Here is the 2021 450 Shoutout?? Deleted??

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10/17/2020 8:59 AM

LKHill wrote:

I can't see how. They ranked it higher than any other outlet. The real problem for me and many others is how the yahama pounded everybody last year and ranked 4th this year.

SwapperMX wrote:

They didn't pound everyone, it was still close. The other bikes improve, even marginally, and they are going to go past a bike that did not change. And wasn't last year's test over one day when this year's test was across 2 days at 2 different tracks. Even still, the Yam is still a damn great bike.

kiwifan wrote:

I agree, all the bikes including the Zook are good enough for everyone, buy what you like and be happy. Just because a brand finishes last or not first in a shootout means fuck all at the end of the day

David did say during the shootout no one bike is gonna make the average guy any faster. Some bikes with suit others better.

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10/17/2020 9:14 AM

LKHill wrote:

I guess I am still confused. All the testers raved about the KTM being the best for them in the old video.

Dirty Points wrote:

That's why the math was so confusing. Best is #2 in this format. Worst is #3, 2nd is #1, and so on...

yz133rider wrote:

Oh and the bike literally everyone hopped on last year from every mag and raved how it took minimal changes to get comfortable on is number 4 and all of a sudden people are struggling with set up.

I’m not sure what other tracks they went to, but I know they did go to State Fair Mx which is not where the Yamaha will shine at all.

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2017 RMZ450
2005 YZ250-sold :,(
1998 YZ250
2005 KX250F

80% of the time it works every time
IG @hamdaddyof2 & @2HRacing
Thanks to : Factory Effex, N2Dirt, Acerbis, DT1, Fasthouse, Matix, FMF, ASV, 100% & Mika Metals

10/17/2020 9:53 AM

The shootouts don't make much sense anymore, it's not the 70's or 80's anymore. All the bikes are good, just in different areas.

Just because 5 or 6 people like it on the other side of the country from me, doesn't mean it's the right one for me.

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10/17/2020 10:00 AM

Brent wrote:

I sure wish that more manufacturers would do the demo days like KTM and Yamaha used to do.

Then bike buyers can decide for themselves instead of relying on input from others. These bikes are so close in performance and handling that it comes down to personal preference and riding style.

The last time I did the Yamaha Jason Raines Demo was back in March just before the Rona hit, it was nice to ride the YZ 450, and even though it wasn't the bike for my riding style, at least I got to try it as opposed to just buying a random bike I have never ridden and hope it fits because some tester that I don't know said it was good.

Maybe riders buy the same brand year after year simply because they have never wanted to take the risk of buying a motorcycle that doesn't feel good to them, its not like you can return the thing if you don't like it...

mxb2 wrote:

Hit a local track, find all the brands you want, give the owner some $$ to spin a few laps. Cheaper than buying a new bike you wont like.

Johnny Ringo wrote:

I wouldn’t let anyone I don’t know ride my bike. If they want to pay me they can pay the KBB and keep it

That’s what I was thinking. Imagine this happening:

“ Hey Bud, I notice you have a brand new 2021 450. You don’t know me from Adam, but here’s 20 bucks, can I take your new bike out on the track?”

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10/17/2020 10:07 AM

numbers wrote:

David did say during the shootout no one bike is gonna make the average guy any faster. Some bikes with suit others better.

There can be 5 seconds a lap or more between bikes with the same rider when all is said and done. It is tough to know the right one to choose without some kind of feedback. I wouldn't let a stranger ride my bike for money but I know the risk/reward of letting others do so and accept it.

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10/17/2020 10:08 AM

mxb2 wrote:

Hit a local track, find all the brands you want, give the owner some $$ to spin a few laps. Cheaper than buying a new bike you wont like.

Johnny Ringo wrote:

I wouldn’t let anyone I don’t know ride my bike. If they want to pay me they can pay the KBB and keep it

Brent wrote:

That’s what I was thinking. Imagine this happening:

“ Hey Bud, I notice you have a brand new 2021 450. You don’t know me from Adam, but here’s 20 bucks, can I take your new bike out on the track?”

I’ve done it.

Ratted out S10 with a roached ‘04 CRF250?

No fucking way.


New Silverado and a 2018 YZ450 - wanting to try my vet weapon 150SX?

Let’s talk

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Washed up moto and enduro weekend warrior.

10/17/2020 11:29 AM

...Check bounced from Big Blue.

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10/17/2020 4:43 PM

A 450 is too much hog.

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10/17/2020 4:54 PM

mxb2 wrote:

Hit a local track, find all the brands you want, give the owner some $$ to spin a few laps. Cheaper than buying a new bike you wont like.

Johnny Ringo wrote:

I wouldn’t let anyone I don’t know ride my bike. If they want to pay me they can pay the KBB and keep it

Brent wrote:

That’s what I was thinking. Imagine this happening:

“ Hey Bud, I notice you have a brand new 2021 450. You don’t know me from Adam, but here’s 20 bucks, can I take your new bike out on the track?”

$100 for 3 laps

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10/17/2020 4:56 PM

mxb2 wrote:

Hit a local track, find all the brands you want, give the owner some $$ to spin a few laps. Cheaper than buying a new bike you wont like.

Johnny Ringo wrote:

I wouldn’t let anyone I don’t know ride my bike. If they want to pay me they can pay the KBB and keep it

Brent wrote:

That’s what I was thinking. Imagine this happening:

“ Hey Bud, I notice you have a brand new 2021 450. You don’t know me from Adam, but here’s 20 bucks, can I take your new bike out on the track?”

Why doesn't Beta and Sherco get their bikes tested.

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10/17/2020 4:56 PM
Edited Date/Time: 10/17/2020 7:20 PM

Believe it or not it happens, after the dude shows you how he rides his own bike. $100 for 6 minutes, pretty good $$.

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10/18/2020 9:46 AM

tek14 wrote:

They took it down because too much dead horse(Honda) kicking.

GuyB wrote:

Honda's results had nothing to do with it being pulled down. I think you guys have an outsized view of Honda's (or any manufacturer's) ability to try and influence results.

Here's the long and short of it...

There was an error made in the tabulation of the results that affected the outcome, and more importantly, the overall winner. What can we say? We goofed up some simple math.

We're in the process of redoing the end of the video, and it'll be up in a day or so. We're also working to have the complete 450 Shootout article up on the site soon, which will have more detailed comments on each of the bikes.

The corrected results look like this.

1. Kawasaki
2. KTM
3. Honda
4. Yamaha
5. Husqvarna

Of course, this is a bummer, and we'll admit...pretty embarrassing. We'd like to pass along our apologies to the brands involved. We're implementing controls to ensure nothing like this happens again.

The easy thing would have been to leave it as it was. But that wasn't the right thing to do, and not what you guys deserve.

Well, it wasn’t a calculation error... we had riders verbally tell us their rankings prior to shooting the video. Then, for the coming text piece, we had them email us their notes and overall scores. The numbers changed from what we were told in person to what they sent in. It did change the winning bike. Unfortunate, but nothing nefarious.

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10/18/2020 10:09 AM
Edited Date/Time: 10/18/2020 10:10 AM

dpingree101 wrote:

Well, it wasn’t a calculation error... we had riders verbally tell us their rankings prior to shooting the video. Then, for the coming text piece, we had them email us their notes and overall scores. The numbers changed from what we were told in person to what they sent in. It did change the winning bike. Unfortunate, but nothing nefarious.

David when are we going to be able to read the updated test?
I’m very curious to see the testers opinion on why a KTM platform that is so similar to the Husqvarna finished so far apart.

I own the 21 KTM but I’ve never ridden the Husky, are they really that different? are these small differences, or are they like night and day?

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10/18/2020 10:25 AM
Edited Date/Time: 10/18/2020 10:28 AM

GuyB wrote:

Honda's results had nothing to do with it being pulled down. I think you guys have an outsized view of Honda's (or any manufacturer's) ability to try and influence results.

Here's the long and short of it...

There was an error made in the tabulation of the results that affected the outcome, and more importantly, the overall winner. What can we say? We goofed up some simple math.

We're in the process of redoing the end of the video, and it'll be up in a day or so. We're also working to have the complete 450 Shootout article up on the site soon, which will have more detailed comments on each of the bikes.

The corrected results look like this.

1. Kawasaki
2. KTM
3. Honda
4. Yamaha
5. Husqvarna

Of course, this is a bummer, and we'll admit...pretty embarrassing. We'd like to pass along our apologies to the brands involved. We're implementing controls to ensure nothing like this happens again.

The easy thing would have been to leave it as it was. But that wasn't the right thing to do, and not what you guys deserve.

dpingree101 wrote:

Well, it wasn’t a calculation error... we had riders verbally tell us their rankings prior to shooting the video. Then, for the coming text piece, we had them email us their notes and overall scores. The numbers changed from what we were told in person to what they sent in. It did change the winning bike. Unfortunate, but nothing nefarious.

Brent wrote:

David when are we going to be able to read the updated test?
I’m very curious to see the testers opinion on why a KTM platform that is so similar to the Husqvarna finished so far apart.

I own the 21 KTM but I’ve never ridden the Husky, are they really that different? are these small differences, or are they like night and day?

I believe this year they shifted the Husky to be more vet oriented. Less suspension travel, more squatted chassis, softer settings, less engine hit, etc.

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Washed up moto and enduro weekend warrior.

10/18/2020 10:39 AM

Brent wrote:

I always thought one day "shootouts" are just rushed out to get views. Common sense would say you need a few days to get a feel for these bikes.

I mean, can you really decide to marry someone after one date?

To spend 11 or 12 grand based on the opinion of someone who only rode a stock bike for maybe 2 hours at one SoCal track seems sketchy to me.

As a person that tests stuff for a living.... quite the contrary.... i know what I need to know, in the first few minutes.... for me,, the most important aspect to testing is have a competitor on hand so u can go directly back to back... durability takes time to test... but it just takes me a couple minutes to know how a certain product stacks overall, up against previous competition

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www.bettercallsaul.com
Die Antwoord

10/18/2020 10:44 AM

Brent wrote:

I always thought one day "shootouts" are just rushed out to get views. Common sense would say you need a few days to get a feel for these bikes.

I mean, can you really decide to marry someone after one date?

To spend 11 or 12 grand based on the opinion of someone who only rode a stock bike for maybe 2 hours at one SoCal track seems sketchy to me.

gt80rider wrote:

As a person that tests stuff for a living.... quite the contrary.... i know what I need to know, in the first few minutes.... for me,, the most important aspect to testing is have a competitor on hand so u can go directly back to back... durability takes time to test... but it just takes me a couple minutes to know how a certain product stacks overall, up against previous competition

Yup, if you don’t know in the first 2 laps it’s not a big enough different to notice/care about

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Washed up moto and enduro weekend warrior.

10/18/2020 1:42 PM

I appreciate the hell outta the works these guys put in for shootouts, but I’ve had “terrible” bikes over the past 10-15 years I always manage to just setup pretty good for me.

Some are of course better than others, but the input the shootouts offer from such a wide variety of people is great to hear, and I believe a great tool for these manufacturers and dealers to use.

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10/19/2020 5:27 AM

Anyone else think they should do shootouts in the Midwest, south, or east coast?

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10/19/2020 6:41 AM

cloud41 wrote:

Anyone else think they should do shootouts in the Midwest, south, or east coast?

I know Keefer wanted to do one in the midwest somewhere but couldnt get the manufacturers to support it. Honestly what they test in Cali has zero correlation to the sand we ride in Michigan. I also think the tests are interesting to read but not everyone is going to like a certain model because their size/ skill/ terrain etc. I think there are bikes every year near the bottom or at bottom people would probably really enjoy to ride.

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