New 450 weight.

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3/25/2018 10:56 AM

I was out at rio bravo in Houston a few weeks ago and I rode my dads 2008 cr450 that has only a TI/CF exhaust a KYB swap and JM suspension revalve. Next I rode my friends 2018 cr 450 brand new stock. There was no question in my mind the 08 was faster. My dad is 65 and retired so his 08 CR is tuned perfect but my dad has also set up my friends suspension. The 2018 just felt like a fat pig with decent horsepower but as far as handling the 08 was much better to me and the 08 just looks tiny in comparison to the 2018.

What do yall think of the steady increasing weight of the bikes? The carborated 450s had plenty of power for me and I don't know about yall but I don't need electric start. When I crash in a race I'm not worried about getting the bike started for points I'm worried about making it to work.

I wish some manufacture would focus on weight and price besides KTM.

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3/25/2018 11:01 AM

Curb weight of the 07 CRF 450 was 227, with a dry weight of 218. New one curb weight is 238 I think? I agree weight is definitely trending in the wrong direction for the Japanese 450s...

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3/25/2018 11:02 AM

jsmi33966 wrote:

I was out at rio bravo in Houston a few weeks ago and I rode my dads 2008 cr450 that has only a TI/CF exhaust a KYB swap and ...more

Kawis are light and always sell cheap leftovers

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3/25/2018 11:20 AM

yz133rider wrote:

Kawis are light and always sell cheap leftovers

I just bough a 2018 kx450. I pretty much had to become a suspension expert but I am liking it. I just sold my 2014 KTM 300sx and I felt safer on it just because the weight of the 450. I swapped off of a triple yesterday and I'm on the couch and with crutches now with a hurt foot for 2 weeks probably.

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3/25/2018 11:32 AM
Edited Date/Time: 3/25/2018 11:35 AM

Not sure about your assessment. Have owned 05, 06, 08, 09, 10 (CRF450r's) models & recently picked up an 18. The power isn't even close as the 05-08 made about 52 hp atrw vs. the 17-18 about 58 hp..
The 05-08 feel bigger / heavier & don't turn as well as the 09+. The 18 might have gained some weight due to the ES (3-4 lb's), but the engineers did a very good job on how the weight is centralized & distributed. The 18 feels as light while in motion to a 17 1/2 KTM450sxf FE ridden.

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Speak softly and carry a big stick.

3/25/2018 11:51 AM

Its amazing how different people " feel" about the ergos, weight, etc about different bikes. This is no arguement with you by any means but i have owned/ rode/ raced many of the bikes you have just listed and " feel" the bikes are much different than you describe.

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3/25/2018 11:55 AM
Edited Date/Time: 3/25/2018 12:02 PM

walent215 wrote:

Its amazing how different people " feel" about the ergos, weight, etc about different bikes. This is no arguement with you by ...more

Yep. He sounds young & probably doesn't have the experience to really understand.

Believe it or not there are still people out there that feel the 08 CRF450r model is still the best 450 made. I owned one & never understood the hype. I actually liked the 06 out of the carbed models the best.

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Speak softly and carry a big stick.

3/25/2018 12:14 PM

H4L wrote:

Not sure about your assessment. Have owned 05, 06, 08, 09, 10 (CRF450r's) models & recently picked up an 18. The power ...more

Honestly I am not getting down with "it feels light". I would rather see a new bike come out and they say "it is light". That thing did not feel light to me it felt like a pig. But to each their own, I'm just sharing my experience I know my lap times were faster on the 08 may have been a 60 year old man set up and KYB suspension.

To me is like, from college physics Newtons law of motion still applies. I'm sure central mass helps but in Physics mass is mass does not matter if it "feels light".

Sorry for being a hater I love motocross and I know I was faster on the old bike.

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3/25/2018 12:17 PM

H4L wrote:

Yep. He sounds young & probably doesn't have the experience to really understand.

Believe it or not there are still ...more

Weren't the 06 and the 08 the same generation frame just cam and ignition changes right? I could be wrong

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3/25/2018 12:18 PM

H4L wrote:

Yep. He sounds young & probably doesn't have the experience to really understand.

Believe it or not there are still ...more

Actually i was referring to your opinions on the noted bikes.

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3/25/2018 12:24 PM

jsmi33966 wrote:

Honestly I am not getting down with "it feels light". I would rather see a new bike come out and they say "it is light". That ...more

The bikes aren't being ridden or raced on the scales. No need to apologize, but 6 hp is a big difference & really noticeable between the 2 models. If you feel faster on the 08 than that's your statement being made on social media so it has to be taken with a grain of salt from my position.

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Speak softly and carry a big stick.

3/25/2018 12:25 PM

walent215 wrote:

Actually i was referring to your opinions on the noted bikes.

LOL ! I stand by my statements & comments..

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Speak softly and carry a big stick.

3/25/2018 12:26 PM

jsmi33966 wrote:

Weren't the 06 and the 08 the same generation frame just cam and ignition changes right? I could be wrong

Yes. The 05-08 were the same gen. 450 with the 08 having some refinements.

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Speak softly and carry a big stick.

3/25/2018 12:29 PM

H4L wrote:

Yep. He sounds young & probably doesn't have the experience to really understand.

Believe it or not there are still ...more

walent215 wrote:

Actually i was referring to your opinions on the noted bikes.

H4L wrote:

LOL ! I stand by my statements & comments..

Lol...likewise. i have rode/ owned some of the earlier hondas that i didnt care for and others that were excellent because of setup. Setup is the key on any bike regardless of year, make, model , curb weight etc

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3/25/2018 12:31 PM

jsmi33966 wrote:

I was out at rio bravo in Houston a few weeks ago and I rode my dads 2008 cr450 that has only a TI/CF exhaust a KYB swap and ...more

I don't know, but my 2008 big bore CRF 480 LIKES this thread!

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3/25/2018 12:43 PM

walent215 wrote:

Its amazing how different people " feel" about the ergos, weight, etc about different bikes. This is no arguement with you by ...more

I have found that guys that have just committed time and money to a new bike of their choice, will only say that its the best thing since sliced bread. Only after many years have past will they admit it was not that good.

But really now......even if your riding the 'worst' machine of the bunch.......your still riding and having fun on a pretty sweet dirt bike. Every one of them regardless of color, is a hoot to ride..

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3/25/2018 12:44 PM

Also motocross is 1/4 of what it was in the late 90s where I live, I grew up in Houston and now I live by South Padre Island.

Where do yall think our sport would be if the AMA banned efi and electric start? What would the prices be like? the number of tracks and turn out at tracks?

Can you imagine the weight of a ktm 450 without e start and efi? That thing would probably feel like a feather around the race track

Is that extra power really all from efi? maybe it is.

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3/25/2018 12:48 PM

vetmxr wrote:

I have found that guys that have just committed time and money to a new bike of their choice, will only say that its the best ...more

I agree dude I am down with people riding 125s right now. I want one bad, that was the funnest years of racing for me. Bring back the 125 class and lets all just worry about making it to work on Monday without crutches.

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3/25/2018 1:04 PM

vetmxr wrote:

I have found that guys that have just committed time and money to a new bike of their choice, will only say that its the best ...more

Most definitely! I just sold my 17 crf450rx that had a few nice mods. It was not near as nice as the bone stock 16.5 ktm 450fe i rode. I still probably wouldn't buy a ktm for my own reasons but it felt way better than my Honda.

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3/25/2018 1:21 PM

Shoulda tried the fastest ignition setting.....no way that old bike is faster than the 2018.

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3/25/2018 1:36 PM

jsmi33966 wrote:

Honestly I am not getting down with "it feels light". I would rather see a new bike come out and they say "it is light". That ...more

In the industry its referred to mass centralization but in physics its technically angular momentum.or the effects of angular momentum on the machine. Depending on the location of the mass combined with rotation/movement, the forces created can be extremely different feeling.

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3/25/2018 1:56 PM

kkawboy14 wrote:

Shoulda tried the fastest ignition setting.....no way that old bike is faster than the 2018.

You really don't need to. With the standard map# 1 the power difference is noticeable enough. With the aggressive map # 3 with out a doubt the 05-08 carbed models aren't in the same league powerwise.

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Speak softly and carry a big stick.

3/25/2018 1:56 PM

I never understand the weight thing. I could ride a 350lb bike and then jump on a 450lb bike and literally feel no difference. Cant imagine how sensitive you need to be to feel 10lbs.

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3/25/2018 2:21 PM

kkawboy14 wrote:

Shoulda tried the fastest ignition setting.....no way that old bike is faster than the 2018.

H4L wrote:

You really don't need to. With the standard map# 1 the power difference is noticeable enough. With the aggressive map # 3 with ...more

The carbureted bikes felt faster because of their power characteristics but they are not.

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Born in Prague,living in LA,so if you don't like my spelling,blow me!

21 CRF450R
16 Yamaha YXZ 1000R
17 Yamaha MT-10 FZ-10 165 Hp RWP
06 CRF450X street legal supermoto
96 CR250R smoker
2012 CR500AF
2003 KLX110 mod




3/25/2018 2:22 PM

jsmi33966 wrote:

I was out at rio bravo in Houston a few weeks ago and I rode my dads 2008 cr450 that has only a TI/CF exhaust a KYB swap and ...more

yz133rider wrote:

Kawis are light and always sell cheap leftovers

jsmi33966 wrote:

I just bough a 2018 kx450. I pretty much had to become a suspension expert but I am liking it. I just sold my 2014 KTM 300sx ...more

Damn! Heal up bub, sorry to hear about that....

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3/25/2018 2:33 PM

H4L wrote:

Not sure about your assessment. Have owned 05, 06, 08, 09, 10 (CRF450r's) models & recently picked up an 18. The power ...more

Whelp Ive owned (2) 05 CRF450’s which are incredibly close to identical to the 08 CRF450 and like Bill Lumburg “Yea umm im gonna sorta have to uh disagree with you in this” i 100% agree with the statements made by the OP. Btw the 2009 CRF450 was thought to be lighter but actually gained 7-8lbs over the 2005-2008 Generation CRF450 strictly due to the addition of EFI and that bike overall was built as light as possible to mitigate the (on average) 10lb weight gain of adding EFI to the 4 strokes AND in and effort to focus on weight loss (thanks to EFI) the Honda CRF450 in 2009 went to that 4 spring clutch design and was literally the worst clutch in modern mx bike history. Not to mention they were so focused on lightening the bike they forgot to focus on bike geometry bec that 2009 CRF450 handled like muff-cabbage and back to back with the bike it replaced, the 2009 was severly lacking HP. Ergonomically speaking the 2009 was a slimmer and SMALLER bike so yes it was slimmer but in retrospect to the 2017 i looked at, no the new 2017/2018 isnt slimmer than the 2008, its about the same.

The buying public demanded EFI... as a result, the 450’s across the board gained on average 10lbs. NOW some crazy sort of human evolution mustve happened bec all of a sudden its become unbearable for some people to have to kickstart their bikes.... once again the buying public got what they wanted, electric start is standard and .... yep, you guessed it, bikes gained ANOTHER 10lbs ... so the japanese bikes have gained roughly 20 unanswered pounds for 2 modern advancements. There is your difference of 20lbs as stated by the OP. Personally I don’t agree with either these two advances although EFI was probably a necessity just for the simple fact of Supercross safety to avoid the boooog, outdoors not so much. One thing I’ve noticed is the heavier the bike the more violent the impact of a crash that just an opinion though and I don’t ride 4 strokes anymore I ride 2 strokes bec i didnt care even for the lighter and carbureted non electric start bikes. Apparently im for sure in the minority though as the general consensus of people buying bikes nowadays are that they are great and I don’t disagree they are great but at what cost they have gained 20 pounds from bike that was already heavier then the 2 strokes they replaced back in the day.

Only KTM/Husky has made a real consorted effort to put forth making their bikes lighter year by year and their MSRP cost is evident of that. Actually Kawasaki deserves a tip of the hat to this as well when they released their 2016 KX450 dropping 7.5lbs almost putting them ina class by themselves between the Austrians and their fellow Japanese competition.

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3/25/2018 2:53 PM

Lightning78 wrote:

Whelp Ive owned (2) 05 CRF450’s which are incredibly close to identical to the 08 CRF450 and like Bill Lumburg “Yea umm im ...more

Good post about weight. I've owned 1of each of the last 3 gens ( 07, 10, and 17). I disagree with the original poster a little. I LOVE my 07. Been riding and fixing it for 10 years now, over 300 hours on the original trans. The bike is good, and the chassis is fantastic. I broke in my leftover 17 last weekend, and this bike feels like a rocketship compared to the 07. The 08 only handled slightly different due to the trans sensor and the steering damper. I've ridden an 18crf and I can feel the extra 20 lbs vs an 07/08. I will say though, a 17 with a kickstarter, whatever I feel in weight is more than offset by a perfectly running 450fi motor. My carbed bike would sputter and stall going between 70 degree sea level and 3000 feet 90 degrees. I got tired of fucking with jets all the time, and didn't want to dump another 1000+ into a rebuild on a 300+ hour bike

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3/25/2018 3:02 PM
Edited Date/Time: 3/25/2018 3:03 PM

H4L wrote:

Not sure about your assessment. Have owned 05, 06, 08, 09, 10 (CRF450r's) models & recently picked up an 18. The power ...more

Lightning78 wrote:

Whelp Ive owned (2) 05 CRF450’s which are incredibly close to identical to the 08 CRF450 and like Bill Lumburg “Yea umm im ...more

This talk about ktm prices being higher than others is such shit. Msrp is like 400 more than the other brands.

Yes some of the other brands cant sell theirs to save their lives so they get blown out year after year but can get deals on ktms also...

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3/25/2018 3:53 PM

Lightning78 wrote:

Whelp Ive owned (2) 05 CRF450’s which are incredibly close to identical to the 08 CRF450 and like Bill Lumburg “Yea umm im ...more

Not to start a debate here, but according to this MX mag the 09+ was 2lbs. lighter than the 05-08's. I added a Ti / Ti Yosh RS4 system that reduced an extra 3-4 lbs.. So a 09-10 owned were about 6 lbs. lighter than the 05-08's owned & it could be felt. A good friend didn't believe me either till we went out & test rode my 08 & 10 back to back.

(6) Weight. Suddenly, the manufacturers are reporting the bike’s weight as “curb weight” (with a full tank of gas). This makes sense from a practical standpoint, but doesn’t mesh with the last 40 years of weighing bikes (tank empty). Honda’s reported curb weight is 234.8 pounds. We weighed our CRF450 the AMA way and it came in at 226.5 pounds (about two pounds less than in 2008)

https://motocrossactionmag.com/2009-honda-crf450-suspension-settings-jetting-specs-likes-dislikes-plus-much-more/

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Speak softly and carry a big stick.

3/25/2018 4:12 PM
Edited Date/Time: 3/25/2018 5:37 PM

Lightning78 wrote:

Whelp Ive owned (2) 05 CRF450’s which are incredibly close to identical to the 08 CRF450 and like Bill Lumburg “Yea umm im ...more

Even though the topic is not about the 09 + compared to the 05-08. The handling of the 05-08 vs. the 09 in stock form wasn't close off the showroom floor. The 09-10 from the showroom floor needed some work in the suspension dept. to get them to work better. If you invested some time & money you were rewarded with a better bike than the 05-08 models.

The 09 had MDK suspension with a remap done & the 10 had FC suspension work with a Yosh Ti RS4 / remap. With mods these bikes were more than capable for mx use vs. what they came from the showroom floor.

Here is a pipe shoot out on the 09 CRF450r with the bike making about 55 hp. That's a respectable # for the average mx rider - racer. I certainly can't use the full potential of the 450 power even in stock form let alone with mods..

https://motocrossactionmag.com/we-test-2009-honda-crf450-exhaust-systems-dr-d-pro-circuit-fmf-yoshimura-vance-hines-and-stock-get-the-dyno-sound-and-powerband-treatment/

The stock oem canister exhaust on the 09-12 was severely corked. Once the 09+ efi engine was uncorked it made good power & was able to rev up top. With a remap to compliment the aftermarket exhaust it was icing on the cake.


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Speak softly and carry a big stick.