Performance Enhancing Drugs

Nerd
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10/27/2011 11:03am Edited Date/Time 10/27/2011 1:20pm
Nerd wrote:
Townley was not going faster than RC. Sorry. He was going the same speed and stayed the same distance behind. They were basically dead equal for...
Townley was not going faster than RC. Sorry. He was going the same speed and stayed the same distance behind. They were basically dead equal for that entire moto, but RC was in front.

So, no, I don't "know you're right".

And the reason I asked when you stopped beating your wife is that's the same thing you're doing here: Presuming things you don't know to be true, and asking questions that by answering them would admit guilt.

I was simply returning your way of thinking back to you.

The FIM tested all of Team USA in France. They were clean. What does this tell you?
themrtoad wrote:
I would say Townley actually rode "better" than RC. But RC had so much more in stamina. After the race BT was finished, and RC looked...
I would say Townley actually rode "better" than RC. But RC had so much more in stamina. After the race BT was finished, and RC looked like he was ready to go another 35 minutes. I find it weird that the best rider in the world, and the 2nd best rider in the world that day was separated by so much in stamina.

I will go out on a limb and say that the tests conducted maybe was done just to please the audience. The real fans of the sport can't handle the truth unlike journalists, insiders and promotors.

Either that or the riders that usually use illegal substances had found a way to get their levels down in time for MXDN. I think a trainer/doctor that's paid a fortune can actually make that happen, and the effect of being able to train harder their whole careers due to PED's were still there. Isn't that what it's all about everywhere else in the world where they try to avoid being caught as they do have rules. What does this tell you?
http://www.motocrossmx1.com/reslists.aspx?ct=7&c=6

Townley was very close, but his best laptime was not as good as Carmichael's best.

RC: 1:54.695
BT: 1:54.763

By the end of the race, RC's laptimes were over 2 minutes. Laps 13-18 (the last five laps) were all over 2 minutes. So, your "proof" that he is using PEDs is that his laptimes dropped by 6-8 seconds PER LAP by the end of the race?

Seriously, that makes no sense.
10/27/2011 11:19am
alot of the ped facts you guys are claiming are way off... saying that I'm not gonna waist my time arguing when it seems like two people are running over everyone in one thread with facts that arent facts at all. Have you done any PEDs? Gonna throw out that X does not count... unless it makes you hump your bike better threw the whoops while hearing that great 4 stroke tone. Is that why some wont let the 2 stroke go? The way it sounds on X? Im not gonna claim not know Manning... brady or whoever is the best in f1 supercross and shuffle board... who gives a shit? I just want to give insight on what these drugs do and how they work and why they would be used. Ive read more wrong stuff by these people claiming to know it all than i can get my head around. Yeah it sounds like a few people googled a couple of things but I am telling you from my own experiences I the things I do know. If anyone has a question about the drugs I will be glad to answer with what I do know not speculation.

Nerd I don't know you so I don't know if youre just being a dick by asking over and over what a PED is or you really don't understand?

If seems self explanatory but maybe I am wrong...

a ped is a lot of things. Anything that lets you manipulate your body to produce way over what it's capable of doing on it's own.
I would not classify a IV as "ped" but do I think its a big advantage yes? have I done it? yes. If I had to again would I? You bet! I thought the Iv thing was a little more hush hush than it seems to be really...

I read claims of hgh being restored to natural levels... are you kidding? a 24 year old should be fine with what they have and also their natural testosterone level.

Would they benefit from using those drugs? HELL YA. I'm just saying to claim its okay to use to get back to your natural levels is not a good excuse at all for some kid that is in his prime in is his mx career. We arent talking about a 50 year old man that might have a legitimate reason to use the stuff.

In my eyes the only time they should be allowed to use hgh is after an injury. It helps all involved imo. The fans get their rider back on the track sooner. The rider their self gets back on the track sooner and it can help build the injury back better and stronger.
A few IUs a day for a month isnt gonna turn ANYONE into Mark Mcguire... It would lean them out some maybe... but what its for is to help you heal and some injuries are harder to heal from than others. If a dr thinks you need and and writes you a RX for it than who are we to judge. It happens everyday. That's the only time I will say HGH should be legal.

It's abuse wont stop though. It can make you stronger but at low dose like anyone that knows what they are doing in mx should be doing will MAINLY help with fatloss and the MOST IMPORTANT Recovering. So you can continue to bust your ass every day at a high level threw you boot camp or whatever it is youre doing.

sorry I always get carried away and say more than I intend.
Mod Killer
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10/27/2011 11:28am
Nerd wrote:
The rules are the same. Both AMA and FIM use IOC as a guideline for PEDs. And both only test urine.
well there u have it. the playing field is level.

this whole FIM vs AMA debate is toast with regards to the topic of this thread.
Nerd
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10/27/2011 11:32am
JayDoubleU wrote:
alot of the ped facts you guys are claiming are way off... saying that I'm not gonna waist my time arguing when it seems like two...
alot of the ped facts you guys are claiming are way off... saying that I'm not gonna waist my time arguing when it seems like two people are running over everyone in one thread with facts that arent facts at all. Have you done any PEDs? Gonna throw out that X does not count... unless it makes you hump your bike better threw the whoops while hearing that great 4 stroke tone. Is that why some wont let the 2 stroke go? The way it sounds on X? Im not gonna claim not know Manning... brady or whoever is the best in f1 supercross and shuffle board... who gives a shit? I just want to give insight on what these drugs do and how they work and why they would be used. Ive read more wrong stuff by these people claiming to know it all than i can get my head around. Yeah it sounds like a few people googled a couple of things but I am telling you from my own experiences I the things I do know. If anyone has a question about the drugs I will be glad to answer with what I do know not speculation.

Nerd I don't know you so I don't know if youre just being a dick by asking over and over what a PED is or you really don't understand?

If seems self explanatory but maybe I am wrong...

a ped is a lot of things. Anything that lets you manipulate your body to produce way over what it's capable of doing on it's own.
I would not classify a IV as "ped" but do I think its a big advantage yes? have I done it? yes. If I had to again would I? You bet! I thought the Iv thing was a little more hush hush than it seems to be really...

I read claims of hgh being restored to natural levels... are you kidding? a 24 year old should be fine with what they have and also their natural testosterone level.

Would they benefit from using those drugs? HELL YA. I'm just saying to claim its okay to use to get back to your natural levels is not a good excuse at all for some kid that is in his prime in is his mx career. We arent talking about a 50 year old man that might have a legitimate reason to use the stuff.

In my eyes the only time they should be allowed to use hgh is after an injury. It helps all involved imo. The fans get their rider back on the track sooner. The rider their self gets back on the track sooner and it can help build the injury back better and stronger.
A few IUs a day for a month isnt gonna turn ANYONE into Mark Mcguire... It would lean them out some maybe... but what its for is to help you heal and some injuries are harder to heal from than others. If a dr thinks you need and and writes you a RX for it than who are we to judge. It happens everyday. That's the only time I will say HGH should be legal.

It's abuse wont stop though. It can make you stronger but at low dose like anyone that knows what they are doing in mx should be doing will MAINLY help with fatloss and the MOST IMPORTANT Recovering. So you can continue to bust your ass every day at a high level threw you boot camp or whatever it is youre doing.

sorry I always get carried away and say more than I intend.
"I read claims of hgh being restored to natural levels... are you kidding? a 24 year old should be fine with what they have and also their natural testosterone level."

Should be, yes. But they aren't always. Would you agree that head injuries are common in MX? Of course you would.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19550389

Hypopituitarism has numerous potential causes, and it is becoming clear that traumatic brain injury (TBI), including traffic accidents and sport-related injuries, is commonly associated with pituitary dysfunction. Mechanisms of pituitary damage after TBI include direct injury and vascular problems, and more recent research suggests that autoimmunity may also be involved. There may also be a genetic influence, as the E3 allele of the ApoE gene may provide some protection from post-traumatic hypopituitarism. Studies suggest that patients with mild or moderate TBI are likely to recover pituitary function over time. In patients with severe TBI, however, adrenocorticotrophic hormone and growth hormone deficiencies may persist. Patients who experience TBI should, therefore, be followed up carefully and evaluated for pituitary dysfunction to ensure that appropriate hormone replacement therapy can be provided if needed.

So, if you hit your head and suffer a concussion, it's common for it to cause problems with how your pituitary regulates your body's HGH generation. Hypopituitarism can also result in decreased testosterone levels, as well as many other essential hormone issues. And hypopituitarism can be caused by head injuries.

The Shop

10/27/2011 11:38am
Yes I do agree with what you just said. But could you give me a honest number of how many people still racing at the top level have Hypopituitarism? Your point is valid and that is a legit reason to use hgh or whatever it takes to get back to normal.
The average kid racing in the lites class doesnt have to restore their hgh levels was my point. Almost all drugs have legit use somewhere besides abuse to get a edge on competition.
Nerd
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10/27/2011 11:44am
JayDoubleU wrote:
Yes I do agree with what you just said. But could you give me a honest number of how many people still racing at the top...
Yes I do agree with what you just said. But could you give me a honest number of how many people still racing at the top level have Hypopituitarism? Your point is valid and that is a legit reason to use hgh or whatever it takes to get back to normal.
The average kid racing in the lites class doesnt have to restore their hgh levels was my point. Almost all drugs have legit use somewhere besides abuse to get a edge on competition.
I would say that in a sport where head injuries are this common, having those head injuries affect your body's ability to regulate its hormone development would be fairly common, regardless of age.

I quit racing at 19. At that time, I had been KO'd 7 times in the 10 years I had raced. I don't think this is a very uncommon thing. Do you?
10/27/2011 11:55am
No I don't but they way you word it all 40 guys on the gate a brain dead lol.
I can really only speak for myself. My career is now coming to a end at a young age. I've been knocked out Atleast 5 times and I think I've raced fine since. Other injuries is why I can not race. I'm not claiming that almost everyone hasn't been knocked out atleast once but I think less people have the issue that you are claiming. I'm not saying it doesn't exist. Hell for all I know I could have that !
Nerd
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10/27/2011 12:03pm
JayDoubleU wrote:
No I don't but they way you word it all 40 guys on the gate a brain dead lol. I can really only speak for myself...
No I don't but they way you word it all 40 guys on the gate a brain dead lol.
I can really only speak for myself. My career is now coming to a end at a young age. I've been knocked out Atleast 5 times and I think I've raced fine since. Other injuries is why I can not race. I'm not claiming that almost everyone hasn't been knocked out atleast once but I think less people have the issue that you are claiming. I'm not saying it doesn't exist. Hell for all I know I could have that !
You're right. You could. You should get your blood examined.

And if you're not making a normal amount of HGH, for example, think about how much harder it would be for your body to heal from other injuries. "Other injuries is why I can not race." Maybe, if your HGH was at proper levels, those other injuries would be better. I don't know what those injuries are, but what if?

See?

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