Kenny should have never left KTM.

JM485
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2/17/2019 5:56pm
BobPA wrote:
Why is it that everyone acts like Kenny is the only rider who has been injured? All the top riders have had big time crashes/injuries. Kenny...
Why is it that everyone acts like Kenny is the only rider who has been injured? All the top riders have had big time crashes/injuries. Kenny just posted more pictures on social media as compared to anyone else. Remember Eli’s shoulders? Moosecan’s shoulder, wrist, knee? Webb’s wrist? Cole’s hip? Etc.
Nobody has even had close to the road Ken did to come back, give me a break.
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tk2stroke
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2/17/2019 5:59pm
resetjet wrote:
I know web is fast, kenny had some severe injuries, and factory jap bikes are just as good. However, At this moment and at other moments...
I know web is fast, kenny had some severe injuries, and factory jap bikes are just as good. However, At this moment and at other moments in time, that ktm just looks super dialed in. Watch the race again and just pay attention to coop, marvs and kennys bike. It seem like you can put that thing anywhere. If kenny never left i wonder how many titles he would have? Such an awesome determined rider....
Without a shadow of a doubt. Virtually every rider that has jumped to KTM or Husky over the past 4-5 years has seen their results improve, usually by an average of 3-5 spots (i.e. Baggett, Anderson, Webb, Osborne, Bloss, Bogle and others).

I understand KR94's decision to move to Honda for the $$$ and to be the guy, but in hindsight it appears it was a fateful career move. I bled red for years and still want to admire Honda, but I do believe the bike is somewhat flawed on a micro level. Whether it's outdoors or indoors the Honders appear to be more active and less stable than the Kawi's, KTM's or Husky's and at their level every aspect of geometry and suspension is worth places.

While he's a whiny little bitch and a terrible ambassador for the sport, there's no doubt Webb is an exceptional rider and he's now a contender that he's riding orange. Put Roczen on orange even after his injuries and he would be the fastest dude in Supercross, and I'd say the same for Tomac.

To add to the flame session forthcoming, most of the self inflicted gnarly crashes over the past 5 years have been on the red machines (Tomac - Thunder Valley / Roczen - Monster Energy Vegas / Roczen - A2 / Seeley - Glen Helen / Canard - Too many to count). Is this coincidence or has another brand had more?
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Nighttrain
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2/17/2019 6:07pm
This. Take away those injuries and Kenny would have a lot more titles on his shelf.
Nighttrain wrote:
And the same can be said for a long list of motocross racers. Roczen’s a warrior. He doesn’t need excuses.
There’s a clear difference pre-injury Kenny and post-injury Kenny.
That’s just Supercross. It’s the real life Rollerball. Are you familiar with Cole Seely? He didn’t post a lot of Instagrams of his surgeries but they were nonetheless horrific. Check that one’s injury report. Seely’s is one of the most heroic returns in the history of the sport.
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VicDaMoan03
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2/17/2019 6:14pm
resetjet wrote:
I know web is fast, kenny had some severe injuries, and factory jap bikes are just as good. However, At this moment and at other moments...
I know web is fast, kenny had some severe injuries, and factory jap bikes are just as good. However, At this moment and at other moments in time, that ktm just looks super dialed in. Watch the race again and just pay attention to coop, marvs and kennys bike. It seem like you can put that thing anywhere. If kenny never left i wonder how many titles he would have? Such an awesome determined rider....
tk2stroke wrote:
Without a shadow of a doubt. Virtually every rider that has jumped to KTM or Husky over the past 4-5 years has seen their results improve...
Without a shadow of a doubt. Virtually every rider that has jumped to KTM or Husky over the past 4-5 years has seen their results improve, usually by an average of 3-5 spots (i.e. Baggett, Anderson, Webb, Osborne, Bloss, Bogle and others).

I understand KR94's decision to move to Honda for the $$$ and to be the guy, but in hindsight it appears it was a fateful career move. I bled red for years and still want to admire Honda, but I do believe the bike is somewhat flawed on a micro level. Whether it's outdoors or indoors the Honders appear to be more active and less stable than the Kawi's, KTM's or Husky's and at their level every aspect of geometry and suspension is worth places.

While he's a whiny little bitch and a terrible ambassador for the sport, there's no doubt Webb is an exceptional rider and he's now a contender that he's riding orange. Put Roczen on orange even after his injuries and he would be the fastest dude in Supercross, and I'd say the same for Tomac.

To add to the flame session forthcoming, most of the self inflicted gnarly crashes over the past 5 years have been on the red machines (Tomac - Thunder Valley / Roczen - Monster Energy Vegas / Roczen - A2 / Seeley - Glen Helen / Canard - Too many to count). Is this coincidence or has another brand had more?
Is it a coincidence that you have a KTM as your avatar? Maybe a bit biased?
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The Shop

tk2stroke
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2/17/2019 6:28pm
Is it a coincidence that you have a KTM as your avatar? Maybe a bit biased?
Nah, I no longer bleed any brand and I currently own red, blue, and orange and will soon get a Beta red. I just call it like I see it without bias.
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Tarz483
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2/17/2019 6:36pm
KTM came out with a much better bike right when Ken left
I always wondered if he ever got to test it before he left?
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brimx153
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2/17/2019 6:38pm
Yeah, that title he got with Suzuki doesn't count.
How long did it take him to set up that Suzuki though?
Seemed brilliant at his first few races on it he was leading the championship till he crashed out . Plus people act like being in a hospital 3 days before outdoors with something broke in his back ,had nothing to do with his results that year .

Puls it was nt like Kenny was killing it on the ktm in sx the year before, he won 2 races , people act like he dom
brimx153
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2/17/2019 6:43pm
Until bogle wins an outdoor he has nt improved yet , plus what other bike did bloss ride ?????
brimx153
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2/17/2019 6:48pm
BobPA wrote:
Why is it that everyone acts like Kenny is the only rider who has been injured? All the top riders have had big time crashes/injuries. Kenny...
Why is it that everyone acts like Kenny is the only rider who has been injured? All the top riders have had big time crashes/injuries. Kenny just posted more pictures on social media as compared to anyone else. Remember Eli’s shoulders? Moosecan’s shoulder, wrist, knee? Webb’s wrist? Cole’s hip? Etc.
JM485 wrote:
Nobody has even had close to the road Ken did to come back, give me a break.
Really ? Doug Henry, cp377 there has been a good few who came back from terrible injuries, plus I can't understand why people say he had 2 massive injuries, he had 1 massive injury and one that prob must of the field have suffered at some time .
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BobPA
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2/17/2019 7:09pm
BobPA wrote:
Why is it that everyone acts like Kenny is the only rider who has been injured? All the top riders have had big time crashes/injuries. Kenny...
Why is it that everyone acts like Kenny is the only rider who has been injured? All the top riders have had big time crashes/injuries. Kenny just posted more pictures on social media as compared to anyone else. Remember Eli’s shoulders? Moosecan’s shoulder, wrist, knee? Webb’s wrist? Cole’s hip? Etc.
JM485 wrote:
Nobody has even had close to the road Ken did to come back, give me a break.
I do not want to sound like I am knocking Kenny, because he has true grit, and is a great dude on a bike. But, he has just posted more updates on social media compared to any other rider on the roster.

Eli and his double shoulder surgery was a major recovery. He just did not make it known to the general public.

Pourcel laid flat on his back for 6 months not know if he would ever walk again. He made a very impressive comeback.

Cole Seeley has had a massive hip injury, but no one talks about that.

Look at Moosecans first ride in the USA outdoors. His wrist was toast.

Barcia also broke his hip, and has had massive injuries in the last few years.

Deano has had 3? ACL surgeries in the last few years? Not including other injuries.

Bogle? Reed? Baggett? Anderson? Webb? Joey?

All of these guys get hurt, bad.

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JM485
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2/17/2019 7:10pm
BobPA wrote:
Why is it that everyone acts like Kenny is the only rider who has been injured? All the top riders have had big time crashes/injuries. Kenny...
Why is it that everyone acts like Kenny is the only rider who has been injured? All the top riders have had big time crashes/injuries. Kenny just posted more pictures on social media as compared to anyone else. Remember Eli’s shoulders? Moosecan’s shoulder, wrist, knee? Webb’s wrist? Cole’s hip? Etc.
JM485 wrote:
Nobody has even had close to the road Ken did to come back, give me a break.
brimx153 wrote:
Really ? Doug Henry, cp377 there has been a good few who came back from terrible injuries, plus I can't understand why people say he had...
Really ? Doug Henry, cp377 there has been a good few who came back from terrible injuries, plus I can't understand why people say he had 2 massive injuries, he had 1 massive injury and one that prob must of the field have suffered at some time .
We're talking in the context of active riders, I'm well aware of all of those.
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resetjet
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2/17/2019 7:17pm
Actually i prefer my yami 250f over my ktm. But anyway, we all agree that kenny is great. The way coop was riding was insane. I thing we all agree on those points. Now get all of this out of your head. Rewatch the 450 main and only look at kens, coopers and marvins bikes and not the riders, and where those bikes go.
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BobPA
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2/17/2019 7:25pm
Tarz483 wrote:
KTM came out with a much better bike right when Ken left
I always wondered if he ever got to test it before he left?
Nope
NeedMoto
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2/17/2019 7:28pm
4csHATER wrote:
You know whats funny, that Ktm and honda had the same momentum when accelerating from the turn to the finish, that krm accelerated faster than the...
You know whats funny, that Ktm and honda had the same momentum when accelerating from the turn to the finish, that krm accelerated faster than the honda, The ktm is pretty much bone stock, the honda however is using a Pankl or carillo setup (same as ktm) and ceramic bearings (same as ktm) and the ktm still accelerated better. Could it have been the fuel-ignition timing?
Maybe Webb twisted the throttle harder than Roczen?
UGOTBIT wrote:
Kenny was about into the tough blocks and bouncing around...

Webb’s tire was in contact with the ground more than Kenny’s was.
This^^^ to the point, and spot on!!!
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2/17/2019 7:33pm
The only thing I can say is that Honda has punted a few riders off the bike (Gasjer, Roczen) in the same fashion multiple times, I'm not sure if its a coincidence or the bike.

Another than that Kenny is riding fantastic, it's not the bike.

Webb has been elite since 250's.
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BobPA
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2/17/2019 7:57pm
The only thing I can say is that Honda has punted a few riders off the bike (Gasjer, Roczen) in the same fashion multiple times, I'm...
The only thing I can say is that Honda has punted a few riders off the bike (Gasjer, Roczen) in the same fashion multiple times, I'm not sure if its a coincidence or the bike.

Another than that Kenny is riding fantastic, it's not the bike.

Webb has been elite since 250's.
Crashes happen on all bikes. Honda’s have not tossed anymore riders than other brands.
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Flatliner
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2/17/2019 8:02pm
He could have lost his arm.

If he didn’t have the best medicine money could buy that was a legit possibility.

Of course he’s a tick off of what he was.
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PEPE001
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2/18/2019 12:34am
Tarz483 wrote:
KTM came out with a much better bike right when Ken left
I always wondered if he ever got to test it before he left?
No
Motofinne
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2/18/2019 12:43am Edited Date/Time 2/18/2019 8:24am
He has gone through so much, the fact that he has been the points leader this year is amazing!

With that said, i have always believed that he made a mistake when he jumped off the KTM when he did. It wasn't the greatest bike when he won the 450 title in 2014 but he should've known where KTM were heading just like Dungey trusted DeCoster in 2012.

But at the same time, the Honda is not a hurdle for him. HRC is a good team to be at.
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drt410
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2/18/2019 1:32am Edited Date/Time 2/18/2019 1:34am
Working with Aldon is only worth it if everything aligns and your ready to go on a win/championship streak. History shows that he catches guys right at that spot, and is very successful. It looks like its about to be the same thing again with Webb. For Kenny I feel like thats the point in his career he was at his first year with Honda coming off his outdoors DOMINATION with Suzuki, then with 3 days on his Honda wins 2/3 MEC races.. also leading the one he crashed. Then won 2 or 3 races in SX then had his major crash.

That was when he should have been with Aldon is these years in his career starting with 16’. Hed be a couple sx championship wins in by now, have a couple more left in him, then either retire or say ok thats enough with Aldon then try it without him. Or he could just win 3/4 in a row then retire. Kenny/Coop are “those guys” to be the next to go on a streak after RV then RD. Then itd be Webbs turn after Kenny won his 4.

drt410
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2/18/2019 1:33am Edited Date/Time 2/18/2019 1:43am
I do agree... but not because of the bike but because Aldon is at KTM/Husky.

He probably should have went to Suzuki in the states first on 250s, then after winning 250s at Suzuki move up to 450s n get some race wins. Then move to KTM/Husky with Aldon and either build the Husky legacy with Aldon at that time or KTM. Then hed be ready to go on his “Aldon win streak”.

Either way its tricky though because when you watch that documentary with Kenny he makes it a point to say Aldon was only gonna give Ken 2 weeks off then go right into boot camp and Ken was like nooo way. Im gonna be burnt out in 2 years. But I feel he could have won for a few years on Suzuki in the 250s then moved up to 450s then got some race wins... then at that point move to Aldon and KTM or Husky and get his 4 “Aldon Guarintee” sx championships like RV and RD. Kenny was that guy to do it. Then hed be there about now with 4 and then Webb would be starting to get his race wins then he could have replaced a burnt out kenny after getting a couple years of race wins on Yamaha then hed go on his 3-4 champ run too after Ken.
resetjet
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2/18/2019 6:36am
VRR7 wrote:
Kenny left KTM because the the bike was crap ! Roger tried to stop him as he knew the bike was crap but he had fixed...
Kenny left KTM because the the bike was crap ! Roger tried to stop him as he knew the bike was crap but he had fixed a lot of the problems and the next years model was going to be much improved, which is was. Still Kenny loved the Suzuki as showed in his results. IMO Dungey was faster on the Suzuki as well. Roger did good work on improving the KTM and today the KTM MX bikes are good bikes. The worst thing about KTM's extremely successful marketing campaign is the indoctrinated cult followers that makes the brand repulsive. It is like being forced to join the Moonie cult and then give the orange garb wearers all your money ? Who willingly falls into that trap?

Kenny is lacking in Mojo and understandably is not as gung ho as he was before his injuries , he is a lot more tentative and given his experiences the past couple of years he naturally would be. Aldon on the other hand has help Webb find his mojo.

What bike should Marvin be ridding ? He was beaten by Kenny on the wrong bike, which means MM was on a worse wrong bike.He should have never left Honda mid contract for KTM money , clever steal. Even KTM knows "It is not the bike !" KTM are great at poaching all the top riders and that is how the win - Honda are useless at that game ask RC " ... If Alta had not closed down ..... Justin Hill would have won ... LaughingLaughingLaughingLaughingLaughingLaughingLaughing
Indont think you get it. Its about moments of time that the bike is good. It may be just one race, or many but right now its dialed. The bike will never win a race, but it can give you just that tiny bit of confidence you need to push it a hair over the line. Or pick up 1/10th of a second per lap, or handle a certain part of the track better. Small, small advantage, but when you have riders like we have this year who all are so close in lap times, the bike matters. Would coop been able to do that on the yamaha, i doubt he would have won. He would maybe have gotten third in his present condition of awesomeness.
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resetjet
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2/18/2019 6:51am
Tarz483 wrote:
KTM came out with a much better bike right when Ken left
I always wondered if he ever got to test it before he left?
If i remember correctly he signed way early. He got a good deal at honda as first fiddle and took it. Ktm then kept the bike away from him. He never got s chance to ride it. And that bike was the game changer for ktm. They finally had a bike that was equal to jap bikes.
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GrapeApe
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2/18/2019 6:54am
4csHATER wrote:
You know whats funny, that Ktm and honda had the same momentum when accelerating from the turn to the finish, that krm accelerated faster than the...
You know whats funny, that Ktm and honda had the same momentum when accelerating from the turn to the finish, that krm accelerated faster than the honda, The ktm is pretty much bone stock, the honda however is using a Pankl or carillo setup (same as ktm) and ceramic bearings (same as ktm) and the ktm still accelerated better. Could it have been the fuel-ignition timing?
Maybe Webb twisted the throttle harder than Roczen?
The KTM throttle goes to 11
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CozMan
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2/18/2019 7:31am
BikeGuy321 wrote:
Even the stock Honda is known to have hard hitting power. Maybe Kenny needs a softer power curve late in the race to seal the deal...
Even the stock Honda is known to have hard hitting power. Maybe Kenny needs a softer power curve late in the race to seal the deal. Obviously losing 15 pounds is gonna help, but I'd bet Webb's KTM has smoother power too and that's why he's fresher at the end of the race.
If you don't think that they can't get that bike to have the softest most perfect power delivery if that's Kenny's taste.... at the level of...
If you don't think that they can't get that bike to have the softest most perfect power delivery if that's Kenny's taste.... at the level of Factory Honda then you are sadly mistaken and should rethink life ??
yeah, I know nothing about pro-bike-set ups...but it would seem to me that a company the size of HONDA could basically craft a custom bike for Kenny if that's what he wanted. Couldn't they customize virtually every moving part on the bike to give him whatever he wanted? I know that ergos and just overall "feel" of certain bikes can bug certain riders, but if Kenny is "comfy" on the bike, couldn't HONDA simply custom tailor the machine, its deliver, suspension etc to do whatever he wanted?
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ob
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2/18/2019 8:07am
I am biased and I do ride a KTM. But I'm not afraid to jump ship to another brand I just think at this point they offer the best platform. And it seems really obvious the team bikes are working really really good. You can see it for sure. Hondas? Not so much
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TeamGreen
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2/18/2019 8:18am
Zycki11 wrote:
The KTM is so awesome! Look how well Tickle, Brayton, and Millsaps turned their careers around because of that KTM
Hey, smart-guy...

Milsaps made some serious coin during his KTM gig.
TeamGreen
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2/18/2019 8:20am
ob wrote:
I am biased and I do ride a KTM. But I'm not afraid to jump ship to another brand I just think at this point they...
I am biased and I do ride a KTM. But I'm not afraid to jump ship to another brand I just think at this point they offer the best platform. And it seems really obvious the team bikes are working really really good. You can see it for sure. Hondas? Not so much
Hey! You keep that shit to yourself!

At this point, This is about bashing KTM...

(Think I’ll be at Pala at about 10)
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resetjet
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2/18/2019 9:58am
BikeGuy321 wrote:
Even the stock Honda is known to have hard hitting power. Maybe Kenny needs a softer power curve late in the race to seal the deal...
Even the stock Honda is known to have hard hitting power. Maybe Kenny needs a softer power curve late in the race to seal the deal. Obviously losing 15 pounds is gonna help, but I'd bet Webb's KTM has smoother power too and that's why he's fresher at the end of the race.
If you don't think that they can't get that bike to have the softest most perfect power delivery if that's Kenny's taste.... at the level of...
If you don't think that they can't get that bike to have the softest most perfect power delivery if that's Kenny's taste.... at the level of Factory Honda then you are sadly mistaken and should rethink life ??
CozMan wrote:
yeah, I know nothing about pro-bike-set ups...but it would seem to me that a company the size of HONDA could basically craft a custom bike for...
yeah, I know nothing about pro-bike-set ups...but it would seem to me that a company the size of HONDA could basically craft a custom bike for Kenny if that's what he wanted. Couldn't they customize virtually every moving part on the bike to give him whatever he wanted? I know that ergos and just overall "feel" of certain bikes can bug certain riders, but if Kenny is "comfy" on the bike, couldn't HONDA simply custom tailor the machine, its deliver, suspension etc to do whatever he wanted?
They can and they do. Thats why factory bikes are all so close. If we were talking stock bikes, different story. Again we are talking about a very small difference, but at that level something so small can be so big. Again its about moments in time. This race is what ktm, maybe honda next race who knows, but the team that draws the longest straw the most wins. Since 2015, i say that has been ktm, and thats what kenny has missed out on. If we only all had a ?
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