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Roczen was extremely fast that year. The first race he won by a mile, the second race Ryan Dungey was just as fast as him, and the third race he crashed. Later in the season Eli Tomac was much, much faster than Dungey, and I think he would have been faster than Kenny too.
People always talk about him getting back to his old speed, I just think others have gotten faster around him.
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Take it one step further back to 2016 nationals, how many motos did he win against tomac, 20?
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Speed wasn't the only thing Roczen had on the competition in '17. The dude believed he was the alpha dog and so did everybody else, the very moment he got out of that Acura wearing an Armani suit. It was further reinforced when he won the first two rounds. Say what you want about Dungey being "as fast," but KRoc won.
I'm not saying it would have been a cakewalk, but there was definitely an impressive air of superiority around him. He was "The man," quite clearly. Nobody can say that in 2019 yet, and we've already raced 4 events.
Braaapin' aint easy.
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1. Riders always get faster as the season progresses 2. He was winning, you only need to win by 5 seconds if your smart, winning by 30 seconds is added risk 3. theres no way to know if he could have just wicked it up more to match Tomac
That being said Tomac in 2015 outdoors still to this day is the fastest Ive ever seen somebody ride a dirt bike. He also paid dearly for it. Kenny was very dominant his last season he won outdoors as well, not quite so fast, but he lasted the whole year so who knows if he is capable of going that speed but just doesnt for self preservation.
So in conclusion nobody knows and nobody will ever know because both of them have been severely injured and those days are the past. Tomac has never again shown the speed he had in 2015 either, but that may just be because its smart not to. I think on eithers good day they are both the 2 most capable riders out there (for now) and both are each others biggest competition, both have strengths and weaknesses.
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RD757 wrote:
Take it one step further back to 2016 nationals, how many motos did he win against tomac, 20?
Agreed but at the same time Tomac was 1 year removed from double shoulder surgery. The speed he showed in 15' was easily enough to run with Ken in 16'. Both are phenominal riders that can both beat the other on their good day.
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2016 AMA outdoors 94 Ken Roczen 25 25 18 25 25 25 25 25 25 25 25 25 22 22 25 25 25 22 25 25 25 25 25 25
he scored 584 out of a possible 600 points ...
the funniest thing about this particular signature is that by the time you realise it doesn't say anything it's to late to stop reading it
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RD757 wrote:
Take it one step further back to 2016 nationals, how many motos did he win against tomac, 20?
wideopen198 wrote:
Yes, 2016 nationals was his prime IMO. He could start in about 10th place and make his way to 1st in just a couple laps. Things were really clickin' on that suzi
Just watch this....
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Saw him at the 2016 MEC, what a red flash! He was going at light speed and was on another level, jaw dropping speed.
He also crashed in the second g-bang. I think he was trying to make a red statement, and he was flying.
Fine line, killing it and crashing.
In my 60’s and still loving dirt scoots up here in the frozen north.
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RD757 wrote:
Take it one step further back to 2016 nationals, how many motos did he win against tomac, 20?
wideopen198 wrote:
Yes, 2016 nationals was his prime IMO. He could start in about 10th place and make his way to 1st in just a couple laps. Things were really clickin' on that suzi
wideopen198 wrote:
Just watch this....
Well. Any questions? !
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No one said he wasn't next level outdoors but again that's never translated to SX.
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In before Dumbgeon....
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RD757 wrote:
Take it one step further back to 2016 nationals, how many motos did he win against tomac, 20?
wideopen198 wrote:
Yes, 2016 nationals was his prime IMO. He could start in about 10th place and make his way to 1st in just a couple laps. Things were really clickin' on that suzi
wideopen198 wrote:
Just watch this....
That shows from how far he really came back. He is a new rider now, more mature, more clever.
We should just be glad he is racing, as much as Tomac with his double shoulders injury, those are gnarly riders.
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drok577 wrote:
Roczen was extremely fast that year. The first race he won by a mile, the second race Ryan Dungey was just as fast as him, and the third race he crashed. Later in the season Eli Tomac was much, much faster than Dungey, and I think he would have been faster than Kenny too.
People always talk about him getting back to his old speed, I just think others have gotten faster around him.
He’s still plenty fast, and riding within what he can do with two rebuilt arms.
As far as 2017 goes, you have a data set of exactly three races to work with, and no way to know how it would have played out.
Personally, I’m enjoying the heck out of the fact that we don’t have two or three dominant riders, and a guy who wins one week might be battling for tenth (or worse) the next. Fans aren’t used to that. Neither am I. But I sure prefer that to knowing who will be on the podium before I even travel to a race. We’ve had enough years of that.
One thing you can say for sure, is that everyone is giving it their all. Some of them may be underperforming in the eyes of some fans, but it’s a new current reality, and I love it.
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drok577 wrote:
Roczen was extremely fast that year. The first race he won by a mile, the second race Ryan Dungey was just as fast as him, and the third race he crashed. Later in the season Eli Tomac was much, much faster than Dungey, and I think he would have been faster than Kenny too.
People always talk about him getting back to his old speed, I just think others have gotten faster around him.
your spellings a bit off, change the "o" & "r" round
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All I have to add is I continue to pick Kroc in fantasy and continue to get my butthole cleaned out.
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drok577 wrote:
Roczen was extremely fast that year. The first race he won by a mile, the second race Ryan Dungey was just as fast as him, and the third race he crashed. Later in the season Eli Tomac was much, much faster than Dungey, and I think he would have been faster than Kenny too.
People always talk about him getting back to his old speed, I just think others have gotten faster around him.GuyB wrote:
He’s still plenty fast, and riding within what he can do with two rebuilt arms.
As far as 2017 goes, you have a data set of exactly three races to work with, and no way to know how it would have played out.
Personally, I’m enjoying the heck out of the fact that we don’t have two or three dominant riders, and a guy who wins one week might be battling for tenth (or worse) the next. Fans aren’t used to that. Neither am I. But I sure prefer that to knowing who will be on the podium before I even travel to a race. We’ve had enough years of that.
One thing you can say for sure, is that everyone is giving it their all. Some of them may be underperforming in the eyes of some fans, but it’s a new current reality, and I love it.
Agreed. This year hasn’t been the same yawner that past seasons have turned into. Maybe Webb will turn it into one after a couple more rounds but it looks like there’s still some fight left in the rest of the field.
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dickjackson170 wrote:
All I have to add is I continue to pick Kroc in fantasy and continue to get my butthole cleaned out.
Until the weekend when you pick Webb or Musquin, and then KRoc wins. 
Braaapin' aint easy.
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RD757 wrote:
Take it one step further back to 2016 nationals, how many motos did he win against tomac, 20?
wideopen198 wrote:
Yes, 2016 nationals was his prime IMO. He could start in about 10th place and make his way to 1st in just a couple laps. Things were really clickin' on that suzi
wideopen198 wrote:
Just watch this....
Kenny was hauling!
That was one of my all-time favorite looking factory bikes
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dickjackson170 wrote:
All I have to add is I continue to pick Kroc in fantasy and continue to get my butthole cleaned out.
Falcon wrote:
Until the weekend when you pick Webb or Musquin, and then KRoc wins.
^ This. You really get me, bro.
