Seattle Mudder: Are Idiotic Contraptions Inferior to Electric Simplicity?

Anonymous (not verified)
Posts
0
Joined
5/10/2021
Edited Date/Time 4/9/2018 7:13am
I wonder if an electric bike would have blown up, overheated, or fried a clutch tonight. Don't get me wrong, I love the drama that a bunch of spinning metal provides. I love overly complicated solutions, like someone setting up a series of unneeded events. Think dominoes falling into a maze, then a ball jumps out of nowhere and onto a sweet little crossbow that shoots it at a button to start a coffee maker. What could go wrong? Hopefully nothing, but it'd be fun to tinker with until it did work, just like an engine is. Smoking, revving without moving, spectacular breakdowns where something shoots out the cases and the like are awesome to see and even to experience if you aren't generally hot-headed. But....none of that crap would have happened on an Alta, right? Does this make Alta, notwithstanding the range issue, a better logical choice for the nastiest conditions? Is it, dare I say, a better DIRT bike since it doesn't have a crapload of mechanical things that render it useless when pushed hard?
|
Zacka 161
Posts
1075
Joined
7/30/2009
Location
Mount Waverley, VIC AU
Fantasy
2067th
4/7/2018 11:04pm
Could an electric bike somehow malfunction and electrify the standing water?
TbonesPop
Posts
3469
Joined
1/26/2010
Location
Gilbert, AZ US
Fantasy
321st
4/7/2018 11:09pm
As hard as the mud is on an engine, I'd bet the battery wouldn't have lasted through that race. Mud and sand drain power
JBernard_401
Posts
1320
Joined
10/29/2013
Location
Boulder, CO US
4/7/2018 11:16pm
Zacka 161 wrote:
Could an electric bike somehow malfunction and electrify the standing water?
I dont know. I think humans are still trying to figure out how to waterproof things. It may take another couple decades. You may want to check beck then. Maybe that modern marvel will be solved but who knows.

The Shop

Zacka 161
Posts
1075
Joined
7/30/2009
Location
Mount Waverley, VIC AU
Fantasy
2067th
4/7/2018 11:20pm
Zacka 161 wrote:
Could an electric bike somehow malfunction and electrify the standing water?
I dont know. I think humans are still trying to figure out how to waterproof things. It may take another couple decades. You may want to...
I dont know. I think humans are still trying to figure out how to waterproof things. It may take another couple decades. You may want to check beck then. Maybe that modern marvel will be solved but who knows.
I mean all the teams still wrap their electrics in plastic to stop the water getting in... waterproofing has gotten much better with electronics though, most new phones are completely waterproof
tkimb
Posts
198
Joined
3/22/2017
Location
CA
4/7/2018 11:24pm
Anonymous wrote:
I wonder if an electric bike would have blown up, overheated, or fried a clutch tonight. Don't get me wrong, I love the drama that a...
I wonder if an electric bike would have blown up, overheated, or fried a clutch tonight. Don't get me wrong, I love the drama that a bunch of spinning metal provides. I love overly complicated solutions, like someone setting up a series of unneeded events. Think dominoes falling into a maze, then a ball jumps out of nowhere and onto a sweet little crossbow that shoots it at a button to start a coffee maker. What could go wrong? Hopefully nothing, but it'd be fun to tinker with until it did work, just like an engine is. Smoking, revving without moving, spectacular breakdowns where something shoots out the cases and the like are awesome to see and even to experience if you aren't generally hot-headed. But....none of that crap would have happened on an Alta, right? Does this make Alta, notwithstanding the range issue, a better logical choice for the nastiest conditions? Is it, dare I say, a better DIRT bike since it doesn't have a crapload of mechanical things that render it useless when pushed hard?
In theory, I'd say yes. But all that mud adds more spinning, more weight, that equals more battery life being used.
B DUB 333
Posts
772
Joined
9/9/2010
Location
New Richland, MN US
4/7/2018 11:32pm
They should scotch guard the track....
4/7/2018 11:36pm
Man, at this age I'd rather have a dead battery than a blown engine. Maybe its just me.
JustMX
Posts
4621
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
TN US
4/8/2018 2:51am Edited Date/Time 4/8/2018 2:52am
Man, at this age I'd rather have a dead battery than a blown engine. Maybe its just me.
I just had a vision of the track safety crew attending safety meetings about the proper use of the jump box they will be carrying instead of having to hear about the technic to get the bike into neutral so vitards don't call them idiots
Graybeard
Posts
1077
Joined
11/25/2013
Location
Athens, TX US
Fantasy
2206th
4/8/2018 3:22am
Oh great, now we’re getting electric bike nazis. Why are internal combustion engines now idiotic contraptions? If electric bikes are good, they’ll take over. Until then, take a pill.
Derpin' DJ
Posts
6309
Joined
5/27/2011
Location
Newcastle AU
Fantasy
2803rd
4/8/2018 4:02am
It is an interesting question. The Altas go into power limiting mode when the battery gets too hot from prolonged high power output. But power is proportional to motor speed (to a point, then remains constant), and you'd have to think you'd only be up to midrange max during a race like this.
MR. X
Posts
6917
Joined
6/24/2010
Location
North Tonawanda, NY US
4/8/2018 4:22am
Graybeard wrote:
Oh great, now we’re getting electric bike nazis. Why are internal combustion engines now idiotic contraptions? If electric bikes are good, they’ll take over. Until then...
Oh great, now we’re getting electric bike nazis. Why are internal combustion engines now idiotic contraptions? If electric bikes are good, they’ll take over. Until then, take a pill.
It's just a discussion ,god forbid any discussion about new technology that is fast approaching down the pipe line . Someone should save a pill for you .
jasonward73
Posts
814
Joined
7/4/2009
Location
West Palm Beach, FL US
4/8/2018 4:30am
JustMX wrote:
I just had a vision of the track safety crew attending safety meetings about the proper use of the jump box they will be carrying instead...
I just had a vision of the track safety crew attending safety meetings about the proper use of the jump box they will be carrying instead of having to hear about the technic to get the bike into neutral so vitards don't call them idiots
Wtf would they have a jump box????

All the e start bikes already carry a battery as is. Now those might need a jump box in order to start the engine but a jump box won’t do shit for a battery powered bike.

Is Feld or the AMA providing special instructions for the e start bikes to the safety crew or flaggers?

observeroffacts
Posts
1028
Joined
9/16/2017
Location
Lake Owens, MO US
Fantasy
3725th
4/8/2018 4:36am
Graybeard wrote:
Oh great, now we’re getting electric bike nazis. Why are internal combustion engines now idiotic contraptions? If electric bikes are good, they’ll take over. Until then...
Oh great, now we’re getting electric bike nazis. Why are internal combustion engines now idiotic contraptions? If electric bikes are good, they’ll take over. Until then, take a pill.
MR. X wrote:
It's just a discussion ,god forbid any discussion about new technology that is fast approaching down the pipe line . Someone should save a pill for...
It's just a discussion ,god forbid any discussion about new technology that is fast approaching down the pipe line . Someone should save a pill for you .
Listen to MR X. He is correct.
gt80rider
Posts
6275
Joined
4/19/2008
Location
Boulder, CO US
4/8/2018 5:02am Edited Date/Time 4/8/2018 5:02am
TbonesPop wrote:
As hard as the mud is on an engine, I'd bet the battery wouldn't have lasted through that race. Mud and sand drain power
There is no engine in an electric bike. It does however have a motor. Yes, get ready for a whole lot of new terminology. Well, if our industry doesn't die before a plethora of electric bikes hit the market.
mx317
Posts
4561
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
TN US
4/8/2018 5:38am
TbonesPop wrote:
As hard as the mud is on an engine, I'd bet the battery wouldn't have lasted through that race. Mud and sand drain power
gt80rider wrote:
There is no engine in an electric bike. It does however have a motor. Yes, get ready for a whole lot of new terminology. Well, if...
There is no engine in an electric bike. It does however have a motor. Yes, get ready for a whole lot of new terminology. Well, if our industry doesn't die before a plethora of electric bikes hit the market.
Is this Hillbilly? JK he always corrected between the two even though I ride a motorcycle and not an enginecycle.
BobPA
Posts
8029
Joined
10/31/2013
Location
PA US
4/8/2018 6:51am
TbonesPop wrote:
As hard as the mud is on an engine, I'd bet the battery wouldn't have lasted through that race. Mud and sand drain power
gt80rider wrote:
There is no engine in an electric bike. It does however have a motor. Yes, get ready for a whole lot of new terminology. Well, if...
There is no engine in an electric bike. It does however have a motor. Yes, get ready for a whole lot of new terminology. Well, if our industry doesn't die before a plethora of electric bikes hit the market.
mx317 wrote:
Is this Hillbilly? JK he always corrected between the two even though I ride a motorcycle and not an enginecycle.
He tries to correct but does not know the actual definitions of either.
Johnny Depp
Posts
6438
Joined
10/16/2014
Location
Buda, TX US
4/8/2018 7:57am
An Alta would have been like cheating. Map 1 so no battery shortage. No radiators, clutch, shifting etc.

Up to now, I never had considered that potential advantage in those conditions, but wow.
yak651
Posts
6705
Joined
8/26/2006
Location
Appleton, WI US
Fantasy
192nd
4/8/2018 8:02am
The "engine" OEMs would be protesting the decision to shorten the races, hoping the Alta battery wouldn't make it the 12 minutes + 1
yak651
Posts
6705
Joined
8/26/2006
Location
Appleton, WI US
Fantasy
192nd
4/8/2018 8:03am
Now we are onto the real fear of DC. There is always at least one mud moto at LL, they are afraid of the Alta showing everyone up in that moto! (J/K - being sarcastic)
tcannon521
Posts
2606
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
HI US
Fantasy
1398th
4/8/2018 9:48am Edited Date/Time 4/8/2018 9:49am
Graybeard wrote:
Oh great, now we’re getting electric bike nazis. Why are internal combustion engines now idiotic contraptions? If electric bikes are good, they’ll take over. Until then...
Oh great, now we’re getting electric bike nazis. Why are internal combustion engines now idiotic contraptions? If electric bikes are good, they’ll take over. Until then, take a pill.
From an efficiency point of view they are compared to electric motors.

I have a feeling in the next 50 to 100 years civilization will judge us as idiotic for relying so heavily on such a harmful and inefficient power source.
Katoomey
Posts
1714
Joined
1/18/2013
Location
WY US
4/8/2018 9:50am
TbonesPop wrote:
As hard as the mud is on an engine, I'd bet the battery wouldn't have lasted through that race. Mud and sand drain power
gt80rider wrote:
There is no engine in an electric bike. It does however have a motor. Yes, get ready for a whole lot of new terminology. Well, if...
There is no engine in an electric bike. It does however have a motor. Yes, get ready for a whole lot of new terminology. Well, if our industry doesn't die before a plethora of electric bikes hit the market.
what, you think you're a genius because you know the difference between an engine and a motor? do you think that they just invented motors yesterday? electric motors are older than internal combustion...
4/8/2018 2:33pm
Graybeard wrote:
Oh great, now we’re getting electric bike nazis. Why are internal combustion engines now idiotic contraptions? If electric bikes are good, they’ll take over. Until then...
Oh great, now we’re getting electric bike nazis. Why are internal combustion engines now idiotic contraptions? If electric bikes are good, they’ll take over. Until then, take a pill.
Far from a nazi, friend. No agenda beyond a salacious title bringing the eyes either.

Of course they're idiotic contraptions. Isn't it obvious? Nothing wrong with that. Some problems are worth having. Not in a race though.
4/8/2018 2:39pm
Zacka 161 wrote:
Could an electric bike somehow malfunction and electrify the standing water?
One can always dream. How awesome would Plessinger's belly flop have been if he was electro-worming when he hit the water. Shoot, on a rainy day the electricity will shoot backward up the raindrops and into the entire stadium! That'll get butts off the seats.
ando
Posts
3062
Joined
8/20/2009
Location
Perth AU
4/8/2018 2:45pm Edited Date/Time 4/8/2018 2:47pm
Graybeard wrote:
Oh great, now we’re getting electric bike nazis. Why are internal combustion engines now idiotic contraptions? If electric bikes are good, they’ll take over. Until then...
Oh great, now we’re getting electric bike nazis. Why are internal combustion engines now idiotic contraptions? If electric bikes are good, they’ll take over. Until then, take a pill.
Internal combustion engines may have been refined a lot since their invention but as an engineering solution they aren’t very elegant or efficient.
4/8/2018 2:47pm
An Alta would have been like cheating. Map 1 so no battery shortage. No radiators, clutch, shifting etc. Up to now, I never had considered that...
An Alta would have been like cheating. Map 1 so no battery shortage. No radiators, clutch, shifting etc.

Up to now, I never had considered that potential advantage in those conditions, but wow.
Johnny gets it.

Even sans breakdown, not needing to shift would have been huge last night.
JustMX
Posts
4621
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
TN US
4/8/2018 8:17pm
JustMX wrote:
I just had a vision of the track safety crew attending safety meetings about the proper use of the jump box they will be carrying instead...
I just had a vision of the track safety crew attending safety meetings about the proper use of the jump box they will be carrying instead of having to hear about the technic to get the bike into neutral so vitards don't call them idiots
Wtf would they have a jump box???? All the e start bikes already carry a battery as is. Now those might need a jump box in...
Wtf would they have a jump box????

All the e start bikes already carry a battery as is. Now those might need a jump box in order to start the engine but a jump box won’t do shit for a battery powered bike.

Is Feld or the AMA providing special instructions for the e start bikes to the safety crew or flaggers?

Geez,

Saying this is going to get old, even if it is so applicable....

Lighten up francis.....

It was a freaking joke
Bearuno
Posts
4145
Joined
6/28/2014
Location
AU
4/8/2018 8:31pm Edited Date/Time 4/8/2018 8:32pm
"Infernal" Contraptions is what ICE vehicles (and steam driven powerplants) were labelled as, a long, long time ago. by many with views that tended towards the Luddite .

As for Electric Shocks in water / liquids with E Bikes - look to the vast amount of Electronics / E Motors that are submerged. Do it right, and you're OK - do it wrong and, you're not.
4/8/2018 8:37pm Edited Date/Time 4/8/2018 8:38pm
I swear people are getting dumber by the minute...

Anyone who has owned an alta long term will tell you they previously were very prone to heat issues.

A hard pro at a fast track that takes power (in prime conditions no mud) could overheat them in 3-4 laps and it would slow dramatically.

Almost ALL POWER usage by people is heat conversion. We take stored energy and convert it to useful work, and in the process it produces heat

So the alta... Would be prone to its own heat related failures

Ill never forget the day I set a top dollar electric rc car on fire just by driving it around for 20 minutes. Was an expensive moment that in a larger scale incident could have been deadly.
That car was problem free most its life and so are all of them on the market... Just wasnt its day

If we had 20 altas on the track, ill bet money at least 1 would have broken in some form or fashion

batteries dont have the power density even remotely close to that of gasoline and other fuels, and as such until they do, hydro carbons will still be used.

Cant fly planes long distance on a battery

Drone owners know this... And the market for drone generators using combustion engine is growing

Very soon electric will on par for avg guys. But it will have all its own issues.

4/8/2018 10:08pm
Luddite schmuddite. CoolWhistling

Harris has the best argument against electric so far. Suss all this crap out!

Post a reply to: Seattle Mudder: Are Idiotic Contraptions Inferior to Electric Simplicity?

The Latest