New long travel KTM

kaboom645
Edited Date/Time 1/27/2012 12:05am
Just thought I would share. My trip to the racetrack was cut short tonight. Out in practice the rear end of the bike started acting funny and as I jumped a smaller tabletop the bike gave a sensation the rear wheel had come off mid air, and when I landed, the bike was bouncing like a pogo stick and riding extremely high in the back. I got back to the truck and as I lifted the bike onto the stand, the back tire never left the ground and the rear susp locked up over extended


I decided to go ahead and unbolt the shock and as I did, it came apart


It appears that the nut on the end of the shock shaft came undone and it allowed the shock to come apart.....I guess I can add to the list of the nuts and bolts that like to fall off KTM's. Luckily it appears there is minimal damage to the shock and the shaft so I shouldnt be out any $$ repairing it..I am a little pissed though as the bike is only a few weeks old.. Has anyone else had a PDS shock failure like this?
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WORCSRacer
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WORCSRacer 6/10/2010 9:39pm
6/10/2010 9:39pm
The upper shock bolts can fall out if you don't use red silicone on them. I haven't seen what happened to you though.
CamP
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CamP 6/10/2010 10:10pm
6/10/2010 10:10pm
The only time I've seen that happen is after a knucklehead performed a re-valve. If that shock hasn't been touched since it left the factory, you need to talk to your dealer about having KTM cover the expenses involved in the repairs.
kaboom645 6/10/2010 10:15pm
6/10/2010 10:15pm
CamP wrote:
The only time I've seen that happen is after a knucklehead performed a re-valve. If that shock hasn't been touched since it left the factory, you...
The only time I've seen that happen is after a knucklehead performed a re-valve. If that shock hasn't been touched since it left the factory, you need to talk to your dealer about having KTM cover the expenses involved in the repairs.
The bike is only 2 weeks old
super rat
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super rat 6/10/2010 10:25pm
6/10/2010 10:25pm
Why anyone would pay more for a KTM is beyond me.

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7GP
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7GP 6/10/2010 10:30pm
6/10/2010 10:30pm Edited Date/Time 6/10/2010 10:31pm
That's crazy. I know that that can happen in the situation that CamP described but I have never seen or heard of it actually happening. Your lucky that it didn't cause you to crash.
rockcrawlerdude 6/10/2010 10:38pm
6/10/2010 10:38pm
i had that happen on my 06 RMZ250 but it was the forks!!! something didnt feel right and i heard clanking so i took it easy as i rode around the track. the ONLY thing that saved me from certian disaster was the front brake line but yea when i got back i put it on the stand the front wheel stayed on the ground Shocked
Sunhouse
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Sunhouse 6/11/2010 3:27am
6/11/2010 3:27am
All KTM bike tests I´ve read say this can happen to the shock, silencer and rear sprocket fasteners too. Check them each ride and you´re good to go.
wreckitrandy
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wreckitrandy 6/11/2010 5:42am
6/11/2010 5:42am
The good news for you kaboom is that you weren't riding a Honda when that happened. As it is, your KTM has an actual WARRANTY.
newmann
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newmann 6/11/2010 6:01am
6/11/2010 6:01am Edited Date/Time 6/11/2010 6:02am
You might want to check the length of the bolts holding the lower handlebar clamps to the triple clamps. The ones on my kids KTM144 were too short. They offer two different lengths, but mine were neither of the ones offered. Only threaded in about 4mm and ripped out in a crash. Other than that, ours has been an excellent bike.
KTMRACER732 6/11/2010 6:12am
6/11/2010 6:12am
my friend's 250xc did the same thing. Evidently the people who worked on his shock forgot to tighten the nut and the shock broke in half, shooting the shock shaft through the airbox and almost through the seat. Luckily it was in a hare scramble so he wasn't jumping with it like that, it was pretty wicked
kaboom645 6/11/2010 7:02am
6/11/2010 7:02am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 11:22pm
super rat wrote:
Why anyone would pay more for a KTM is beyond me.
Pay more?.. The KTM 250sx is $400 cheaper than a YZ 250 retail....I only paid $4500 for this bike, and I bought it out of state(700 miles away) from an individual who ended up with alot of inventory from a dealer that went under, so warranty is questionable. I am going to talk to my local dealer today and see what they say.

Anyways I figured this was a freak thing but it doesnt appear the shock bolt had been peened. When I fix it I will take the TIG and just put a small tac weld on the nut.
newmann
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newmann 6/11/2010 7:07am
6/11/2010 7:07am
super rat wrote:
Why anyone would pay more for a KTM is beyond me.
Maybe for the fact that they make modern updated 2 strokes. Might just be all of the quality components that come on them.
YellowZonker 6/11/2010 7:20am
6/11/2010 7:20am
Sunhouse wrote:
All KTM bike tests I´ve read say this can happen to the shock, silencer and rear sprocket fasteners too. Check them each ride and you´re good...
All KTM bike tests I´ve read say this can happen to the shock, silencer and rear sprocket fasteners too. Check them each ride and you´re good to go.
This isn't the same thing that they talk about in the tests. Generally the bolt at the top of the shock that connects it to the frame is the one that comes loose.
kaboom645 6/11/2010 7:25am
6/11/2010 7:25am
Sunhouse wrote:
All KTM bike tests I´ve read say this can happen to the shock, silencer and rear sprocket fasteners too. Check them each ride and you´re good...
All KTM bike tests I´ve read say this can happen to the shock, silencer and rear sprocket fasteners too. Check them each ride and you´re good to go.
YellowZonker wrote:
This isn't the same thing that they talk about in the tests. Generally the bolt at the top of the shock that connects it to the...
This isn't the same thing that they talk about in the tests. Generally the bolt at the top of the shock that connects it to the frame is the one that comes loose.
Yes, the nut that holds the shock piston on the shaft (and essentially is what holds the shock together) came off, allowing the shock to come apart. The end of the shock shaft is supposed to be peeded over onto the nut, to prevent this sort of failure. As it was already mentioned, you usually only see this after a revalve, since that peening has to be ground off in order to gain access to the shim stack and piston
BIGHEAD1
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BIGHEAD1 6/11/2010 8:42am
6/11/2010 8:42am
1. There isn't peening on KTM's shock shafts.
2. The nut didn't fall off, the secondary piston stem came off that threads onto the shaft.Inside the shock will be a piston at the top of the shock then another piston that will be damaged, as well as all the shims. 90% chance your body is screwed as well as the needle and piston..or pistons. The sooner you noticed it the better. Most of the time when the shock falls apart it will stay together until you hit a jump and put you on your head. The more damaged the end of the shaft is the more screwed you are.
3. I have worked on a 100's of KTM's and I have never seen that happen. If the dealer doesn't do anything, I would call KTM USA. If the shock has never been apart the nut wasn't tightened or loctited.
sxf138
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sxf138 6/11/2010 9:06am
6/11/2010 9:06am
You guys are rediculous, and for goodness sake blaming the bike. Forst off glad you ok, couold have been worse. Second bolts come loose, especially if you ride mx. Check EVRYTHING after you clean your bike. We rebuild our bikes from the ground up, every 10 hours, lock tite everything. We also ride ktms and the bottom shock bolt has come loose on me before, but considering the pounding they go through it is not uncommon on any mx bike for stuff to come loose.

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RACEGUY
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RACEGUY 6/11/2010 9:13am
6/11/2010 9:13am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 11:22pm
If they are anything like KTM Canada, they will look after you, sketchy purchase history or not.

Imagine! - a competition bike that they will warranty.
oldx
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oldx 6/11/2010 10:29am
6/11/2010 10:29am
BIGHEAD1 wrote:
1. There isn't peening on KTM's shock shafts. 2. The nut didn't fall off, the secondary piston stem came off that threads onto the shaft.Inside the...
1. There isn't peening on KTM's shock shafts.
2. The nut didn't fall off, the secondary piston stem came off that threads onto the shaft.Inside the shock will be a piston at the top of the shock then another piston that will be damaged, as well as all the shims. 90% chance your body is screwed as well as the needle and piston..or pistons. The sooner you noticed it the better. Most of the time when the shock falls apart it will stay together until you hit a jump and put you on your head. The more damaged the end of the shaft is the more screwed you are.
3. I have worked on a 100's of KTM's and I have never seen that happen. If the dealer doesn't do anything, I would call KTM USA. If the shock has never been apart the nut wasn't tightened or loctited.
If it were mine, this is the advise I would listen to.
RACEGUY
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RACEGUY 6/11/2010 10:31am
6/11/2010 10:31am
BIGHEAD1 wrote:
1. There isn't peening on KTM's shock shafts. 2. The nut didn't fall off, the secondary piston stem came off that threads onto the shaft.Inside the...
1. There isn't peening on KTM's shock shafts.
2. The nut didn't fall off, the secondary piston stem came off that threads onto the shaft.Inside the shock will be a piston at the top of the shock then another piston that will be damaged, as well as all the shims. 90% chance your body is screwed as well as the needle and piston..or pistons. The sooner you noticed it the better. Most of the time when the shock falls apart it will stay together until you hit a jump and put you on your head. The more damaged the end of the shaft is the more screwed you are.
3. I have worked on a 100's of KTM's and I have never seen that happen. If the dealer doesn't do anything, I would call KTM USA. If the shock has never been apart the nut wasn't tightened or loctited.
oldx wrote:
If it were mine, this is the advise I would listen to.
x10
kaboom645 6/11/2010 10:45am
6/11/2010 10:45am
sxf138 wrote:
You guys are rediculous, and for goodness sake blaming the bike. Forst off glad you ok, couold have been worse. Second bolts come loose, especially if...
You guys are rediculous, and for goodness sake blaming the bike. Forst off glad you ok, couold have been worse. Second bolts come loose, especially if you ride mx. Check EVRYTHING after you clean your bike. We rebuild our bikes from the ground up, every 10 hours, lock tite everything. We also ride ktms and the bottom shock bolt has come loose on me before, but considering the pounding they go through it is not uncommon on any mx bike for stuff to come loose.
Maybe you should re-read... This wasnt a shock bolt that came loose, it was an internal nut INSIDE the shock that came off.. Doubtful many people are going to disassemble their shock every 10hrs to check that nut.
kaboom645 6/11/2010 10:50am
6/11/2010 10:50am
BIGHEAD1 wrote:
1. There isn't peening on KTM's shock shafts. 2. The nut didn't fall off, the secondary piston stem came off that threads onto the shaft.Inside the...
1. There isn't peening on KTM's shock shafts.
2. The nut didn't fall off, the secondary piston stem came off that threads onto the shaft.Inside the shock will be a piston at the top of the shock then another piston that will be damaged, as well as all the shims. 90% chance your body is screwed as well as the needle and piston..or pistons. The sooner you noticed it the better. Most of the time when the shock falls apart it will stay together until you hit a jump and put you on your head. The more damaged the end of the shaft is the more screwed you are.
3. I have worked on a 100's of KTM's and I have never seen that happen. If the dealer doesn't do anything, I would call KTM USA. If the shock has never been apart the nut wasn't tightened or loctited.
Matt, you by chance dont have a M13 x 1.0 die do you?... The shock shaft was undamaged other than a slight burr on the threads. I havent pulled the rest of the internals from the shock body yet, but looking into the shock bore it appears the body is undamaged. Bobby Williams (Pro Action) was at the track when it came apart and after looking at it it appeared that only the shim stack was damaged.
Jakes Dad
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Jakes Dad 6/11/2010 10:57am
6/11/2010 10:57am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 11:22pm
BIGHEAD1 wrote:
1. There isn't peening on KTM's shock shafts. 2. The nut didn't fall off, the secondary piston stem came off that threads onto the shaft.Inside the...
1. There isn't peening on KTM's shock shafts.
2. The nut didn't fall off, the secondary piston stem came off that threads onto the shaft.Inside the shock will be a piston at the top of the shock then another piston that will be damaged, as well as all the shims. 90% chance your body is screwed as well as the needle and piston..or pistons. The sooner you noticed it the better. Most of the time when the shock falls apart it will stay together until you hit a jump and put you on your head. The more damaged the end of the shaft is the more screwed you are.
3. I have worked on a 100's of KTM's and I have never seen that happen. If the dealer doesn't do anything, I would call KTM USA. If the shock has never been apart the nut wasn't tightened or loctited.
kaboom645 wrote:
Matt, you by chance dont have a M13 x 1.0 die do you?... The shock shaft was undamaged other than a slight burr on the threads...
Matt, you by chance dont have a M13 x 1.0 die do you?... The shock shaft was undamaged other than a slight burr on the threads. I havent pulled the rest of the internals from the shock body yet, but looking into the shock bore it appears the body is undamaged. Bobby Williams (Pro Action) was at the track when it came apart and after looking at it it appeared that only the shim stack was damaged.
He'll get back with you when he finds a nut for my kids shock shaft. The factory peening from Kawasaki was so shitty it ruined the nut and can't be reused.

Man that's just plain weird! Who knows how bad that could have been.
kaboom645 6/11/2010 11:07am
6/11/2010 11:07am
Jakes Dad wrote:
He'll get back with you when he finds a nut for my kids shock shaft. The factory peening from Kawasaki was so shitty it ruined the...
He'll get back with you when he finds a nut for my kids shock shaft. The factory peening from Kawasaki was so shitty it ruined the nut and can't be reused.

Man that's just plain weird! Who knows how bad that could have been.
I am just glad the problem didnt happen out at Steve's track last Saturday.. That place wouldnt have been to forgiving of this type of failure
Suns_PSD
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Suns_PSD 6/11/2010 11:11am
6/11/2010 11:11am
Glad your OK. That's a pretty freaky occurance.

My KTM has been ridden hard 1-2x per week at the track going on 3 years now and that bike has been so good to me. Never gives me any problems. But it is a 2 stroke and they vibrate so maintenance to double check bolts is always a good idea. (I realize that would not have made a difference in this case.)

KTM's don't cost anymore than Jap bikes which is amazing when you look at the quality of the end product.

BIGHEAD1
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BIGHEAD1 6/11/2010 11:17am
6/11/2010 11:17am
No I don't have a 13x1.0 die.. Anything odd is a pain in the ass to find.. You will basically have to get something shipped from overseas (and get raped for it). You are going to have to get a machinist to chase the threads, or machine the damaged portion of the threads away. As long as it is the first couple threads that are damaged, you should be ok. Be careful, as the threads are so fine on a KTM that I wouldn't remove too much or it might pull out as that nut deals with a ton of force on rebound. Anyone with a lathe can do that for you...

To be honest, I wouldn't touch it and let KTM warranty it out for you. If you start messing with things they might become suspicious. Regardless of how many hours are on it the only way that would happen would be if the nut was lose or someone else worked on it.They are an awesome company about that, and most likely will send you new parts or shock.
kaboom645 6/11/2010 11:24am
6/11/2010 11:24am
BIGHEAD1 wrote:
No I don't have a 13x1.0 die.. Anything odd is a pain in the ass to find.. You will basically have to get something shipped from...
No I don't have a 13x1.0 die.. Anything odd is a pain in the ass to find.. You will basically have to get something shipped from overseas (and get raped for it). You are going to have to get a machinist to chase the threads, or machine the damaged portion of the threads away. As long as it is the first couple threads that are damaged, you should be ok. Be careful, as the threads are so fine on a KTM that I wouldn't remove too much or it might pull out as that nut deals with a ton of force on rebound. Anyone with a lathe can do that for you...

To be honest, I wouldn't touch it and let KTM warranty it out for you. If you start messing with things they might become suspicious. Regardless of how many hours are on it the only way that would happen would be if the nut was lose or someone else worked on it.They are an awesome company about that, and most likely will send you new parts or shock.
I just put a call in to KTM and I am waiting to see what they say first.. Common sense says to wait and see if they will fix it for free... I have lathe and tooling to cut threads here, but its a PITA, and I didnt really want to buy a die for what would possibly be a single time use. It is only the first 2 threads that are damaged.
kaboom645 6/11/2010 11:43am
6/11/2010 11:43am
Local dealer just called me and asked me to bring the shock in to take some pictures to send to KTM.. They said most likely KTM was going to replace the entire shock for me.. I'll keep everybody updated
kaboom645 6/15/2010 8:17am
6/15/2010 8:17am
Just talked to my dealer again.. They are going to warranty the shock, so I should be back riding very soon... HUGE props to KTM for standing behind their product!

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