KTM 250sx

Kayaba SSS Suspension

I know, I know.... but I'm telling ya this thing was GOOD. Can't imagine how good it would be after my suspension guy had his way with it.

I'm just bitter because I called on a 2018 250sx last week and was gonna go look at it. Dude went MIA and by the end of the weekend the ad was gone. I need to get ready for a big trip so at that point I had no choice but to put all my efforts into sprucing up the trusty YZ. Can't be waiting around for another good opportunity and I'm not about to buy new.

So I don't want to hear about how good the 250sx is right now. LOL!

mx_563 wrote:

I'm just bitter because I called on a 2018 250sx last week and was gonna go look at it. Dude went MIA and by the end of the weekend the ad was gone. I need to get ready for a big trip so at that point I had no choice but to put all my efforts into sprucing up the trusty YZ. Can't be waiting around for another good opportunity and I'm not about to buy new.

So I don't want to hear about how good the 250sx is right now. LOL!

Its not good, its awesome lol.

I rode a 2018 a few months ago and the carb was terrible. It blurbled until top end then it smoothed out. I thought the choke was on. I asked my buddy what the deal was and he said this was already worked on and was as good as it was going to get. The bike did have a nice feel to it though.

mx_563 wrote:

Kayaba SSS Suspension

This isn't 2006.

They are really good, but I honestly think the YZ is right there. I was expecting after riding the KTM (Husky) to be blown away. After riding them back to back, I think I like the YZ better. I am not going to say that the YZ is better, because on paper it is not. But I just have always gelled with that 06+ Yam chassis / suspension. And I think they make very usable motors (that goes for the 125 also.) It's a preference thing. If I had to buy 1 2stroke as a do-it-all keeper for many years, whether it be a 125 or 250, I'd pick the Yamaha. But for people who aren't in love with the 06+ Yams (and I know a lot of guys want a little bit of a sharper cornering machine) then the KTMs are really good. It shouldn't be that way, because the KTMs have so much upside that they bring to the table, but I think for me it's just that the YZs are easy to go fast on and I just ride them and don't even think about it.

I rode a 2020 sx on a demo day and I had a blast. I'm not really a two-stroke guy growing up with the "new age" four strokes. I thought it was impressive with the power outage, cornering ability, and light weight feeling. I will say that the grass isn't always greener. I just bought a 2020 450xcf (basically an sxf) after two Yz450fs and a Yz250f. I think if you don't mind throwing money into the KTM it's the best choice. I kept all my Yams stock besides pipes and they kept me happy for years. I loved the rear wheel slippage you get from them and the handling in corners. Although my KTM soaks up breaking bumps much better, jumping is much better. But I will say if I had the money I would KYB swap it after riding a friends 250sx with KYB.

VetMX.com wrote:

I rode a 2018 a few months ago and the carb was terrible. It blurbled until top end then it smoothed out. I thought the choke was on. I asked my buddy what the deal was and he said this was already worked on and was as good as it was going to get. The bike did have a nice feel to it though.

there is a big jetting thread on here for the 150/250 sx for how to fix all the issues

mx_563 wrote:

Kayaba SSS Suspension

seth505 wrote:

This isn't 2006.

Stole the words out of my mouth.

Don’t listen to the idiots who send their WP suspension off for all sorts of reinventing the wheel. Stock AER is fine for anything other than AMA Supercross. And if you want to send it off, send it to a place like Enzo that won’t force hundreds or thousands of dollars in parts. It’s completely unnecessary.

Yamaha’s engines are the same since 02, and chassis the same since 2006. Lots has changed in the last 15-20 years, believe it or not.

KTM moved past Yamaha in the 2-Stroke department in 2012 when they added linkage. Since then, each generation has gotten better and better.

LungButter wrote:

So for 20 years I've been beating the drum of the YZ 250 as the best all around 2 stroke if you want to race any and every discipline.

Well.... the other night I threw my leg over a 2020 KTM 250sx.... WOW. Just wow. This thing was bone stock, 2.3 hours on it. I cannot believe how good it was. Power felt electric and pulled from bottom to top, absolutely no vibration, front end felt super planted, turned on a dime, overall chassis felt stable. Can't imagine how good it could be with a few tweaks for rider preference.

Just had to throw that out there because I'm sure there are threads on here where I belittled anyone who suggested the 250sx was on the level of the YZ250

Welcome to the party

i have had 25 new yz250s from 87-16 i consider myself a yamaha guy and i had plenty of the Al framed ones had
06
07
08
09
11
12
16
in the current state that unit is in, ive raced them in every class from novice to expert to vet to over the hill (55+)
i made expert in new england on an 87yz250


soooo my buddy owns a husky dealer makes me buy a 19 TC250
hands down boys and girls, its better than the YZ and if yamaha dont do something about that bike they should just stop making them its an embarassment

Kyle978 wrote:

Stole the words out of my mouth.

Don’t listen to the idiots who send their WP suspension off for all sorts of reinventing the wheel. Stock AER is fine for anything other than AMA Supercross. And if you want to send it off, send it to a place like Enzo that won’t force hundreds or thousands of dollars in parts. It’s completely unnecessary.

Yamaha’s engines are the same since 02, and chassis the same since 2006. Lots has changed in the last 15-20 years, believe it or not.

KTM moved past Yamaha in the 2-Stroke department in 2012 when they added linkage. Since then, each generation has gotten better and better.

Curious on how AER handles heavy chop/bumps/whoops etc compared to KYB SSS. My understanding was that was always the big KYB advantage.

My next bike may very well be of Austrian make... But if the front feels harsh in those real world rough conditions, you can be damn sure I'll be one of those "idiots" doing a conversion kit or the like. Slow guy or not, I know what a good fork feels like.

mx_563 wrote:

Kayaba SSS Suspension

seth505 wrote:

This isn't 2006.

Kyle978 wrote:

Stole the words out of my mouth.

Don’t listen to the idiots who send their WP suspension off for all sorts of reinventing the wheel. Stock AER is fine for anything other than AMA Supercross. And if you want to send it off, send it to a place like Enzo that won’t force hundreds or thousands of dollars in parts. It’s completely unnecessary.

Yamaha’s engines are the same since 02, and chassis the same since 2006. Lots has changed in the last 15-20 years, believe it or not.

KTM moved past Yamaha in the 2-Stroke department in 2012 when they added linkage. Since then, each generation has gotten better and better.

I can ride my bike faster with MXTech Lucky cartridges installed. Does that make me an idiot?

I ride a 2020 KTM 250sx at the demo day i wasn’t blown away. The yz250 is such a solid package suspensh is premium you never have to jet it. I rode mine on indoor tracks outdoor tracks and harescrambles it was the best all around like ever had if somebody wants to race motocross and not f$$k around with anything that’s the best bike

The newer Austrian two strokes are really great bikes and in the last 5-6 years have become a super reliable platform. Some people just love hating what's popular. The YZ is a great bike as well, but dated in a few departments IMO.

Rickyisms wrote:

The newer Austrian two strokes are really great bikes and in the last 5-6 years have become a super reliable platform. Some people just love hating what's popular. The YZ is a great bike as well, but dated in a few departments IMO.

I feel like if Yamaha wanted to do the bare minimum for an update, they could tweak the frame geometry for sharper handling and change up the swingarm (align it with 250f or 450f), which all can potentially shave a couple pounds off as well.

Also, perhaps give the cylinder head a reasonable squish band.

The rest is fine. Yes the KTM makes more power in the mid range, but the YZ makes more up top and has a broader delivery. Pick your poison and mod accordingly. Pretty crazy that the 21 year old YZ engine is still so damn good as it is!

seth505 wrote:

This isn't 2006.

Kyle978 wrote:

Stole the words out of my mouth.

Don’t listen to the idiots who send their WP suspension off for all sorts of reinventing the wheel. Stock AER is fine for anything other than AMA Supercross. And if you want to send it off, send it to a place like Enzo that won’t force hundreds or thousands of dollars in parts. It’s completely unnecessary.

Yamaha’s engines are the same since 02, and chassis the same since 2006. Lots has changed in the last 15-20 years, believe it or not.

KTM moved past Yamaha in the 2-Stroke department in 2012 when they added linkage. Since then, each generation has gotten better and better.

SoCalMX70 wrote:

Curious on how AER handles heavy chop/bumps/whoops etc compared to KYB SSS. My understanding was that was always the big KYB advantage.

My next bike may very well be of Austrian make... But if the front feels harsh in those real world rough conditions, you can be damn sure I'll be one of those "idiots" doing a conversion kit or the like. Slow guy or not, I know what a good fork feels like.

The new AER gives a TON of feedback but it does great at soaking up in fast breaking bumps and hits. It doesn't wallow in the sand and the rear shock compliments the forks well. I haven't had a chance to go up north in ride in the woods yet. But for stock forks they work well. It's obviously different than KYB. To me it's been a learning curve not SO much better or SO much worse. Having the check the air pressure in the forks every ride is kind of annoying but it's just another piece of the check list. I have two rides on my 2020 so far.

A KTM 250 smoker is a bad bitch, it broke out its shell in 2013, but that 2017 on is slayer max volume.

Here's a 2021 to look at in the meantime

2017+ generation TC250 and 250SXs are awesome. Huge step forward from the 2013 platform (which Seth505 and I both had.. and now have current gen)

I've ridden the SSS stuff plenty. It's nice, but this idea that is SO MUCH BETTER than AER 48s / WP shock is absurd. The AER48s were a damn nice upgrade from my 2013 CC forks (which were done up by my buds at WP USA) and as such I've left my AER48s bone-stock.

LungButter wrote:

I know, I know.... but I'm telling ya this thing was GOOD. Can't imagine how good it would be after my suspension guy had his way with it.

Only thing is it’s another grand to get it right!

LungButter wrote:

I know, I know.... but I'm telling ya this thing was GOOD. Can't imagine how good it would be after my suspension guy had his way with it.

Nice honest feedback on your experience! If you did ride one that's fully dialed I'm pretty sure you'd be at the dealership next day. I have a '19 with cone valve forks from Powerband and a set of Hoosier MX25's on it. Front end grip is like a cat on carpet. Rear shock is stock with a couple clicks here and there. Some jetting tweaks from AJ's thread and the bike is f'n incredible.

Alex.434 wrote:

2017+ generation TC250 and 250SXs are awesome. Huge step forward from the 2013 platform (which Seth505 and I both had.. and now have current gen)

I've ridden the SSS stuff plenty. It's nice, but this idea that is SO MUCH BETTER than AER 48s / WP shock is absurd. The AER48s were a damn nice upgrade from my 2013 CC forks (which were done up by my buds at WP USA) and as such I've left my AER48s bone-stock.

I agree with a lot of what you said. I guess 1 thing I need to point out, in saying that I prefer the Yamahas is I also have a Husky 350. I waited until Husky got it right in '17 by getting a better fork and that is what finally pushed me to buy one and I don't regret it. I have gone back and forth with the suspension. At first I hated it, then I got it pretty good after a couple of tries with my local suspension guy. I felt like it was really solid for a while but then when I started to go to other tracks later that year, I changed my mind again. So after Lorettas, my bike is getting serviced in hopes to make it a little more plush initially, then a better transition through the mid-stroke. To me, the AER stuff isn't bad but it's not great. But again, it's preference, it's where you ride, riding style etc.

Some guys (not you, just a general statement) get so bent out of shape when someone disagrees. I have gone back and forth on the AER, depending on where I've ridden, some days I love it, other days it isn't great. But that's me. I can see how some guys wouldn't like it and others love it. SO many things factor in. I'd for sure buy a TC/SX 250, so by all means I'm not knocking them. Great bike. Like you said the last 2 gens really stepped up and on paper it blows away the Yamaha. But I hop on the YZs and it just feels more at home.

Broseph wrote:

I can ride my bike faster with MXTech Lucky cartridges installed. Does that make me an idiot?

Yeah

Yes wp suspension is not as good as the Yamaha’s but from my experience the aer feels a lot better on the 2 strokes compared to the 4 strokes for whatever reason. The chassis/ergos/brakes/clutch of the sx far outweigh the suspension and overall package of the yz

Counterbalanced motor is a ridiculous step up. Toss in the magic button on the xc/xcw and it’s pure sex

So we’re talking about YZ vs. KTM 2 strokes and AER vs. KYB? Got it. I have some unbiased info to share since I own an 18 YZ 250 and a KTM (KTM is a newer 450 tho) but have plenty of time on a buddies 18 250 SX.

First off there are a lot of great comments. Lemme say they are both great bikes. I have ridden both with stock suspension and revalved suspension.

Stock to stock suspension the KYB is better, but stock KYB is soft for a 180-185lb human. A stock WP AER is only average if you know how to set it up. An ENZO revalved AER is very good and better than stock KYB.

Revalved/resprung KYB vs. revalved WP... that’s a tough one. To me it’s down to set up, you have that 3rd variable with the WP - air pressure. In all honesty if my set up is dialed the revalved WP is as good or better than than the revalved KYB, caveat being I could very well be feeling the forgiveness of a steel frame.

Handling: the YZ is not as natural in corners, little more bar input needed. My forks are up 10mm. Turns great, rails ruts, decently stable but not quite as stable as KTM. Almost feels like the YZ has a shorter wheelbase if that makes any sense.

Engine: the YZ is a riot! You know you are riding a 2 stroke, everyone who rides it is like F&@K this thing is fast! It does have an FMF with a shorty.
KTM has a smooth electric feel. Fun and easy to ride.

Bottom line both bikes need suspension revalved.
The KTM is the easiest 2 stroke to ride. Anyone can jump off a 450 right on one no problem. Smooth and mellow, very electric feel.
The YZ is more of a handful but ridiculously fun to ride and will put a huge grin on your face.

mx_563 wrote:

Kayaba SSS Suspension

seth505 wrote:

This isn't 2006.

And yet, 16 years later, every media outlet agrees it’s the better suspension platform. Catchup, KTM!