Premier 450 rides given without a 250 title

Johnny Ringo
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Johnny Ringo
Since the Savatgy deal seems to be a polarizing deal for folks, let’s take a look at some 450 rides given to riders with no 250 titles:

2004 - Michael Byrne Factory kawi
2004 - all of Suzuki’s team was dudes with no 250 titles
2005 - Heath Voss Factory Yam
2007 - Andrew Short Factory Honda
2007 - Mike Alessi Factory KTM
2007 - Jeff Alessi Factory KTM
2008 - Josh Hill Factory Yam
2009 - Josh Grant JGR
2009 - Kyle Chisholm L&M
2010 - Matt Moss Suzuki
2010 - Justin Brayton JGR
2011 - Kyle Regal L&M
2015 - Weston Peick JGR
2015 - Cole Seely Honda
2017 - Benny Bloss RMATV

I might have missed a few. I’m not really even a Savatgy fan but all this hate over the 2nd spot at kawi is beyond ridiculous. A lot of good dudes over the years have gotten 1 year deals and become mainstays in the 450 class. Not sure who Kawi could even sign over Joey.
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ML512
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ML512 8/29/2018 4:57pm
8/29/2018 4:57pm
In Matt Moss defense, he had 250 titles in outdoors and Supercross, but in Australia...
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TXDirt
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TXDirt 8/29/2018 5:03pm
8/29/2018 5:03pm
A longer list would be 250 riders with a championship who didn’t make it on the big bikes. Post that one up.
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Zaugg
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Zaugg 8/29/2018 5:20pm
8/29/2018 5:20pm
Pretty easy transition for Savatgy to go from PC to Factory Kawi. He knows the system so to speak. If I'm the factory, I'm not just drawing names out of a hat or looking to the experts here on Vital to choose my other rider. haha
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jeffro503
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jeffro503 8/29/2018 8:04pm
8/29/2018 8:04pm
Well....if I'm one of the guys this thread is steered for.....I never said " I don't think he doesn't deserve a shot on a 450 ". He does , by what history has shown on his record so far.

But......I don't like the guy at all , and I also think he'll flop on a 450. Deserves a shot?......yeah I guess so. Do I think he's capable of doing much on s 450....no I don't. Probably my least favorite rider out there....so sorry for the lack of enthusiasm.
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tylermx967
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tylermx967 8/29/2018 8:15pm
8/29/2018 8:15pm
WE GOED TO THE FREESTONE RACE IN 2010 AND THIS THE DAY THAT MATT MOSS GIVED ME HIS GOGGILS WHEN HE RIDED SUSZUKI
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deanwhite51
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deanwhite51 8/29/2018 9:18pm
8/29/2018 9:18pm
ML512 wrote:
In Matt Moss defense, he had 250 titles in outdoors and Supercross, but in Australia...
Mossy was also a dominate rider here in the land down under.
He was unstoppable on that 250f here.. even gave reed a run for his money on the tighter tracks in Lap times.

pretty sure it was Perth where mossy had faster laptimes nearly every lap on a 250f back in 2009 against reed on his 450.


Moss was a freak at his peak for the aussie side of things.
bsharkey
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bsharkey 8/29/2018 9:28pm
8/29/2018 9:28pm
He might do okay on the 450 s it seems like he always folded under pressure but I'm sure there's no pressure to win
Kelz87
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Kelz87 8/29/2018 9:58pm
8/29/2018 9:58pm
jeffro503 wrote:
Well....if I'm one of the guys this thread is steered for.....I never said " I don't think he doesn't deserve a shot on a 450 "...
Well....if I'm one of the guys this thread is steered for.....I never said " I don't think he doesn't deserve a shot on a 450 ". He does , by what history has shown on his record so far.

But......I don't like the guy at all , and I also think he'll flop on a 450. Deserves a shot?......yeah I guess so. Do I think he's capable of doing much on s 450....no I don't. Probably my least favorite rider out there....so sorry for the lack of enthusiasm.
I’m not a big Savatgy fan by any means, but just curious why you don’t like him?
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SoCalMX70
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SoCalMX70 8/29/2018 10:14pm
8/29/2018 10:14pm
Anyone ever win a 125/250 championship and not get a factory ride the year after? That would be more interesting.
Sully
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Sully 8/29/2018 10:22pm
8/29/2018 10:22pm
SoCalMX70 wrote:
Anyone ever win a 125/250 championship and not get a factory ride the year after? That would be more interesting.
Tim Ferry did in the 90's. Won a 125 championship and didn't get re-signed by Suzuki (I think).
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SoCalMX70
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SoCalMX70 8/29/2018 10:24pm
8/29/2018 10:24pm
SoCalMX70 wrote:
Anyone ever win a 125/250 championship and not get a factory ride the year after? That would be more interesting.
Sully wrote:
Tim Ferry did in the 90's. Won a 125 championship and didn't get re-signed by Suzuki (I think).
Ah, I do recall that. Never won a race that season though, from what I remember. A string of 2nd places? Wonder if that was part of the issue...
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Raikzz
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Raikzz 8/29/2018 10:28pm
8/29/2018 10:28pm
SoCalMX70 wrote:
Anyone ever win a 125/250 championship and not get a factory ride the year after? That would be more interesting.
Mookie
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Sully
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Sully 8/29/2018 10:35pm
8/29/2018 10:35pm
SoCalMX70 wrote:
Anyone ever win a 125/250 championship and not get a factory ride the year after? That would be more interesting.
Raikzz wrote:
Mookie
How the hell do I remember that Tim Ferry did it in the 90s, but I forgot about Mookie 3 years ago?!
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EZZA 95B
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EZZA 95B 8/29/2018 10:47pm
8/29/2018 10:47pm
Sully wrote:
Tim Ferry did in the 90's. Won a 125 championship and didn't get re-signed by Suzuki (I think).
Yep, went to Noleen Yamaha.
Cortami79
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Cortami79 8/30/2018 12:08am
8/30/2018 12:08am
SoCalMX70 wrote:
Anyone ever win a 125/250 championship and not get a factory ride the year after? That would be more interesting.
In Europe Tixier became World Champion and still had to leave KTM..
TDeath21
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TDeath21 8/30/2018 8:20am
8/30/2018 8:20am
SoCalMX70 wrote:
Anyone ever win a 125/250 championship and not get a factory ride the year after? That would be more interesting.
Raikzz wrote:
Mookie
Eh. That was on Mookie though. He had offers.
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billyp330
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billyp330 8/30/2018 8:30am
8/30/2018 8:30am
Johnny Ringo wrote:
Since the Savatgy deal seems to be a polarizing deal for folks, let’s take a look at some 450 rides given to riders with no 250...
Since the Savatgy deal seems to be a polarizing deal for folks, let’s take a look at some 450 rides given to riders with no 250 titles:

2004 - Michael Byrne Factory kawi
2004 - all of Suzuki’s team was dudes with no 250 titles
2005 - Heath Voss Factory Yam
2007 - Andrew Short Factory Honda
2007 - Mike Alessi Factory KTM
2007 - Jeff Alessi Factory KTM
2008 - Josh Hill Factory Yam
2009 - Josh Grant JGR
2009 - Kyle Chisholm L&M
2010 - Matt Moss Suzuki
2010 - Justin Brayton JGR
2011 - Kyle Regal L&M
2015 - Weston Peick JGR
2015 - Cole Seely Honda
2017 - Benny Bloss RMATV

I might have missed a few. I’m not really even a Savatgy fan but all this hate over the 2nd spot at kawi is beyond ridiculous. A lot of good dudes over the years have gotten 1 year deals and become mainstays in the 450 class. Not sure who Kawi could even sign over Joey.
Wonder if its a coincidence that none of those listed won any titles in 450s either...
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Johnny Ringo
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Johnny Ringo 8/30/2018 8:36am
8/30/2018 8:36am
billyp330 wrote:
Wonder if its a coincidence that none of those listed won any titles in 450s either...
Maybe, but there’s a lot of 250 champs that never won 450 titles either...
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billyp330
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billyp330 8/30/2018 8:38am
8/30/2018 8:38am
billyp330 wrote:
Wonder if its a coincidence that none of those listed won any titles in 450s either...
Johnny Ringo wrote:
Maybe, but there’s a lot of 250 champs that never won 450 titles either...
True. Has anyone ever won a premier title without winning a title on smaller bike? Can't think of any off the top of my head.
Kyle_McNab
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Kyle_McNab 8/30/2018 8:47am
8/30/2018 8:47am
Johnny Ringo wrote:
Since the Savatgy deal seems to be a polarizing deal for folks, let’s take a look at some 450 rides given to riders with no 250...
Since the Savatgy deal seems to be a polarizing deal for folks, let’s take a look at some 450 rides given to riders with no 250 titles:

2004 - Michael Byrne Factory kawi
2004 - all of Suzuki’s team was dudes with no 250 titles
2005 - Heath Voss Factory Yam
2007 - Andrew Short Factory Honda
2007 - Mike Alessi Factory KTM
2007 - Jeff Alessi Factory KTM
2008 - Josh Hill Factory Yam
2009 - Josh Grant JGR
2009 - Kyle Chisholm L&M
2010 - Matt Moss Suzuki
2010 - Justin Brayton JGR
2011 - Kyle Regal L&M
2015 - Weston Peick JGR
2015 - Cole Seely Honda
2017 - Benny Bloss RMATV

I might have missed a few. I’m not really even a Savatgy fan but all this hate over the 2nd spot at kawi is beyond ridiculous. A lot of good dudes over the years have gotten 1 year deals and become mainstays in the 450 class. Not sure who Kawi could even sign over Joey.
Exactly! Everyone loves to hate for him. I guess people don’t like him personally which I don’t get. He’s not the most happy go guy like plessinger but he takes full responsibility in his results. Of course when you not winning it’s hard to be happy. Hope he shuts the haters up this year. Btw he had way better 250 career than Bowers and grant
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MR. X
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MR. X 8/30/2018 8:55am
8/30/2018 8:55am
tylermx967 wrote:
WE GOED TO THE FREESTONE RACE IN 2010 AND THIS THE DAY THAT MATT MOSS GIVED ME HIS GOGGILS WHEN HE RIDED SUSZUKI
Then you gots them autographed by the big show?
TEL36
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TEL36 8/30/2018 9:01am
8/30/2018 9:01am
Didn't Heath Voss win an "FIM world Supercross" championship in '04? What races did that consist of? I was 11 at the time so i'm not really familiar with it.
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TDeath21
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TDeath21 8/30/2018 9:29am
8/30/2018 9:29am
TEL36 wrote:
Didn't Heath Voss win an "FIM world Supercross" championship in '04? What races did that consist of? I was 11 at the time so i'm not...
Didn't Heath Voss win an "FIM world Supercross" championship in '04? What races did that consist of? I was 11 at the time so i'm not really familiar with it.
That championship was a joke. Reed, Windham, and a few others still beat him in points despite not racing the two Canadian rounds. But the stipulation was you had to race those in order to get the “world” championship.
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early
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early 8/30/2018 9:34am
8/30/2018 9:34am
billyp330 wrote:
Wonder if its a coincidence that none of those listed won any titles in 450s either...
Johnny Ringo wrote:
Maybe, but there’s a lot of 250 champs that never won 450 titles either...
billyp330 wrote:
True. Has anyone ever won a premier title without winning a title on smaller bike? Can't think of any off the top of my head.
I don't think Emig won a 125sx title and went on be 97 250sx champ. He did win the 125 class outdoors though.
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Squirrelings 8/30/2018 9:38am
8/30/2018 9:38am Edited Date/Time 8/30/2018 9:41am
jeffro503 wrote:
Well....if I'm one of the guys this thread is steered for.....I never said " I don't think he doesn't deserve a shot on a 450 "...
Well....if I'm one of the guys this thread is steered for.....I never said " I don't think he doesn't deserve a shot on a 450 ". He does , by what history has shown on his record so far.

But......I don't like the guy at all , and I also think he'll flop on a 450. Deserves a shot?......yeah I guess so. Do I think he's capable of doing much on s 450....no I don't. Probably my least favorite rider out there....so sorry for the lack of enthusiasm.
What exactly is it about him that you seem to dislike so much? I'm sure it's absolutely nothing as he never causes drama and is a hard worker, but we all can't wait to find out what the almighty Jeffro thinks so we can hate him for no reason also.
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bnero44
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bnero44 8/30/2018 10:06am
8/30/2018 10:06am
TEL36 wrote:
Didn't Heath Voss win an "FIM world Supercross" championship in '04? What races did that consist of? I was 11 at the time so i'm not...
Didn't Heath Voss win an "FIM world Supercross" championship in '04? What races did that consist of? I was 11 at the time so i'm not really familiar with it.
TDeath21 wrote:
That championship was a joke. Reed, Windham, and a few others still beat him in points despite not racing the two Canadian rounds. But the stipulation...
That championship was a joke. Reed, Windham, and a few others still beat him in points despite not racing the two Canadian rounds. But the stipulation was you had to race those in order to get the “world” championship.
cant win if you dont race! yamaha bought that number 1 thats why heath got that ride
Tarz483
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Tarz483 8/30/2018 10:09am
8/30/2018 10:09am
I'm sure there are More that have gotten a ride than that
The 1st that popped in my mind was Broc Hepler
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RichieW13 8/30/2018 11:01am
8/30/2018 11:01am
billyp330 wrote:
True. Has anyone ever won a premier title without winning a title on smaller bike? Can't think of any off the top of my head.
Greg Albertyn (1999 250 MX)
Mike LaRocco (1993 500 MX, 1994 250 MX)
Jeff Stanton (Six 250 titles)
Jean-Michel Bayle (in 1991 he won 250 SX, 250 MX and 500 MX)
Jeff Emig (as mentioned above)

There was no 125 class in SX before 1985, so before the late 80's it was a little "easier" to win a 250 or 500 title without ever winning a 125 title.

Ricky Johnson
David Bailey
Donnie Hansen (1982 250 MX and 250 SX)
Kent Howerton (3 championships)
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