Eli: “Where do you draw the line? ...That pass was over the line!”

hillbilly
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4/22/2018 11:13am
The problem with tomacs throttle was not twisting it far enuff
JeepnMike
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4/22/2018 11:17am
hamncheeze wrote:
One problem now is if Eli goes for any payback he might get penalized or punished as the AMA will view it as retaliatory. And I...
One problem now is if Eli goes for any payback he might get penalized or punished as the AMA will view it as retaliatory. And I guarantee if Tomac cleans out Marvin, Decoster will be all over the officials to exert his influence. Just like the whoops at A2.

I’m a Tomac fan but I’m OK with Marvin making that move. Just be ready to take one in return. And Marvin, just shut up and own it. Don’t start saying BS about “Oh and Eli he was not in the rut as he was before, I didn’t expect this”. Making stuff up, like when you moved over for Dungey in NJ last year, it just comes off so weak.
If Eli retaliates and Decoster cries to the AMA, the Kawasaki folks will be rolling their eyes throwing their hands up in the air laughing.. Remember last year when MM25 let Dungey by for the win last year (I think it may have even been Foxborough)?
4/22/2018 11:17am
I stand with the Frenchman. Good show. Eli should try harder next time instead of coasting into the final corner like that and leaving a wide-open line. When Zach did it for a championship it's celebrated, but when the Frenchman does it... WWIII.

TeamGreen
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4/22/2018 11:23am Edited Date/Time 4/22/2018 11:23am
hamncheeze wrote:
One problem now is if Eli goes for any payback he might get penalized or punished as the AMA will view it as retaliatory. And I...
One problem now is if Eli goes for any payback he might get penalized or punished as the AMA will view it as retaliatory. And I guarantee if Tomac cleans out Marvin, Decoster will be all over the officials to exert his influence. Just like the whoops at A2.

I’m a Tomac fan but I’m OK with Marvin making that move. Just be ready to take one in return. And Marvin, just shut up and own it. Don’t start saying BS about “Oh and Eli he was not in the rut as he was before, I didn’t expect this”. Making stuff up, like when you moved over for Dungey in NJ last year, it just comes off so weak.
JeepnMike wrote:
If Eli retaliates and Decoster cries to the AMA, the Kawasaki folks will be rolling their eyes throwing their hands up in the air laughing.. Remember...
If Eli retaliates and Decoster cries to the AMA, the Kawasaki folks will be rolling their eyes throwing their hands up in the air laughing.. Remember last year when MM25 let Dungey by for the win last year (I think it may have even been Foxborough)?
New York & Eli whinned about it last-night at the Presser.

The Shop

4/22/2018 11:27am
TeamGreen wrote:
TEXT-BOOK "Block Pass" Arenacross-style. When did SX -AND- it's fans become such sissified pansies? [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/04/22/256869/s1200_image.jpg[/img]
TEXT-BOOK "Block Pass" Arenacross-style.
When did SX -AND- it's fans become such sissified pansies?
Since when has a text book block pass ended up with someone on the ground? If you want to see a text book block pass watch...
Since when has a text book block pass ended up with someone on the ground? If you want to see a text book block pass watch Tomac pass Marvin half a lap before.

You do follow the sport don't you? Or just claim to?
TeamGreen wrote:
No, I'm brand new to it. Please explain to me when a block pass became defined the way you claim. You see... As a total noob...
No, I'm brand new to it. Please explain to me when a block pass became defined the way you claim. You see...

As a total noob to this sport, I've noticed A LOT of examples posted in here...on Vital in various threads...MANY examples of block passes, T-Bones...etc.

So, since you're an expert...please, explain it with all your expertise and wisdom.

In the meantime, I'm gonna go with Jason Anderson: "Shit Happens".

Oh, by the way, "Do you even ride, Bro?"
I'll refer to the GOAT, never heard him claim a block pass was "text book" when someone ends up on the ground but sure have heard him say it when both guys stay up, but yeah Ricky Carmichael knows nothing about supercross. Nothing wrong with what Marvin did it's for the win and nearly anything goes at that point, just don't think that's a "text book block pass" as you claim, but it got the job done so I guess it doesn't matter.

I do ride thanks for asking, not as much I'd like anymore but maybe someday we will have the opportunity to ride together.
TeamGreen
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4/22/2018 11:36am
Since when has a text book block pass ended up with someone on the ground? If you want to see a text book block pass watch...
Since when has a text book block pass ended up with someone on the ground? If you want to see a text book block pass watch Tomac pass Marvin half a lap before.

You do follow the sport don't you? Or just claim to?
TeamGreen wrote:
No, I'm brand new to it. Please explain to me when a block pass became defined the way you claim. You see... As a total noob...
No, I'm brand new to it. Please explain to me when a block pass became defined the way you claim. You see...

As a total noob to this sport, I've noticed A LOT of examples posted in here...on Vital in various threads...MANY examples of block passes, T-Bones...etc.

So, since you're an expert...please, explain it with all your expertise and wisdom.

In the meantime, I'm gonna go with Jason Anderson: "Shit Happens".

Oh, by the way, "Do you even ride, Bro?"
I'll refer to the GOAT, never heard him claim a block pass was "text book" when someone ends up on the ground but sure have heard...
I'll refer to the GOAT, never heard him claim a block pass was "text book" when someone ends up on the ground but sure have heard him say it when both guys stay up, but yeah Ricky Carmichael knows nothing about supercross. Nothing wrong with what Marvin did it's for the win and nearly anything goes at that point, just don't think that's a "text book block pass" as you claim, but it got the job done so I guess it doesn't matter.

I do ride thanks for asking, not as much I'd like anymore but maybe someday we will have the opportunity to ride together.
Go watch Ricky Carmicheal's Road to Supercross aka Arenacross series and get back to me. Mmmmmmm'kay?

Then there's this...as they're EXITING THE TURN...


Who left the door WIDE-OPEN?
Who's suppose to be A PROFESSIONAL?
Who's suppose to be able to deal with THE VERY SAME SHIT -HE- HANDS OUT TO OTHERS?
Who's suppose to know that HE AND EVERYONE-ELSE IS RACING TO WIN?

Now, as I said, I'm a noob...so, explain it for my UN-KNOWING mind.
4/22/2018 11:38am
TeamGreen wrote:
No, I'm brand new to it. Please explain to me when a block pass became defined the way you claim. You see... As a total noob...
No, I'm brand new to it. Please explain to me when a block pass became defined the way you claim. You see...

As a total noob to this sport, I've noticed A LOT of examples posted in here...on Vital in various threads...MANY examples of block passes, T-Bones...etc.

So, since you're an expert...please, explain it with all your expertise and wisdom.

In the meantime, I'm gonna go with Jason Anderson: "Shit Happens".

Oh, by the way, "Do you even ride, Bro?"
I'll refer to the GOAT, never heard him claim a block pass was "text book" when someone ends up on the ground but sure have heard...
I'll refer to the GOAT, never heard him claim a block pass was "text book" when someone ends up on the ground but sure have heard him say it when both guys stay up, but yeah Ricky Carmichael knows nothing about supercross. Nothing wrong with what Marvin did it's for the win and nearly anything goes at that point, just don't think that's a "text book block pass" as you claim, but it got the job done so I guess it doesn't matter.

I do ride thanks for asking, not as much I'd like anymore but maybe someday we will have the opportunity to ride together.
TeamGreen wrote:
Go watch Ricky Carmicheal's Road to Supercross aka Arenacross series and get back to me. Mmmmmmm'kay? Then there's this...as they're EXITING THE TURN... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/04/22/256880/s1200_image.jpg[/img] Who left...
Go watch Ricky Carmicheal's Road to Supercross aka Arenacross series and get back to me. Mmmmmmm'kay?

Then there's this...as they're EXITING THE TURN...


Who left the door WIDE-OPEN?
Who's suppose to be A PROFESSIONAL?
Who's suppose to be able to deal with THE VERY SAME SHIT -HE- HANDS OUT TO OTHERS?
Who's suppose to know that HE AND EVERYONE-ELSE IS RACING TO WIN?

Now, as I said, I'm a noob...so, explain it for my UN-KNOWING mind.
Please show me a video of Tomac doing that to someone after being passed straight up and clean. I will wait.
zookrider62!
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4/22/2018 11:45am
TeamGreen wrote:
No, I'm brand new to it. Please explain to me when a block pass became defined the way you claim. You see... As a total noob...
No, I'm brand new to it. Please explain to me when a block pass became defined the way you claim. You see...

As a total noob to this sport, I've noticed A LOT of examples posted in here...on Vital in various threads...MANY examples of block passes, T-Bones...etc.

So, since you're an expert...please, explain it with all your expertise and wisdom.

In the meantime, I'm gonna go with Jason Anderson: "Shit Happens".

Oh, by the way, "Do you even ride, Bro?"
I'll refer to the GOAT, never heard him claim a block pass was "text book" when someone ends up on the ground but sure have heard...
I'll refer to the GOAT, never heard him claim a block pass was "text book" when someone ends up on the ground but sure have heard him say it when both guys stay up, but yeah Ricky Carmichael knows nothing about supercross. Nothing wrong with what Marvin did it's for the win and nearly anything goes at that point, just don't think that's a "text book block pass" as you claim, but it got the job done so I guess it doesn't matter.

I do ride thanks for asking, not as much I'd like anymore but maybe someday we will have the opportunity to ride together.
TeamGreen wrote:
Go watch Ricky Carmicheal's Road to Supercross aka Arenacross series and get back to me. Mmmmmmm'kay? Then there's this...as they're EXITING THE TURN... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/04/22/256880/s1200_image.jpg[/img] Who left...
Go watch Ricky Carmicheal's Road to Supercross aka Arenacross series and get back to me. Mmmmmmm'kay?

Then there's this...as they're EXITING THE TURN...


Who left the door WIDE-OPEN?
Who's suppose to be A PROFESSIONAL?
Who's suppose to be able to deal with THE VERY SAME SHIT -HE- HANDS OUT TO OTHERS?
Who's suppose to know that HE AND EVERYONE-ELSE IS RACING TO WIN?

Now, as I said, I'm a noob...so, explain it for my UN-KNOWING mind.
Problem is, Marv aint exiting the turn, that was his entrance. No dif from kdub and dv, when kdub got penalized
lando356
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4/22/2018 11:49am
yak651 wrote:
Yep, Eli's never taken anyone out, oh yeah and none of these are on the last lap for the win...[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/04/21/256762/s1200_index.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/04/21/256761/s1200_wilson_tomac_battle_10.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/04/21/256763/s1200_maxresdefault.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/04/21/256765/s1200_s1200_1.jpg[/img]
Yep, Eli's never taken anyone out, oh yeah and none of these are on the last lap for the win...





Lmao


4/22/2018 11:52am
I draw the line at making contact as someone is exiting the turn and/or giving no option for the other rider to check up.
Taking an inside line is usually safest but with all those ruts Tomac would of been better going to a middle or outside rut. Marv wouldn’t of been able to cross through them to make contact.
Looking forward to next week now!
TerryB
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4/22/2018 11:54am
The only reason this is a big deal is because the French Guy bested our All-American Cry-Baby. I hope Marv puts an exclamation point on this and does it to him again next week.

The Pussification continues...
TeamGreen
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4/22/2018 11:59am
I'll refer to the GOAT, never heard him claim a block pass was "text book" when someone ends up on the ground but sure have heard...
I'll refer to the GOAT, never heard him claim a block pass was "text book" when someone ends up on the ground but sure have heard him say it when both guys stay up, but yeah Ricky Carmichael knows nothing about supercross. Nothing wrong with what Marvin did it's for the win and nearly anything goes at that point, just don't think that's a "text book block pass" as you claim, but it got the job done so I guess it doesn't matter.

I do ride thanks for asking, not as much I'd like anymore but maybe someday we will have the opportunity to ride together.
TeamGreen wrote:
Go watch Ricky Carmicheal's Road to Supercross aka Arenacross series and get back to me. Mmmmmmm'kay? Then there's this...as they're EXITING THE TURN... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/04/22/256880/s1200_image.jpg[/img] Who left...
Go watch Ricky Carmicheal's Road to Supercross aka Arenacross series and get back to me. Mmmmmmm'kay?

Then there's this...as they're EXITING THE TURN...


Who left the door WIDE-OPEN?
Who's suppose to be A PROFESSIONAL?
Who's suppose to be able to deal with THE VERY SAME SHIT -HE- HANDS OUT TO OTHERS?
Who's suppose to know that HE AND EVERYONE-ELSE IS RACING TO WIN?

Now, as I said, I'm a noob...so, explain it for my UN-KNOWING mind.
Please show me a video of Tomac doing that to someone after being passed straight up and clean. I will wait.
Please show me a video of Tomac doing that to someone after being passed straight up and clean. I will wait.
You do realize this is a SUPERCROSS MAIN, right?
You do realize that Marvin is still in a CHAMPIONSHIP RACE* & 5 points is a whole lot better than THREE?
You do realize that there's around $100K on the line? (difference in win bonuses versus 2nd).*
You do realize that he left the door WIDE OPEN? (Eli did)

Definitions:

Marvin was 39 points behind Jason going into last-night with 78 points available in the remaining 3 races. He needs to race for EVERY POINT! The Championship Bonus is THE REAL MONEY! Marvin's still in it.
BYE THE WAY! You could argue that Eli "was" still in it, too...maybe he shoulda rode like it (65 points back w/78 avail.)

Podium Bonuses...example, Marvin...
KTM-Red Bull
Thor
AIROH
100%
A-Stars
I'm quite confident that he gets around $140-175K+ (All in) for a win...all sponsors combined. I'm also willing to bet it's about 1/2 of that...or less...for 2nd. I'm pretty sure that Marvin is REALLY SERIOUS about "Wins". I know Mathilde is!

So, if ya REALLY WANT THE WIN? Well, then ya need to go for it.

But, I really don't know. I'm new. I could be wrong; but, I'm willing to bet that the way I've written it...above...is pretty much how they and their team mgrs see things. You see, I'm a really big fan and I read a lot...
Graybeard
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4/22/2018 12:09pm
TeamGreen wrote:
No, I'm brand new to it. Please explain to me when a block pass became defined the way you claim. You see... As a total noob...
No, I'm brand new to it. Please explain to me when a block pass became defined the way you claim. You see...

As a total noob to this sport, I've noticed A LOT of examples posted in here...on Vital in various threads...MANY examples of block passes, T-Bones...etc.

So, since you're an expert...please, explain it with all your expertise and wisdom.

In the meantime, I'm gonna go with Jason Anderson: "Shit Happens".

Oh, by the way, "Do you even ride, Bro?"
I'll refer to the GOAT, never heard him claim a block pass was "text book" when someone ends up on the ground but sure have heard...
I'll refer to the GOAT, never heard him claim a block pass was "text book" when someone ends up on the ground but sure have heard him say it when both guys stay up, but yeah Ricky Carmichael knows nothing about supercross. Nothing wrong with what Marvin did it's for the win and nearly anything goes at that point, just don't think that's a "text book block pass" as you claim, but it got the job done so I guess it doesn't matter.

I do ride thanks for asking, not as much I'd like anymore but maybe someday we will have the opportunity to ride together.
TeamGreen wrote:
Go watch Ricky Carmicheal's Road to Supercross aka Arenacross series and get back to me. Mmmmmmm'kay? Then there's this...as they're EXITING THE TURN... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/04/22/256880/s1200_image.jpg[/img] Who left...
Go watch Ricky Carmicheal's Road to Supercross aka Arenacross series and get back to me. Mmmmmmm'kay?

Then there's this...as they're EXITING THE TURN...


Who left the door WIDE-OPEN?
Who's suppose to be A PROFESSIONAL?
Who's suppose to be able to deal with THE VERY SAME SHIT -HE- HANDS OUT TO OTHERS?
Who's suppose to know that HE AND EVERYONE-ELSE IS RACING TO WIN?

Now, as I said, I'm a noob...so, explain it for my UN-KNOWING mind.
Manny, I will respectfully disagree, Tomac is exiting the turn, but Marvin is still coming in, he doesn’t turn until hit hits the front wheel. He said in the post race interview that he thought Tomac was going wider, and he was actually aiming to block him further out. But he clearly did say he was going to block him. Wouldn’t like to be on the receiving end of that when I’m on the gas already exiting the turn.
4/22/2018 12:09pm
TeamGreen wrote:
Go watch Ricky Carmicheal's Road to Supercross aka Arenacross series and get back to me. Mmmmmmm'kay? Then there's this...as they're EXITING THE TURN... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/04/22/256880/s1200_image.jpg[/img] Who left...
Go watch Ricky Carmicheal's Road to Supercross aka Arenacross series and get back to me. Mmmmmmm'kay?

Then there's this...as they're EXITING THE TURN...


Who left the door WIDE-OPEN?
Who's suppose to be A PROFESSIONAL?
Who's suppose to be able to deal with THE VERY SAME SHIT -HE- HANDS OUT TO OTHERS?
Who's suppose to know that HE AND EVERYONE-ELSE IS RACING TO WIN?

Now, as I said, I'm a noob...so, explain it for my UN-KNOWING mind.
Please show me a video of Tomac doing that to someone after being passed straight up and clean. I will wait.
Please show me a video of Tomac doing that to someone after being passed straight up and clean. I will wait.
TeamGreen wrote:
You do realize this is a SUPERCROSS MAIN, right? You do realize that Marvin is still in a CHAMPIONSHIP RACE* & 5 points is a whole...
You do realize this is a SUPERCROSS MAIN, right?
You do realize that Marvin is still in a CHAMPIONSHIP RACE* & 5 points is a whole lot better than THREE?
You do realize that there's around $100K on the line? (difference in win bonuses versus 2nd).*
You do realize that he left the door WIDE OPEN? (Eli did)

Definitions:

Marvin was 39 points behind Jason going into last-night with 78 points available in the remaining 3 races. He needs to race for EVERY POINT! The Championship Bonus is THE REAL MONEY! Marvin's still in it.
BYE THE WAY! You could argue that Eli "was" still in it, too...maybe he shoulda rode like it (65 points back w/78 avail.)

Podium Bonuses...example, Marvin...
KTM-Red Bull
Thor
AIROH
100%
A-Stars
I'm quite confident that he gets around $140-175K+ (All in) for a win...all sponsors combined. I'm also willing to bet it's about 1/2 of that...or less...for 2nd. I'm pretty sure that Marvin is REALLY SERIOUS about "Wins". I know Mathilde is!

So, if ya REALLY WANT THE WIN? Well, then ya need to go for it.

But, I really don't know. I'm new. I could be wrong; but, I'm willing to bet that the way I've written it...above...is pretty much how they and their team mgrs see things. You see, I'm a really big fan and I read a lot...
Still waiting for the video of him doing the same move Marvin did to him like you said he has.

Like I said previously, I have no problem with what Marvin did, it's for the win and as you said championship points. I'm not really sure what you're trying to prove to me here? My whole point was that was not a block pass, that was a takeout. Plain and simple. Nothing wrong with taking someone down, especially for a win, winning is Marvin's job.

I do have a problem with Marvin thinking everyone watching is stupid and BSing his way through the interview. In my opinion he's got to own that shit.
JMR1976
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4/22/2018 12:22pm
WITCH HUNT,
TeamGreen
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4/22/2018 12:27pm
I'll refer to the GOAT, never heard him claim a block pass was "text book" when someone ends up on the ground but sure have heard...
I'll refer to the GOAT, never heard him claim a block pass was "text book" when someone ends up on the ground but sure have heard him say it when both guys stay up, but yeah Ricky Carmichael knows nothing about supercross. Nothing wrong with what Marvin did it's for the win and nearly anything goes at that point, just don't think that's a "text book block pass" as you claim, but it got the job done so I guess it doesn't matter.

I do ride thanks for asking, not as much I'd like anymore but maybe someday we will have the opportunity to ride together.
TeamGreen wrote:
Go watch Ricky Carmicheal's Road to Supercross aka Arenacross series and get back to me. Mmmmmmm'kay? Then there's this...as they're EXITING THE TURN... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/04/22/256880/s1200_image.jpg[/img] Who left...
Go watch Ricky Carmicheal's Road to Supercross aka Arenacross series and get back to me. Mmmmmmm'kay?

Then there's this...as they're EXITING THE TURN...


Who left the door WIDE-OPEN?
Who's suppose to be A PROFESSIONAL?
Who's suppose to be able to deal with THE VERY SAME SHIT -HE- HANDS OUT TO OTHERS?
Who's suppose to know that HE AND EVERYONE-ELSE IS RACING TO WIN?

Now, as I said, I'm a noob...so, explain it for my UN-KNOWING mind.
Graybeard wrote:
Manny, I will respectfully disagree, Tomac is exiting the turn, but Marvin is still coming in, he doesn’t turn until hit hits the front wheel. He...
Manny, I will respectfully disagree, Tomac is exiting the turn, but Marvin is still coming in, he doesn’t turn until hit hits the front wheel. He said in the post race interview that he thought Tomac was going wider, and he was actually aiming to block him further out. But he clearly did say he was going to block him. Wouldn’t like to be on the receiving end of that when I’m on the gas already exiting the turn.
Marvin sure as hell ain't in the previous straightaway. That's what many seem to imply. He IS making the turn as you say, with deliberate intent and with the desired effect.

Now, why you needed to go and be all respectable and stuff is simply uncalled for!?!? I mean, damn, this is the interwebs-thingy and you're being all collected and thoughtful.

WTF?
Hcallz5
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4/22/2018 12:40pm
Renner153 wrote:
To me, it looks like Marv is going up the inside while Tomas is cutting down early. Not like Marv is going backwards on the track...
To me, it looks like Marv is going up the inside while Tomas is cutting down early. Not like Marv is going backwards on the track.

Looks to me like Eli is in the inside rut and Marvin is headed perpendicular to the ruts AKA a T-Bone because he can't make a clean pass like Eli did to him after he led most of the race.
Ktoum
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4/22/2018 12:54pm
Tomorrow Macron is coming to USA for official visit, I hope they can solve this incident with diplomacy...
TDeath21
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4/22/2018 1:16pm
I think a huge part of whether it is a clean out or a highly aggressive block pass depends on whether or not the offending rider would have made the turn or not without contact. A few instances I can think of off the top of my head and my opinion of whether or not they’d have made the turn.

Reed/Stewart - Atlanta 2011 - Would have made the turn. Highly aggressive.

Osborne/Savatgy - Vegas 2017 - Would not have made the turn. Take out.

Alessi/Tickle - Would not have made the turn. Take out.

Musquin/Tomac - Would have made the turn. Highly aggressive.

All four of those instances were on the last lap with major stakes on the line. Reed/Stewart and Musquin/Tomac for the WIN of a 450 main event. Osborne/Savatgy for the CHAMPIONSHIP. Alessi/Tickle for the final transfer spot.

Stakes get raised the more people will risk. Musquin does that for second place in a heat race then I’m right along side some of you calling it a dirty move. Given these circumstances though, this is fair game. He went in there to block Tomac. However quick and fast Tomac decided to cut down was going to determine how much contact there was. Tomac cut down early, quick, and hard, creating the maximum contact.

I’m not sure how Tomac’s awareness is so terrible. Either go way inside to cover that or be prepared to counter it when he tries it. Do these riders have tunnel vision nowadays or what? Remember all the times Reed and Carmichael battled hard and made several highly aggressive passes? Yet it was extremely rare for one of them to go down. Even on last lap passes. They’d lay up, square each other up, protect the right lines, etc. when they saw the highly aggressive move incoming.

Detroit 2006, San Diego 2005, Dallas 2003, etc. etc. Several others I can’t remember the exact race off the top of my head.
4/22/2018 1:38pm
TDeath21 wrote:
I think a huge part of whether it is a clean out or a highly aggressive block pass depends on whether or not the offending rider...
I think a huge part of whether it is a clean out or a highly aggressive block pass depends on whether or not the offending rider would have made the turn or not without contact. A few instances I can think of off the top of my head and my opinion of whether or not they’d have made the turn.

Reed/Stewart - Atlanta 2011 - Would have made the turn. Highly aggressive.

Osborne/Savatgy - Vegas 2017 - Would not have made the turn. Take out.

Alessi/Tickle - Would not have made the turn. Take out.

Musquin/Tomac - Would have made the turn. Highly aggressive.

All four of those instances were on the last lap with major stakes on the line. Reed/Stewart and Musquin/Tomac for the WIN of a 450 main event. Osborne/Savatgy for the CHAMPIONSHIP. Alessi/Tickle for the final transfer spot.

Stakes get raised the more people will risk. Musquin does that for second place in a heat race then I’m right along side some of you calling it a dirty move. Given these circumstances though, this is fair game. He went in there to block Tomac. However quick and fast Tomac decided to cut down was going to determine how much contact there was. Tomac cut down early, quick, and hard, creating the maximum contact.

I’m not sure how Tomac’s awareness is so terrible. Either go way inside to cover that or be prepared to counter it when he tries it. Do these riders have tunnel vision nowadays or what? Remember all the times Reed and Carmichael battled hard and made several highly aggressive passes? Yet it was extremely rare for one of them to go down. Even on last lap passes. They’d lay up, square each other up, protect the right lines, etc. when they saw the highly aggressive move incoming.

Detroit 2006, San Diego 2005, Dallas 2003, etc. etc. Several others I can’t remember the exact race off the top of my head.
I can see where you're coming from but does the context of what's at stake really have (or should it at least) any influence on whether we "define" something as just highly aggressive, or actually crossing into dirty? Surely these moves should be examined in a vacuum as much as humanely possible. I couldn't help but defend Zach last year even though I knew that what he did was technically wrong (Savatgy having absolutely no chance of staying on two wheels) because the title... So I'm not claiming to be holier than thou or anything. But... yeah, I have difficulty squaring this.

Certainly for just a race win I can't defend it personally. I don't even think it's productive long term either because now Eli owes him one back, surely.
bd
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4/22/2018 1:52pm
Jack offs - Tomac is being a little dramatic? Supercross Live puts a mic on him five minutes after happens. You think he should be slapping 5 to Marv? He was pissed and I don’t blame him. Added note — I don’t blame Marv for the pass. But call it what is was... a T-Bone pass. It was not a block pass and it was dirty... it was also for $100k and win.
mxsx104
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4/22/2018 1:55pm
hamncheeze wrote:
One problem now is if Eli goes for any payback he might get penalized or punished as the AMA will view it as retaliatory. And I...
One problem now is if Eli goes for any payback he might get penalized or punished as the AMA will view it as retaliatory. And I guarantee if Tomac cleans out Marvin, Decoster will be all over the officials to exert his influence. Just like the whoops at A2.

I’m a Tomac fan but I’m OK with Marvin making that move. Just be ready to take one in return. And Marvin, just shut up and own it. Don’t start saying BS about “Oh and Eli he was not in the rut as he was before, I didn’t expect this”. Making stuff up, like when you moved over for Dungey in NJ last year, it just comes off so weak.
JeepnMike wrote:
If Eli retaliates and Decoster cries to the AMA, the Kawasaki folks will be rolling their eyes throwing their hands up in the air laughing.. Remember...
If Eli retaliates and Decoster cries to the AMA, the Kawasaki folks will be rolling their eyes throwing their hands up in the air laughing.. Remember last year when MM25 let Dungey by for the win last year (I think it may have even been Foxborough)?


"Hannah introduced DeCoster with a story about how he tried to break his leg in one of their superb duels during that period."

The Man knows how to throw down for a win...Slightly smaller win bonus as well. Pride!
bd
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4/22/2018 1:55pm
TDeath21 wrote:
I think a huge part of whether it is a clean out or a highly aggressive block pass depends on whether or not the offending rider...
I think a huge part of whether it is a clean out or a highly aggressive block pass depends on whether or not the offending rider would have made the turn or not without contact. A few instances I can think of off the top of my head and my opinion of whether or not they’d have made the turn.

Reed/Stewart - Atlanta 2011 - Would have made the turn. Highly aggressive.

Osborne/Savatgy - Vegas 2017 - Would not have made the turn. Take out.

Alessi/Tickle - Would not have made the turn. Take out.

Musquin/Tomac - Would have made the turn. Highly aggressive.

All four of those instances were on the last lap with major stakes on the line. Reed/Stewart and Musquin/Tomac for the WIN of a 450 main event. Osborne/Savatgy for the CHAMPIONSHIP. Alessi/Tickle for the final transfer spot.

Stakes get raised the more people will risk. Musquin does that for second place in a heat race then I’m right along side some of you calling it a dirty move. Given these circumstances though, this is fair game. He went in there to block Tomac. However quick and fast Tomac decided to cut down was going to determine how much contact there was. Tomac cut down early, quick, and hard, creating the maximum contact.

I’m not sure how Tomac’s awareness is so terrible. Either go way inside to cover that or be prepared to counter it when he tries it. Do these riders have tunnel vision nowadays or what? Remember all the times Reed and Carmichael battled hard and made several highly aggressive passes? Yet it was extremely rare for one of them to go down. Even on last lap passes. They’d lay up, square each other up, protect the right lines, etc. when they saw the highly aggressive move incoming.

Detroit 2006, San Diego 2005, Dallas 2003, etc. etc. Several others I can’t remember the exact race off the top of my head.
Marv would have made turn? That was an unique place to make a turn — perhaps you should watch it again and see the direction of Tomac’s bike. Marv is right — Anderson did the same shit to him too.
TDeath21
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4/22/2018 1:58pm
TDeath21 wrote:
I think a huge part of whether it is a clean out or a highly aggressive block pass depends on whether or not the offending rider...
I think a huge part of whether it is a clean out or a highly aggressive block pass depends on whether or not the offending rider would have made the turn or not without contact. A few instances I can think of off the top of my head and my opinion of whether or not they’d have made the turn.

Reed/Stewart - Atlanta 2011 - Would have made the turn. Highly aggressive.

Osborne/Savatgy - Vegas 2017 - Would not have made the turn. Take out.

Alessi/Tickle - Would not have made the turn. Take out.

Musquin/Tomac - Would have made the turn. Highly aggressive.

All four of those instances were on the last lap with major stakes on the line. Reed/Stewart and Musquin/Tomac for the WIN of a 450 main event. Osborne/Savatgy for the CHAMPIONSHIP. Alessi/Tickle for the final transfer spot.

Stakes get raised the more people will risk. Musquin does that for second place in a heat race then I’m right along side some of you calling it a dirty move. Given these circumstances though, this is fair game. He went in there to block Tomac. However quick and fast Tomac decided to cut down was going to determine how much contact there was. Tomac cut down early, quick, and hard, creating the maximum contact.

I’m not sure how Tomac’s awareness is so terrible. Either go way inside to cover that or be prepared to counter it when he tries it. Do these riders have tunnel vision nowadays or what? Remember all the times Reed and Carmichael battled hard and made several highly aggressive passes? Yet it was extremely rare for one of them to go down. Even on last lap passes. They’d lay up, square each other up, protect the right lines, etc. when they saw the highly aggressive move incoming.

Detroit 2006, San Diego 2005, Dallas 2003, etc. etc. Several others I can’t remember the exact race off the top of my head.
bd wrote:
Marv would have made turn? That was an unique place to make a turn — perhaps you should watch it again and see the direction of...
Marv would have made turn? That was an unique place to make a turn — perhaps you should watch it again and see the direction of Tomac’s bike. Marv is right — Anderson did the same shit to him too.
Yes Musquin would have made the turn for sure.
Lightning78
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4/22/2018 2:03pm
He mentioned on his podcast last week that the langauge thing is 100% a sarcastic joke
yak651 wrote:
Yeah cause everyone watches his podcast. Seems everyone in the PC was uncomfortable when he mentioned to watch it.
Asimo wrote:
Exactly and he backed off anderson with the Sarcasm BS because they are bros.

Normally you dont watch podcasts because they are audio only but i digress Grinning

Just trying to let you guys know that it was supposed to be a joke when he mentioned it after last weeks press conference he said it was the perfect storm of facial expressions and that Martin caught him off guard when he burned him back.

I dont care if you want to pass judgement but try to at least hear the other side of the issue before taking a hard stance. I always try to bec it helps fully understand the whole kit n kaboodle, i too thought Blair was being a weenie about the language comment last week until i heard what he had to say in his podcast
Lightning78
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4/22/2018 2:13pm Edited Date/Time 4/22/2018 2:19pm
Renner153 wrote:
To me, it looks like Marv is going up the inside while Tomas is cutting down early. Not like Marv is going backwards on the track...
To me, it looks like Marv is going up the inside while Tomas is cutting down early. Not like Marv is going backwards on the track.

Hcallz5 wrote:
Looks to me like Eli is in the inside rut and Marvin is headed perpendicular to the ruts AKA a T-Bone because he can't make a...
Looks to me like Eli is in the inside rut and Marvin is headed perpendicular to the ruts AKA a T-Bone because he can't make a clean pass like Eli did to him after he led most of the race.
A T-Bone is defined as an angle roughly 90* at which a rider would have to hit him completely perpendicular to the other riders line....hence th name “T-Bone. You can see the letter “T” would indicate a perfect 90* and one can clearly see from this and the million other pics of this incident that Marv was nowhere near perpendicular to Eli when he hit his FRONT wheel. Its more of a V-Bone bros...

I dont care if the situation were reversed I dont have a dog in the fight as im not a fan of either rider. That pass was aggressive but far from dirty, Eli left Marv plenty of room amd then cut down, had he not they still wouldve slightly bumped but I doubt Eli wouldve went down.

Im not saying this is Eli’s fault either but when he “pays Marv back” I can almost guarantee you hes going to go out of his way to hit Marv as hard as possible in a fashion that isnt in any way an attempt to make a pass for the win..... Can someone post that butt-hurt form? Grinning

For Eli, not the posters above... just to be clear
Graybeard
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4/22/2018 3:05pm
TeamGreen wrote:
Go watch Ricky Carmicheal's Road to Supercross aka Arenacross series and get back to me. Mmmmmmm'kay? Then there's this...as they're EXITING THE TURN... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/04/22/256880/s1200_image.jpg[/img] Who left...
Go watch Ricky Carmicheal's Road to Supercross aka Arenacross series and get back to me. Mmmmmmm'kay?

Then there's this...as they're EXITING THE TURN...


Who left the door WIDE-OPEN?
Who's suppose to be A PROFESSIONAL?
Who's suppose to be able to deal with THE VERY SAME SHIT -HE- HANDS OUT TO OTHERS?
Who's suppose to know that HE AND EVERYONE-ELSE IS RACING TO WIN?

Now, as I said, I'm a noob...so, explain it for my UN-KNOWING mind.
Graybeard wrote:
Manny, I will respectfully disagree, Tomac is exiting the turn, but Marvin is still coming in, he doesn’t turn until hit hits the front wheel. He...
Manny, I will respectfully disagree, Tomac is exiting the turn, but Marvin is still coming in, he doesn’t turn until hit hits the front wheel. He said in the post race interview that he thought Tomac was going wider, and he was actually aiming to block him further out. But he clearly did say he was going to block him. Wouldn’t like to be on the receiving end of that when I’m on the gas already exiting the turn.
TeamGreen wrote:
Marvin sure as hell ain't in the previous straightaway. That's what many seem to imply. He IS making the turn as you say, with deliberate intent...
Marvin sure as hell ain't in the previous straightaway. That's what many seem to imply. He IS making the turn as you say, with deliberate intent and with the desired effect.

Now, why you needed to go and be all respectable and stuff is simply uncalled for!?!? I mean, damn, this is the interwebs-thingy and you're being all collected and thoughtful.

WTF?
LOL, I’m trying to keep it civil, but there’s a part of me that was actually happy Marvin got aggressive. I watched Anderson and then Peick drop him and wondered if he would ever retaliate!
yak651
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4/22/2018 6:31pm
Graybeard wrote:
Manny, I will respectfully disagree, Tomac is exiting the turn, but Marvin is still coming in, he doesn’t turn until hit hits the front wheel. He...
Manny, I will respectfully disagree, Tomac is exiting the turn, but Marvin is still coming in, he doesn’t turn until hit hits the front wheel. He said in the post race interview that he thought Tomac was going wider, and he was actually aiming to block him further out. But he clearly did say he was going to block him. Wouldn’t like to be on the receiving end of that when I’m on the gas already exiting the turn.
TeamGreen wrote:
Marvin sure as hell ain't in the previous straightaway. That's what many seem to imply. He IS making the turn as you say, with deliberate intent...
Marvin sure as hell ain't in the previous straightaway. That's what many seem to imply. He IS making the turn as you say, with deliberate intent and with the desired effect.

Now, why you needed to go and be all respectable and stuff is simply uncalled for!?!? I mean, damn, this is the interwebs-thingy and you're being all collected and thoughtful.

WTF?
Graybeard wrote:
LOL, I’m trying to keep it civil, but there’s a part of me that was actually happy Marvin got aggressive. I watched Anderson and then Peick...
LOL, I’m trying to keep it civil, but there’s a part of me that was actually happy Marvin got aggressive. I watched Anderson and then Peick drop him and wondered if he would ever retaliate!
Yep this is the new "V" bone pass for the millenials! No T-bone here!
JAFO92
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4/22/2018 6:42pm
TerryB wrote:
The only reason this is a big deal is because the French Guy bested our All-American Cry-Baby. I hope Marv puts an exclamation point on this...
The only reason this is a big deal is because the French Guy bested our All-American Cry-Baby. I hope Marv puts an exclamation point on this and does it to him again next week.

The Pussification continues...
Laughing

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