Leatt Helmet doesn't look good at this crash...

roninho
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2/18/2019 6:33am Edited Date/Time 2/18/2019 6:36am
If i go to Revzilla and filter on dirt bike helmets and SNELL M2015 certified i get 66 helmets from 7 manufacturers ranging from $124 to $700. That's still like searching a a needle in a haystick to find the best helmet. And that's based on go for Snell over Dott because kb228 said so on Vital... (You might be right, i don't know, just trying to point out that there is so little object data out there)
roninho
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2/18/2019 6:35am
roninho wrote:
First of all i hope Brad recovers quickly. And I have not seen the accident so cannot comment on the Leatt helmet. Having said that, imo...
First of all i hope Brad recovers quickly. And I have not seen the accident so cannot comment on the Leatt helmet.

Having said that, imo there is a need for a new objective 'safety ranking system' in the MX helmet industry.
If i look for a helmet and visit one of the bigger online retailers (regardless of which retailer) they offer a bunch of different makes and there is no way to objectively view which helmets offer the best protection. Basically all helmets above $ 100 are snell approved and then you have 30 makes, 100 models and price ranges from $100 to $800. But no way to see testdata or some kind of ranking (a to e or whatever).
OtotheB178 wrote:
they should put rankings like they do for energy efficiency on nearly all electrical items/windows/insulation/homes. Good idea! Would also encourage companies to increase the safety of...
they should put rankings like they do for energy efficiency on nearly all electrical items/windows/insulation/homes.
Good idea!
Would also encourage companies to increase the safety of their cheaper units as well, forcing competition and then the consumer would benefit from better tech at lower price points!
Yeah i agree. Just bought some led ligthing and it has a nice scale from inefficent to very efficient. Something similar would be very helpfull.
2/18/2019 6:51am
I know you aren't that old dude, I'm just finding it hard to picture an Arai with a blown out chinbar... pics or it didn't happen.
The Arai is specifically designed with a curved chin bar so in the event of a crash where it breaks, the broken portion will go outside of the helmet and not into your face. It’s not that uncommon for a helmet to break. Built right into the design.
ML512
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2/18/2019 6:57am
Sir wrote:
Never heard of Aria helmets. Arai on the other hand would learn from that malfunction and adjust design/manufacturing to ensure the best they could that would...
Never heard of Aria helmets. Arai on the other hand would learn from that malfunction and adjust design/manufacturing to ensure the best they could that would not happen again.

The concept might be the same as cars but then vehicle manufactures have considerably more material to work with. You may have noticed that automobiles are much larger than what they were back in the 80's/90's. What is considered a small car today would have been family size three decades ago. That concept cannot be used in helmet manufacture as you will end up with shell sizes that are way to big in comparison to the riders head, that in its self would be a hazard for the rider.

I would much rather suffer a concussion and have NO intrusion through the shell verses a helmet that has all the bells and whistles regarding MIPS and other absorption technologies but allows a foreign object to pierce the shell and through the skull. I think that has the bigger potential for a more brain damaging injury compared to a concussion, don't you?
After four knockouts in Arai and a year period of struggling to hold conversations with short term memory loss I swore off them. Thanks to my gig I’ve been lucky enough to visit MIPS lab, visit Bell’s test facility, chat endlessly with the 6D crew, meet the doctor behind Rheon, and see a ton of test results from all kinds of brands when they test each other’s helmets...I wasn’t impressed with what I saw on the Arai.

If your main focus is keeping an object from piercing the shell, the Arai is a good way to go, it’s stiff...very stiff...if you’re actually worried about the condition of your brain, my personal opinion is there are many other options in the market that’ll keep that part much safer.
13

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scrallex
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2/18/2019 6:58am
Question wrote:
I do too call it bollocks as the energy transfered to the brain is similar.



You clearly haven't spent years studying physics to understand that energy is finite and conserved in any closed system. This means that there is a fixed amount of energy that will be distributed to the path of least resistance. If the helmet holds up, yes, not all of it will go to the skull/face/brain, but a lot of it will. If the helmet crumpled, you can calculate the exact amount of energy that was diverted AWAY from the rider through the strength of the materials that deformed/broke and the extent at which they broke.

At the end of the day, the helmet diverted a substantial amount of energy away from rider through crumpling/breaking. This is not always the best way to keep the rider safe, but there are certain situations where this is preferable to the helmet staying together. I'm not saying that he would have been better off if the helmet were designed differently and didn't break apart, as I did not see the incident nor good photos of the areas of the helmet that broke. However, you can't look at the broken helmet and definitively say that he was better off in a helmet that wouldn't have snapped under the same circumstances.

Note: No two crashes are the same. Even though eye-witnesses state that it was a fairly low-speed crash, many of us know that sometimes those crashes cause more damage than you would expect. I would consider the rider very lucky to be leaving the facility with full consciousness (enough to post a selfie after the fact). Hoping for a speedy recovery for the rider and, if he were using their 2nd tier helmet, he opts for the top of the line model from here on out because he clearly has the talent to warrant it.
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ML512
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2/18/2019 6:58am
The Arai is specifically designed with a curved chin bar so in the event of a crash where it breaks, the broken portion will go outside...
The Arai is specifically designed with a curved chin bar so in the event of a crash where it breaks, the broken portion will go outside of the helmet and not into your face. It’s not that uncommon for a helmet to break. Built right into the design.
Depends on the impact though, the one I fractured went inwards.
kb228
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2/18/2019 6:59am
roninho wrote:
If i go to Revzilla and filter on dirt bike helmets and SNELL M2015 certified i get 66 helmets from 7 manufacturers ranging from $124 to...
If i go to Revzilla and filter on dirt bike helmets and SNELL M2015 certified i get 66 helmets from 7 manufacturers ranging from $124 to $700. That's still like searching a a needle in a haystick to find the best helmet. And that's based on go for Snell over Dott because kb228 said so on Vital... (You might be right, i don't know, just trying to point out that there is so little object data out there)
Its not hard. The fly formula, f2 carbon, bell moto 9, and shoeis are all snell rated and have rotation protection technology like MIPS.

Theres no argument to purchase a $150 DOT helmet over one of those if money is not a factor. Anyone can see that.
2/18/2019 7:09am
ML512 wrote:
Depends on the impact though, the one I fractured went inwards.
Obviously. Just stating that they incorporated that into the design intentionally.
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drt410
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2/18/2019 7:13am Edited Date/Time 2/18/2019 9:48am
ML512 wrote:
Ummm, I shattered one side of a chin bar out on an Aria.
drt410 wrote:
What about this then ^^ Thats why I said its a compromise. You compromise the longevity of the helmet for it to crack in places that...
What about this then ^^


Thats why I said its a compromise. You compromise the longevity of the helmet for it to crack in places that otherwise would have been your skull. The crash impact forces were apparently so high that if this were transferred to his skull/brain hed be muuuch more jacked up than a broken nose and some cuts.

We dont know the forces involved here, but like I said Id rather have some cuts and a destroyed helmet that be in a coma. Leatt makes high quality products and they have stringent safety standards to meet.

Wed have to see how severe the crash was. The interior is meant to disperse the impact but theres only so much a couple inches of foam can do with extreme forces involved. The shell is there to protect the skull from fractures. If the helmet fractures it means your skull would have fractured. These helmets have to meet stringent safety standards. Its illegal for Leatt to sell a POS helmet that doesnt meet safety standards and will explode in normal crashes. This will happen if forces are beyond what a little foam can do.

Its the same concept as crumple zones in a car. The energy HAS to be absorbed somewhere. In a severe crash the car will be destroyed, but all that destruction absorbs energy that otherwise would have been transfered right through the occupants. What would you rather... a car that can survive crashes in tact but the people inside are scrambled eggs or a car that crumples, absorbs energy, and is destroyed, but everybody survives with minor injuries?
Sir wrote:
Never heard of Aria helmets. Arai on the other hand would learn from that malfunction and adjust design/manufacturing to ensure the best they could that would...
Never heard of Aria helmets. Arai on the other hand would learn from that malfunction and adjust design/manufacturing to ensure the best they could that would not happen again.

The concept might be the same as cars but then vehicle manufactures have considerably more material to work with. You may have noticed that automobiles are much larger than what they were back in the 80's/90's. What is considered a small car today would have been family size three decades ago. That concept cannot be used in helmet manufacture as you will end up with shell sizes that are way to big in comparison to the riders head, that in its self would be a hazard for the rider.

I would much rather suffer a concussion and have NO intrusion through the shell verses a helmet that has all the bells and whistles regarding MIPS and other absorption technologies but allows a foreign object to pierce the shell and through the skull. I think that has the bigger potential for a more brain damaging injury compared to a concussion, don't you?
Im sorry but size has nothing to do with why cars are much safer today. It comes down to advances in meterials and engineering. They even do tests of old cars vs new cars and the big cars of the past get demolished by the smaller new cars of today. Technology has allowed this. My example holds up perfect, unlike yours, because the helmet just like the car is designed to deform and break when absorbing large amounts of energy and the shell will crack vs your skull. Again.. these helmets have standards they have to meet, Leatt cant just put out a dud that is completely unsafe to the wearer.

Unluckily for your argument... They crashed a 1959 Bel air into a 2009 Malibu to show the effects of 50 years of engineering. The new car is actually smaller than the old car so your argument that new cars are safer because theyre bigger you can throw right out the window. Its not safer “because it got bigger” its safer because of engineering. The older Bel Air gets absolutely demolished. The dummy in the drivers seat is decapitated. The Malibu is a smaller car but it cuts thru the Bel Air like a hot knife thru Catanzarro butter.
https://youtu.be/fPF4fBGNK0U


1959 Bel Air

2009 Malibu




The test... Will the older car win because its bigger?

Boom

Not lookin good


Look at the difference in damage to the passenger compartment. You cant even see the dummy.. The left headlight is past the firewall *Dead


*Not Dead (Just Chillin)


I almost feel kinda bad lol cuz usually ppl are safe to talk out their ass on the internet and it usually ends with someone being wrong but both at least can feel like they were right in their head. I dont think he could have ever expected that when he said new cars are safer cuz theyre bigger that his argument was going to be so systematically and thoroughly dismantled like this.

Sorry bro
6
drt410
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2/18/2019 7:58am Edited Date/Time 2/18/2019 8:09am
Question wrote:
I do too call it bollocks as the energy transfered to the brain is similar.



scrallex wrote:
You clearly haven't spent years studying physics to understand that energy is finite and conserved in any closed system. This means that there is a fixed...
You clearly haven't spent years studying physics to understand that energy is finite and conserved in any closed system. This means that there is a fixed amount of energy that will be distributed to the path of least resistance. If the helmet holds up, yes, not all of it will go to the skull/face/brain, but a lot of it will. If the helmet crumpled, you can calculate the exact amount of energy that was diverted AWAY from the rider through the strength of the materials that deformed/broke and the extent at which they broke.

At the end of the day, the helmet diverted a substantial amount of energy away from rider through crumpling/breaking. This is not always the best way to keep the rider safe, but there are certain situations where this is preferable to the helmet staying together. I'm not saying that he would have been better off if the helmet were designed differently and didn't break apart, as I did not see the incident nor good photos of the areas of the helmet that broke. However, you can't look at the broken helmet and definitively say that he was better off in a helmet that wouldn't have snapped under the same circumstances.

Note: No two crashes are the same. Even though eye-witnesses state that it was a fairly low-speed crash, many of us know that sometimes those crashes cause more damage than you would expect. I would consider the rider very lucky to be leaving the facility with full consciousness (enough to post a selfie after the fact). Hoping for a speedy recovery for the rider and, if he were using their 2nd tier helmet, he opts for the top of the line model from here on out because he clearly has the talent to warrant it.
Ding ding ding. We have a winner ladies and gentlemen.


“In physics and chemistry, the law of conservation of energy states that the total energy of an isolated system remains constant; it is said to be conserved over time.[1] This law means that energy can neither be created nor destroyed; rather, it can only be transformed or transferred from one form to another.”


I dont expect many on Vital to have the best grasp of physics, but let us that do explain why this was in fact, a good thing that the energy was transferred through the structure of the helmet... vs his skull/brain. The poster I quoted is exactly right in that no 2 crashes are the same and also what something looks like doesnt mean how it is. Dale Earnhardts crash that killed him did not look more severe than dozens of other crashes weve seen. His injuries tell another story. Same with Jessy Nelson.
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Forty
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2/18/2019 8:08am
Sir wrote:
Never heard of Aria helmets. Arai on the other hand would learn from that malfunction and adjust design/manufacturing to ensure the best they could that would...
Never heard of Aria helmets. Arai on the other hand would learn from that malfunction and adjust design/manufacturing to ensure the best they could that would not happen again.

The concept might be the same as cars but then vehicle manufactures have considerably more material to work with. You may have noticed that automobiles are much larger than what they were back in the 80's/90's. What is considered a small car today would have been family size three decades ago. That concept cannot be used in helmet manufacture as you will end up with shell sizes that are way to big in comparison to the riders head, that in its self would be a hazard for the rider.

I would much rather suffer a concussion and have NO intrusion through the shell verses a helmet that has all the bells and whistles regarding MIPS and other absorption technologies but allows a foreign object to pierce the shell and through the skull. I think that has the bigger potential for a more brain damaging injury compared to a concussion, don't you?
ML512 wrote:
After four knockouts in Arai and a year period of struggling to hold conversations with short term memory loss I swore off them. Thanks to my...
After four knockouts in Arai and a year period of struggling to hold conversations with short term memory loss I swore off them. Thanks to my gig I’ve been lucky enough to visit MIPS lab, visit Bell’s test facility, chat endlessly with the 6D crew, meet the doctor behind Rheon, and see a ton of test results from all kinds of brands when they test each other’s helmets...I wasn’t impressed with what I saw on the Arai.

If your main focus is keeping an object from piercing the shell, the Arai is a good way to go, it’s stiff...very stiff...if you’re actually worried about the condition of your brain, my personal opinion is there are many other options in the market that’ll keep that part much safer.
So what is your lid of choice?
1
JM485
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2/18/2019 8:18am
drt410 wrote:
Im sorry but size has nothing to do with why cars are much safer today. It comes down to advances in meterials and engineering. They even...
Im sorry but size has nothing to do with why cars are much safer today. It comes down to advances in meterials and engineering. They even do tests of old cars vs new cars and the big cars of the past get demolished by the smaller new cars of today. Technology has allowed this. My example holds up perfect, unlike yours, because the helmet just like the car is designed to deform and break when absorbing large amounts of energy and the shell will crack vs your skull. Again.. these helmets have standards they have to meet, Leatt cant just put out a dud that is completely unsafe to the wearer.

Unluckily for your argument... They crashed a 1959 Bel air into a 2009 Malibu to show the effects of 50 years of engineering. The new car is actually smaller than the old car so your argument that new cars are safer because theyre bigger you can throw right out the window. Its not safer “because it got bigger” its safer because of engineering. The older Bel Air gets absolutely demolished. The dummy in the drivers seat is decapitated. The Malibu is a smaller car but it cuts thru the Bel Air like a hot knife thru Catanzarro butter.
https://youtu.be/fPF4fBGNK0U


1959 Bel Air

2009 Malibu




The test... Will the older car win because its bigger?

Boom

Not lookin good


Look at the difference in damage to the passenger compartment. You cant even see the dummy.. The left headlight is past the firewall *Dead


*Not Dead (Just Chillin)


I almost feel kinda bad lol cuz usually ppl are safe to talk out their ass on the internet and it usually ends with someone being wrong but both at least can feel like they were right in their head. I dont think he could have ever expected that when he said new cars are safer cuz theyre bigger that his argument was going to be so systematically and thoroughly dismantled like this.

Sorry bro
Just want to say fuck them for doing that, I'll never buy a Chevy because of what those dipshits did to that car. What a waste, anyone with half a brain knows newer cars are safer, there was no reason to destroy a piece of history like that.
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BobPA
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2/18/2019 8:22am
The Leatt helmet did what it should do. The chin bar broke off to prevent Anderson from breaking his neck. He came of pretty good if...
The Leatt helmet did what it should do. The chin bar broke off to prevent Anderson from breaking his neck. He came of pretty good if you ask me.
Yeah, judging by the photo he looks great....How do you know he would have broken his neck if the chin bar stayed? Maybe the chin bar failed at a level much lower than a neck breaking force.

I’d love to give the aforementioned doctor an open face helmet. Tell him to go into his parking lot, get on his knees and simulate a low speed face plant by just falling forward.....See how much he likes a skid lid with no chin bar then....
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Motohead279
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2/18/2019 8:27am
A helmets job is to absorb the impact, and relaying the least amount of energy to the head. If the helmet chin bar is too rigid and doesn’t give it could easily harm the rider like snap the riders neck.

Without video of the crash it’s hard to determine what type of impact the rider had and how the helmet reacted.
1
drt410
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2/18/2019 8:27am
drt410 wrote:
Im sorry but size has nothing to do with why cars are much safer today. It comes down to advances in meterials and engineering. They even...
Im sorry but size has nothing to do with why cars are much safer today. It comes down to advances in meterials and engineering. They even do tests of old cars vs new cars and the big cars of the past get demolished by the smaller new cars of today. Technology has allowed this. My example holds up perfect, unlike yours, because the helmet just like the car is designed to deform and break when absorbing large amounts of energy and the shell will crack vs your skull. Again.. these helmets have standards they have to meet, Leatt cant just put out a dud that is completely unsafe to the wearer.

Unluckily for your argument... They crashed a 1959 Bel air into a 2009 Malibu to show the effects of 50 years of engineering. The new car is actually smaller than the old car so your argument that new cars are safer because theyre bigger you can throw right out the window. Its not safer “because it got bigger” its safer because of engineering. The older Bel Air gets absolutely demolished. The dummy in the drivers seat is decapitated. The Malibu is a smaller car but it cuts thru the Bel Air like a hot knife thru Catanzarro butter.
https://youtu.be/fPF4fBGNK0U


1959 Bel Air

2009 Malibu




The test... Will the older car win because its bigger?

Boom

Not lookin good


Look at the difference in damage to the passenger compartment. You cant even see the dummy.. The left headlight is past the firewall *Dead


*Not Dead (Just Chillin)


I almost feel kinda bad lol cuz usually ppl are safe to talk out their ass on the internet and it usually ends with someone being wrong but both at least can feel like they were right in their head. I dont think he could have ever expected that when he said new cars are safer cuz theyre bigger that his argument was going to be so systematically and thoroughly dismantled like this.

Sorry bro
JM485 wrote:
Just want to say fuck them for doing that, I'll never buy a Chevy because of what those dipshits did to that car. What a waste...
Just want to say fuck them for doing that, I'll never buy a Chevy because of what those dipshits did to that car. What a waste, anyone with half a brain knows newer cars are safer, there was no reason to destroy a piece of history like that.
Yea it was bs. It was for the 50th anniversary to show exactly how much safer they are with a real world test so you can see exactly what the difference is on real cars in a real collision. Its striking how bad the old cars were. I dont think theres a way to quantify really how many, but millions of lives have been saved due to advances in technology.
TeamGreen
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2/18/2019 8:33am
There are PLENTY of studies that explain dispersion of energy and how it's accomplished in protective devices.
2
2/18/2019 8:35am
TeamGreen wrote:
There are PLENTY of studies that explain dispersion of energy and how it's accomplished in protective devices.
Hope you're eating crow from the last thread about these paper bag helmets.
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MXMattii
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2/18/2019 8:45am
I'm happy that this picture makes you guys think about safety and talk about safety. With some in the known comments. So this wasn't a attack on leatt.
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TeamGreen
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2/18/2019 8:50am
TeamGreen wrote:
There are PLENTY of studies that explain dispersion of energy and how it's accomplished in protective devices.
Hope you're eating crow from the last thread about these paper bag helmets.
Bwahahahahaha

Your such an ass-clown...

My point was that a helmet DOESN'T have to be EXPENSIVE to be among the best...

Case in point and here's YOUR CROW, fool (as worn by Troy, himself):


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tek14
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2/18/2019 8:58am
TeamGreen wrote:
There are PLENTY of studies that explain dispersion of energy and how it's accomplished in protective devices.
Hope you're eating crow from the last thread about these paper bag helmets.
TeamGreen wrote:
Bwahahahahaha Your such an ass-clown... My point was that a helmet DOESN'T have to be EXPENSIVE to be among the best... Case in point and here's...
Bwahahahahaha

Your such an ass-clown...

My point was that a helmet DOESN'T have to be EXPENSIVE to be among the best...

Case in point and here's YOUR CROW, fool (as worn by Troy, himself):


Cool logos doenst make this plastic helmet any better than other cheap plastic helmets. I love looks but would not buy plastic helmet as long as riding motocross.
2
TeamGreen
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2/18/2019 9:07am
You guys have A LOT of homework to do...
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drt410
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2/18/2019 9:10am Edited Date/Time 2/18/2019 9:55am
If a helmet is too strong it can be unsafe too because all of the energy will be transferred right through and on to your brain. Thats why its such a delicate balancing act between strong materials and safety. Its also a balancing act to deliver a helmet with a high safety margin at reasonable cost. Thats why we dont see metal helmets in mx though you see them in other sports, the type of impacts in mx are very different.

Mx helmets are designed to be unserviceable after a big crash, thats because the foam is not enough to absorb all of the impact energy and the structure itself has to give, destroying the structure of the helmet instead of your brain. Sometimes you cant even tell that the helmet is destroyed, but helmets will crush and crumple to transfer the energy from impact/momentum into destruction of material.
Falcon
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2/18/2019 9:16am
They lived. Same idea:

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Motohead279
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2/18/2019 9:19am
Hope you're eating crow from the last thread about these paper bag helmets.
TeamGreen wrote:
Bwahahahahaha Your such an ass-clown... My point was that a helmet DOESN'T have to be EXPENSIVE to be among the best... Case in point and here's...
Bwahahahahaha

Your such an ass-clown...

My point was that a helmet DOESN'T have to be EXPENSIVE to be among the best...

Case in point and here's YOUR CROW, fool (as worn by Troy, himself):


tek14 wrote:
Cool logos doenst make this plastic helmet any better than other cheap plastic helmets. I love looks but would not buy plastic helmet as long as...
Cool logos doenst make this plastic helmet any better than other cheap plastic helmets. I love looks but would not buy plastic helmet as long as riding motocross.
It’s whats underneath the helmets outer shell is what is mostly protecting the riders head. The foam and design of the crush cells underneath is what is absorbing the energy, not the shell.

Your cool carbon fiber helmet is pricy because it’s lighter and used more expensive materials, and takes more time to make, but it doesn’t necessarily make it safer. I would also bet that the same TLD helmet that is made in carbon/Kevlar and also in a “plastic” (which it’s actually more involved than that) that both helmets will have similar crash testing results.
1
GrapeApe
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2/18/2019 9:36am
Question wrote:
I do too call it bollocks as the energy transfered to the brain is similar.



scrallex wrote:
You clearly haven't spent years studying physics to understand that energy is finite and conserved in any closed system. This means that there is a fixed...
You clearly haven't spent years studying physics to understand that energy is finite and conserved in any closed system. This means that there is a fixed amount of energy that will be distributed to the path of least resistance. If the helmet holds up, yes, not all of it will go to the skull/face/brain, but a lot of it will. If the helmet crumpled, you can calculate the exact amount of energy that was diverted AWAY from the rider through the strength of the materials that deformed/broke and the extent at which they broke.

At the end of the day, the helmet diverted a substantial amount of energy away from rider through crumpling/breaking. This is not always the best way to keep the rider safe, but there are certain situations where this is preferable to the helmet staying together. I'm not saying that he would have been better off if the helmet were designed differently and didn't break apart, as I did not see the incident nor good photos of the areas of the helmet that broke. However, you can't look at the broken helmet and definitively say that he was better off in a helmet that wouldn't have snapped under the same circumstances.

Note: No two crashes are the same. Even though eye-witnesses state that it was a fairly low-speed crash, many of us know that sometimes those crashes cause more damage than you would expect. I would consider the rider very lucky to be leaving the facility with full consciousness (enough to post a selfie after the fact). Hoping for a speedy recovery for the rider and, if he were using their 2nd tier helmet, he opts for the top of the line model from here on out because he clearly has the talent to warrant it.
drt410 wrote:
Ding ding ding. We have a winner ladies and gentlemen. “In physics and chemistry, the law of conservation of energy states that the total energy of...
Ding ding ding. We have a winner ladies and gentlemen.


“In physics and chemistry, the law of conservation of energy states that the total energy of an isolated system remains constant; it is said to be conserved over time.[1] This law means that energy can neither be created nor destroyed; rather, it can only be transformed or transferred from one form to another.”


I dont expect many on Vital to have the best grasp of physics, but let us that do explain why this was in fact, a good thing that the energy was transferred through the structure of the helmet... vs his skull/brain. The poster I quoted is exactly right in that no 2 crashes are the same and also what something looks like doesnt mean how it is. Dale Earnhardts crash that killed him did not look more severe than dozens of other crashes weve seen. His injuries tell another story. Same with Jessy Nelson.
Principles of energy absorption are not lost on anyone in here. Until/unless we know if that helmet was destroyed by a steel post or a fuzzy cat the debate is meaningless.

drt410
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2/18/2019 10:02am Edited Date/Time 2/18/2019 10:40am
TeamGreen wrote:
Bwahahahahaha Your such an ass-clown... My point was that a helmet DOESN'T have to be EXPENSIVE to be among the best... Case in point and here's...
Bwahahahahaha

Your such an ass-clown...

My point was that a helmet DOESN'T have to be EXPENSIVE to be among the best...

Case in point and here's YOUR CROW, fool (as worn by Troy, himself):


tek14 wrote:
Cool logos doenst make this plastic helmet any better than other cheap plastic helmets. I love looks but would not buy plastic helmet as long as...
Cool logos doenst make this plastic helmet any better than other cheap plastic helmets. I love looks but would not buy plastic helmet as long as riding motocross.
It’s whats underneath the helmets outer shell is what is mostly protecting the riders head. The foam and design of the crush cells underneath is what...
It’s whats underneath the helmets outer shell is what is mostly protecting the riders head. The foam and design of the crush cells underneath is what is absorbing the energy, not the shell.

Your cool carbon fiber helmet is pricy because it’s lighter and used more expensive materials, and takes more time to make, but it doesn’t necessarily make it safer. I would also bet that the same TLD helmet that is made in carbon/Kevlar and also in a “plastic” (which it’s actually more involved than that) that both helmets will have similar crash testing results.
Yup. Actually with carbon fiber helmets they have to be careful because it can be too strong and it needs give. A good fact with certain carbon fibers like unidirectional weaves is that they are strong in certain directions and weak in others. This can be used to the advantage of the helmet builder. So can twill weaves in areas that need strength in all directions.

They actually want the carbon fiber to act pretty much the same as those other materials... they all meet the same standards. The benefit is that it allows them to make very thin shells saving weight making a very light helmet (Airoh, Carbon Kevlar). The point of helmets of this material is they can be lighter (thinner) while meeting the same safety rating of other helmets of other materials. It doesnt make the other helmets bad, it makes the Airoh light.

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drt410
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2/18/2019 10:40am Edited Date/Time 2/18/2019 11:33am
Also ECE is homologated for AMA and FIM racing in the US, SX/MX, so thats why Airoh helmets can be used by the pros here even though they cant be bought/sold in US stores. ECE is a stricter standard so I had no qualms with ordering my Airoh from over seas to ride with. Some people say they wouldnt trust them because they are so ungodly light, but its because the carbon kevlar shell is so strong that it can be very thin.

They are crazy light, mines only 2 pounds. Bell, 6D are almost 3.5. All tracks say you need a DOT helmet, some may allow snell and some ECE, I think I heard theres a site in the US you can order Airoh helmets from that have the DOT sticker. Some people have bought a DOT sticker and put it on lol knowing that it passed ECE and its a great helmet and its really just semantics at that point.. Idk if Id recommend this because if you get injured insurance may not pay if they found out. Idk though cuz they are homologated for AMA so its a slippery slope.

Id say if the track says DOT only thats your best bet but insurance may still cover ECE because it tests beyond DOT and AMA has recognized it so if someone crashes in SX/MX theyll be fine. I do know that I want the strictest standard on my head so Ill gladly wear an ECE helmet. They really need to get that peperwork in order but I wonder if its a back room handshake agreement to keep ECE helmets overseas to not bite into US company sales of DOT helmets. ECE is stricter standards because it has to cover all Euro countries where DOT is just the US.
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drt410
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2/18/2019 11:30am Edited Date/Time 2/18/2019 11:31am
One more interesting thing of note:

DOT is an American standard. Unlike the other certifications, DOT helmets aren't actually tested. It is up to the manufacturer to ensure their helmets are built to regulation and will survive crashes. Random checks are sometimes done and if the helmet fails, very heavy fines are imposed. ECE helmets are required to be tested and certified before the model is allowed to be sold.

This means at very high risk to the manufacturer, they can try to get around the rules and not test the helmet before putting it up for sale on the market. This leaves the MFG open for MASSIVE lawsuits... but it is possible that a Brand could skirt around this to save time/money. This is another reason why ECE and the British Sharp Certified Helmets are considered the best in the world.
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77Moto
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2/18/2019 11:44am
TeamGreen wrote:
There are PLENTY of studies that explain dispersion of energy and how it's accomplished in protective devices.
Hope you're eating crow from the last thread about these paper bag helmets.
TeamGreen wrote:
Bwahahahahaha Your such an ass-clown... My point was that a helmet DOESN'T have to be EXPENSIVE to be among the best... Case in point and here's...
Bwahahahahaha

Your such an ass-clown...

My point was that a helmet DOESN'T have to be EXPENSIVE to be among the best...

Case in point and here's YOUR CROW, fool (as worn by Troy, himself):


What idiot pays 250 bucks to advertise for all those companies?

Post a reply to: Leatt Helmet doesn't look good at this crash...

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