How does a new 250F compare to a vintage 250 2t ?

swatdoc
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swatdoc
Edited Date/Time 4/6/2015 4:28pm
Hey guys I was wondering if any of you out there have a new 250f and also ride a vintage 250 2 stroke, like a 78-80 CR250 or similar.
Was curious how the power of the new bikes would compare. On paper a 2 stroke of the same displacement should have more power, but with 35 years of progress how close are the new 4strokes to the power of the old air-cooled 2 strokes??
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zehn
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zehn 4/4/2015 3:07pm
4/4/2015 3:07pm Edited Date/Time 4/4/2015 3:07pm
swatdoc wrote:
Hey guys I was wondering if any of you out there have a new 250f and also ride a vintage 250 2 stroke, like a 78-80...
Hey guys I was wondering if any of you out there have a new 250f and also ride a vintage 250 2 stroke, like a 78-80 CR250 or similar.
Was curious how the power of the new bikes would compare. On paper a 2 stroke of the same displacement should have more power, but with 35 years of progress how close are the new 4strokes to the power of the old air-cooled 2 strokes??
Modern 250 4Ts with a little modification make about as much power as a 250 2T from 10 years ago, IIRC
plynn41
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plynn41 4/4/2015 3:34pm
4/4/2015 3:34pm Edited Date/Time 4/4/2015 3:35pm
There's no good comparison to the 78-80 CR250 or other bikes of that era. The slowest 250f from today (the red one) is yards ahead of those older bikes in every race-related way. New 250f's put out 40+hp of smooth power, while the old air cooled bikes probably made 30-35hp.

And I don't own a 4-stroke btw. Smile
swatdoc
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swatdoc 4/5/2015 2:09pm
4/5/2015 2:09pm
thanks guys - I'm trying to figure out the best new bike for me to get.

About 2 months ago I rode an 81 YZ250, and a 03 KX250. Seemed to be plenty of power for me. I currently have a '12 KTm EXC500 which i ride moto, and that thing just wears me out too quickly. (I'm 55 yrs old/205 lbs., but in decent shape)
So I'm thinking a smaller bike - not a new 450 - would be the way to go. Was debating between a 250 SXF or 350 SXF. I was a little concerned the 250 might be underpowered for me, but if it's more powerful than the older 2t 250's it should be OK for me. Maybe put a big bore kit on it. 350 prob wouldn't be bad either - might just be a little more tiring to ride - but still not as bad as a 450.
jtiger12
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jtiger12 4/5/2015 2:19pm
4/5/2015 2:19pm
Sounds like you will be fine with a 250f. If an 03 kx250 is enough power, you will be about there. thumper are way smoother than a 2 stroke in the rough stuff

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FI2T
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FI2T 4/5/2015 2:34pm
4/5/2015 2:34pm
Just snag a new 10yr old vintage yz250... 205 is pretty big for a 250f.
Pat
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Pat 4/5/2015 2:36pm
4/5/2015 2:36pm
350 sounds like the way to go
Flatliner
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Flatliner 4/5/2015 2:56pm
4/5/2015 2:56pm
FI2T wrote:
Just snag a new 10yr old vintage yz250... 205 is pretty big for a 250f.
Not at the local level.... new 250f's are pretty darn fast.

h&m_cycle
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h&m_cycle 4/5/2015 3:14pm
4/5/2015 3:14pm
h&m_cycle wrote:
here's newer 250 2 stroke vs. 250f. YZ puts out 10 more ft. pounds of torque then the thumper
YZ also has 10 more horsepower

http://motocrossactionmag.com/bike-tests/you-asked-for-it-motocross-act…
zehn wrote:
To be fair, that's the older YZF design. The newer motor puts out a lot more power.
yes, If I was going to buy a 4 stroke it would be a new yamaha, Horsepower + suspension
Wasatch Rider 4/5/2015 3:27pm
4/5/2015 3:27pm
For the time the old stuff was better. By far.

During the early 80s was some of the most tech advancements still being used today.

Disc brakes, power valves, and the 1982 Full Floater rear suspension was as good as anything today. Just a bit heavy.

JW381
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JW381 4/5/2015 4:02pm
4/5/2015 4:02pm
Interesting question, but what does it have to do with you settling on a new bike? Are you actually torn between an '80 CR250 and a new 250F?
Empty Pockets 4/5/2015 4:11pm
4/5/2015 4:11pm Edited Date/Time 4/5/2015 4:14pm
JW381 wrote:
Interesting question, but what does it have to do with you settling on a new bike? Are you actually torn between an '80 CR250 and a...
Interesting question, but what does it have to do with you settling on a new bike? Are you actually torn between an '80 CR250 and a new 250F?
My take from reading what he's written, he doesn't want it to be less powerfull than his old cr250, he wants a new, light weight bike with around the same power, hence if a modern 250f is comparable he doesn't have to go 350/450 ?
markit
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markit 4/5/2015 4:17pm
4/5/2015 4:17pm
I've won many a race in the A class (open displacement) on a 250f and i was close to 250 w/ gear then. This was off road though.
CrGuy2T
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CrGuy2T 4/5/2015 4:31pm
4/5/2015 4:31pm
I am a big 2 stroke guy, I just sold an 02 cr 250 with every bolt on you can have and I have a 02 cr 125 that is full mod with a 134. I just recently bought a 2012 crf 250 with 5hrs on it bone stock and I must say that the newer 250f is superior to them both. The fun factor vs my mod 125 is almost equal but not quite. Very hard to admit this but I will if I had to compare bike to bike I would have to say the 250f would be my choice.Also the 48mm showa spring forks are very nice.
Suns_PSD
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Suns_PSD 4/5/2015 4:34pm
4/5/2015 4:34pm
A 250F feels slower than an early '80s 2 stroke just because it has such a better (smoother) powerband and of course a vastly improved chassis.
It was a big deal when the then new '88 CR250 dynoed 38 hp, well above contemporary 250T numbers. Well below a modern 250F however.
OP, you sound like a great candidate for the new improved 2016 350F. Good luck!

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swatdoc
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swatdoc 4/5/2015 4:36pm
4/5/2015 4:36pm
I'm going with a four stroke for a couple reasons - slightly easier to ride - better traction, etc, and the fact that with a KTM I can have electric start.
So it's boiling down to a 2016 KTM 250F or 350F.
The 350 will no doubt be better than a 450, but still might be a little more than I want. Another real big factor is that MXA says the 16 350's will NOT have the upgraded smaller/lighter motors like the 250/450's will have. So with those factors. I'm leaning towards the 2016 250 with a big bore kit.
It sounds like from what most of you are saying that I should be happy with that
Thanks guys
JW381
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JW381 4/5/2015 5:00pm
4/5/2015 5:00pm
JW381 wrote:
Interesting question, but what does it have to do with you settling on a new bike? Are you actually torn between an '80 CR250 and a...
Interesting question, but what does it have to do with you settling on a new bike? Are you actually torn between an '80 CR250 and a new 250F?
Empty Pockets wrote:
My take from reading what he's written, he doesn't want it to be less powerfull than his old cr250, he wants a new, light weight bike...
My take from reading what he's written, he doesn't want it to be less powerfull than his old cr250, he wants a new, light weight bike with around the same power, hence if a modern 250f is comparable he doesn't have to go 350/450 ?
Okay, I see what you're saying. Seemed odd when I first read it.
Empty Pockets 4/5/2015 5:24pm
4/5/2015 5:24pm
CrGuy2T wrote:
I am a big 2 stroke guy, I just sold an 02 cr 250 with every bolt on you can have and I have a 02...
I am a big 2 stroke guy, I just sold an 02 cr 250 with every bolt on you can have and I have a 02 cr 125 that is full mod with a 134. I just recently bought a 2012 crf 250 with 5hrs on it bone stock and I must say that the newer 250f is superior to them both. The fun factor vs my mod 125 is almost equal but not quite. Very hard to admit this but I will if I had to compare bike to bike I would have to say the 250f would be my choice.Also the 48mm showa spring forks are very nice.
Did you sell the b kit/coated showas you had for sale on here, i sent you a pm but didn't hear back ?
Empty Pockets 4/5/2015 5:30pm
4/5/2015 5:30pm
JW381 wrote:
Interesting question, but what does it have to do with you settling on a new bike? Are you actually torn between an '80 CR250 and a...
Interesting question, but what does it have to do with you settling on a new bike? Are you actually torn between an '80 CR250 and a new 250F?
Empty Pockets wrote:
My take from reading what he's written, he doesn't want it to be less powerfull than his old cr250, he wants a new, light weight bike...
My take from reading what he's written, he doesn't want it to be less powerfull than his old cr250, he wants a new, light weight bike with around the same power, hence if a modern 250f is comparable he doesn't have to go 350/450 ?
JW381 wrote:
Okay, I see what you're saying. Seemed odd when I first read it.
No worries bud, wasn't being a nobber, was just my assumption and could've quite as easily been wrong.
joeellis
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joeellis 4/5/2015 6:27pm
4/5/2015 6:27pm
I'm your exact age and weight. Just bought a 2105 YZ250F. Also owned a KTM 250F. Both had plenty of power for me. The power of each is different. Yamaha is more linear with better bottom to mid and the kTM almost seems to not have a rev limiter. Both are excellent bikes. May want to consider the new Yamaha 250FX. Believe that is right. Supposedly very similar but with 6 gears, 18" wheel etc., but it also has electric start.
markit
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markit 4/5/2015 8:21pm
4/5/2015 8:21pm
That's my next bike yz250fx.
swatdoc
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swatdoc 4/5/2015 8:26pm
4/5/2015 8:26pm Edited Date/Time 4/5/2015 8:31pm
Empty - yes exactly. Just wanting to make sure I wasnt going to be down on power with a new 250F compared to the power of an older 250 2t.

The Yam 25-FX sounds cool, but not set up for MX, which will be the sole use of my bike. The Yam sounds heavy too, compared to the 2016 250 SXF (221 lbs)

Now if KTM comes out with a 250SX (2t) for 2016 that has FI and electric start, that could throw a monkey wrench in there and add one more option. A new electric start 250 2t with maybe 9oz. Flywheel weight to smooth out the power might be pretty awesome.
zehn
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zehn 4/5/2015 8:36pm
4/5/2015 8:36pm
kaboom645 wrote:
I'm 220 with gear on and this is me on my son's '15 250f.. I have a 450, but I'm gonna sell it soon to go...
I'm 220 with gear on and this is me on my son's '15 250f.. I have a 450, but I'm gonna sell it soon to go back to a 2stroke
https://youtu.be/IlsezjSlb5A
Video is private, can't watch it
mxfiend
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mxfiend 4/5/2015 9:05pm
4/5/2015 9:05pm
swatdoc wrote:
Empty - yes exactly. Just wanting to make sure I wasnt going to be down on power with a new 250F compared to the power of...
Empty - yes exactly. Just wanting to make sure I wasnt going to be down on power with a new 250F compared to the power of an older 250 2t.

The Yam 25-FX sounds cool, but not set up for MX, which will be the sole use of my bike. The Yam sounds heavy too, compared to the 2016 250 SXF (221 lbs)

Now if KTM comes out with a 250SX (2t) for 2016 that has FI and electric start, that could throw a monkey wrench in there and add one more option. A new electric start 250 2t with maybe 9oz. Flywheel weight to smooth out the power might be pretty awesome.
A 1980s bike isnt set up for todays mx either....so just get any newer bike and be happy

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