've ever said is that Service Honda should join the 21st centruy and stop hacking them together.

It appears the status quo shall remain .... and thats too bad.
scooter5002
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Nanton Alberta CA
1/4/2013 12:51pm
Bet the guy on that 1200 Kaw was a little shocked. Lol.
If AJs work has improved huge over the last 3 years, then there is no complaint. I would suggest that MPS' (using some peoples math) has not, and that's what's at issue here. Simply because you disagree with his construction methods does not merit a huge problem. If you don't like the product, don't buy it. Had I seen any of MPS' frame work before I owned the one I have now, this debate would not be taking place. Those red rags were very effective in concealing all the warts on his jobs. I chose not to buy one of AJs bikes based on what I'd seen personally, and some earlier model photos.
rallendude
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Adger, AL US
1/4/2013 12:53pm
Glad you showed up AJ. For those of you just spectating, this is regular fare over on both CR 500rider sites. No new news here.

Scooter, sorry you got hosed on the frame deal. It seems a common thread among the 500 builders. That Stoffers dude is doing some pretty work. But that is why I chose to go with a Service Honda. Solid reputation for many years of quality bikes.
jtomasik
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Golden, CO US
1/4/2013 12:54pm
Bet the guy on that 1200 Kaw was a little shocked. Lol. If AJs work has improved huge over the last 3 years, then there is...
Bet the guy on that 1200 Kaw was a little shocked. Lol.
If AJs work has improved huge over the last 3 years, then there is no complaint. I would suggest that MPS' (using some peoples math) has not, and that's what's at issue here. Simply because you disagree with his construction methods does not merit a huge problem. If you don't like the product, don't buy it. Had I seen any of MPS' frame work before I owned the one I have now, this debate would not be taking place. Those red rags were very effective in concealing all the warts on his jobs. I chose not to buy one of AJs bikes based on what I'd seen personally, and some earlier model photos.
Scooter, if I remember correctly, didn't you say you don't know how to TIG weld or have time to learn how?
scooter5002
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Nanton Alberta CA
1/4/2013 12:58pm
rallendude wrote:
Glad you showed up AJ. For those of you just spectating, this is regular fare over on both CR 500rider sites. No new news here. Scooter...
Glad you showed up AJ. For those of you just spectating, this is regular fare over on both CR 500rider sites. No new news here.

Scooter, sorry you got hosed on the frame deal. It seems a common thread among the 500 builders. That Stoffers dude is doing some pretty work. But that is why I chose to go with a Service Honda. Solid reputation for many years of quality bikes.
It's great that you got a product that you're happy with, and I'm happy for you. In your pics, it's a fine looking steed, and you've taken good care of it as well. In hindsight, I should have done things differently. Live and learn.
Apparently NOW, though, I get to sit back and watch the fur fly. Oh boy. Someone post up the Picard and Number 1 double face palm shot for me? Lol.
AJ
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Lowell, IN US
1/4/2013 12:59pm Edited Date/Time 1/4/2013 1:03pm
AJ clearly stated Madison had his own motor and his own suspension on the bike .


Alisobob it appears you have some weird axe to grind, and some goofy ideas,.
its the internet, that kind of thing is pretty common.

I clearly stated he had the engine, the stock one we put in , ported.
Porting is hardly something special?
do you not think we offer most any customer porting by whomever they want?

Robbies bike was ported by Pro Circuit I believe, but it could have been another source.
we 'd offer that as well.and suspension work

There was nothing particularly special about Maddos bike that wouldn't be done to any CRF450 he jumped.

On the Corinth canal bike, it again was stock other than powder coated.
Trigger Gums world record bike as well. a stocker other than porting or suspension work, that's pretty typical for a world record attempt.
Ryan Capes bike also , Deegans bike, Mike Metzgers, Scott Murrays.

We have built thousands of 500AF's 250AF's 125AF's etc, yet some random internet poster knows more about how we make them or what is done tio the Pros bikes specifically??

You seem to think you can make up anything on the internet for the audience, and make it reality.


No one else does. S/H SCABS onto 2" long stubbs they left sticking out of the foot peg pockets.


Another miss representation and out right falsehood.
The cradle is completely replaced ,there are no stubbs ,on any CRF250R based Service Honda 500AF and there has never been.

Opinions are one thing, outright lying about the way a product is made, is something you should have the integrity to avoid.

I'll leave you to your opinion, on all products across the world, the world according to *bob*

Smile
scooter5002
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Nanton Alberta CA
1/4/2013 1:01pm
jtomasik wrote:
Scooter, if I remember correctly, didn't you say you don't know how to TIG weld or have time to learn how?
Correct on both counts, jtom. I can MIG steel okay, if I stay on it, but that's it. I can tell the difference between a nice weld and a shitty one though. The welds on mine certainly aren't textbook. Lol.
jtomasik
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Golden, CO US
1/4/2013 1:12pm Edited Date/Time 1/4/2013 1:15pm
Correct on both counts, jtom. I can MIG steel okay, if I stay on it, but that's it. I can tell the difference between a nice...
Correct on both counts, jtom. I can MIG steel okay, if I stay on it, but that's it. I can tell the difference between a nice weld and a shitty one though. The welds on mine certainly aren't textbook. Lol.
Maybe. I can do a lay-wire technique with TIG that looks absolutely stunning, but the weld is actually relatively weak. It's intentionally a cold weld to prevent suck-back on metals that have low thermal conductive coefficients, like stainless and cast iron (like manifolds). Point is, some aluminum TIG welds might not have pretty freeze lines, but that doesn't make them structurally unsound. Fillet welds can be pretty sloppy but still work. Open root stuff is much more touchy, especially on tube where you have to weld in many different positions (vert up, vert down, overhead, etc.).

Maybe I'm more of a 'sleeper' fan. What I mean is that appearance means little, and I'd rather have more function than flash. With a dirt bike, I have even less interest in aesthetics. Hell, the only thing I see is the front fender when I get sloppy or tired riding and stop looking forward like I should.

Now, I'm not saying MPS did a good job. Just the simple fact that you had to grind things away to get the engine to fit is adequate to be rightfully pissed off. I'm just trying to separate aesthetics from function in this thread. A weld with a bunch of undercut or inclusions is one thing...but lacking freeze lines may not matter. Not sure what you saw from the SH bike that turned you off so much. Hell, you might've told me but with all of the discussion that's transpired in this thread I've forgotten...lol.
scooter5002
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Nanton Alberta CA
1/4/2013 1:19pm Edited Date/Time 1/4/2013 1:23pm
Lol. No doubt. My fab guy said the MPS welds were fine, insofar as strength, penetration and integrity. Again, at 47 years experience, I'll take his word. He's welded up a lot of stuff for me over the years, and his work is flawless. Aluminum or steel. When it's done, it's perfect. Craftsman. That the word to describe his stuff. I can weld my own steel, but when it needs to be perfect cosmetically, it goes to him.
The SH welds and construction looked average, and I just didn't like the construction, for the price. I also already had two complete bikes, and lacked the 12G US to buy a whole bike. Which I didn't need.
jtomasik
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Golden, CO US
1/4/2013 1:25pm Edited Date/Time 1/4/2013 1:27pm
Lol. No doubt. My fab guy said the MPS welds were fine, insofar as strength, penetration and integrity. Again, at 47 years experience, I'll take his...
Lol. No doubt. My fab guy said the MPS welds were fine, insofar as strength, penetration and integrity. Again, at 47 years experience, I'll take his word. He's welded up a lot of stuff for me over the years, and his work is flawless. Aluminum or steel. When it's done, it's perfect. Craftsman. That the word to describe his stuff. I can weld my own steel, but when it needs to be perfect cosmetically, it goes to him.
The SH welds and construction looked average, and I just didn't like the construction, for the price. I also already had two complete bikes, and lacked the 12G US to buy a whole bike. Which I didn't need.
I paid about $6500 for mine, if I remember right. It's been 4 years ago.

The MPS welds looked structurally ok, except you had to grind half of them away to get your engine to fit, and that created stress risers in that area. Did you actually assemble that frame and ride that thing?
GrapeApe
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Mc Kinney, TX US
Fantasy
806th
1/4/2013 1:33pm
rallendude wrote:
Glad you showed up AJ. For those of you just spectating, this is regular fare over on both CR 500rider sites. No new news here. Scooter...
Glad you showed up AJ. For those of you just spectating, this is regular fare over on both CR 500rider sites. No new news here.

Scooter, sorry you got hosed on the frame deal. It seems a common thread among the 500 builders. That Stoffers dude is doing some pretty work. But that is why I chose to go with a Service Honda. Solid reputation for many years of quality bikes.
Amazing that there are apparently 2 CR500 sites (really?) where this turd of a thread could be dropped, yet it's taking up room on the front page of a website dedicated to a sport that is having its "Daytona 500" this weekend.

Scooter, the saving the world rhetoric is nauseating you're just grinding an axe.
scooter5002
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Nanton Alberta CA
1/4/2013 1:35pm
Yes, I have about 20 hours or less on it. Got it done in October 11 in a spell of anger when my trusty 93 let me down. Got mad, finished it off, and rode it twice before years end. Rode it some this year , but I was busy working. Seems to be okay stucturally, but it's an embarrassment in public. Guys look at it and say nothing. What's THAT tell you? Lol.
jtomasik
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Golden, CO US
1/4/2013 1:40pm
Them not looking at it tells me little. Hell, probably over 75% of the people I come across at the track have zero clue what my bike is. I'd bet most think it's some old guy's antiquated 250 smoker. The decals are worn off in the area where it said '500', so I'm pretty sure most are clueless and wouldn't know a 500 engine to save their life.

But you riding it tells me you're nuts. After grinding away over half of the welds on some of those mounts, I'd keep a damn close eye on it. A bike coming apart on you on the track probably isn't the best experience.
TerryK
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CA
1/4/2013 1:50pm
AJ, I'm glad you showed up, and it's fair to have your voice here. You have that right. HOWEVER, I've been informed by management to restrict...
AJ, I'm glad you showed up, and it's fair to have your voice here. You have that right. HOWEVER, I've been informed by management to restrict this to an MPS thread. Bob has received the same notice, albeit it via PM. I've started this thread because people need to be warned about MPS' work. Yours does not fall into that category. If this escalates, this thread will get clipped, defeating the purpose of the original mission.
Not to worry. Now that AJ showed up to defend himself we'll be fine. Just keep it civil guys.

On that note, like AJ says, it appears Bob-o has a hidden agenda, even though he says he dosen't. Why else would anyone trash a guys work who in the same sentence he says is a great guy? I can see him being upset if, like Scooter, Bob-o had an issue with a bike he owned or bought from a builder, but he dosen't. it appears he's trying to discredit SHs work and pump up someone else's (his own?).

So which is it Bob-o, you buy some pile and want to blame someone, or are you trying to compete for sales? It must be one or the other, otherwise it makes no sense.
TerryK
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CA
1/4/2013 1:56pm Edited Date/Time 1/4/2013 1:56pm
GrapeApe wrote:
Amazing that there are apparently 2 CR500 sites (really?) where this turd of a thread could be dropped, yet it's taking up room on the front...
Amazing that there are apparently 2 CR500 sites (really?) where this turd of a thread could be dropped, yet it's taking up room on the front page of a website dedicated to a sport that is having its "Daytona 500" this weekend.

Scooter, the saving the world rhetoric is nauseating you're just grinding an axe.
The more people that chime in complaining about this thread the longer it stays on the front page. Seems that after 12 pages there's still quite a bit of interest in it.

Post a reply to: Since it needs no further introduction, I give you the MPS masterpiece:

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