MXGP Italy - 250s, 14 Riders shy of a Full Gate, very, very, very Sad!!!

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6/17/2018 3:59 PM

Even serious Race series can't fill a 40 Rider Gate! 4-Strokes are KILLING the Sport! COST, COST, COST!

Solution, allow "250 2-Strokes" to compete in the Class!!

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SDT-YZ ESR 325

Keep It Simple Stupid (KISS)

6/17/2018 4:05 PM

70 rider EMX250 field... where is your logic? And 250 2T are allowed in EMX... and there is 1.

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6/17/2018 4:08 PM

philG wrote:

70 rider EMX250 field... where is your logic? And 250 2T are allowed in EMX... and there is 1.

Bingo. The age rule is the biggest contributor to the low entries. That and the cost of racing MX2 vs. EMX.

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Old MXer turned Superfan.

6/17/2018 4:16 PM

Question?

Do you Want the Sport to Grow?

If you do, riders should be able to Race 250 2-Ts against 250 4-Ts in the all Classes! If this happened how many EMX 250 Riders would move to MXGP-2?

COST is the driving factor.

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SDT-YZ ESR 325

Keep It Simple Stupid (KISS)

6/17/2018 4:27 PM

The thing killing the 250 class for me is the 23 year old age limit

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6/17/2018 4:28 PM

The thing killing the 250 class for me is the 23 year old age limit

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6/17/2018 4:32 PM
Edited Date/Time: 6/17/2018 4:45 PM

SDTony YZ ESR 325 wrote:

Question?

Do you Want the Sport to Grow?

If you do, riders should be able to Race 250 2-Ts against 250 4-Ts in the all ...more

Probably... none! As it stands, very few racers use a 250 two stroke in the EMX250 class as it is bro. Why would they 'move up' if the rules were changed for the MX2 class? Cost is the driving factor, but from an entry fee/travel/age perspective and not a 2/4 stroke decision! Sorry to break it to you, but it's over Jonny!

... and whilst 26 riders on the gate isn't great, I prefer quality over quantity! Granted if YS weren't so greedy, we could probably have both but we are where we are. In any case, I'd rather see 26 decent riders over a bunch of moving roadblocks when the leaders come to lap like we saw at High Point. Heck, a dude got lapped 5 times in the 250 class yesterday! Shocking!

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6/17/2018 4:34 PM

SDTony YZ ESR 325 wrote:

Question?

Do you Want the Sport to Grow?

If you do, riders should be able to Race 250 2-Ts against 250 4-Ts in the all ...more

Actually, the age rule is killing MX2 as many of the top entries in EMX are over 23. Secondly, they choose to race EMX to chases whole championship (it only races in Europe, thus the E, while MX2 has Fly always that are local expensive to go to.)

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6/17/2018 4:36 PM

No prize money is killing the GPs, little doubles in sx are killing U.S. riders!

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6/17/2018 4:42 PM
Edited Date/Time: 6/17/2018 4:42 PM

Shouldn't the honchos be embarrassed with a turnout like this? Especially a continental race. Doesn't exactly exude professional and attract outside interest(imo anyway), pretty sad. I would have to think DC would be mortified if that happened here.

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vomiting equals disqualification.

6/17/2018 5:04 PM

Maybe there would be more riders if they had a prize pool and you didn't have to pay a 500 euro start fee cash, no receipt for a starter wink

The moto-mob still going strong with with the MXGP cool

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- The Oracle

6/17/2018 7:27 PM

SDTony YZ ESR 325 wrote:

Question?

Do you Want the Sport to Grow?

If you do, riders should be able to Race 250 2-Ts against 250 4-Ts in the all ...more

St Ann More wrote:

Probably... none! As it stands, very few racers use a 250 two stroke in the EMX250 class as it is bro. Why would they 'move ...more

I agree the Entry Fee/Travel is driving the reduction in Riders, but the 23 and below age makes it EVEN more of a problem based on overall cost to go racing and produce results that would get them a Sponser in the first place.

These very young guys do not have a lot of time on the track and cannot show there capability when it cost $7,000 for just a competitive engine let alone another $6,000 to $12,000 for competitive suspension. All cost ADD up, therefore all MX Fans should support getting more riders in the show.

However I am a big F1 Fan, and where I see this going is "NO MXGP 250 Class on TV", only 450. F1 has 11 Manufactures to produce the big show with 22 cars, why would MXGP show anything but 450's on TV.

It ------will not in the future!

Below is an MXA article to understand why some of us say to hell with the Manufacturers pushing expensive technology, we will bypass them.

Article comment....................MXA

Heavy, expensive, complicated four-strokes are "not the ultimate motocross machinery". Four-strokes are closer to "agricultural equipment" than racing weapons. Contrary to popular belief—pound for pound, cubic centimeter for cubic centimeter and head to head—the "Two-stroke is the ultimate motocross racing engine"!

https://motocrossactionmag.com/we-ride-l-a-sleeves-yamaha-yz300-rip-grip-big-bore-kit/

MXA Article
TWO VS. FOUR SHOOTOUT: YZ250 TWO-STROKE VS. YZ250F FOUR-STROKE
https://motocrossactionmag.com/bikes-yz250-two-stroke-vs-yz250f-four-stroke/


Choosing a YZ250 or YZ250F depends on your goals as a motocross racer, but even more significantly on how deep your pockets are. Building a full-race YZ250F four-stroke cost us $7000 more than building a full-race YZ250 two-stroke.


Photo

Photo


Support your Sport! The OEM's sell far fewer MX bikes today than ever before!

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SDT-YZ ESR 325

Keep It Simple Stupid (KISS)

6/17/2018 7:37 PM
Edited Date/Time: 6/17/2018 7:47 PM

BR8ES wrote:

Shouldn't the honchos be embarrassed with a turnout like this? Especially a continental race. Doesn't exactly exude ...more

Luongo embarrassed by this?

Well, no, that mongrel seems immune to embarrassment. He's tried to have / has had 30 rider gates in the rule book for the main classes before.

I hate to sound like I even slightly agree with the pricks ideas, but when you've got an EMX class as well, you've a hell of a lot of 250 riders at the event.

That people such as the OP, and others, inevitably Americans, don't seem to register that, is a bit puzzling.

2 strokes in MX2 - well Yes , Equivalency at the highest level in both MX2 and MXGP ( And the US Nationals ) Should be in place. This Bullshit Four Stroke Handicap class racing, at the highest (well, all) levels needs to be done with.

Equivalency is the only way you'll get more 2ts in the GPs - be it the EMX250 class or the World Championship classes. Many of the riders have GP aspirations, and they / their backers need / have to be on 4ts . Well even if they are mainly doing their and others Nationals. . You , your Team race what you get the backing for, and are allowed to race.

Equivalency.- No Age Limit, it's such BS, that drives away so many competitors / teams, to just then do Nationals - Lower Entry Fees - Prize/ Start money - And decent / real travel assistance for fly away rounds. With the 2 Chinese rounds next year, it's even more of a burden. Luongo / Youthstream need to think past their own arses / wallets.

Go have a look, a few of you, and see the entries for the fabled Carlsbad USGP - it always had a Lot of GP regulars not attenting. It cost a shitload back in the day to travel.

And hell, the Canadian SX rounds were often very lightly attended, and that was just across the border - yet plenty of Americans didn't do it.

Hell, weren't a few SX rounds this year fairly 'light on' for 450 entries? A domestic World Championships, you'd think, would have plenty of entries.

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6/17/2018 7:41 PM

BR8ES wrote:

Shouldn't the honchos be embarrassed with a turnout like this? Especially a continental race. Doesn't exactly exude ...more

Bearuno wrote:

Luongo embarrassed by this?

Well, no, that mongrel seems immune to embarrassment. He's tried to have / has had 30 rider gates ...more

Fair enough mate, hard to argue your points. Seems like fans think it is bad, but the organisers don't, so business as usual.

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vomiting equals disqualification.

6/17/2018 8:05 PM

BR8ES wrote:

Fair enough mate, hard to argue your points. Seems like fans think it is bad, but the organisers don't, so business as usual. ...more

Hey, at least Luongo The Drongo has allowed Equivalency in EMX250. It's a start. But, you'll only ever get the One or Two out there, whilst the World Championships class is a 4 Stroke Handicap Class.

At the 2009 FIM Congress, Equivalency was put into place for the 2010 World 250 Championships.

But, it 'disappeared' before the start of the season. Strange , that...........

Equivalency racing gives Great racing.

Not a monotone race event. It's fantastic to see and hear Equivalency racing.

2ts won't devastate the 4ts.

And, with the main manufacturers attitude to 2ts and their marketing / making products they want to make, the 4ts will be the majority of bikes out there, and the ones that do the majority of winning. They aren't granddad's trail bike engines anymore. Haven't been for nearly 2 decades now.

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6/17/2018 10:18 PM

SDTony YZ ESR 325 wrote:

Question?

Do you Want the Sport to Grow?

If you do, riders should be able to Race 250 2-Ts against 250 4-Ts in the all ...more

You are partially correct. Cost is a factor, but it isn't the cost of bike for the racer.

It's the cost that Youthstream charges for a "team" to field riders, and the difficulty of a single rider entering events. A rider can't just turn up at an event and enter, nor can they simply turn in a privateer application sometime before the event.

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6/17/2018 10:22 PM

How much does a MXGP Pro license and a entry fee cost?? Isn’t it a crazy number?

I still can’t believe there’s no purse money at all and no matter what there’s no excuse in my book for that. Look how many fans are at those races and they sure as shit didn’t come to watch Luongo Large-pockets!!

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6/17/2018 10:34 PM

much ty for this very insightful thread

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6/18/2018 12:02 AM

Last time I checked the entry fees were €1000 for the GP and €300 for EMX. I doubt those costs have reduced.

What I find crazy is that 100 or more 250s show up between the two classes yet 30 don’t get to race despite there being empty gates in the GP class.

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6/18/2018 1:06 AM

Chris O'Neal wrote:

How much does a MXGP Pro license and a entry fee cost?? Isn’t it a crazy number?

I still can’t believe there’s no purse money ...more

Entry Fees: 900euros for MX2 and EMX is only 300euros I know which class I would rather race in silly

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6/18/2018 1:15 AM

Reasons why don't see a full field in MX2:

1. If you are above 23 you are not allowed
2. If you are under 23 but not in an official team you can only rely on wildcards. As a privateer expect to not be allowed at multiple EU gp's.
3. The entry fee for 3 GP's equals the fee for teh full emx season (11 races)

In addition you have other reasons like some people prefer to do a full championship (compared to missing overseas gp's), talent from emx125s are better of adapting to 250f's in a 'lesser' championship, etc. etc.

Finally, this has nothing to do with 2-strokes vs. 4 strokes and the costs of those. 70 entries in EMX250 and only 1 250 2-stroke.

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6/18/2018 1:23 AM

roninho wrote:

Reasons why don't see a full field in MX2:

1. If you are above 23 you are not allowed
2. If you are under 23 but not in an ...more

This^

Now, close the thread.

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6/18/2018 1:31 AM

70 riders and only one 250T...haha, I’m sure he is having ‘fun’ though.

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6/18/2018 1:38 AM
Edited Date/Time: 6/18/2018 1:40 AM

Why does everyone have such a hard-on for a 40 rider gate? I mean if all 40 are fast, then cool, but look at the 450's in the US nationals. Lappers are completely horrible, every race there are riders just rolling around at the end doing laps 20-30 seconds a lap slower than the leaders.

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6/18/2018 1:51 AM
Edited Date/Time: 6/18/2018 1:52 AM

There was over 30 at the start of the weekend, it's still not perfect , but it's bearable. Injuries and the heat took its toll over the weekend to dwindle the field for the last moto. It looked worse than it was, but I've long said that they should do away with age rules and EMX250 and just run MX2 the same as they run the EMX250 class. Make it cheap to enter and make people qualify

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6/18/2018 1:54 AM

Andy_Greenney wrote:

70 riders and only one 250T...haha, I’m sure he is having ‘fun’ though.

That's James Dunn, one of your compatriots. Good to see the GL12 team still out there. I thought they we done after last year.

Didn't he win, or at least podium OA the French round of EMX250 on his 2t last year? And, got protested, so a strip down was performed?........

I've only caught up with the 1st EMX250 race - he seemed to have a shocker in that one. And, had to come through the LCQ (2nd in that) to get a start.

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6/18/2018 2:34 AM

SDTony YZ ESR 325 wrote:

Question?

Do you Want the Sport to Grow?

If you do, riders should be able to Race 250 2-Ts against 250 4-Ts in the all ...more

St Ann More wrote:

Probably... none! As it stands, very few racers use a 250 two stroke in the EMX250 class as it is bro. Why would they 'move ...more

SDTony YZ ESR 325 wrote:

I agree the Entry Fee/Travel is driving the reduction in Riders, but the 23 and below age makes it EVEN more of a problem ...more

Ask yourself this, why do 97% in the EMX250 class race a 250f instead of a 250t? Then answer your own question, how many would move up if the rule was changed for MX2?

As I said, 'probably... none' and that whilst cost is a factor, it is 'from an 'entry fee/travel/age perspective and not a 2/4 stroke decision'.

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6/18/2018 2:37 AM

EnvyMedia wrote:

Why does everyone have such a hard-on for a 40 rider gate? I mean if all 40 are fast, then cool, but look at the 450's in the ...more

I get what you are saying, and i would agree if the 10 guys that would be added to get to a 40 man gate would be slower then the 30 who lined up in Italy.

However, that is not the case. There are a bunch of guys in EMX250 who are faster then guys currently scoring points in MX2. A guy like Freek van de Vlist is racing EMX250 this year, and hasnt scored a top 10 in the series, but did score 50 points and a top 10 at valkenswaard last year in MX2.


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6/18/2018 3:07 AM
Edited Date/Time: 6/18/2018 3:07 AM

DoubleA wrote:

Entry Fees: 900euros for MX2 and EMX is only 300euros I know which class I would rather race in silly

yes but the highlights package sent out does not include emx footage.
those 450 and 250 highlights get a lot of exposure, even used on generic sports shows.

loubongo knows that, the sponsors see that

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6/18/2018 3:19 AM

make1go wrote:

yes but the highlights package sent out does not include emx footage.
those 450 and 250 highlights get a lot of exposure, ...more

Someone has mentioned it somewhere here but you can race the whole EMX250 series for the price of 3 MX2 races (if you enter all the races you get a discounted price same with MX2 & MXGP). Which do you think sponsors would rather pay for? You ride whatever your sponsor pays for.

I don't know how much but someone will know the cost of flying a bike around to all the MX2 races, its sure going to be a lot more than driving a van around Europe.

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