JGR...how things have changed.

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2/14/2020 11:09 AM
Edited Date/Time: 2/14/2020 11:10 AM

I'm not posting this to slam the JGR or the Gibbs family, but when they came on the scene they were so incredibly hyped, and expectations were so high...all the talk on Vital and abroad was how deep their pockets were, and how the NASCAR machine shop and group of design engineers could "make anything they wanted" so that the one-off factory parts that were unobtainable to the average teams were within the reach of JGR, and the ones that weren't, they could build themselves! It was looking to be a better-than-factory team!

But now, it seems that JGR has fallen to the level of being the team where factory riders go to retire, and fast guys seem to sign with and never attain what they could have if they'd been on "real" factory teams. They've never had a championship level rider...except for James Stewart, and that completely imploded into a bad situation both with Stewart and Yamaha. Heck, the only A-Tier rider they've been able to sign was Chad Reed...and even he never rode up to his reputation on the JGR Suzuki.

It's a sad affair, if you ask me. J-Bone has been with them seemingly forever...and you hardly ever see Coy Gibbs any more...and there is just a sense of desperation that covers them instead of one of excitement that used to be their attitude. What has happened? Has the money dried up so that they can't "buy" a hot, winning rider? Are their creative hands ties by the OEMs so that they can't build what they want, only being able to use what the OEM gives them, if anything at all?

I'm wondering how many more seasons JGR can hang on. I wish the absolute best for them, but I think their dreams of being a championship team have faded.

I truly hope I'm wrong...

Any thoughts?

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2/14/2020 11:21 AM

Hobby is over. When suzuki takes its last gasp which may be soon, so will jgr. In the end there are only so many people buying scooters. Ktm came in and drained the japs market share.

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2/14/2020 11:26 AM

Savatgy was a good signing and shined a little light of hope but in typical JGR luck, Joey gets injured in an off season race. To me it doesn’t matter what brand they’re on, so long as they can keep a semi and a team of people at the races each weekend.

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2/14/2020 11:33 AM

Coy has moved over to the car racing effort after the untimely and unfortunate passing of his brother.

Biggest issue facing JGR is getting good OEM support. They dragged Yamaha along when they weren't interested in running a factory program. Then when Yamaha decided to re-enter they basically said "we're good, we'll do our own thing" and JGR felt pretty slighted. So this is why they went to Suzuki, but that was already a sinking ship.

Best outcome for JGR is to become the GasGas team in the USA, or if KTM gave them the TLD program which certainly has been an underperformer.

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Old MXer turned Superfan.

2/14/2020 11:35 AM

Savatgy had a really good transition to 450s IMO, (remember he held off Tomac kinda). He was a really good signing at the time, then he got hurt. Shit happens with an unpredictable sport.

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2/14/2020 11:38 AM

im betting tickle will put some fire under the JGR tent and JS17 will be returning soon I would imagine
hopeful things turn around for JGR / Suzuki shortly as the pits need more teams not less

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2/14/2020 11:45 AM
Edited Date/Time: 2/14/2020 12:51 PM

In their existence(since ‘08), they've won the same amount of premier SX championships as Honda. The fact they're still giving it a go is a testament to their love and commitment to the sport. Time to move on to GasGas.. That doesn't work, 3 strikes you're out.

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2/14/2020 6:54 PM

JGR seems to run a loose program. That’s why a guy like Savatgy Is such a good fit. He is self motivated.
Same reason Martin has done pretty well against All the kids.
Peick ,Peters, Enzo all just had injuries while there but I’m expecting Jimmy D to pull a few good hole shots on East Coast and run well. Love the JGR presence in the Sport!

Ghost

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2/14/2020 8:42 PM
Edited Date/Time: 2/14/2020 8:44 PM

You said it no success since James Stewart, that's right they had the best rider and they haven't had the best rider since.

Suzuki haven't won a championship since Carmichael, Kawi hasn't won since Villopoto and so on, Rider > Bike everyday of the week.

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2/14/2020 8:48 PM

DrinkMoreWater wrote:

You said it no success since James Stewart, that's right they had the best rider and they haven't had the best rider since.

Suzuki haven't won a championship since Carmichael, Kawi hasn't won since Villopoto and so on, Rider > Bike everyday of the week.

Did u bang your head? Reed, Dungey and Roczen all won championships on suzuki after RC4

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2/14/2020 8:57 PM

DrinkMoreWater wrote:

You said it no success since James Stewart, that's right they had the best rider and they haven't had the best rider since.

Suzuki haven't won a championship since Carmichael, Kawi hasn't won since Villopoto and so on, Rider > Bike everyday of the week.

Rotaholic wrote:

Did u bang your head? Reed, Dungey and Roczen all won championships on suzuki after RC4

And Tomac won a few titles for Kawi. lol

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2/14/2020 8:58 PM

DrinkMoreWater wrote:

You said it no success since James Stewart, that's right they had the best rider and they haven't had the best rider since.

Suzuki haven't won a championship since Carmichael, Kawi hasn't won since Villopoto and so on, Rider > Bike everyday of the week.

Might want to recheck your facts on those stats your preaching...neither of which are correct!

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2/14/2020 9:12 PM

Outside looking in I don’t know about the culture there. Seems like they have no problem openly talking down about there riders somewhat publicly

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2/15/2020 12:32 AM

Car people doing bikes never works. They dont get it.

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2/15/2020 12:33 AM

Ghostrider145 wrote:

JGR seems to run a loose program. That’s why a guy like Savatgy Is such a good fit. He is self motivated.
Same reason Martin has done pretty well against All the kids.
Peick ,Peters, Enzo all just had injuries while there but I’m expecting Jimmy D to pull a few good hole shots on East Coast and run well. Love the JGR presence in the Sport!

Ghost

Does JGR spend all of their time in N.C and have their riders do all their testing out there? I know that their shop is out there but I wonder if they ever come out to SoCal to test and ride tracks out here with most of the other guys or if a rider wants to go to SoCal or Florida they just ship a bike and parts with a mechanic? If not it seems like it would benefit JGR to come out to SoCal with their riders and test and ride with the different dirt and a lot more riders.

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2/15/2020 12:47 AM

hamncheeze wrote:

Coy has moved over to the car racing effort after the untimely and unfortunate passing of his brother.

Biggest issue facing JGR is getting good OEM support. They dragged Yamaha along when they weren't interested in running a factory program. Then when Yamaha decided to re-enter they basically said "we're good, we'll do our own thing" and JGR felt pretty slighted. So this is why they went to Suzuki, but that was already a sinking ship.

Best outcome for JGR is to become the GasGas team in the USA, or if KTM gave them the TLD program which certainly has been an underperformer.

If KTM gives Butler Bro’s the factory GasGas program it’d be cool to see JGR become the satellite KTM 450 team. Or what about a Husky satellite 450 team or JGR becoming the factory supported Husky 250 team like TLD is KTMs? TLD kinda had bad luck with McElrath and Jordan Smith leaving and with some of their amateur guys that they had for awhile not panning out like Cantrell and Falk. Pierce Brown looks like he has a lot of potential from the straight rhythm race but he’s out unfortunately with an injury. I don’t know much about Derek Drake but he’s been with TLD for awhile now too and I heard talk that Decoster was the one who wanted to bring Brian Moreau over here from France and he’s only 18 yrs old. This was a bad year to lose your top 2 guys and try and sign championship level guys. Justin Coopers contract is up with Star at the end of this year, TLD and KTM should be going after him with a blank check book because I think their bike is up there with the rest of the factory bikes. I don’t really see KTM dropping TLD anytime soon, too much time and energy invested into them, but they need to make something happen with signing a legit championship level guy this year.

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2/15/2020 1:03 AM

DrinkMoreWater wrote:

You said it no success since James Stewart, that's right they had the best rider and they haven't had the best rider since.

Suzuki haven't won a championship since Carmichael, Kawi hasn't won since Villopoto and so on, Rider > Bike everyday of the week.

I remember my first hit of acid ...

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2/15/2020 5:04 AM

resetjet wrote: When suzuki takes its last gasp which may be soon, so will jgr


Last gasp? Suzuki?

MMm-kay.

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"We don't rent pigs."

2/15/2020 5:32 AM

Honestly right now they have some light at the end of the tunnel as far as riders are concerned. Savatgy coming back will be good for them. Tickle you can pick up cheap and get good results. Alex is a great guy for the 250 for now. They need better 250 riders to shine again.

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2/15/2020 7:45 AM

Basically if you show up to the races on a yellow bike, you are pretty much racing a 2009 against 2020's. Your night is over, find a good seat in the stands and make yourself comfortable. Tickle won't finish top 10.

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SoCal - Behind the scenes MX/SX

2/15/2020 8:03 AM

drifto614 wrote:

Basically if you show up to the races on a yellow bike, you are pretty much racing a 2009 against 2020's. Your night is over, find a good seat in the stands and make yourself comfortable. Tickle won't finish top 10.

I don't think anyone...including Broc, expects him to finish in the top-10 the first race on a relatively new bike. He'll probably do top-15 though just because he's talented, and he's a proven guy racing by and large the same bike when he was with the RCH team not too long ago. He'll be fine.

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2/15/2020 8:49 AM

I dont get the, its the same bike as a 2009..... completely new engine, completely new frame, new suspension, what exactly is the same as a 2009?

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2/15/2020 9:37 AM

davistld01 wrote:

I'm not posting this to slam the JGR or the Gibbs family, but when they came on the scene they were so incredibly hyped, and expectations were so high...all the talk on Vital and abroad was how deep their pockets were, and how the NASCAR machine shop and group of design engineers could "make anything they wanted" so that the one-off factory parts that were unobtainable to the average teams were within the reach of JGR, and the ones that weren't, they could build themselves! It was looking to be a better-than-factory team!

But now, it seems that JGR has fallen to the level of being the team where factory riders go to retire, and fast guys seem to sign with and never attain what they could have if they'd been on "real" factory teams. They've never had a championship level rider...except for James Stewart, and that completely imploded into a bad situation both with Stewart and Yamaha. Heck, the only A-Tier rider they've been able to sign was Chad Reed...and even he never rode up to his reputation on the JGR Suzuki.

It's a sad affair, if you ask me. J-Bone has been with them seemingly forever...and you hardly ever see Coy Gibbs any more...and there is just a sense of desperation that covers them instead of one of excitement that used to be their attitude. What has happened? Has the money dried up so that they can't "buy" a hot, winning rider? Are their creative hands ties by the OEMs so that they can't build what they want, only being able to use what the OEM gives them, if anything at all?

I'm wondering how many more seasons JGR can hang on. I wish the absolute best for them, but I think their dreams of being a championship team have faded.

I truly hope I'm wrong...

Any thoughts?

If pops was running the show they would have been winners. Smart man and he loved John Riggins too.

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2/15/2020 9:39 AM

philG wrote:

Car people doing bikes never works. They dont get it.

Yea uh huh. Football folks going racing didn't work out either, you think?

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2/15/2020 9:44 AM

BobbyM wrote:

Yea uh huh. Football folks going racing didn't work out either, you think?

You hire people to get the job done. In car racing ,you make the best car, it wins. In bikes, you dont win with the best bike unless you have best guy on it. Nascar is a control formula, how hard can it be.

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2/15/2020 10:25 AM

No matter how good a bike you can build...you're only as good as the guy who knows how to ride it.

With the depth of the pockets that the Gibbs' were supposed to have, they seem to have missed opportunities to hire championship caliber riders the old fashioned way...by throwing the most money at them. Talent can't be taught...but it can be bought.

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2/15/2020 10:38 AM
Edited Date/Time: 2/15/2020 10:52 AM

Dtat720 wrote:

I dont get the, its the same bike as a 2009..... completely new engine, completely new frame, new suspension, what exactly is the same as a 2009?

The lower engine cases and the old 4 stroke “feel” 😂...and a kickstart. The KX250 is still kickstart but no one brings that up. Not much of an argument really. Haters gonna hate.

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2/15/2020 12:57 PM

most vital folk dont want to hear the truth but the sport is on its way out

id give it 10 years at most before MX racing will be on the same level as ATV MX in the USA..

there isnt enough young blood entering the sport and its dying at the local level overall..yeah..some areas have booming racing scenes but most do not.

i wish things were different but the managerial class of this sport are stuck in the past and the economics of running a track are terrible. the lower middle class people who actually follow this sport were decimated in 2008 and most never recovered and never will.

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2/15/2020 1:12 PM

JGR is not the problem its Suzuki. The only problem with JGR is they thought they could buy championships. If they switched to KTM/Husky or Kawi they would do much better. They have only used the two worst brands in the 450 Class Yamaha when that bike was horrible and they didn't run a 250 team and now Suzuki that hasn't changed their bikes in years. They also need a amateur program to bring riders up. They have just had the worst luck!

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2/15/2020 1:41 PM

BobbyM wrote:

If pops was running the show they would have been winners. Smart man and he loved John Riggins too.

Maybe JGR just picked the wrong manufacturers to align with.

Its seems like if you are running a non factory team, Honda and KTM are your best bets for factory assistance.

Also, not to bash anyone, but If I owned JGR I would have made a personnel change from J-Bone years ago, he has never had one successful season as manager- and remember, Stewart quit that team mid season to ride a Suzuki.

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