Feld Entertainment Responds to Track Conditions Following Last Week’s Supercross Event in San Diego

UpTiTe
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2/6/2019 8:43am
UpTiTe wrote:
A guy who has owned a company for a few decades whose major ingredient in one of its products is lime. I've seen plenty of lime...
A guy who has owned a company for a few decades whose major ingredient in one of its products is lime. I've seen plenty of lime burns, and what I see from the pictures isn't anything I haven't seen.

Yes, lime burn sucks, but unless you're literally bathing in it, you'll be fine after a couple weeks of discomfort.


And say they all do get together for a class action suit, they would be tied up for YEARS in litigation and they would still probably at the very most get 60k, and the lawyer would get 40% of that.
Well wrap it up boys, we've got a like burn expert in here and he doesn't think the riders suffered from lime contact and exposure. We'll...
Well wrap it up boys, we've got a like burn expert in here and he doesn't think the riders suffered from lime contact and exposure. We'll all be sure to send your findings to Bowers, Friese, and Vann Martin.
LMAO, maybe learn to read genius, I never said they weren't burned, I'm saying it isn't life altering.

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2/6/2019 8:46am Edited Date/Time 2/6/2019 9:18am
UpTiTe wrote:
LMAO, maybe learn to read genius, I never said they weren't burned, I'm saying it isn't life altering.

"I've seen plenty of lime burns and what I see from the pictures isn't anything I haven't seen"

I think you might actually be setting a vital record for how many wrong posts one user can have in a thread.
BR8ES
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2/6/2019 8:48am
you guys learn your legal skills in the joint?
Gregory
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2/6/2019 8:48am
jstein639 wrote:
The size and prestige of a firm matters little when the facts of the case are heavily weighted to one side. If the company knows they...
The size and prestige of a firm matters little when the facts of the case are heavily weighted to one side. If the company knows they are likely liable and either a) fees are statutorily recoverable by the plaintiff, or b) the plaintiff could never pay fees if the plaintiff lost because they’re broke (like a privateer), a big company knows they’re never going to recover the hundreds of thousands of dollars they throw at fees through years of litigation. That’s why lunch break violation lawsuits or ADA violation lawsuits settle for $25,000 to $50,000 when the violations may only add up to hundreds of dollars— big companies are smart enough to know when they’re throwing money into a fire.

Plaintiff attorneys also know this.
Gregory wrote:
McDonald’s is bigger than Feld, spill a cup of coffee, make 11 million! Stop with the “Feld will tie up in court for years!” They won’t...
McDonald’s is bigger than Feld, spill a cup of coffee, make 11 million! Stop with the “Feld will tie up in court for years!” They won’t! And are you all ingnorant? You know lawyers will not take any money up front if they believe in your case.
It doesn’t look good for a company to be tied up it court cases, especially when they are wrong.
UpTiTe wrote:
Nobody got 11 mill from hot coffee, she got a little less than 600k and it took 4 years to settle it all because McDs tried...
Nobody got 11 mill from hot coffee, she got a little less than 600k and it took 4 years to settle it all because McDs tried to tie it up longer.

Out of that 600k, the lawyer got 40% leaving her with around 350k.
350k is a lot more than the 800 bucks McDonalds was offering her before she lawyered up.
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The Shop

motograss
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2/6/2019 8:58am
BR8ES wrote:
you guys learn your legal skills in the joint?
College and on the job.

Btw change your username to BR8EIX. They make better plugs these days.
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Kenny Lingus
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2/6/2019 8:59am
Ozzy wrote:
Ya know, you can call me an AHole or whatever, I’m a BigBoy & can handle that. I’ve been in Pro Racing for most of my...

Ya know, you can call me an AHole or whatever, I’m a BigBoy & can handle that.
I’ve been in Pro Racing for most of my Life.
This like many other things over my many yrs kills me.
At the end of the day, SD & its Schedule for the day set the tone for a Cluster Fuck of a Day.
Any 5yr old with a cell phone saw the approaching weather.
Sound Testing was a Huge waste of Every1’s time due to the 300% coming weather.
After that the Track Walk & Practice should have been moved up.
Why the Amateur Screw Up??
Not their 1st Rodeo!!!
Again, these mistakes happen ALL TO OFTEN.
For me, it’s the people involved.
None of this should’ve happened.
Now they’re just passing the Buck the same way they always do.
It’s a Sad State of Affairs, 1 I don’t miss since Retiring from the Sport I call the Circus.
To to many people in positions they shouldn’t be in.
#What’sNext?
Totally agree. Kind of scary that Feld doesn't even have anyone working for them that knows dumping lime in standing water is stupid and potentially dangerous.

Probably are using the money they were saving to buy better Tuff blocks to pay off riders.?
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SPODEBOY
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2/6/2019 8:59am

LoL all that said was that it is the rain's fault.
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UpTiTe
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2/6/2019 9:00am
UpTiTe wrote:
LMAO, maybe learn to read genius, I never said they weren't burned, I'm saying it isn't life altering.

"I've seen plenty of lime burns and what I see from the pictures isn't anything I haven't seen" I think you might actually be setting a...
"I've seen plenty of lime burns and what I see from the pictures isn't anything I haven't seen"

I think you might actually be setting a vital record for how many wrong posts one user can have in a thread.
You quoted me wrong so I’m not sure what I’m wrong about.

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2/6/2019 9:01am Edited Date/Time 2/6/2019 9:02am
early wrote:
Can Feld claim the payout on their liability insurance policy if it doesn't go to court? If so then a couple million dollars shouldn't be too...
Can Feld claim the payout on their liability insurance policy if it doesn't go to court? If so then a couple million dollars shouldn't be too big of a deal to take care of the situation. I wouldn't expect any long term health hazards if they haven't shown up yet.
My opinion only:

I’d bet a lot of money they’re self-insured up to at least the first two to five million. Liability insurance wouldn’t kick in until after that.

For those calling for the riders to lawyer up i don’t know about that. Even if your attorney would be able to get you $50k, hell even $100k you’ll be giving at least 40% of that to the attorney. And you won’t be racing Supercross until it’s decided. And after it’s decided you might never race a Feld event again.

If you think $5k is a terrible offer you’d be better off calmly telling Feld’s representatives what you believe your losses are worth - proving it with receipts, pictures, etc. Let them know if they meet you at x dollar amount you’d sign a non-disclosure and agree to never take them to court in the future - which the guys that take the $5k will doubtlessly agree to.

EDIT: (he’ll to hell)
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UpTiTe
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2/6/2019 9:03am
jstein639 wrote:
I’m not so sure it would be a class action. It’s not like everyone has identical burns or identical damage to their bikes and equipment.
UpTiTe wrote:
It was all a result of the same incident, it would be grounds for class action.
jstein639 wrote:
That’s not necessarily true
I can’t say either way for sure, that’s just what I was told this morning
BR8ES
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2/6/2019 9:03am
BR8ES wrote:
you guys learn your legal skills in the joint?
motograss wrote:
College and on the job.

Btw change your username to BR8EIX. They make better plugs these days.
that is good, an actual lawyer! I am old skool and cheap, so the ES is my plug haha.
aroark247
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2/6/2019 9:05am
BR8ES wrote:
you guys learn your legal skills in the joint?
motograss wrote:
College and on the job.

Btw change your username to BR8EIX. They make better plugs these days.
Those are way more expensive bro
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slipdog
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2/6/2019 9:12am
Gregory wrote:
McDonald’s is bigger than Feld, spill a cup of coffee, make 11 million! Stop with the “Feld will tie up in court for years!” They won’t...
McDonald’s is bigger than Feld, spill a cup of coffee, make 11 million! Stop with the “Feld will tie up in court for years!” They won’t! And are you all ingnorant? You know lawyers will not take any money up front if they believe in your case.
It doesn’t look good for a company to be tied up it court cases, especially when they are wrong.
UpTiTe wrote:
Nobody got 11 mill from hot coffee, she got a little less than 600k and it took 4 years to settle it all because McDs tried...
Nobody got 11 mill from hot coffee, she got a little less than 600k and it took 4 years to settle it all because McDs tried to tie it up longer.

Out of that 600k, the lawyer got 40% leaving her with around 350k.
Gregory wrote:
350k is a lot more than the 800 bucks McDonalds was offering her before she lawyered up.
I'm no Esquire but the Google says it was 3 mil.
3
jstein639
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2/6/2019 9:14am
UpTiTe wrote:
It was all a result of the same incident, it would be grounds for class action.
jstein639 wrote:
That’s not necessarily true
UpTiTe wrote:
I can’t say either way for sure, that’s just what I was told this morning
You could split the riders into at least two distinct categories: factory and true privateer. I heard that factories maintain ownership of the race bike used so those riders wouldn't be able to sue for damaged equipment, whereas a true privateer likely owns the bike and could recover for damaged equipment. Theoretically that distinction could sever lawsuits between the manufacturers, factory/support riders, and true privateers based on damages caused from the same incident.
jstein639
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2/6/2019 9:17am
jstein639 wrote:
That’s not necessarily true
Premix wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2019/02/06/323639/s1200_AA819280_E081_4AD6_A406_32A7651FBB47.jpg[/img]

LOL spot on
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early
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2/6/2019 9:21am
BR8ES wrote:
you guys learn your legal skills in the joint?
motograss wrote:
College and on the job.

Btw change your username to BR8EIX. They make better plugs these days.
Change your username to Motograss Esq. You'll get more respect around here.
OldYZRider1
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2/6/2019 9:28am
moto348 wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2019/02/05/323595/s1200_Screen_Shot_2019_02_06_at_1.08.28_AM.jpg[/img] I think I'd laugh, hang up. And call up a qualified attorney and then CA OSHA.


I think I'd laugh, hang up. And call up a qualified attorney and then CA OSHA.
OSHA will only come into play for employees that have suffered injury. The riders are independent contractors and really have no basis to file an OSHA complaint. Now if a riders mechanic is paid by the rider then the rider could be considered the mechanics employer such that the mechanic could file a complaint against the rider and the rider could be investigated for allowing his employee to enter an unsafe work environment. The Dirt Wurx employees could lodge a complaint and Dirt Wurx could be in OSHA's crosshairs. Same for the AMA employees on the track. I'm not sure Feld would have any risk of an OSHA investigation as practically everyone is a subcontractor for them.

As a government entity OSHA will have to respond to any complaints lodged by an employee. This may or may not cause them to visit the employer's premises or jobsite. If they do come out of their office you can bet they're going to levy a fine against the employer for violating one or more of their standards; that's how they bring in their money. Once they're on a jobsite they may only constrain their investigation to the specified incident but if they see other violations they can fine for those too. There are new silica dust control standards that affect fill material handling activities that could come into play and if there's any hint of respiratory problems arising from gassing caused by the lime in the water it could get particularly nasty as OSHA gets tough on respiratory issues.

The best path would be to not exercise this option IMO. If OSHA finds a revenue stream stemming from dirt moving activities related to MX, all of MX could be negatively effected, maybe even the privately owned track you frequent.
1
Motox627!
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2/6/2019 9:31am
jstein639 wrote:
The size and prestige of a firm matters little when the facts of the case are heavily weighted to one side. If the company knows they...
The size and prestige of a firm matters little when the facts of the case are heavily weighted to one side. If the company knows they are likely liable and either a) fees are statutorily recoverable by the plaintiff, or b) the plaintiff could never pay fees if the plaintiff lost because they’re broke (like a privateer), a big company knows they’re never going to recover the hundreds of thousands of dollars they throw at fees through years of litigation. That’s why lunch break violation lawsuits or ADA violation lawsuits settle for $25,000 to $50,000 when the violations may only add up to hundreds of dollars— big companies are smart enough to know when they’re throwing money into a fire.

Plaintiff attorneys also know this.
Gregory wrote:
McDonald’s is bigger than Feld, spill a cup of coffee, make 11 million! Stop with the “Feld will tie up in court for years!” They won’t...
McDonald’s is bigger than Feld, spill a cup of coffee, make 11 million! Stop with the “Feld will tie up in court for years!” They won’t! And are you all ingnorant? You know lawyers will not take any money up front if they believe in your case.
It doesn’t look good for a company to be tied up it court cases, especially when they are wrong.
UpTiTe wrote:
Nobody got 11 mill from hot coffee, she got a little less than 600k and it took 4 years to settle it all because McDs tried...
Nobody got 11 mill from hot coffee, she got a little less than 600k and it took 4 years to settle it all because McDs tried to tie it up longer.

Out of that 600k, the lawyer got 40% leaving her with around 350k.
I will pour hot coffee on my dick all day long for 350k WoohooWoohooWoohooWoohooWoohoo
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VoR
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2/6/2019 9:37am
For all you affected on here use code: VITARD20 for a special discount your next Supercross ticket purchase.
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GIwasB4
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2/6/2019 9:46am
UpTiTe wrote:
A guy who has owned a company for a few decades whose major ingredient in one of its products is lime. I've seen plenty of lime...
A guy who has owned a company for a few decades whose major ingredient in one of its products is lime. I've seen plenty of lime burns, and what I see from the pictures isn't anything I haven't seen.

Yes, lime burn sucks, but unless you're literally bathing in it, you'll be fine after a couple weeks of discomfort.


And say they all do get together for a class action suit, they would be tied up for YEARS in litigation and they would still probably at the very most get 60k, and the lawyer would get 40% of that.
^UpTiTe gets it:
I own a farm and use lime every year. The 20 year old lime spreader that is made of metal and rubber gets hosed out a couple times a season. It has no mechanical issues other than normal wear. I've had my hands in more bags of lime in 1 day than all the riders together were subject to in an hours riding time. People have different sensitivities and the folks that received burns should be compensated for their injuries.

I think the actual number of injuries compared to the total number of riders, track crew, and staff that were not injured will prove to be quite low in comparison.
mattyhamz2
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2/6/2019 9:50am
Gregory wrote:
McDonald’s is bigger than Feld, spill a cup of coffee, make 11 million! Stop with the “Feld will tie up in court for years!” They won’t...
McDonald’s is bigger than Feld, spill a cup of coffee, make 11 million! Stop with the “Feld will tie up in court for years!” They won’t! And are you all ingnorant? You know lawyers will not take any money up front if they believe in your case.
It doesn’t look good for a company to be tied up it court cases, especially when they are wrong.
UpTiTe wrote:
Nobody got 11 mill from hot coffee, she got a little less than 600k and it took 4 years to settle it all because McDs tried...
Nobody got 11 mill from hot coffee, she got a little less than 600k and it took 4 years to settle it all because McDs tried to tie it up longer.

Out of that 600k, the lawyer got 40% leaving her with around 350k.
Motox627! wrote:
I will pour hot coffee on my dick all day long for 350k WoohooWoohooWoohooWoohooWoohoo
I could pay my house, truck and wife's car off then go buy myself a new bike then put the rest in the savings!
2
moto348
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2/6/2019 9:51am
moto348 wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2019/02/05/323595/s1200_Screen_Shot_2019_02_06_at_1.08.28_AM.jpg[/img] I think I'd laugh, hang up. And call up a qualified attorney and then CA OSHA.


I think I'd laugh, hang up. And call up a qualified attorney and then CA OSHA.
I think you’d be surprised what some of the riders responses are.
As in they think it's sufficient?

If so, then they lack some serious awareness. Lets not forget what the long term effects are of breathing the dust & ingesting the caustic mud/water in addition to the short term skin burns and destroyed bike components
1
moto348
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2/6/2019 9:54am
motogrady wrote:
I dunno. Unfortunate situation for sure. I'm sure all parties involved learned something. I'd be surprised it happens again. To one man, talk of lawsuits at...
I dunno.

Unfortunate situation for sure.
I'm sure all parties involved learned something.
I'd be surprised it happens again.

To one man, talk of lawsuits at this time is wrong.
It happens again, maybe then.

But for now, take what they offer and move on.

I mean, In almost 50 years of following this sport, I have never, ever, heard of a track or promoter giving compensation to a team or rider for what they do with the track.
How many times have you seen riders injured and/or bike components destroyed due to the track?
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Premix
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2/6/2019 10:04am
moto348 wrote:
How many times have you seen riders injured and/or bike components destroyed due to the track?
More times than I can count. Arenacross used to be horrible about it. Come hang out in the off-road world. Your bike will look like that after every race.
sumdood
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2/6/2019 10:06am Edited Date/Time 2/6/2019 1:55pm
I no legal expert but if lawyers get involved those affected better not hold their breath waiting for a settlement. I'm on year 5 of a lawsuit from a botched metal on metal hip replacement. Every once in awhile I'll call the lawyer(s) on the case. "It's still moving forward, it's a process”
77Moto
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2/6/2019 10:10am
GIwasB4 wrote:
^UpTiTe gets it: I own a farm and use lime every year. The 20 year old lime spreader that is made of metal and rubber gets...
^UpTiTe gets it:
I own a farm and use lime every year. The 20 year old lime spreader that is made of metal and rubber gets hosed out a couple times a season. It has no mechanical issues other than normal wear. I've had my hands in more bags of lime in 1 day than all the riders together were subject to in an hours riding time. People have different sensitivities and the folks that received burns should be compensated for their injuries.

I think the actual number of injuries compared to the total number of riders, track crew, and staff that were not injured will prove to be quite low in comparison.
That's dry and irrelevant.
moto348
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2/6/2019 10:14am
moto348 wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2019/02/05/323595/s1200_Screen_Shot_2019_02_06_at_1.08.28_AM.jpg[/img] I think I'd laugh, hang up. And call up a qualified attorney and then CA OSHA.


I think I'd laugh, hang up. And call up a qualified attorney and then CA OSHA.
OSHA will only come into play for employees that have suffered injury. The riders are independent contractors and really have no basis to file an OSHA...
OSHA will only come into play for employees that have suffered injury. The riders are independent contractors and really have no basis to file an OSHA complaint. Now if a riders mechanic is paid by the rider then the rider could be considered the mechanics employer such that the mechanic could file a complaint against the rider and the rider could be investigated for allowing his employee to enter an unsafe work environment. The Dirt Wurx employees could lodge a complaint and Dirt Wurx could be in OSHA's crosshairs. Same for the AMA employees on the track. I'm not sure Feld would have any risk of an OSHA investigation as practically everyone is a subcontractor for them.

As a government entity OSHA will have to respond to any complaints lodged by an employee. This may or may not cause them to visit the employer's premises or jobsite. If they do come out of their office you can bet they're going to levy a fine against the employer for violating one or more of their standards; that's how they bring in their money. Once they're on a jobsite they may only constrain their investigation to the specified incident but if they see other violations they can fine for those too. There are new silica dust control standards that affect fill material handling activities that could come into play and if there's any hint of respiratory problems arising from gassing caused by the lime in the water it could get particularly nasty as OSHA gets tough on respiratory issues.

The best path would be to not exercise this option IMO. If OSHA finds a revenue stream stemming from dirt moving activities related to MX, all of MX could be negatively effected, maybe even the privately owned track you frequent.
Fwiw I'm not a fan of most govt agencies but if Feld doesn't step up and do what's right in regards to compensation for the negligent mistakes, that would be the route that has to be unfortunately taken. Hopefully it doesn't have to come to that.
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TbonesPop
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2/6/2019 10:29am
moto348 wrote:
How many times have you seen riders injured and/or bike components destroyed due to the track?
Premix wrote:
More times than I can count. Arenacross used to be horrible about it. Come hang out in the off-road world. Your bike will look like that...
More times than I can count. Arenacross used to be horrible about it. Come hang out in the off-road world. Your bike will look like that after every race.
Ok, so if that’s the case (and I trust that what you say is true), why in the hell do they continue to use lime? Doing something a certain just because that’s the way it’s akwaus been done even if it causes a lot of problems is stupid. There are dozens of safe alternate soil amendment products that are also hygroscopic, and allow for the soil to be altered to the desired quality. Why not try something new? Shoot, there might be something better for the dirt out there.
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Premix
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2/6/2019 10:36am
TbonesPop wrote:
Ok, so if that’s the case (and I trust that what you say is true), why in the hell do they continue to use lime? Doing...
Ok, so if that’s the case (and I trust that what you say is true), why in the hell do they continue to use lime? Doing something a certain just because that’s the way it’s akwaus been done even if it causes a lot of problems is stupid. There are dozens of safe alternate soil amendment products that are also hygroscopic, and allow for the soil to be altered to the desired quality. Why not try something new? Shoot, there might be something better for the dirt out there.
Out of all the craziness this week I believe you’re the only one that has offered a sound solution for the replacement of lime. So if we have these said alternatives, why aren’t they using them? Cost? Do they not allow for the same racing surface lime produces? I don’t know. They’ve been using it for years. The tracks break down at an alarming rate these days with the high horsepower and torque of the four strokes. Remember when we were having issues going to the plywood a few years ago? This is nothing new, it just had a recipe for disaster with the circumstances that presented themselves on Saturday.

Write Feld, AMA, and the FIM. Offer to be a consultant for them. You seem to have some valuable information that would maybe better things going forward.
1

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