Interesting heart rate stuff from tonight

lostboy819 wrote:

lol, I had a Cardioversion on Friday and they hit me twice and both times I went back to A-Fib,they changed the meds and in two...

lol, I had a Cardioversion on Friday and they hit me twice and both times I went back to A-Fib,they changed the meds and in two weeks if I am not back to a sinus rhythm they will try the Cardioversion again, I still have the burns on my chest and back so I am hoping the meds do their thing.

lostboy819 wrote:

lol, I had a Cardioversion on Friday and they hit me twice and both times I went back to A-Fib,they changed the meds and in two...

lol, I had a Cardioversion on Friday and they hit me twice and both times I went back to A-Fib,they changed the meds and in two weeks if I am not back to a sinus rhythm they will try the Cardioversion again, I still have the burns on my chest and back so I am hoping the meds do their thing.

Reedo wrote:

Hey Lostboy were you riding when your heart revved out ?.Ive been diagnosed with SVT and the Docs got me on some drugs and im not...

Hey Lostboy were you riding when your heart revved out ?.Ive been diagnosed with SVT and the Docs got me on some drugs and im not sure about getting back on the bike.

lostboy819 wrote:

I have had it for years and didn't even know it, I feel worse when my heart is in a normal rhythm than when its in...

I have had it for years and didn't even know it, I feel worse when my heart is in a normal rhythm than when its in A-fib. It is very common and 1 in 4 will have it at some point and most do not even know it but you can ride and do what ever you want. The risk as you get older is stoke but with the beta blockers and blood thinners you will be fine so don't let it slow you down. They can get you in sinus rhythm again a number of different ways. I felt fine and normal even when my heart rate was 150-160 and had no clue. Just take some time getting used to new meds but they have no strange side effects on me.

GuyB wrote:

Some might question the use of blood thinners and racing. Just saying.

Tim507 wrote:

I us my HRM all the time......on my bicycles and in the gym...not so much on my dirt bike. At 61 I try to keep my...

I us my HRM all the time......on my bicycles and in the gym...not so much on my dirt bike. At 61 I try to keep my HR in the gym about 120 plus for a good cardio workout. On my bicycles push it up to the high 140 to mid 150. I have no need to go to my max or even consider going anaerobic.
For me the goal is to maintain a strong heart that will take me years into the future I have had several heart scans as PM and some blockage has always shown up.....however by working my heart muscle extensively all these years the cardiologist says that the extra blood flow helps to keep build up down.

For the pro mx ride my guess is that SX gets them the highest HR readings and outdoors a bit less.

For those that do understand anaerobic ....this is when the demand for fuel is so excessive that the body starts getting fuel from the consumption of muscle.

jeffro503 wrote:

Let me ask you guys this.......... If a guy was wanting to train cardio to help in his MX performance ( say like 20 min motos...

Let me ask you guys this..........

If a guy was wanting to train cardio to help in his MX performance ( say like 20 min motos ) and he wanted to be able to push to about 90% MHR........what would be your training schedule for that?

Do you train in the gym to hit about 90%.....or more? And if you were training for 20 min motos.......what is the duration you would train at? Like an hour every other day , every day. Should you push past that 90% on your workouts?

jeffro503 wrote:

Let me ask you guys this.......... If a guy was wanting to train cardio to help in his MX performance ( say like 20 min motos...

Let me ask you guys this..........

If a guy was wanting to train cardio to help in his MX performance ( say like 20 min motos ) and he wanted to be able to push to about 90% MHR........what would be your training schedule for that?

Do you train in the gym to hit about 90%.....or more? And if you were training for 20 min motos.......what is the duration you would train at? Like an hour every other day , every day. Should you push past that 90% on your workouts?

EddieC wrote:

I can tell you want you shouldn't do. Race mountain bike races (MTB) during the week thinking somehow this is appropriate training for SX. People may...

I can tell you want you shouldn't do. Race mountain bike races (MT during the week thinking somehow this is appropriate training for SX. People may argue that HR's are equally high during MTB racing and so that justifies the its use. Well HR's in soccer, basketball as well as other sports also have high HR's with the time spent above 80% MAX HR varying between them. True (college educated) strength and conditioning professionals understand this and that is why you don't see NFL, NHL, MLS, MLB, NBA athletes racing mountain bike races during the week or other non-movement specific exercises.

On the flip side you will have Moto athletes that do spend the majority of their training on the dirt bike but fail miserably in managing HR intensity. I have spoken with riders who make it a point to do a 100 laps 3-4 X per week. Others simply go out and mimic race day scenarios with the occasional sprint laps at the end of the day. I have questioned moto athletes who wear HR monitors what they do with the information stored on the watch. Most look at me with a puzzled look and say "I only look at what my HR is after I finish a moto".

The majority of your cardio training should be done on the bike preferably with one or two other racers. Using a term from soccer you should break up your riding into technical and tactical training days. Moto days and technique days.
Moto days should always be done at race pace and preferably racing with two other riders. Buy a HR rate monitor that can record HR during your motos and learn how to use it. Use this data in conjunction with your laps times to help set up your training parameters.

Your training should give you the confidence to go at 90%HR for a full moto but in reality you want to avoid that. At those intensities you leave yourself little margin for error. Ideally you would like your 70% to be everyone else's 90%.

One last and very IMPORTANT training tip that is grossly misunderstood amongst moto "trainers" and poorly applied is STRENGTH training. When you watch some of the "training" videos from posted by these "experts" you'd think you where training for the circus. Sure they will throw words out there like core and stability but do they really know how these work within the parameters of moto? Racing moto is a delicate balance between being one with the bike and fighting for your life as it bitch slaps you. Strength training for moto should be looked at in two ways 1. resistance of the violent forces that can be placed upon your body. ie. swapping, headshake, casing. 2. limiting cardio vascular strain.

The stronger you are the less energy you will have to exert thus giving you HEART a break.
For example if rider A. can squat 225 pounds 10X while rider B can only do it 1X and if FOR EXAMPLE the forces acting on the body on during the race equate to 185 pounds rider A can ride with less effort and for longer than rider B.

To obtain this type of strength one needs to train using "heavy weights" on a FIRM base with proper form so that the CORRECT muscles are working to perform the exercise.
How HEAVY? My belief is that one should be able to bench at least their bodyweight, pull up their bodyweight, 1/2 squat and deadlift 1 1/2 X bodyweight. I don't have the science yet (it's coming) to substantiate my numbers but if you can't handle your own bodyweight how can you expect to handle your bodyweight plus the increase in force put upon it during a moto?

Are their riders that have won by not training this way? Yes
As we further look into the science of moto will this change the way riders train? Absolutely.

If you care to discuss on a more personal basis please email me at info@ichorsportsmedicine.com

Tim507 wrote:

I us my HRM all the time......on my bicycles and in the gym...not so much on my dirt bike. At 61 I try to keep my...

I us my HRM all the time......on my bicycles and in the gym...not so much on my dirt bike. At 61 I try to keep my HR in the gym about 120 plus for a good cardio workout. On my bicycles push it up to the high 140 to mid 150. I have no need to go to my max or even consider going anaerobic.
For me the goal is to maintain a strong heart that will take me years into the future I have had several heart scans as PM and some blockage has always shown up.....however by working my heart muscle extensively all these years the cardiologist says that the extra blood flow helps to keep build up down.

For the pro mx ride my guess is that SX gets them the highest HR readings and outdoors a bit less.

For those that do understand anaerobic ....this is when the demand for fuel is so excessive that the body starts getting fuel from the consumption of muscle.

thephoenix wrote:

Actually, not muscle per se, but anaerobic burns the stored sugars/glycogen (carbs) in your blood and tissues initially, which does not require near as much oxygen...

Actually, not muscle per se, but anaerobic burns the stored sugars/glycogen (carbs) in your blood and tissues initially, which does not require near as much oxygen as being aerobic. Anaerobic means "without oxygen", and sugars have about 4 calories per gram.

Aerobic states burn FAT, which has about 9 calories per gram, but requires lots of oxygen to do so.

So, being that the average person can store about 1800-2200 calories in stored carbs for energy...you run out really fast if you are in the anaerobic state, ask any marathoner what "bonking" is :-)

If you are aerobic and can burn fat...you can go for hours upon end, provided you have enough water and salts to process it, since even relatively "thin" people have tens of thousands of fat calories to spare.

With high aerobic fitness comes higher anaerobic threshold levels, meaning you can push that maxed out anaerobic stage longer before bonking. Hell, 5k runners (HIGH heart rates when racing) spend LOTS of time and miles (12-15, or more) running at much lower heart rates. To go fast, you must first learn to go slow. Aerobic base building comes from LOW heart rate training, training all the time at HIGH heart rates is counterproductive (and risky) to aerobic endurance, there are oxygen receptor changes in muscle tissues that ONLY occur at low heart rates where fat can be used for fuel.

I am training for my first Ironman, and 95% of my training is being done at 125-150 heart rate. Building a HUGE aerobic base is paramount when you have to keep moving for 12+ hours. When I was racing motocross, I ran 6-10 miles 4x a week, slowly, to build endurance for that 20-25 minute sprint. The pros don't spend all that time running and cycling at high heart rates, they are doing aerobic training.

One of the most effective things an average local motocrosser could do to build endurance is to go out and run, cycle, or swim, for 1-2 hours per session, 3-4 times a week, wear an HR monitor, and stick to the HR guidelines.

http://duathlon.com/articles/1460/

GuyB wrote:

I'm not a doctor and don't claim to be. But I do know a past mountain bike downhill world champ (Dave Cullinan) who wasn't allowed to...

I'm not a doctor and don't claim to be. But I do know a past mountain bike downhill world champ (Dave Cullinan) who wasn't allowed to race by the sanctioning body because he was on blood thinners after a heart valve replacement. They were afraid he'd bleed out if he crashed.

That's where the comment came from.

Radical wrote:

I say workouts for endurance should include a mix of aerobic and anaerobic. Find the pace that is pushing yourself pretty hard, but that you can...

I say workouts for endurance should include a mix of aerobic and anaerobic. Find the pace that is pushing yourself pretty hard, but that you can maintain for 30-60 minutes. Then add in some periods of intensity that push you in the anaerobic stage (Hills on a mountain bike, fast sections if you're running). I have no scientific data on this. I just know that the harder you work, the stronger your body (and heart) become. Ultimately aren't we trying to increase the strength of our hearts, and increase our body's oxygen efficiency?

It's like saying that the guy who runs on flat ground for 90 minutes is going to be stronger and have more endurance than the guy who runs up a nasty hills for 30 minutes. Absurd! The guy running hills will whoop your ass!

Running or cycling at a low heart rate for endless hours is a waste of time. It's like lifting weights with 10 lbs for hour upon hour.

I would bet money that working hard enough to bounce in and out of your aerobic zone will increase your endurance far more than staying below 70%.

If you work out the way I'm suggesting, and your competitors don't, you'll be able to outwork your competitors every single time.

Stamp it!

jeffro503 wrote:

Let me ask you guys this.......... If a guy was wanting to train cardio to help in his MX performance ( say like 20 min motos...

Let me ask you guys this..........

If a guy was wanting to train cardio to help in his MX performance ( say like 20 min motos ) and he wanted to be able to push to about 90% MHR........what would be your training schedule for that?

Do you train in the gym to hit about 90%.....or more? And if you were training for 20 min motos.......what is the duration you would train at? Like an hour every other day , every day. Should you push past that 90% on your workouts?

Tim507 wrote:

I us my HRM all the time......on my bicycles and in the gym...not so much on my dirt bike. At 61 I try to keep my...

I us my HRM all the time......on my bicycles and in the gym...not so much on my dirt bike. At 61 I try to keep my HR in the gym about 120 plus for a good cardio workout. On my bicycles push it up to the high 140 to mid 150. I have no need to go to my max or even consider going anaerobic.
For me the goal is to maintain a strong heart that will take me years into the future I have had several heart scans as PM and some blockage has always shown up.....however by working my heart muscle extensively all these years the cardiologist says that the extra blood flow helps to keep build up down.

For the pro mx ride my guess is that SX gets them the highest HR readings and outdoors a bit less.

For those that do understand anaerobic ....this is when the demand for fuel is so excessive that the body starts getting fuel from the consumption of muscle.

thephoenix wrote:

Actually, not muscle per se, but anaerobic burns the stored sugars/glycogen (carbs) in your blood and tissues initially, which does not require near as much oxygen...

Actually, not muscle per se, but anaerobic burns the stored sugars/glycogen (carbs) in your blood and tissues initially, which does not require near as much oxygen as being aerobic. Anaerobic means "without oxygen", and sugars have about 4 calories per gram.

Aerobic states burn FAT, which has about 9 calories per gram, but requires lots of oxygen to do so.

So, being that the average person can store about 1800-2200 calories in stored carbs for energy...you run out really fast if you are in the anaerobic state, ask any marathoner what "bonking" is :-)

If you are aerobic and can burn fat...you can go for hours upon end, provided you have enough water and salts to process it, since even relatively "thin" people have tens of thousands of fat calories to spare.

With high aerobic fitness comes higher anaerobic threshold levels, meaning you can push that maxed out anaerobic stage longer before bonking. Hell, 5k runners (HIGH heart rates when racing) spend LOTS of time and miles (12-15, or more) running at much lower heart rates. To go fast, you must first learn to go slow. Aerobic base building comes from LOW heart rate training, training all the time at HIGH heart rates is counterproductive (and risky) to aerobic endurance, there are oxygen receptor changes in muscle tissues that ONLY occur at low heart rates where fat can be used for fuel.

I am training for my first Ironman, and 95% of my training is being done at 125-150 heart rate. Building a HUGE aerobic base is paramount when you have to keep moving for 12+ hours. When I was racing motocross, I ran 6-10 miles 4x a week, slowly, to build endurance for that 20-25 minute sprint. The pros don't spend all that time running and cycling at high heart rates, they are doing aerobic training.

One of the most effective things an average local motocrosser could do to build endurance is to go out and run, cycle, or swim, for 1-2 hours per session, 3-4 times a week, wear an HR monitor, and stick to the HR guidelines.

http://duathlon.com/articles/1460/