Ryno has no idea what he is talking about................. ****Clickbait Title****

Phil109
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7/27/2021 10:27am
I like Ryno’s insight and knowledge on all things moto. His view points may come off rather wacky at times and that’s fine. It causes good discussion and thought on these matters to help yourself make an educated decision on what is best for you personally. Without proper back and forth either way you don’t get the full side of either story. I am neither for nor against bracing. Wear what gives you the most confidence and comfort while riding.
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ZOSICK
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AZ US
7/27/2021 10:31am
I think Ryno is off his rocker at times with some of the stuff he is saying. I think from a fundamentals stand point, he is usually spot. I'm not sure how I feel about the neck brace argument. I use to wear one and now I don't. My kid has never worn on but some of his friends do. I use to wear knee braces and not I don't. I wear knee and shin guards. My son has been wearing Askerisks knee braces for years. In the end, I don't think there is a right or wrong answer. There are arguments for both side. Bottom line, I don't take medical advice from non doctors. That being said, not all doctors know what the hell they are talking about either. When you have someone who created a device that he makes money on, I'm sure he's not going to say that they don't work. and yes, Ryno does makes money off what he says, thinks and tells people. It's also his job to "help" people. In turn, he is paid by some for his advice/coaching. I have no doubt that he is a good coach and trainer. Just like I have no doubt that Dr. Leatt is a good doctor. Wear what you want. Some of us know the risk of riding. All you can do is prepare for the crash.
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GrapeApe
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7/27/2021 10:52am
McG194 wrote:
I'm honestly a little disappointed that no-one has given me the business about my thread title. I guess my joke was too subtle.......................Or maybe not funny...
I'm honestly a little disappointed that no-one has given me the business about my thread title. I guess my joke was too subtle.......................Or maybe not funny. Woohoo
I see an(other) idiotic thread based on a false premise, but not any humor. Better luck with your next one.
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McG194
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7/27/2021 11:01am
McG194 wrote:
I'm honestly a little disappointed that no-one has given me the business about my thread title. I guess my joke was too subtle.......................Or maybe not funny...
I'm honestly a little disappointed that no-one has given me the business about my thread title. I guess my joke was too subtle.......................Or maybe not funny. Woohoo
GrapeApe wrote:
I see an(other) idiotic thread based on a false premise, but not any humor. Better luck with your next one.
Ouch, if I had feelings they would be hurt.

Before I decide to jump off the nearest bridge and end it all can you tell me what the false premise is?

I simply made an observation that one of Ryno's biggest complaints have been addressed with the latest brace.

If you look at my posts I've never personally come out against braces. They are not for me as I have a stupid large neck and haven't found one that fits. If you like them and believe in their effectiveness go ahead and wear one. If you don't believe in them don't wear one. Freedom of choice is a beautiful thing.
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The Shop

EastFlorida
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Merritt Island, FL US
7/27/2021 11:56am
Well, I'm an Old Guy (OG) that still races. I wear a neck brace and just started wearing knee braces. Why? Because any minimal limitations these protective devices cause are offset by the benefit of potentially less sever injury.

I am NOT a Pro racer, so a little limitation is OK in exchange for a little more safety.

I race with the OP in Hare Scrambles with FTR down here in FL. I see lots of guys wearing even more protection than I do. To each his own, but don't rely on a Pro or Ex-Pro to tell you not to wear certain safety equipment because it may hurt your race performance.

That ONLY matters if you're racing for $$$ and are willing to pay the injury consequences.
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McG194
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7/27/2021 12:16pm
Well, I'm an Old Guy (OG) that still races. I wear a neck brace and just started wearing knee braces. Why? Because any minimal limitations these...
Well, I'm an Old Guy (OG) that still races. I wear a neck brace and just started wearing knee braces. Why? Because any minimal limitations these protective devices cause are offset by the benefit of potentially less sever injury.

I am NOT a Pro racer, so a little limitation is OK in exchange for a little more safety.

I race with the OP in Hare Scrambles with FTR down here in FL. I see lots of guys wearing even more protection than I do. To each his own, but don't rely on a Pro or Ex-Pro to tell you not to wear certain safety equipment because it may hurt your race performance.

That ONLY matters if you're racing for $$$ and are willing to pay the injury consequences.
True you are an old guy. LaughingLaughingLaughing I just want to see you at the races more.

As for the rest of the gear, I just can't get comfortable in knee braces. TP199 for me, I need new knees anyway. lol
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CKNY
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7/27/2021 12:18pm
Broken femurs and collarbones have accelerated during the brace era. Manufacturer's have business interest's to protect. Ryno has no financial interests and can speak freely.
CKNY wrote:
Show me the data to back up that claim.
McG194 wrote:
Why can't you just use logic? Force absolutely has to go somewhere. In a car they have sacrificial crumple zones to redirect force. On a motorcycle...
Why can't you just use logic?

Force absolutely has to go somewhere. In a car they have sacrificial crumple zones to redirect force. On a motorcycle we are the crumple zone. If we are rigid from the feet to above the knee where is that force going to go? Either in the femur or the hip.
Yeah no sorry man, logic doesn’t work that way. That is inference, assumption or opinion at the best.
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McG194
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7/27/2021 12:27pm
CKNY wrote:
Show me the data to back up that claim.
McG194 wrote:
Why can't you just use logic? Force absolutely has to go somewhere. In a car they have sacrificial crumple zones to redirect force. On a motorcycle...
Why can't you just use logic?

Force absolutely has to go somewhere. In a car they have sacrificial crumple zones to redirect force. On a motorcycle we are the crumple zone. If we are rigid from the feet to above the knee where is that force going to go? Either in the femur or the hip.
CKNY wrote:
Yeah no sorry man, logic doesn’t work that way. That is inference, assumption or opinion at the best.
So, if I'm wearing knee braces and my foot catches in a rut the force just dissipates but if I'm not wearing a knee brace there is enough torque to literally rip my leg off at the knee?
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7/27/2021 1:41pm Edited Date/Time 7/27/2021 9:52pm
The dude constantly says he “challenges science” but that’s bullshit….. he denies science, there is a big difference.

I have never heard him say things like “the studies assume impacts in this direction, here is my evidence saying they haven’t considered x” or “the studies assume x force into the spine, but I found this other medical journal saying motorcycle accidents typically result in x kN of force into the spine” that is what it means to challenge a study, I bet he hasn’t even read any of the studies, let alone understand them and challenge them.
He just rants and raves about bear traps, alpha energy and a bunch of other trash.

When it comes to “challenging the science” the dude is bringing a piece of cooked spaghetti to a gun fight.
He is like one of the guys that says the earth isn’t a globe because the horizon is flat from his back yard.

By all means, he doesn’t need to wear a brace, and nothing wrong with his opinion as such, but using a large platform to actively try to stop others wearing safety equipment without a shred of evidence is irresponsible.

Great rider, interesting character but a total loon when he rants about anything science related.
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CKNY
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7/27/2021 1:42pm Edited Date/Time 7/27/2021 3:58pm
McG194 wrote:
Why can't you just use logic? Force absolutely has to go somewhere. In a car they have sacrificial crumple zones to redirect force. On a motorcycle...
Why can't you just use logic?

Force absolutely has to go somewhere. In a car they have sacrificial crumple zones to redirect force. On a motorcycle we are the crumple zone. If we are rigid from the feet to above the knee where is that force going to go? Either in the femur or the hip.
CKNY wrote:
Yeah no sorry man, logic doesn’t work that way. That is inference, assumption or opinion at the best.
McG194 wrote:
So, if I'm wearing knee braces and my foot catches in a rut the force just dissipates but if I'm not wearing a knee brace there...
So, if I'm wearing knee braces and my foot catches in a rut the force just dissipates but if I'm not wearing a knee brace there is enough torque to literally rip my leg off at the knee?
Would you rather rip your leg off at the knee with no brace or break your leg? I have a lot of buddies that are ortho surgeons, some ride. Not one recommends no braces. Not one of them has any scientific proof they work or do not work. Same thing with neuro surgeons and neck braces.
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7/27/2021 2:18pm Edited Date/Time 7/27/2021 3:04pm
Broken femurs and collarbones have accelerated during the brace era. Manufacturer's have business interest's to protect. Ryno has no financial interests and can speak freely.
Even if that is true, (I have no idea if there is actual data to back up the statement) is it the braces? or the fact that we now ride motorcycles which have a lot more power, heavier, with better suspension allowing us to go much much faster. And kids are now taking bigger risks than ever on the track as the technique has also changed.
Watch a pro 125 race from 25 years ago, and compare it to a modern 250 race, it would be daft to expect injury rates to stay the same.
Correlation does not equal causation.

To prove your hypothesis that it is the braces causing the change in injury, you would need to compare riders using the same bikes on the same tracks etc.

Or it could be done with testing on cadavers, and using simulation tools. which to my understanding has happened
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7/27/2021 2:22pm
Broken femurs and collarbones have accelerated during the brace era. Manufacturer's have business interest's to protect. Ryno has no financial interests and can speak freely.
CKNY wrote:
Show me the data to back up that claim.
McG194 wrote:
Why can't you just use logic? Force absolutely has to go somewhere. In a car they have sacrificial crumple zones to redirect force. On a motorcycle...
Why can't you just use logic?

Force absolutely has to go somewhere. In a car they have sacrificial crumple zones to redirect force. On a motorcycle we are the crumple zone. If we are rigid from the feet to above the knee where is that force going to go? Either in the femur or the hip.
You are assuming the braces are infinitely stiff. They do bend somewhat and bending dissipates energy, and beyond that, you are right. It’s all about energy management, a good brace should direct the energy to a part of the “structure” that can absorb more energy, and ideally apply that energy to a wider area.

To my engineering knowledge, braces look like they are designed to do exactly that.
Bruce372
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7/27/2021 3:35pm
The dude constantly says he “challenges science” but that’s bullshit….. he denies science, there is a big difference. I have never heard him say things like...
The dude constantly says he “challenges science” but that’s bullshit….. he denies science, there is a big difference.

I have never heard him say things like “the studies assume impacts in this direction, here is my evidence saying they haven’t considered x” or “the studies assume x force into the spine, but I found this other medical journal saying motorcycle accidents typically result in x kN of force into the spine” that is what it means to challenge a study, I bet he hasn’t even read any of the studies, let alone understand them and challenge them.
He just rants and raves about bear traps, alpha energy and a bunch of other trash.

When it comes to “challenging the science” the dude is bringing a piece of cooked spaghetti to a gun fight.
He is like one of the guys that says the earth isn’t a globe because the horizon is flat from his back yard.

By all means, he doesn’t need to wear a brace, and nothing wrong with his opinion as such, but using a large platform to actively try to stop others wearing safety equipment without a shred of evidence is irresponsible.

Great rider, interesting character but a total loon when he rants about anything science related.
It's "alfa".... this is the same alfa male that got his ass kicked by a teenage boy.

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viking174
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7/27/2021 4:26pm
McGrath wore knee braces and won more races than anyone in supercross. The goat wore them as well right?
Didn’t James Stewart wear knee braces too? Doesn’t ken roczen as well... mr fluidity’
Villapoto’ neck braces , millsaps’ and many others..
Does it slightly hinder some range of
Motion , sure. Does it keep you from being the best ??
Apparently not.
Ryno .. blah blah blah
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smoothies862
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7/27/2021 5:11pm Edited Date/Time 7/27/2021 5:13pm
All i can add is my trauma surgeon saw the bruising from my brace (everywhere the brace made contact with its legs) and said it saved me. I am fused t1-6. The brace kept from my spine compressing even more. He said millimeters from paralysis. He also added which is why im not riding now, 75% with my injuries are no longer with us. Vertebrae in pieces. Neck so swollen and bruised. I’ll roll with the trauma surgeon at one of the top places in the country. Sorry ryno. it was an atlas
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Johnny Depp
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7/27/2021 6:42pm
Broken femurs and collarbones have accelerated during the brace era. Manufacturer's have business interest's to protect. Ryno has no financial interests and can speak freely.
Even if that is true, (I have no idea if there is actual data to back up the statement) is it the braces? or the fact...
Even if that is true, (I have no idea if there is actual data to back up the statement) is it the braces? or the fact that we now ride motorcycles which have a lot more power, heavier, with better suspension allowing us to go much much faster. And kids are now taking bigger risks than ever on the track as the technique has also changed.
Watch a pro 125 race from 25 years ago, and compare it to a modern 250 race, it would be daft to expect injury rates to stay the same.
Correlation does not equal causation.

To prove your hypothesis that it is the braces causing the change in injury, you would need to compare riders using the same bikes on the same tracks etc.

Or it could be done with testing on cadavers, and using simulation tools. which to my understanding has happened
You haven't been paying attention on Vital this week, there were several threads where modern bikes competed against 30-40 year old bikes, and the old bikes did not suck. Massive speed difference, yeah, no.
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Markus422
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7/27/2021 7:47pm Edited Date/Time 7/27/2021 7:51pm
Dude keeps saying wilder and wilder things, at this point it honestly seems like it’s just for attention. I really feel embarrassed that a heeded his advice at one point in my life. I’d say he’s like the Kanye West of motocross lol.
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Bruce372
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7/27/2021 8:23pm Edited Date/Time 7/27/2021 8:45pm
Markus422 wrote:
Dude keeps saying wilder and wilder things, at this point it honestly seems like it’s just for attention. I really feel embarrassed that a heeded his...
Dude keeps saying wilder and wilder things, at this point it honestly seems like it’s just for attention. I really feel embarrassed that a heeded his advice at one point in my life. I’d say he’s like the Kanye West of motocross lol.
I think you nailed it dude.
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McG194
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7/28/2021 5:12am
Broken femurs and collarbones have accelerated during the brace era. Manufacturer's have business interest's to protect. Ryno has no financial interests and can speak freely.
Even if that is true, (I have no idea if there is actual data to back up the statement) is it the braces? or the fact...
Even if that is true, (I have no idea if there is actual data to back up the statement) is it the braces? or the fact that we now ride motorcycles which have a lot more power, heavier, with better suspension allowing us to go much much faster. And kids are now taking bigger risks than ever on the track as the technique has also changed.
Watch a pro 125 race from 25 years ago, and compare it to a modern 250 race, it would be daft to expect injury rates to stay the same.
Correlation does not equal causation.

To prove your hypothesis that it is the braces causing the change in injury, you would need to compare riders using the same bikes on the same tracks etc.

Or it could be done with testing on cadavers, and using simulation tools. which to my understanding has happened
You haven't been paying attention on Vital this week, there were several threads where modern bikes competed against 30-40 year old bikes, and the old bikes...
You haven't been paying attention on Vital this week, there were several threads where modern bikes competed against 30-40 year old bikes, and the old bikes did not suck. Massive speed difference, yeah, no.
Is it the bikes haven't improved as much or riding techniques are better and tracks are better which allow higher speeds?

I don't know he answer, that's why I ask. I just remember tracks from the 90's were way more point and shoot and choppy with way less rhythm.
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stone881
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7/28/2021 6:11pm
Broken femurs and collarbones have accelerated during the brace era. Manufacturer's have business interest's to protect. Ryno has no financial interests and can speak freely.
I would say the opposite about broken collarbones, I haven't broken one since I put on a neck brace....Knock on wood!

It makes sense if you think about it as the brace keeps your helmet from snapping it.
TheGetFresh
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7/29/2021 8:13am
McG194 wrote:
They may not claim that it's a brace but it is under the brace tab and it is listed as "Atlas Vision MX Neck Brace." Yes...
They may not claim that it's a brace but it is under the brace tab and it is listed as "Atlas Vision MX Neck Brace."

Yes, I am claiming that Dr. Leatt knows less about proper body positioning racing MX than Ryno does.
soggy wrote:
Body positioning is nearly the same across a shit load of activities. People thinking moto is such a unique athletic sport as far as body positioning...
Body positioning is nearly the same across a shit load of activities. People thinking moto is such a unique athletic sport as far as body positioning goes is off base. Body position for me skiing is nearly the same as moto.
Skiing has helped my moto so much. Body position, weighting one foot or the other, keeping your chest up, looking forward… the list goes on. So many shared techniques.
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Undersprung
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7/29/2021 7:22pm
It says pretty clearly that the Vision isn't a neck brace on Atlas' website. Mostly designed to give people who can't wear a full brace because they have a short neck or issues with a full brace an option for compression forces.
soggy
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7/30/2021 6:15am
McG194 wrote:
They may not claim that it's a brace but it is under the brace tab and it is listed as "Atlas Vision MX Neck Brace." Yes...
They may not claim that it's a brace but it is under the brace tab and it is listed as "Atlas Vision MX Neck Brace."

Yes, I am claiming that Dr. Leatt knows less about proper body positioning racing MX than Ryno does.
soggy wrote:
Body positioning is nearly the same across a shit load of activities. People thinking moto is such a unique athletic sport as far as body positioning...
Body positioning is nearly the same across a shit load of activities. People thinking moto is such a unique athletic sport as far as body positioning goes is off base. Body position for me skiing is nearly the same as moto.
Skiing has helped my moto so much. Body position, weighting one foot or the other, keeping your chest up, looking forward… the list goes on. So...
Skiing has helped my moto so much. Body position, weighting one foot or the other, keeping your chest up, looking forward… the list goes on. So many shared techniques.
100%. Hips too, so much of skiing well has to do with keeping your hips unlocked so you’re lower body moves independent of your upper body. I wish I rode as well as I skied.
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McG194
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7/30/2021 6:45am
It says pretty clearly that the Vision isn't a neck brace on Atlas' website. Mostly designed to give people who can't wear a full brace because...
It says pretty clearly that the Vision isn't a neck brace on Atlas' website. Mostly designed to give people who can't wear a full brace because they have a short neck or issues with a full brace an option for compression forces.
It does say that clearly but it also has it as the first brace listed under the brace tab and it compares range of movement to the Air.



"66% more range of motion (vs Atlas Air)
Introducing Pro-Motion, a drastically increased range of motion allows you to freely see up and down hills, at your feet, to the sky, or tuck and roll during a crash"



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TheGetFresh
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7/30/2021 10:00pm
soggy wrote:
Body positioning is nearly the same across a shit load of activities. People thinking moto is such a unique athletic sport as far as body positioning...
Body positioning is nearly the same across a shit load of activities. People thinking moto is such a unique athletic sport as far as body positioning goes is off base. Body position for me skiing is nearly the same as moto.
Skiing has helped my moto so much. Body position, weighting one foot or the other, keeping your chest up, looking forward… the list goes on. So...
Skiing has helped my moto so much. Body position, weighting one foot or the other, keeping your chest up, looking forward… the list goes on. So many shared techniques.
soggy wrote:
100%. Hips too, so much of skiing well has to do with keeping your hips unlocked so you’re lower body moves independent of your upper body...
100%. Hips too, so much of skiing well has to do with keeping your hips unlocked so you’re lower body moves independent of your upper body. I wish I rode as well as I skied.
I’m a rank amateur at both, but I’m working on it.

There’s a ski area about 30 minutes from one of my local tracks. The ski area is pretty small and just a local spot, but this winter I’m hoping to ski in the morning and ride prepped practice in the afternoon. I think doing them back to back would be a fun comparison.
Tuplis
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7/31/2021 12:51am Edited Date/Time 7/31/2021 12:52am
Just made my biggest crash last weekend without my neck brace what I use 95% of the time usually.

Whisky throttled 4th gear and kept it wide open, cased in to a hill outside track, hit my chin to bars(?) and lost consciousness for a while. Spent two days in hospital.

Now feeling dizzy in some neck positions etc.
Having quite mixed feelings if I would be any better if same crash would have happened with a neck brace on... Might have broken jaw instead of 7 stitches?

Reason why I did not have brace was that I did have very minor low sider two weeks earlier and I thought then that my brace caused collarbone and back shoulder pain - but not really sure if it really was braces fault
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colonel
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7/31/2021 3:24am
Ryno - a guy who is at one with the earth, wind and fire, peace love and anti socialism and all that but lives on Instagram / social media telling everyone that will listen he is right and is the outlier in all things he does. He jumps and thrives on attention and seems to create a bubble he feeds off.

Whatever he is trying to search for, hole to fill inside or pretend he is doing while displaying narcissistic personality disorder, I wish him the best.
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