Emig's intensity comment...

6/9/2012 9:08pm
Everyone keeps saying that Kenny was the best MX2 rider “hands down” blah, blah, blah, blah at the last 2 MX of Nations. I say not. Maybe he ended up with the best result, but hands down the fastest guy. Not really. During the Saturday qualifier in France Baggett smoked him and everyone else during the MX2 qualifying race fairly handily. During the 2 races on Sunday when the MX2 guys raced against MX1 & MX3 Baggett had a crash in the first corner, and then got stuck under a fence. So to say that Blake choked, or got annihilated by either Kenny or the pressure is wrong. Kid rode his ass off and when it was just MX2 guys on the track he waxed everyone.

I was at the race and saw all of this first hand, much different then you jackasses that weren’t there and that were watching the web coverage which didn’t show the whole story.

Quit ripping on Blake for MX of Nations, and quit pumping Kenny up more than he should be. Kenny is an awesome rider and is world champ and he will find that intensity he currently lacks a couple of percentage points of. He will get there. Also as an FYI, last year was pretty much Baggett’s first year racing the nationals as he got hurt very early in 2010 while riding for Rockstar Suzuki and didn't race after the first couple of laps of moto 1 at Budds. A number of the tracks he won at last year was his first time there.

If you’re going to make comparisons then do it correctly and compare apples to apples.

Carry on..!
TDeath21
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6/9/2012 9:25pm
Emig is right. Roczen has a style that is much easier to translate though, as opposed to a style like Musquin. Their results show it too.
pilotdude
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6/9/2012 9:33pm
Everyone keeps saying that Kenny was the best MX2 rider “hands down” blah, blah, blah, blah at the last 2 MX of Nations. I say not...
Everyone keeps saying that Kenny was the best MX2 rider “hands down” blah, blah, blah, blah at the last 2 MX of Nations. I say not. Maybe he ended up with the best result, but hands down the fastest guy. Not really. During the Saturday qualifier in France Baggett smoked him and everyone else during the MX2 qualifying race fairly handily. During the 2 races on Sunday when the MX2 guys raced against MX1 & MX3 Baggett had a crash in the first corner, and then got stuck under a fence. So to say that Blake choked, or got annihilated by either Kenny or the pressure is wrong. Kid rode his ass off and when it was just MX2 guys on the track he waxed everyone.

I was at the race and saw all of this first hand, much different then you jackasses that weren’t there and that were watching the web coverage which didn’t show the whole story.

Quit ripping on Blake for MX of Nations, and quit pumping Kenny up more than he should be. Kenny is an awesome rider and is world champ and he will find that intensity he currently lacks a couple of percentage points of. He will get there. Also as an FYI, last year was pretty much Baggett’s first year racing the nationals as he got hurt very early in 2010 while riding for Rockstar Suzuki and didn't race after the first couple of laps of moto 1 at Budds. A number of the tracks he won at last year was his first time there.

If you’re going to make comparisons then do it correctly and compare apples to apples.

Carry on..!
My goodness how those hard facts leave welts like 450 roost. Mmmm mmm.
fmfred
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6/9/2012 9:35pm Edited Date/Time 6/9/2012 9:40pm
Canard won the MX2 heat race at MXON at lakewood, but only because Roczen bobbled on the last lap. Kenny is deffinately going to win some races this summer, he's fast as hell. It seems like he slows down on the last few laps because he's riding tight, or as Emig would put it he's ridding with ding a lings in his hands

The Shop

Motodude
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6/9/2012 9:42pm
wildbill wrote:
Happens when a newb does our circuit for the first time. That's why they race here. Or, maybe this has something to do with it? [img]http://coedmagazine.files.wordpress.com/2011/02/main.jpg[/img]...
Happens when a newb does our circuit for the first time. That's why they race here.

Or, maybe this has something to do with it?

.....those are Australian ( not Austrian) chicks in Australia. geez
BAD10
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6/9/2012 11:00pm
Didnt you guys hear Roczen's interview? He even said himself that he needs to adjust to the high intensity from the drop of the gate to the checkers. He basically said its not like that in the GP's. He definitely looked fruestrated.....
Craze
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6/9/2012 11:07pm
BAD10 wrote:
Didnt you guys hear Roczen's interview? He even said himself that he needs to adjust to the high intensity from the drop of the gate to...
Didnt you guys hear Roczen's interview? He even said himself that he needs to adjust to the high intensity from the drop of the gate to the checkers. He basically said its not like that in the GP's. He definitely looked fruestrated.....
X2...They don't
go all out 45 mins plus 2 in the GPs........Here it's all out for 30mins plus 2 as soon as the gate drops !!!
Barrett57
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6/10/2012 4:39am
julienmark wrote:
Yes, but only in New Zealand do they have sex with sheep!
Take it you've never been to Wales. Wink
Huckster
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6/10/2012 5:19am
Using a one off race to compare a guys ability level is idiotic IMHO. Roczen is doing great. He has been on the podium at every race and is the only guy to do as such so far. He is right there with speed but he hasn't learned how to close it yet. He has never had to worry about being run down towards the end of the moto and now it is a totally different ball game for him. There are 3 other guys who run his pace or better at any given time. He can't gap them and relax like he is used to. He will figure it out and will win a moto and most likely an overall before its over unless he is a complete headcase and can't handle the pressure, which I don't think is the case. This season is just starting. Its 1/3 over and he is right there in the hunt. Hopefully all 4 will perform at their best and injury free. If that happens, hopefully everyone will take off their "fanboy" hats and enjoy what could be the best series on this planet in a long time....
BobbyM
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6/10/2012 9:47am
a better description would be "FRANTIC" imho. intensity has its limit but "franticity" knows no boundries.
Huckster
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6/10/2012 11:26am
Everyone keeps saying that Kenny was the best MX2 rider “hands down” blah, blah, blah, blah at the last 2 MX of Nations. I say not...
Everyone keeps saying that Kenny was the best MX2 rider “hands down” blah, blah, blah, blah at the last 2 MX of Nations. I say not. Maybe he ended up with the best result, but hands down the fastest guy. Not really. During the Saturday qualifier in France Baggett smoked him and everyone else during the MX2 qualifying race fairly handily. During the 2 races on Sunday when the MX2 guys raced against MX1 & MX3 Baggett had a crash in the first corner, and then got stuck under a fence. So to say that Blake choked, or got annihilated by either Kenny or the pressure is wrong. Kid rode his ass off and when it was just MX2 guys on the track he waxed everyone.

I was at the race and saw all of this first hand, much different then you jackasses that weren’t there and that were watching the web coverage which didn’t show the whole story.

Quit ripping on Blake for MX of Nations, and quit pumping Kenny up more than he should be. Kenny is an awesome rider and is world champ and he will find that intensity he currently lacks a couple of percentage points of. He will get there. Also as an FYI, last year was pretty much Baggett’s first year racing the nationals as he got hurt very early in 2010 while riding for Rockstar Suzuki and didn't race after the first couple of laps of moto 1 at Budds. A number of the tracks he won at last year was his first time there.

If you’re going to make comparisons then do it correctly and compare apples to apples.

Carry on..!
If Blake Baggett was a "first year rider" last year, why didnt he win "AMA Rookie of the Year" after such a solid season? Yes he did get hurt and yes he did not race most of the tracks, but no it was not his "1st year of racing"

If you're going to make comparisons then do it correctly and compare apples to apples. he has been racing as long as Tomac outdoors......
NoGo
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6/10/2012 11:29am Edited Date/Time 6/10/2012 11:35am
^^ he's been pro as long as tomac but he hasn't raced outdoors as much as tomac.

Kinda like canard being pro since '08 but didn't get a full season of racing til '10.
carlosmacho
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6/10/2012 11:59am Edited Date/Time 6/10/2012 12:00pm
mxgeoff wrote:
Seems to me that the difference in tracks, life style and race format really catches the Euro riders out every time they race the AMA series...
Seems to me that the difference in tracks, life style and race format really catches the Euro riders out every time they race the AMA series, or maybe Supercross stuffs them in the head.

Roczen was the fastest MX2 rider in the World, he hands down beat the best AMA Lites guys at the MXoN the last two years, and those wins were no mirage.

There is more to this than Barcia, Tomac and Baggett being faster than Roczen. What it is nobody knows.

I mean Langston got it right pretty quickly and Mike Brown returned to America a much better rider after doing his 2000 FIM 125cc third place finish (winning the AMA 125cc title in 2001). I really am surprised Roczen isn't smoking everyone.

Reed was on it straight away after his single season in the GPs, but obviously Bayle handled the change well, but the rest have all struggled compared to their GP results. Tortelli, Alby, Rattray, Pourcel, Townley, Musquin, McFarlane and Roczen were/are not far of the pace, just a place of two on their GP results.

I wonder if the lifestyle maybe plays more in it than anything else. So much to do in American and for the euros maybe it takes away too much of their focus??

Maybe the fact Roczen didn't have as much pressure at those MXoN (due to Germany not having much chance of winning) made him ride more comfortable, while the AMA Lites guys were under huge pressure.

Geoff
"Roczen was the fastest MX2 rider in the World, he hands down beat the best AMA Lites guys at the MXoN the last two years, and those wins were no mirage. "

Two points, the Americans are not racing for the personal win, they are racing to keep the trophy in the US.

Last few years our lites guys have had bad holeshots.

No excuses, but regardless of the individual win, we won the trophy and that is what we set out to do.

No Roczen is here, he can now see that when the Americans race for the moto and overall win, they come from the back of the pack to pass the world champ as if he was standing still.
6/10/2012 12:58pm Edited Date/Time 6/10/2012 3:18pm
Roczen finished 2nd in that 2nd moto yesterday, and he pulled away from everyone else bar Tomac to do it. He's right in the mix but is not the very best guy any more. Granted, everyone (with sense) understands that the AMA 250s are a deeper field right now than the MX2 GPs. Instead of one guy that can challenge and beat KR at times, there are now three who can do it much more consistently. But beyond that the rest of the field is toast just as much as they were in the GPs - regardless of intensity.

If the GP riders weren't at least comparable in speed to the AMA riders then every MXDN would be like 2007. Every one off AMA appearance for a rider like Desalle would surely end in disaster. It's also not unreasonable to surmise that the difference in format and tracks WILL have weakened Roczen somewhat. If the USA (and other AMA riders) have an abominable MXDN appearance in Lommel then I will say the same. Where you ride, your routine, how comfortable you feel makes a huge difference! Of course it does.

I also agree that Ken has to learn the American sprint riding style (the whole way) but as I said earlier, given the way the GP tracks are, you wouldn't last long with that sort of riding style. After riding GPs for the last 3 years it's no surprise that KR has retained a style which is better suited to those tracks and format.
Huckster
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6/10/2012 1:55pm
NoGo wrote:
^^ he's been pro as long as tomac but he hasn't raced outdoors as much as tomac. Kinda like canard being pro since '08 but didn't...
^^ he's been pro as long as tomac but he hasn't raced outdoors as much as tomac.

Kinda like canard being pro since '08 but didn't get a full season of racing til '10.
Exactly like that. Just because you crash and get hurt doesn't take away the fact that you started racing and raced in that calender year. If he was a "rookie" last year, he would have won the Rookie of the Year award hands down.....Its his 3rd year outdoors.....
NoGo
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6/10/2012 2:06pm
Huckster wrote:
Exactly like that. Just because you crash and get hurt doesn't take away the fact that you started racing and raced in that calender year. If...
Exactly like that. Just because you crash and get hurt doesn't take away the fact that you started racing and raced in that calender year. If he was a "rookie" last year, he would have won the Rookie of the Year award hands down.....Its his 3rd year outdoors.....
I never said last year was his rookie year. I said it was his first full year.

If you crash and don't race then you can't really count those races where you weren't even on the line as experience.
jamma10
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6/10/2012 2:50pm Edited Date/Time 6/10/2012 2:54pm
Everyone keeps saying that Kenny was the best MX2 rider “hands down” blah, blah, blah, blah at the last 2 MX of Nations. I say not...
Everyone keeps saying that Kenny was the best MX2 rider “hands down” blah, blah, blah, blah at the last 2 MX of Nations. I say not. Maybe he ended up with the best result, but hands down the fastest guy. Not really. During the Saturday qualifier in France Baggett smoked him and everyone else during the MX2 qualifying race fairly handily. During the 2 races on Sunday when the MX2 guys raced against MX1 & MX3 Baggett had a crash in the first corner, and then got stuck under a fence. So to say that Blake choked, or got annihilated by either Kenny or the pressure is wrong. Kid rode his ass off and when it was just MX2 guys on the track he waxed everyone.

I was at the race and saw all of this first hand, much different then you jackasses that weren’t there and that were watching the web coverage which didn’t show the whole story.

Quit ripping on Blake for MX of Nations, and quit pumping Kenny up more than he should be. Kenny is an awesome rider and is world champ and he will find that intensity he currently lacks a couple of percentage points of. He will get there. Also as an FYI, last year was pretty much Baggett’s first year racing the nationals as he got hurt very early in 2010 while riding for Rockstar Suzuki and didn't race after the first couple of laps of moto 1 at Budds. A number of the tracks he won at last year was his first time there.

If you’re going to make comparisons then do it correctly and compare apples to apples.

Carry on..!
pilotdude wrote:
My goodness how those hard facts leave welts like 450 roost. Mmmm mmm.
'During the Saturday qualifier in France Baggett smoked him and everyone else during the MX2 qualifying race fairly handily.'

Blakes only competiton in the MX2 class at Saint Jean d'Angely was Roczen, Musquin and an injured Wilson.

Here is the overall MX2 World Championship results from 2011 and the riders who were racing that class at the MXdN...

1 Roczen MX2 Germany
2 Herlings MX3
3 Searle MX3
4 Paulin MX3
5 Tonus MX3
6 Anstie (Wasn't racing)
7 Aubin (Wasn't racing)
8 Osborne (Wasn't racing)
9 Kullas (Wasn't racing)
10 Roelants MX2 Belgium
11 Nicholls (Wasn't racing)
12 Charlier (Wasn't racing)
13 Tixier (Wasn't racing)
14 Butron MX2 Spain
15 Lupino MX2 Italy
16 van Horebeek (Wasn't racing)
18 Rauchenecker MX2 Austria
19 Teillet (Wasn't racing)
20 Triest (Wasn't racing)

The track was nice and dry on Saturday and all it took for Baggett to win that qualifier was a good start. Roczen had a bad start but had passed his way into second within about four or five laps and was visibly catching Baggett before getting caught up in a rut at the far end of the circuit and dropping back down the order again. On the day it mattered, on a tricky surface, Ken finished 2nd and 4th, while Blake went 17-17.

They are the hard facts.
lestat
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6/10/2012 5:41pm
no question about it . the euro riders are not as mentally strong as the ama riders .
6/10/2012 6:01pm Edited Date/Time 6/10/2012 6:02pm
Everyone keeps saying that Kenny was the best MX2 rider “hands down” blah, blah, blah, blah at the last 2 MX of Nations. I say not...
Everyone keeps saying that Kenny was the best MX2 rider “hands down” blah, blah, blah, blah at the last 2 MX of Nations. I say not. Maybe he ended up with the best result, but hands down the fastest guy. Not really. During the Saturday qualifier in France Baggett smoked him and everyone else during the MX2 qualifying race fairly handily. During the 2 races on Sunday when the MX2 guys raced against MX1 & MX3 Baggett had a crash in the first corner, and then got stuck under a fence. So to say that Blake choked, or got annihilated by either Kenny or the pressure is wrong. Kid rode his ass off and when it was just MX2 guys on the track he waxed everyone.

I was at the race and saw all of this first hand, much different then you jackasses that weren’t there and that were watching the web coverage which didn’t show the whole story.

Quit ripping on Blake for MX of Nations, and quit pumping Kenny up more than he should be. Kenny is an awesome rider and is world champ and he will find that intensity he currently lacks a couple of percentage points of. He will get there. Also as an FYI, last year was pretty much Baggett’s first year racing the nationals as he got hurt very early in 2010 while riding for Rockstar Suzuki and didn't race after the first couple of laps of moto 1 at Budds. A number of the tracks he won at last year was his first time there.

If you’re going to make comparisons then do it correctly and compare apples to apples.

Carry on..!
"he might have ended up with the best result, but hands down not the fastest guy"



I am Jack's uncontrollable urge to call you an idiot...

Pray tell old fellow, what does constitute the fastest man in a motocross race, if not the results?
6/10/2012 6:05pm
NoGo wrote:
^^ he's been pro as long as tomac but he hasn't raced outdoors as much as tomac. Kinda like canard being pro since '08 but didn't...
^^ he's been pro as long as tomac but he hasn't raced outdoors as much as tomac.

Kinda like canard being pro since '08 but didn't get a full season of racing til '10.
his only full season, i believe.
mxgeoff
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6/10/2012 10:59pm
Everyone keeps saying that Kenny was the best MX2 rider “hands down” blah, blah, blah, blah at the last 2 MX of Nations. I say not...
Everyone keeps saying that Kenny was the best MX2 rider “hands down” blah, blah, blah, blah at the last 2 MX of Nations. I say not. Maybe he ended up with the best result, but hands down the fastest guy. Not really. During the Saturday qualifier in France Baggett smoked him and everyone else during the MX2 qualifying race fairly handily. During the 2 races on Sunday when the MX2 guys raced against MX1 & MX3 Baggett had a crash in the first corner, and then got stuck under a fence. So to say that Blake choked, or got annihilated by either Kenny or the pressure is wrong. Kid rode his ass off and when it was just MX2 guys on the track he waxed everyone.

I was at the race and saw all of this first hand, much different then you jackasses that weren’t there and that were watching the web coverage which didn’t show the whole story.

Quit ripping on Blake for MX of Nations, and quit pumping Kenny up more than he should be. Kenny is an awesome rider and is world champ and he will find that intensity he currently lacks a couple of percentage points of. He will get there. Also as an FYI, last year was pretty much Baggett’s first year racing the nationals as he got hurt very early in 2010 while riding for Rockstar Suzuki and didn't race after the first couple of laps of moto 1 at Budds. A number of the tracks he won at last year was his first time there.

If you’re going to make comparisons then do it correctly and compare apples to apples.

Carry on..!
"he might have ended up with the best result, but hands down not the fastest guy" I am Jack's uncontrollable urge to call you an idiot...
"he might have ended up with the best result, but hands down not the fastest guy"



I am Jack's uncontrollable urge to call you an idiot...

Pray tell old fellow, what does constitute the fastest man in a motocross race, if not the results?
Why would you carry the results from the qualification race with more importance than he real races? Roczen was miles better than any MX2 rider in the World in the last two MXoN and nobody can take that away from him. He will come good and in my book will win this years AMA 250 class championship. He is showing in his speed and consistency that he's a quick learner on tracks that are nothing like he's ever raced. In Europe it's stop and start circuits, throttle control, and it seems like USA is just wide open. I am not a racer, but that must be a huge change and for sure riders like Musquin and Pourcel it is not really thier type of circuits. Kenny can go wide open as he has shown so far this year.
mxgeoff
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6/10/2012 11:01pm
mxgeoff wrote:
Seems to me that the difference in tracks, life style and race format really catches the Euro riders out every time they race the AMA series...
Seems to me that the difference in tracks, life style and race format really catches the Euro riders out every time they race the AMA series, or maybe Supercross stuffs them in the head.

Roczen was the fastest MX2 rider in the World, he hands down beat the best AMA Lites guys at the MXoN the last two years, and those wins were no mirage.

There is more to this than Barcia, Tomac and Baggett being faster than Roczen. What it is nobody knows.

I mean Langston got it right pretty quickly and Mike Brown returned to America a much better rider after doing his 2000 FIM 125cc third place finish (winning the AMA 125cc title in 2001). I really am surprised Roczen isn't smoking everyone.

Reed was on it straight away after his single season in the GPs, but obviously Bayle handled the change well, but the rest have all struggled compared to their GP results. Tortelli, Alby, Rattray, Pourcel, Townley, Musquin, McFarlane and Roczen were/are not far of the pace, just a place of two on their GP results.

I wonder if the lifestyle maybe plays more in it than anything else. So much to do in American and for the euros maybe it takes away too much of their focus??

Maybe the fact Roczen didn't have as much pressure at those MXoN (due to Germany not having much chance of winning) made him ride more comfortable, while the AMA Lites guys were under huge pressure.

Geoff
"Roczen was the fastest MX2 rider in the World, he hands down beat the best AMA Lites guys at the MXoN the last two years, and...
"Roczen was the fastest MX2 rider in the World, he hands down beat the best AMA Lites guys at the MXoN the last two years, and those wins were no mirage. "

Two points, the Americans are not racing for the personal win, they are racing to keep the trophy in the US.

Last few years our lites guys have had bad holeshots.

No excuses, but regardless of the individual win, we won the trophy and that is what we set out to do.

No Roczen is here, he can now see that when the Americans race for the moto and overall win, they come from the back of the pack to pass the world champ as if he was standing still.
Bad holeshots, I like that one.......
PressPassP
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6/11/2012 1:31am
Everyone keeps saying that Kenny was the best MX2 rider “hands down” blah, blah, blah, blah at the last 2 MX of Nations. I say not...
Everyone keeps saying that Kenny was the best MX2 rider “hands down” blah, blah, blah, blah at the last 2 MX of Nations. I say not. Maybe he ended up with the best result, but hands down the fastest guy. Not really. During the Saturday qualifier in France Baggett smoked him and everyone else during the MX2 qualifying race fairly handily. During the 2 races on Sunday when the MX2 guys raced against MX1 & MX3 Baggett had a crash in the first corner, and then got stuck under a fence. So to say that Blake choked, or got annihilated by either Kenny or the pressure is wrong. Kid rode his ass off and when it was just MX2 guys on the track he waxed everyone.

I was at the race and saw all of this first hand, much different then you jackasses that weren’t there and that were watching the web coverage which didn’t show the whole story.

Quit ripping on Blake for MX of Nations, and quit pumping Kenny up more than he should be. Kenny is an awesome rider and is world champ and he will find that intensity he currently lacks a couple of percentage points of. He will get there. Also as an FYI, last year was pretty much Baggett’s first year racing the nationals as he got hurt very early in 2010 while riding for Rockstar Suzuki and didn't race after the first couple of laps of moto 1 at Budds. A number of the tracks he won at last year was his first time there.

If you’re going to make comparisons then do it correctly and compare apples to apples.

Carry on..!
pilotdude wrote:
My goodness how those hard facts leave welts like 450 roost. Mmmm mmm.
jamma10 wrote:
'During the Saturday qualifier in France Baggett smoked him and everyone else during the MX2 qualifying race fairly handily.' Blakes only competiton in the MX2 class...
'During the Saturday qualifier in France Baggett smoked him and everyone else during the MX2 qualifying race fairly handily.'

Blakes only competiton in the MX2 class at Saint Jean d'Angely was Roczen, Musquin and an injured Wilson.

Here is the overall MX2 World Championship results from 2011 and the riders who were racing that class at the MXdN...

1 Roczen MX2 Germany
2 Herlings MX3
3 Searle MX3
4 Paulin MX3
5 Tonus MX3
6 Anstie (Wasn't racing)
7 Aubin (Wasn't racing)
8 Osborne (Wasn't racing)
9 Kullas (Wasn't racing)
10 Roelants MX2 Belgium
11 Nicholls (Wasn't racing)
12 Charlier (Wasn't racing)
13 Tixier (Wasn't racing)
14 Butron MX2 Spain
15 Lupino MX2 Italy
16 van Horebeek (Wasn't racing)
18 Rauchenecker MX2 Austria
19 Teillet (Wasn't racing)
20 Triest (Wasn't racing)

The track was nice and dry on Saturday and all it took for Baggett to win that qualifier was a good start. Roczen had a bad start but had passed his way into second within about four or five laps and was visibly catching Baggett before getting caught up in a rut at the far end of the circuit and dropping back down the order again. On the day it mattered, on a tricky surface, Ken finished 2nd and 4th, while Blake went 17-17.

They are the hard facts.
Wow,those hard facts hit even harder,like a blunder-buster Smile

MXdN in Europe:
Roczen beats all MX2 riders very convincingly including AMA no.1 & 2,(to be fair Wilson was riding injured

MXdN in USA:
Roczen beats all MX riders very convincingly including AMA no.1 and 4 (2 & 3 placed "Euros" absent)

These are the only times the top riders from the class had previously met Outdoors,and this year again will see 2 if those top 4 AMA riders race some of the top GP riders in the same MX2 class so we'll see how that turns out
(Roczen might be called AMA and not a Euro by then by then :laughSmile

I also don't buy the not racing to win BS,Bagget had 2 bad rides and RV was going all out to get to Paulin and Herlings,he laid down his fastest lap on the final lap,actually the fastest of the race,however Paulin and Herlings did too,almost matching it.The only time it could happen in late in the last race if the overall is in the bag

K-roc is now being compared while racing and now living the opposing series full time and he's doing very well,the class has the strongest top 4 or5 in years too,if they all raced the GP series last year,or this for that matter I'm pretty certain the AMA guys would be struggling to get to grips a with the tracks and race format too.Kenny's a class act as we know,he has the speed over here and over there and I'm sure he'll adjust to the US racing,just like the 3 class American guys would over here
mxgeoff
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vegas SH
6/11/2012 2:03am
Every rider at the MXoN rides to win his race, it's when you realize you can't win (Stewart in 2006, Villopoto last year in the first moto) that you slow down for a safe finish.

When Villopoto scored third in his opening moto in 2011 he did that because he couldn't keep the pace of a Frenchman (Paulin) on a French track and a super quick Jeffrey Herlings.

Remember Cairoli beating both Reed and Dungey at the 2009 MXoN in Italy. Hey, in front of his own crowd.

Same as Roczen struggles against American riders on America tracks. It isn't rocket science, just simple fact. Herlings is the King of the sand in Holland, his hometrack.

It's been like that for year, and every time a euro/ South African/ Australian/New Zealander goes to America the American public and press like to tell us, see, "we have the fastest riders in the World". Of course you do, on your own tracks, in your own country. So actually you have the fastest rider in America.

It's a stupid way to shape up a riders quality saying our rider won at home, so he is the best in the World. We all do it, because we all want our riders to be knowns as the best. But there is no even way of finding out who is 100% the best. In my opinion Villpoto shows enough in Europe and America to say he is the fastest rider in the World, but until he races Cairoli on a number of occasions, and with a mix between Europe and America, and in one series, then we don't really know who is the fastest.

MXoN motos are usually split between AMA and GP riders, so I will say the Americans are great at producing good results away from home, but that doesn't surprise me. Americans are the proudest country in the World and their sportsmen always impress, no matter what sport. Just like the Aussies I guess.

Thankfully Europes series does reward some of your riders, like Mike Brown, Zach Osborne, both who were able to race in Europe and then find their feet again in the AMA series.

Life in Europe is much tougher for non-euro's and believe me I know, because I have lived in both USA and Europe for many years.

The tracks are very slick and stop start type tracks. I have never raced at a high level, but I can't imagine how difficult that is to then turn it around and run full gas for a complete moto. Can't wait to see Roczen at places where the circuits are slower and slicker. Musquin will do well at UNadilla I think, but his style really isn't suited to AMA tracks.
jamma10
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6/11/2012 2:26am Edited Date/Time 6/11/2012 2:30am
'When Villopoto scored third in his opening moto in 2011 he did that because he couldn't keep the pace of a Frenchman (Paulin) on a French track and a super quick Jeffrey Herlings.'

RV was reeling them in pretty fast towards the end of the race and Herlings and Paulin had to step it up quite a bit for those last two or three laps. I don't think it was because RV couldn't keep the pace, he just had a bad start. He looked (to me anyway) as though he was the fastest rider in France that weekend. He is absolute class and was at the very top of his game having just clinched the 450 Outdoor title. In comparison Cairoli had just missed the last GP of the season due to his mum passing away and five of the top 10 MX1 riders (including 2nd & 3rd in the championship) were not riding.

But in general I do completely agree with you about the way European riders are only assessed by American fans when they're racing on US soil. Its always going to be biased in favour of their American guys and racing (alone) in a foreign country is tougher than most US fans appreciate because they have little experience of it.
mxgeoff
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6/11/2012 2:38am
jamma10 wrote:
[i]'When Villopoto scored third in his opening moto in 2011 he did that because he couldn't keep the pace of a Frenchman (Paulin) on a French...
'When Villopoto scored third in his opening moto in 2011 he did that because he couldn't keep the pace of a Frenchman (Paulin) on a French track and a super quick Jeffrey Herlings.'

RV was reeling them in pretty fast towards the end of the race and Herlings and Paulin had to step it up quite a bit for those last two or three laps. I don't think it was because RV couldn't keep the pace, he just had a bad start. He looked (to me anyway) as though he was the fastest rider in France that weekend. He is absolute class and was at the very top of his game having just clinched the 450 Outdoor title. In comparison Cairoli had just missed the last GP of the season due to his mum passing away and five of the top 10 MX1 riders (including 2nd & 3rd in the championship) were not riding.

But in general I do completely agree with you about the way European riders are only assessed by American fans when they're racing on US soil. Its always going to be biased in favour of their American guys and racing (alone) in a foreign country is tougher than most US fans appreciate because they have little experience of it.
Yes, but he battled with Herlings for two laps, he had reeled him in though. I think Villopoto is the best guy out there, so it's no arguement with me about his speed. He probably was the fastest, but Paulin beat him, Roczen beat Dungey and Searle beat Rattray, so it wasn't all AMA, AMA, AMA. The euros in Europe are another story to the Euros in America, but you agree with that anyway. As for Cairoli, he just doesn't seem to have the luck at the MXoN, despite winning two motos and battling with the likes of Villopoto, Dungey and Reed on occasions he can't take a trick. He is an awesome sand rider, so it will be interesting at Lommel how he goes against the likes of Dungey and whoever isn't injured......

Man, what is Team USA going to be, Dungey, Short and Baggett?? How is Alessi in sand? Who are your sand riders??
jamma10
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6/11/2012 2:42am Edited Date/Time 6/11/2012 2:52am
Searle also beat Reed and Metcalfe in the 3rd race (passed Reed twice even), but that is often overlooked.

Ever since Motocross in America developed to such a level that it rivalled the World Championship the USA have had the strongest team at the MXdN and probably always will. Euopean riders prove time and time again that they're capable of race wins (even if some chose to dismiss these) but its going to take something special to grapple the trophy off of them, wherever the race is held. You certainly can't beat them with malfunctioning mousse tires and other freak incidents though!

Im English btw - my avatar is only a bit of satirical fun Smile
Derpin' DJ
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6/11/2012 2:46am Edited Date/Time 6/11/2012 2:49am
mxgeoff wrote:
Yes, but he battled with Herlings for two laps, he had reeled him in though. I think Villopoto is the best guy out there, so it's...
Yes, but he battled with Herlings for two laps, he had reeled him in though. I think Villopoto is the best guy out there, so it's no arguement with me about his speed. He probably was the fastest, but Paulin beat him, Roczen beat Dungey and Searle beat Rattray, so it wasn't all AMA, AMA, AMA. The euros in Europe are another story to the Euros in America, but you agree with that anyway. As for Cairoli, he just doesn't seem to have the luck at the MXoN, despite winning two motos and battling with the likes of Villopoto, Dungey and Reed on occasions he can't take a trick. He is an awesome sand rider, so it will be interesting at Lommel how he goes against the likes of Dungey and whoever isn't injured......

Man, what is Team USA going to be, Dungey, Short and Baggett?? How is Alessi in sand? Who are your sand riders??
Stewarts hand is only sore. He'll be healthy by then easily. At this stage, I predict barcia to be picked, considering how strong he is riding now. It'll be roczen v barcia at Southwick I reckon.
moto282
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6/11/2012 7:26am Edited Date/Time 6/11/2012 7:27am
The question in this thread was if Emig's intensity comment was accurate, and Roczen himself has said it is true during interviews, so there's not much to argue on that front. He has to adjust to the intensity in the AMA from the gate drop to checkers. That doesn't mean the AMA pace is necessarily faster, it just means they race differently - probably because they have 15mins less to get the job done than the GP boys so when the gate drops they have to go now.

The thing that is inaccurate, is saying that Roczen is the "fastest MX2 rider on the planet" right now. Maybe last year you could argue he was but this year he isn't. Tomac and Barcia have gotten faster this year and Baggett is more consistent. Roczen is ONE of the fastest MX2 riders on the planet, along with Baggett, Tomac, Barcia, and Herlings.

Given there has been 4 races and 3 different overall winners (and Herlings winning most of the races overseas), I think there isn't a single standout 250 rider. There are 5 of them... with Marvin and Searle right behind them.
mxgeoff
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6/11/2012 7:32am
moto282 wrote:
The question in this thread was if Emig's intensity comment was accurate, and Roczen himself has said it is true during interviews, so there's not much...
The question in this thread was if Emig's intensity comment was accurate, and Roczen himself has said it is true during interviews, so there's not much to argue on that front. He has to adjust to the intensity in the AMA from the gate drop to checkers. That doesn't mean the AMA pace is necessarily faster, it just means they race differently - probably because they have 15mins less to get the job done than the GP boys so when the gate drops they have to go now.

The thing that is inaccurate, is saying that Roczen is the "fastest MX2 rider on the planet" right now. Maybe last year you could argue he was but this year he isn't. Tomac and Barcia have gotten faster this year and Baggett is more consistent. Roczen is ONE of the fastest MX2 riders on the planet, along with Baggett, Tomac, Barcia, and Herlings.

Given there has been 4 races and 3 different overall winners (and Herlings winning most of the races overseas), I think there isn't a single standout 250 rider. There are 5 of them... with Marvin and Searle right behind them.
What an awesome group of MX2 riders. Add the MX1/450cc class with guys like Stewart, Canard, Villopoto, Dungey, Reed, Rattray, Cairoli, Desalle, Frossard, Philippaerts, Pourcel, Paulin and we have a pretty cool era.

Damn why don't we have a mini series with three round in USA and three in Europe, or even better 10 rounds mixed throughout the World. Australia, USA a couple, Belgium, England, France, Brazil, New Zealand and some other cool places. Now that would be the best series in the World.

All we would need is another 3 months in the year and it's possible.................

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