Next sport changing talent?

bayodome
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2/28/2018 6:08am
I don't believe there will ever be another rider like Stewart who completely changed how people ride. I think Roczen comes the closest to embodying what Stewart introduced...their riding styles are very similar.

Herlings is pushing the limits as well, but away from the sand, doesn't do anything particularly different or innovative...he just does it all very, very well.

Future stars though, I don't know. Not up on the Amateur scene, but I haven't seen anyone blow my mind the way James did.
2/28/2018 6:20am
Herlings has always been at the very top of the game, since the day he went pro. Even last year, after recovering from his broken hand, he started a win streak. Roczen was too. Up until his crash last year.

I'd say Herlings and Gajser are definitely sport changing talents.
lumpy790
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2/28/2018 6:34am
Who will take their last winning laps at Lorettas this year?
Motofinne
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2/28/2018 6:49am Edited Date/Time 2/28/2018 6:52am
Herlings is the only one that is close to the level RV, RD and Cairoli(Cairoli is still amazing but he will retire 2020) was. But he needs to stay off the ground more to reach that level.

I thought Roczen was going to become the next legendary rider but i'm doubting that at the moment. Last years injury was way worse than what i thought. He has been forced to change his riding style drastically and now he got injured again.

Tomac is the difficult one. Look at how amazing he can be, but he has basically been in his prime for 2 years and screwed things up and he wont win this years SX title either. He also got pretty lucky with the outdoor title last summer. Roczen hurt, Dungey retired, Marvin hurt, Baggett hurt, Anderson hurt. Everyone got hurt and he wasn't able to dominate the series.

Then there are the current 250 riders. I can't see anyone of those riders(US and GPs) that could become the next generational talent.

But like someone already posted. This is in a way a good thing, we will wont have 5-10 years of domination like MC, Cairoli, Everts, RV, RC etc. did.

The Shop

Turbojez
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2/28/2018 6:55am
I can't wait to see Deegan's kid on a big bike in a few years.
He might become the next big thing if him and his dad keep it fun, and Haiden doesn't burn out.
rhargrave431
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2/28/2018 7:19am
AC on a big bike is either going to be really good or really bad. He won't over ride it, and crash less or the 450 will just pile him into the ground harder.
Titan1
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2/28/2018 7:23am
I don’t follow the amateur moto scene at all...never have...but I knew Stewart and Pastrana and RC and Villopoto’s names while they were on 60’s, and clear up here in Utah was hearing about how fast they were before I’d ever even seen a video of them riding, and so I was looking forward to them turning pro...does any current mini riders have that level of legendary speed even that young? I haven’t heard of any....The only mini rider I could even name right now would be Deegan...
early
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2/28/2018 7:35am
There haven't been any young guys really dominate 250s since Tomac/Roczen and they haven't planned out as expected. Unless Forkner or Sexton step it up big time we'll have to wait to see how Mumford/deegan/difrancisco perform in the pro ranks. Maybe there is others but idk.
PFitzG38
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2/28/2018 8:00am
Well now that Kenny's mojo seems to be more elusive than anticipated, from what I 've seen and heard the last few days. I'd be very worried about Hill if I was a current 450 guy. Other than that there is a handful that seem on the cusp of figuring out the final piece. AC, Forkner, RJ. Plessinger on a 450 will be interesting but I don't think we'll see something next level until Ryder, Haiden and a few of their peers make the jump. If those guys stay healthy and don't burn out or discover girls too soon, we'll see some unreal rides.

Supercross Tracks to scale and unlimited seat time. How can DangerBoy not be successful if he stays healthy and motivated? He's being groomed from the cradle, in what appears to be a well thought out manner. ie Staying in school and doing other sports specifically.

Sometimes I feel like any of the top 10 can discover one piece of the puzzle and just take off overnight....sounds simple but realistically maybe not so easy.
p0wn
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2/28/2018 8:10am
I'd like to see how Justin Cooper does once he gets back.
GrapeApe
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2/28/2018 8:24am
Titan1 wrote:
I don’t follow the amateur moto scene at all...never have...but I knew Stewart and Pastrana and RC and Villopoto’s names while they were on 60’s, and...
I don’t follow the amateur moto scene at all...never have...but I knew Stewart and Pastrana and RC and Villopoto’s names while they were on 60’s, and clear up here in Utah was hearing about how fast they were before I’d ever even seen a video of them riding, and so I was looking forward to them turning pro...does any current mini riders have that level of legendary speed even that young? I haven’t heard of any....The only mini rider I could even name right now would be Deegan...
Jett Reynolds has that type of pedigree on mini's, he won 9 straight LL titles. It would have been 10 except for a 3rd moto DNF in his last race. We'll see how it translates to the big bikes, though.
PFitzG38
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2/28/2018 8:27am Edited Date/Time 2/28/2018 8:28am
Turbojez wrote:
I can't wait to see Deegan's kid on a big bike in a few years. He might become the next big thing if him and his...
I can't wait to see Deegan's kid on a big bike in a few years.
He might become the next big thing if him and his dad keep it fun, and Haiden doesn't burn out.
Deegan is the first one that comes to mind because of name recognition. He already could/is making a good living on YouTube just Freeriding, but there are a handful of kids in the So Cal desert and TX/FL that have more racing experience and gate drops but less name recognition and probably seat time that you will be hearing about. Mumford, Reynolds, Defrancesca, Masterpool etc. Besides seeing kids doing hairball jumps, I'm seeing racecraft in the 60 and 80 classes. I enjoy watching these kids at the big qualifying races I do, just like I did back in the day. I never raced a mini other than my XR75 twice (kinda). I went straight to a 100 and always thought the mini kids from the 80's on the 80's were impressive to watch.......Still do.
kb228
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2/28/2018 8:34am
Jett reynolds or seth hammacker look promising too. Will have to see how the 250 treats them
TDeath21
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2/28/2018 8:52am Edited Date/Time 2/28/2018 8:56am
Bottom line:

For the first time in a long time we have no all time greats out there. It makes for great racing at the front. Racing that would normally be for 3rd-5th place.

Think about this for a second. Justin Bogle, while obviously a top rider in the world, is not anywhere near that top tier professional level. He won a moto last year. That would NEVER happen with Carmichael, Villopoto, Stewart, or Dungey out there. Roczen too pre injury and even Reed back in his prime. No chance that would ever happen. None. Nada. MAYBE if only one of the above mentioned was racing and they happened to have a bad day. Think the end of 07 when Stewart was injured and Reed went SX only. Or early in 09 before Reed got going and after Villopoto got injured. Or one moto here and there when only one all time great was out there and they happen to struggle one moto. Alessi at Washougal in 12 when Villopoto was out and he held off Dungey. But we look at years like 04, 05, 06, 07, 11, and 13 where we had multiple all time greats pushing each other, a guy like Bogle could kiss a moto win goodbye no matter what. Even years where there was just one out there like 12 and 15 (with Roczen pre injury), moto wins were impossible for a guy on Bogle’s level. Windham, in my opinion, would win a championship or even multiple with the current group of guys.
Nas
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2/28/2018 9:07am
Turbojez wrote:
I can't wait to see Deegan's kid on a big bike in a few years. He might become the next big thing if him and his...
I can't wait to see Deegan's kid on a big bike in a few years.
He might become the next big thing if him and his dad keep it fun, and Haiden doesn't burn out.
PFitzG38 wrote:
Deegan is the first one that comes to mind because of name recognition. He already could/is making a good living on YouTube just Freeriding, but there...
Deegan is the first one that comes to mind because of name recognition. He already could/is making a good living on YouTube just Freeriding, but there are a handful of kids in the So Cal desert and TX/FL that have more racing experience and gate drops but less name recognition and probably seat time that you will be hearing about. Mumford, Reynolds, Defrancesca, Masterpool etc. Besides seeing kids doing hairball jumps, I'm seeing racecraft in the 60 and 80 classes. I enjoy watching these kids at the big qualifying races I do, just like I did back in the day. I never raced a mini other than my XR75 twice (kinda). I went straight to a 100 and always thought the mini kids from the 80's on the 80's were impressive to watch.......Still do.
Don't kill me for this, I'm not hating/wishing bad for Deegan, just my thoughts...

The issue I see in Deegan's kids is they won't be made from the right "material". What I mean by that is, the money will never be a problem for them, their dad will pay for everything with no problem. The patter that occurs in almost 95% of the best athelets, especially in mx and sx, is that their parents were broke. I mean, they were an average family, with average earnings, that just invested everything they had in their kid untill they basically became broke. When I watched RV's documentaries, you can read between the lines how bad it was. I also personally know Gajser, who has the potential to be one of the greats, and let me tell you his childhood was pure suffer... His dad spent so much money on his racing, that his family had nothing to eat... Let's leave the facts that these kids also got beat up by dad when they didn't finish in a place their father wanted.

The point I'm trying to make is that some "conditions" have to be fullfield that some fast kid becomes one of the greatest and change the sport. The suffering and strugles when they were growing up were necessary, because they give them that something that separates an average "fast guy" and a "legend" (like RV,RD,..)

I just don't see something like that in Deegan's kids... They will become pro probably, maybe even win a race or two, but I just don't see them as the next big "thing".

But, like I said, this is just my opinion...
2/28/2018 9:49am Edited Date/Time 2/28/2018 10:02am
None of the guys listed here are "sport changing". As great as they were, neither were Villopoto or Dungey -- both pretty much left with the sport largely in the same condition it was when they entered it.

"Sport Changing" requires much more than just being really good. It requires being good in a remarkably different way than everyone before.
Flip109
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2/28/2018 9:58am
Herlings is the current alien. The speed he carried in Tennessee was like nothing I’ve ever seen. I mean through the TV I was thinking OMG. Maybe RV back in the day or Tomac when he’s on a few times but Holy shit. He has a whole extra gear on our brownie dirt outdoor tracks with all the traction.
aharper33
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2/28/2018 11:42am
I dont really see anyone coming up that is totally changing the way we think of the sport. Even with the exposer the kids are getting these days. When I think back since I started riding when I was 4 in 1985 I remember hearing about RC in Florida and we lived in San Diego. I remember hearing about Allesi, Stewert, RV, guys like that even though we didnt live around them at the time you knew who they were. Long before the internet and long before facebook, and Instagram.
Turbojez
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2/28/2018 12:34pm
Nas wrote:
Don't kill me for this, I'm not hating/wishing bad for Deegan, just my thoughts... The issue I see in Deegan's kids is they won't be made...
Don't kill me for this, I'm not hating/wishing bad for Deegan, just my thoughts...

The issue I see in Deegan's kids is they won't be made from the right "material". What I mean by that is, the money will never be a problem for them, their dad will pay for everything with no problem. The patter that occurs in almost 95% of the best athelets, especially in mx and sx, is that their parents were broke. I mean, they were an average family, with average earnings, that just invested everything they had in their kid untill they basically became broke. When I watched RV's documentaries, you can read between the lines how bad it was. I also personally know Gajser, who has the potential to be one of the greats, and let me tell you his childhood was pure suffer... His dad spent so much money on his racing, that his family had nothing to eat... Let's leave the facts that these kids also got beat up by dad when they didn't finish in a place their father wanted.

The point I'm trying to make is that some "conditions" have to be fullfield that some fast kid becomes one of the greatest and change the sport. The suffering and strugles when they were growing up were necessary, because they give them that something that separates an average "fast guy" and a "legend" (like RV,RD,..)

I just don't see something like that in Deegan's kids... They will become pro probably, maybe even win a race or two, but I just don't see them as the next big "thing".

But, like I said, this is just my opinion...
Great point. Seems like every huge name from mx was once in the "all or nothing" situation. Where their families put it all on the line, and it was pretty much to make it, or back off and try to recover from everything that was put in and everything that those families sacrificed.
That's a huge weight on a kid's shoulders, but it seem like that's what it takes to make that "next level" athlete.
mauidex
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2/28/2018 12:45pm
Dirt Wurx, if that's who's doing Feld's track designs this year!!
mxpappy711
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2/28/2018 1:29pm
So cool to see a couple people mention Hammaker. He is a great kid and has worked his ass off to get to where he is. Working class family, humble, wrenches on his own stuff, down to earth and thankful for everything he gets. Hope he kills it this year, he deserves it!
RichieW13
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2/28/2018 3:51pm
Most of the dominant riders won their first premier championship by age 21. Villopoto was 22.

Now, it seems like most of the riders stay in the 250 class past age 22.

Not sure if it's chicken or egg. Do guys not become dominant, because they wait too long to move up? Or, do they not move up because they know they can't be dominant.
kkawboy14
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3/1/2018 7:25am
I’m all onboard the Herlings train but I don’t think he would hold up if you split the challenge between half sx and half mx. In my eyes that would go to Tomac
Motofinne
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3/1/2018 7:28am
kkawboy14 wrote:
I’m all onboard the Herlings train but I don’t think he would hold up if you split the challenge between half sx and half mx. In...
I’m all onboard the Herlings train but I don’t think he would hold up if you split the challenge between half sx and half mx. In my eyes that would go to Tomac
Probably. But Herlings could become one of the best MX riders in the modern history(RC, Everts, Cairoli level). I don't think that Tomac will be that in SX or MX.
kkawboy14
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3/1/2018 7:46am Edited Date/Time 3/1/2018 7:46am
kkawboy14 wrote:
I’m all onboard the Herlings train but I don’t think he would hold up if you split the challenge between half sx and half mx. In...
I’m all onboard the Herlings train but I don’t think he would hold up if you split the challenge between half sx and half mx. In my eyes that would go to Tomac
Motofinne wrote:
Probably. But Herlings could become one of the best MX riders in the modern history(RC, Everts, Cairoli level). I don't think that Tomac will be that...
Probably. But Herlings could become one of the best MX riders in the modern history(RC, Everts, Cairoli level). I don't think that Tomac will be that in SX or MX.
So far.....Herlings has been hurt kinda like Tomac, so time will tell. Hopefully both of them this year can fix the crashes. But going as fast as they can go can lead to crashes. Didn’t Herlings just wad it up on the start of a race last week?
Motofinne
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3/1/2018 7:49am
kkawboy14 wrote:
I’m all onboard the Herlings train but I don’t think he would hold up if you split the challenge between half sx and half mx. In...
I’m all onboard the Herlings train but I don’t think he would hold up if you split the challenge between half sx and half mx. In my eyes that would go to Tomac
Motofinne wrote:
Probably. But Herlings could become one of the best MX riders in the modern history(RC, Everts, Cairoli level). I don't think that Tomac will be that...
Probably. But Herlings could become one of the best MX riders in the modern history(RC, Everts, Cairoli level). I don't think that Tomac will be that in SX or MX.
kkawboy14 wrote:
So far.....Herlings has been hurt kinda like Tomac, so time will tell. Hopefully both of them this year can fix the crashes. But going as fast...
So far.....Herlings has been hurt kinda like Tomac, so time will tell. Hopefully both of them this year can fix the crashes. But going as fast as they can go can lead to crashes. Didn’t Herlings just wad it up on the start of a race last week?
Yeah Herlings could become a rider that never fulfilled his potential because of crashes(I think KR94 is heading towards that destiny), but we have to remember that last year was his first year. This is Tomacs 4th(?) year on a 450?
trevor310mx
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3/1/2018 10:20am
TDeath21 wrote:
Nobody racing now. Villopoto dominated on the 250. Didn’t just win. Dominated. At age 17-19. A near perfect SX season. Winning 9 races per MX season...
Nobody racing now. Villopoto dominated on the 250. Didn’t just win. Dominated. At age 17-19. A near perfect SX season. Winning 9 races per MX season. For you to be a superstar on the 450, you can’t just be winning on the 250. You need to dominate. Webb, Tomac, Roczen, etc. never dominated on the 250. Dominant races yes, but never were they head and shoulders above everyone for extended periods of time.
I agree. When I think of a talent that is sport changing, I think it should stem from their entire career, and sadly nobody right now has that. I give Forkner a slim chance, but I think he’s got too much competition. I’m hoping one of the up and coming amateurs will be it, some of them sure do look good...but we know how it can go.

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