Here we go

fresh knobby 9/11/2017 4:25pm
9/11/2017 4:25pm
I'm more intrigued by the front sprocket. Is the countershaft bearing and spline good? A little moment out of kilter up front compounded by the big torque Spike of overly tight chain definitely put it over the edge. Read up on instant center s and ATK.
BobPA
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BobPA 9/11/2017 4:29pm
9/11/2017 4:29pm
mxb2 wrote:
I rest my case your honor. Lol. Fwiw buy a good set, maintain them. Be done with it. Your health isn't worth saving $500-600 bucks.
lumpy790 wrote:
Health is MUCH more expensive!
mxb2 wrote:
Exactly my point. Can't put a price on someones health.
You can put a price on anything.
Racer_Twentynine 9/11/2017 4:29pm
9/11/2017 4:29pm
BUT WAIT!!!!!!
That sprocket has a full ring around the hub. I though it wasn't supposed to happen with that style sprocket.
JM485
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JM485 9/11/2017 4:38pm
9/11/2017 4:38pm
Still waiting for someone to qualitatively explain why these hubs are so inferior. . .Whistling

The Shop

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eric513anderson 9/11/2017 5:00pm
9/11/2017 5:00pm
tobz wrote:
Lucky man, shit gets a bit more depressing when your laid up and having to replace cases. But wouldn't you hear/feel that shit clunking around when...
Lucky man, shit gets a bit more depressing when your laid up and having to replace cases.


But wouldn't you hear/feel that shit clunking around when it's THAT loose?
Couldn't hear anything lol
early
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early 9/11/2017 5:43pm
9/11/2017 5:43pm
tobz wrote:
Lucky man, shit gets a bit more depressing when your laid up and having to replace cases. But wouldn't you hear/feel that shit clunking around when...
Lucky man, shit gets a bit more depressing when your laid up and having to replace cases.


But wouldn't you hear/feel that shit clunking around when it's THAT loose?
eric513anderson wrote:
Couldn't hear anything lol
The bolts may have loosened up to the point where the sprocket would slip but not wobble. Would have looked fine even with enough thread on the backside of the nut. May have noticed it putting around but not hammering. It could have even happened that day .
Monk
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Monk 9/11/2017 6:12pm
9/11/2017 6:12pm
Old-Man wrote:
How tight was that chain? You said you tightened the bolts but the sprocket looks like it was running loose before letting go. See the round...
How tight was that chain?

You said you tightened the bolts but the sprocket looks like it was running loose before letting go.
See the round out on the Hub?





Pretty much what I was thinking...
eric513anderson 9/11/2017 6:31pm
9/11/2017 6:31pm
Old-Man wrote:
How tight was that chain? You said you tightened the bolts but the sprocket looks like it was running loose before letting go. See the round...
How tight was that chain?

You said you tightened the bolts but the sprocket looks like it was running loose before letting go.
See the round out on the Hub?





Monk wrote:
Pretty much what I was thinking...
Honestly the chain wasn't that tight. I do the 3 finger method behind the chain slider on the swing arm

rocky94
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rocky94 9/11/2017 6:38pm
9/11/2017 6:38pm
eric513anderson wrote:
So I had an eventful night last night. We showed up late and ended up missing both practices. Never rode this track before either. Go out...
So I had an eventful night last night. We showed up late and ended up missing both practices. Never rode this track before either. Go out for moto 1 and end up 7th out of 12. I'm happy for just getting a feel of the track. Moto 2. I grab a massive holeshot and I'm out front leading until....disaster strikes. Landed a double went to gas it for the next double and nothing. I'm thinking did my bike somehow kick down into neuatral? I click down into first and gas it and go nowhere. I costed over the double and then my bike starting hopping. This is what happened.











Yes it's a Tusk hub. Yes I torqued my sprocket bolts to Yamaha spec and used red Loctite as well. Maybe it was negligence on my part and not double checking the torque on them every so often. Just put them on in April when I got new tires so I thought they'd be good for awhile. I'm just super lucky this happened on a landing and didn't result in a bad crash. Flame away fellow vitards
OP do you use nylock nuts or stover nuts?
-MAVERICK-
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-MAVERICK- 9/11/2017 6:39pm
9/11/2017 6:39pm
Old-Man wrote:
How tight was that chain? You said you tightened the bolts but the sprocket looks like it was running loose before letting go. See the round...
How tight was that chain?

You said you tightened the bolts but the sprocket looks like it was running loose before letting go.
See the round out on the Hub?





Monk wrote:
Pretty much what I was thinking...
eric513anderson wrote:
Honestly the chain wasn't that tight. I do the 3 finger method behind the chain slider on the swing arm [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2017/09/11/214275/s1200_IMG_1941.jpg[/img]
Honestly the chain wasn't that tight. I do the 3 finger method behind the chain slider on the swing arm

So you check the chain tension but forgo the sprocket bolts?

Maintenance 101 check every bolt before riding.
wildbill
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wildbill 9/11/2017 7:38pm
9/11/2017 7:38pm
Congrats on the huge holey.
JB 19
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JB 19 9/11/2017 8:02pm
9/11/2017 8:02pm Edited Date/Time 9/11/2017 8:03pm
Who gets 5 months out of a set of tires in the middle of the summer?
Flip109
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Flip109 9/11/2017 8:12pm
9/11/2017 8:12pm
tobz wrote:
Lucky man, shit gets a bit more depressing when your laid up and having to replace cases. But wouldn't you hear/feel that shit clunking around when...
Lucky man, shit gets a bit more depressing when your laid up and having to replace cases.


But wouldn't you hear/feel that shit clunking around when it's THAT loose?
eric513anderson wrote:
Couldn't hear anything lol
Had the exact same shit happen on my 05 Honda 450 back in the day. I just never even considered them coming loose back then. I always tightened them and used lock tight. Never had anything like that happen to me before then. Hit a 120ft table to table, jump was blind. There was a step up right after. I cleared the table to table and upon landing from the step up my rear wheel locked up. Hub was destroyed. OEM hub. The prior laps I never noticed or felt a thing hitting that jump over and over. No telling how loose they were for how long. So I could see how you never felt them coming loose. Scary feeling knowing it coulda ended bad for sure.
JB 19
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JB 19 9/11/2017 8:25pm
9/11/2017 8:25pm Edited Date/Time 9/11/2017 8:28pm
Post didn't make it to the page.
eric513anderson 9/12/2017 6:42am
9/12/2017 6:42am
Monk wrote:
Pretty much what I was thinking...
eric513anderson wrote:
Honestly the chain wasn't that tight. I do the 3 finger method behind the chain slider on the swing arm [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2017/09/11/214275/s1200_IMG_1941.jpg[/img]
Honestly the chain wasn't that tight. I do the 3 finger method behind the chain slider on the swing arm

-MAVERICK- wrote:
So you check the chain tension but forgo the sprocket bolts?

Maintenance 101 check every bolt before riding.
Didn't think they would come loose that easily

Pit Row

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eric513anderson 9/12/2017 6:42am
9/12/2017 6:42am
eric513anderson wrote:
So I had an eventful night last night. We showed up late and ended up missing both practices. Never rode this track before either. Go out...
So I had an eventful night last night. We showed up late and ended up missing both practices. Never rode this track before either. Go out for moto 1 and end up 7th out of 12. I'm happy for just getting a feel of the track. Moto 2. I grab a massive holeshot and I'm out front leading until....disaster strikes. Landed a double went to gas it for the next double and nothing. I'm thinking did my bike somehow kick down into neuatral? I click down into first and gas it and go nowhere. I costed over the double and then my bike starting hopping. This is what happened.











Yes it's a Tusk hub. Yes I torqued my sprocket bolts to Yamaha spec and used red Loctite as well. Maybe it was negligence on my part and not double checking the torque on them every so often. Just put them on in April when I got new tires so I thought they'd be good for awhile. I'm just super lucky this happened on a landing and didn't result in a bad crash. Flame away fellow vitards
rocky94 wrote:
OP do you use nylock nuts or stover nuts?
I just used the oem bolts
eric513anderson 9/12/2017 6:43am
9/12/2017 6:43am
JB 19 wrote:
Who gets 5 months out of a set of tires in the middle of the summer?
I do. Our tracks around here don't really get hardpack at all. One track is mostly sandy and the other we ride at 80% of the time is pretty soft dirt
TeamGreen
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TeamGreen 9/12/2017 7:21am
9/12/2017 7:21am
This thread is worthless without Peely.
RPM93
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RPM93 9/12/2017 7:35am
9/12/2017 7:35am
Meg,
Please let Peely out of the leg lock so he can respond....
GangGreen
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GangGreen 9/12/2017 7:37am
9/12/2017 7:37am
Torqueing the sprockets bolts can also give a false reading. Allen Bolt Flat heads are countersunk (cone shaped under the head) with a flat top. I usually put a 6 sided wrench on the back and give them an extra 1/4 turn. The pressure from the countersunk contact can give a false reading. If you break it, big deal, it's just a bolt/nut combination. Really odd that it also broke the front sprocket.
Ted722
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Ted722 9/12/2017 9:31am
9/12/2017 9:31am Edited Date/Time 9/12/2017 11:57am
JM485 wrote:
Still waiting for someone to qualitatively explain why these hubs are so inferior. . .Whistling
Would be interesting to take a Kite or Talon hub and compare back to back with a Tusk hub. Quality of material, machining, etc. Even though they say they're T6 6061, there can be a large variance in quality between mfg's. Dubya's John Anderson touched on this last night on Matthes' podcast as they've mulled over making their own hub.

So, for the average Joe I wouldn't say they're inferior, but I believe they're more prone to failure in extreme conditions and lack of maintenance. Talk about eating your own dog food to dispel any doubt, I'd like to see the Rocky Mountain team run them.
eric513anderson 9/12/2017 9:37am
9/12/2017 9:37am
GangGreen wrote:
Torqueing the sprockets bolts can also give a false reading. Allen Bolt Flat heads are countersunk (cone shaped under the head) with a flat top. I...
Torqueing the sprockets bolts can also give a false reading. Allen Bolt Flat heads are countersunk (cone shaped under the head) with a flat top. I usually put a 6 sided wrench on the back and give them an extra 1/4 turn. The pressure from the countersunk contact can give a false reading. If you break it, big deal, it's just a bolt/nut combination. Really odd that it also broke the front sprocket.
I used a Allen wrench to hold the face of the bold and used my torq wrench on the nut side to torq it since I don't have any Allen sockets. But yeah I can see what your saying how it can screw with the reading
mxb2
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mxb2 9/12/2017 9:49am
9/12/2017 9:49am
JM485 wrote:
Still waiting for someone to qualitatively explain why these hubs are so inferior. . .Whistling
Ted722 wrote:
Would be interesting to take a Kite or Talon hub and compare back to back with a Tusk hub. Quality of material, machining, etc. Even though...
Would be interesting to take a Kite or Talon hub and compare back to back with a Tusk hub. Quality of material, machining, etc. Even though they say they're T6 6061, there can be a large variance in quality between mfg's. Dubya's John Anderson touched on this last night on Matthes' podcast as they've mulled over making their own hub.

So, for the average Joe I wouldn't say they're inferior, but I believe they're more prone to failure in extreme conditions and lack of maintenance. Talk about eating your own dog food to dispel any doubt, I'd like to see the Rocky Mountain team run them.
Last paragraph is spot on. Maybe use the products you sell?
Katoomey
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Katoomey 9/12/2017 12:39pm
9/12/2017 12:39pm
it's fun when you get to see Darwin's theories come to life!
JB 19
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JB 19 9/12/2017 1:22pm
9/12/2017 1:22pm
I try to stay away from red loctite. It can seize up a bolt and give the illusion that it's "tight" even if the bolt has stretched or been installed over paint that has worn off, like in the case of a motor mount bolt.

You can put a wrench on it and feel that it's tight even though the bolt can't properly do it's job. I had this happen on a bike I bought that developed and bad vibration. The previous owner powder coated the frame and installed the motor mounts over the paint. I kept checking all the bolts and realized that the paint began to wear off and loosened the mounts, but the bolts had red loctite on them and where seized up which is why they felt tight.

On the other hand, I use.blue loctite on nearly everything.
JM485
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JM485 9/12/2017 4:28pm
9/12/2017 4:28pm
JM485 wrote:
Still waiting for someone to qualitatively explain why these hubs are so inferior. . .Whistling
Ted722 wrote:
Would be interesting to take a Kite or Talon hub and compare back to back with a Tusk hub. Quality of material, machining, etc. Even though...
Would be interesting to take a Kite or Talon hub and compare back to back with a Tusk hub. Quality of material, machining, etc. Even though they say they're T6 6061, there can be a large variance in quality between mfg's. Dubya's John Anderson touched on this last night on Matthes' podcast as they've mulled over making their own hub.

So, for the average Joe I wouldn't say they're inferior, but I believe they're more prone to failure in extreme conditions and lack of maintenance. Talk about eating your own dog food to dispel any doubt, I'd like to see the Rocky Mountain team run them.
I think those are valid points, but even if the machining is a little rougher I still don't see how it could cause a failure like the one in the OP. Surface finish absolutely has an effect on the fatigue life of a part, but I don't think that is really a consideration for what we are seeing here. Hey, you may be right about them being more prone to failure, they might even use crap metal for all I know, but I don' think it's right for people to just jump on the bandwagon and blame the hub right away because it's one of the cheaper ones on the market and claim they know that caused the failure.

As for the RM team running them, there are obviously much lighter and higher quality hubs on the market. Just because they don't run them doesn't mean they are prone to failure, there are just better options out there from a purely performance standpoint, and nobody in their right mind would argue that. I mean we see stock hubs break as well, does that mean they are low quality and prone to failure?

See ya in Reno, just starting to get the bikes together and ready to roll!Cool
smoothies862
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smoothies862 9/12/2017 5:06pm
9/12/2017 5:06pm
I put a dot , blue even,lol. on the nut then on whatever it tightens to. still check them. its just an easy way to catch one moving.

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