Feld says don’t give pics away for free

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2/12/2019 12:36 PM

Here's a good question. If said photographer is also sponsored by Fly, Dunlop, etc, then could they tag those companies????

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2/12/2019 12:42 PM

danman wrote:

Here's a good question. If said photographer is also sponsored by Fly, Dunlop, etc, then could they tag those companies????

If the photographer pays for a press pass they can probably do whatever they want.

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2/12/2019 12:45 PM

You can tag who/what you want, NOBODY can police that , I mean, it's a "tag" lol.

They can try the standover approach (as above) but it's pure bluff.

Would they prefer you tagged companies that produce lime?

J.Cochrane

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2/12/2019 12:45 PM

This isn't the first time this has happened.

Media from the event is valuable, it's in Feld's interest to protect their professionals who have invested in them.

If photog "John" is giving company freebies, then photog "Joe" just lost a client and a paycheck.

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2/12/2019 12:53 PM
Edited Date/Time: 2/12/2019 12:59 PM

psg119 wrote:

Who is it?

jreed530 wrote:

@j_reedphotos on Instagram

FWIW this is not me

Premix wrote:

So just using common sense here: You own X business, X business offers an entertainment platform that they sell advertisement rights to company Y and Z for said amount each year guaranteeing them commercials and prime time advertisement on TV and Social Media.

If a amatuer photog (not professionally shooting for mag or company) comes and takes pics from stands or from the floor and then tags Y and Z in pics providing them free advertising, what benefit would they have to continue to purchase advertising space from X business?

FWIW, I’d pull those pictures down ASAP. There’s some legal reprocussions that Feld would be happy to whip out. Not saying they would, but they would.

Because the pictures of their brand logo would not happen if the banners were not put up in the stadium.

If anything this is good for feld. People tagging companies makes feld’s advertising even more valuable and seen by even more people than just tv/stream viewers would have.

Thats an even stronger selling point for advertising with Feld when your logo will also appear in thousands of photos along with tv and the stream...

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2/12/2019 12:54 PM

Falcon wrote:

Let's get a lawyer in here to back up or contradict my argument:

The way I would think I understand it, a photographer owns all rights to any photos he took. There may be model releases necessary to publish likenesses of professionals, but the rights belong to the photographer until he releases said rights.
Assuming the sanctioning body allowed the photographer into the building with his camera, and he was taking pictures in any area that he was allowed to photograph from, I don't see how Feld can claim any rights whatsoever to the photographer's work.
The photographer has no contract with Feld. There can be no trademark or copyright infringement as long as the photographer does not claim to be associated with "Monster Energy Supercross."

In short, "Go pound sand; I'm going to post and tag whatever the absolute F I want, since I paid to get in and you allowed me to bring a camera."

Exactly right.

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2/12/2019 12:58 PM

danman wrote:

Here's a good question. If said photographer is also sponsored by Fly, Dunlop, etc, then could they tag those companies????

early wrote:

If the photographer pays for a press pass they can probably do whatever they want.

I don't believe they pay for press passes.

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2/12/2019 1:02 PM

jreed530 wrote:

This person takes them as a hobby because they enjoy the sport. They were contacted by Feld this morning telling them to remove all of there photos from Minneapolis.

psg119 wrote:

Who is it?

jreed530 wrote:

@j_reedphotos on Instagram

FWIW this is not me

Are we just going to act like this is not the same person?

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2/12/2019 1:05 PM
Edited Date/Time: 2/12/2019 1:05 PM

Lol I totally believe him brozy

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2/12/2019 1:15 PM

psg119 wrote:

Who is it?

jreed530 wrote:

@j_reedphotos on Instagram

FWIW this is not me

dc444 wrote:

Are we just going to act like this is not the same person?

This is NOT the same person. Ones name is Justin and the others name is Jessica. Brother and sister. Sister takes the pictures and runs the @j_reedphotos and @SHOULDASEENITINCOLOR IG pages

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2/12/2019 1:16 PM

psg119 wrote:

Who is it?

jreed530 wrote:

@j_reedphotos on Instagram

FWIW this is not me

dc444 wrote:

Are we just going to act like this is not the same person?

This is 100% not me. My camera skills start and stop with my iPhone.

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2/12/2019 1:17 PM

a photo taken by a private citizen at a sporting event cannot be controlled by the promoter of said event. They can ban cameras, but they can't tell you what you can do with the photos, much less who you can tag? (insert giant eye-roll emoticon).

A professional photographer can of course control the image, but even with that, unless Feld has these guys signing away some rights regarding their photography, they sure as hell can't stop them from tagging people/companies.

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2/12/2019 1:21 PM
Edited Date/Time: 2/12/2019 1:27 PM

CozMan wrote:

a photo taken by a private citizen at a sporting event cannot be controlled by the promoter of said event. They can ban cameras, but they can't tell you what you can do with the photos, much less who you can tag? (insert giant eye-roll emoticon).

A professional photographer can of course control the image, but even with that, unless Feld has these guys signing away some rights regarding their photography, they sure as hell can't stop them from tagging people/companies.

Precisely.

I also saw feld threatened that Husky team Carson Brown is on’s film guy from filming the track from the stands and posting the footage to his vlogs on youtube. Yet literally every one else does this... because youre allowed to. When he said that I was like woooow u shoulda told em to screw. Sounds like theyre overstepping their bounds to see who listens and ppl get scared and just comply which helps feld. Everyone that believes them is 1 less person.


The thing is posting amateur pics/videos of the ads around the track actually makes Felds ad space MORE valuable because thats thousands more pics/vids of exposure for the companies vs just tv or streams. Feld is wrong in that they have no authority over this and theyre wrong thinking it hurts them when these companies are getting even more exposure from paying feld to advertise around the track making felds ad slots MORE valuable. You can sell those ad slots as with the potential to be on tv, in streams, and in thousands of amateur pics and vids when you buy advertising around the track...

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2/12/2019 1:21 PM
Edited Date/Time: 2/12/2019 1:22 PM

jreed530 wrote:

Feld is now upset that a photographer gave away and tagged companies in pictures. As they put it. They control who gets tagged in pictures from SX. You are allowed to tag riders but you cannot tag companies unless you are paid by said company. I find it hard to believe that a company would be upset with free advertising on social media.

FWYT wrote:

" I find it hard to believe that a company would be upset with free advertising on social media."

Of course the companies don't mind! But Feld is nuts, it's not going to happen. Social media has destroyed
commercial photography to a large extent. All kinds of idiots shoot stuff and post it tagging companies
because for some jacked up reason they think it legitimizes their efforts. I mean I see stuff that is fully produced with a team just tagging companies freely. No, fool, you are giving away
your photography for free. But that's where we are at now; the toothpaste is out of the tube and it
ain't going back in anytime soon.

jreed530 wrote:

This person takes them as a hobby because they enjoy the sport. They were contacted by Feld this morning telling them to remove all of there photos from Minneapolis.

No kidding? I'm kind of surprised they're spending their resources pursuing that stuff or maybe they just have an algorithm out there mopping things up. Hahaha but yeah, I've heard of Feld doing that before with photos. Not so much the tagging part because that's relatively new but photos in general.

The guy that should chime in is the dude that is from NorCal that actually is an attorney and a really excellent photographer... His handle escapes me at the moment I know his name is Michael. Excellent, excellent photographer.

If I recall correctly, basically there's something on the admission ticket that says that Feldowns all IP rights... Something like that.

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2/12/2019 1:28 PM

FWYT wrote:

" I find it hard to believe that a company would be upset with free advertising on social media."

Of course the companies don't mind! But Feld is nuts, it's not going to happen. Social media has destroyed
commercial photography to a large extent. All kinds of idiots shoot stuff and post it tagging companies
because for some jacked up reason they think it legitimizes their efforts. I mean I see stuff that is fully produced with a team just tagging companies freely. No, fool, you are giving away
your photography for free. But that's where we are at now; the toothpaste is out of the tube and it
ain't going back in anytime soon.

jreed530 wrote:

This person takes them as a hobby because they enjoy the sport. They were contacted by Feld this morning telling them to remove all of there photos from Minneapolis.

FWYT wrote:

No kidding? I'm kind of surprised they're spending their resources pursuing that stuff or maybe they just have an algorithm out there mopping things up. Hahaha but yeah, I've heard of Feld doing that before with photos. Not so much the tagging part because that's relatively new but photos in general.

The guy that should chime in is the dude that is from NorCal that actually is an attorney and a really excellent photographer... His handle escapes me at the moment I know his name is Michael. Excellent, excellent photographer.

If I recall correctly, basically there's something on the admission ticket that says that Feldowns all IP rights... Something like that.

Feld CANNOT own the IP rights to an image taken at a show if they allow cameras, which they do. You think the NFL owns the IP rights to every image taken at a football game? No dice. This is just strong-arming people into allowing them more control than is allowed. You think DC owns every pic taken at a National? LOL

Companies that do this shit crack me up.

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2/12/2019 1:29 PM

Hey OP, the way I see it, this helped your sister out and got her more followers. I started following her. Great photos!

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2/12/2019 1:34 PM

mattyhamz2 wrote:

Hey OP, the way I see it, this helped your sister out and got her more followers. I started following her. Great photos!

x2

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2/12/2019 1:44 PM

FWYT wrote:

" I find it hard to believe that a company would be upset with free advertising on social media."

Of course the companies don't mind! But Feld is nuts, it's not going to happen. Social media has destroyed
commercial photography to a large extent. All kinds of idiots shoot stuff and post it tagging companies
because for some jacked up reason they think it legitimizes their efforts. I mean I see stuff that is fully produced with a team just tagging companies freely. No, fool, you are giving away
your photography for free. But that's where we are at now; the toothpaste is out of the tube and it
ain't going back in anytime soon.

jreed530 wrote:

This person takes them as a hobby because they enjoy the sport. They were contacted by Feld this morning telling them to remove all of there photos from Minneapolis.

FWYT wrote:

No kidding? I'm kind of surprised they're spending their resources pursuing that stuff or maybe they just have an algorithm out there mopping things up. Hahaha but yeah, I've heard of Feld doing that before with photos. Not so much the tagging part because that's relatively new but photos in general.

The guy that should chime in is the dude that is from NorCal that actually is an attorney and a really excellent photographer... His handle escapes me at the moment I know his name is Michael. Excellent, excellent photographer.

If I recall correctly, basically there's something on the admission ticket that says that Feldowns all IP rights... Something like that.

His username is FTE.

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2/12/2019 1:54 PM

jreed530 wrote:

This person takes them as a hobby because they enjoy the sport. They were contacted by Feld this morning telling them to remove all of there photos from Minneapolis.

FWYT wrote:

No kidding? I'm kind of surprised they're spending their resources pursuing that stuff or maybe they just have an algorithm out there mopping things up. Hahaha but yeah, I've heard of Feld doing that before with photos. Not so much the tagging part because that's relatively new but photos in general.

The guy that should chime in is the dude that is from NorCal that actually is an attorney and a really excellent photographer... His handle escapes me at the moment I know his name is Michael. Excellent, excellent photographer.

If I recall correctly, basically there's something on the admission ticket that says that Feldowns all IP rights... Something like that.

theprizefighter wrote:

His username is FTE.

That's right, thank you!

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2/12/2019 1:55 PM

"... you cannot tag companies unless you are paid by said company."

Shit, I wouldn't need Feld to tell me that.

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2/12/2019 2:06 PM
Edited Date/Time: 2/12/2019 2:38 PM

CozMan wrote:

Feld CANNOT own the IP rights to an image taken at a show if they allow cameras, which they do. You think the NFL owns the IP rights to every image taken at a football game? No dice. This is just strong-arming people into allowing them more control than is allowed. You think DC owns every pic taken at a National? LOL

Companies that do this shit crack me up.

No, I'm not entirely sure if Feld can do this still obviously they are trying. No I do not agree with it though a lot of venues do try to control IPs.( I hear a lot of that from music clubs.) Not entirely sure on their legal footing on this thing as I never mess with it which is why I thought FTE might be able to join in. Don't know what DC's position is on that as far as the Nationals.

To be very, very clear here - I am NOT sticking up for Feld!

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2/12/2019 3:07 PM

CozMan wrote:

a photo taken by a private citizen at a sporting event cannot be controlled by the promoter of said event. They can ban cameras, but they can't tell you what you can do with the photos, much less who you can tag? (insert giant eye-roll emoticon).

A professional photographer can of course control the image, but even with that, unless Feld has these guys signing away some rights regarding their photography, they sure as hell can't stop them from tagging people/companies.

In the past for outdoors and I understand SX as well the application for the credential includes a level of control over image distribution and display, including purporting to convey the photographers copyright to images from the event. I don't know that this remains the case, but I expect it is. Its the price paid for access. I haven't heard about this ebing enforced apart from Feld's predecessor maybe 10 years ago having SX photos pulled from a charity aauction where the images had been contributed by photohounds.

I wonder if what Feld is tripping on is that companies not paying a sponsor fee to Feld are getting exposure through SX images (akin to the teams not being allowed to sell in the pits, if still the case).

Some general background: A photographer, like any creative, has a common law copyright in his or her works on creation (typically the work would have to be registered under the Copyright act for the photographer to have the Act's remedies). That said, if the subject is a notable person, say an athlete, and the value of the image relates to that person, that person has the right to control their image that supersedes the photographer's right to sell that person's image outside of an editorial context. These rights and limitations usually get bundled up in the various parties' credentials such that the creative work is advancing everyone's interests. My own personal experience has been that the restrictions don't get hammered if someone is posting on a web board or social media, but the gloves come off when someone starts selling images outside of the credential framework, like ebay posters.

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Twitter: @ftemoto
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2/12/2019 3:19 PM
Edited Date/Time: 2/12/2019 3:21 PM

FWYT wrote:

"... you cannot tag companies unless you are paid by said company."

Shit, I wouldn't need Feld to tell me that.

Apparently you can because he did. blush Allowed and should are different questions.

I've done it occasionally on instagram, but largely dated old pics and its unlikely I'll be shooting races any more (it's become too physically hard for me). I hadn't thought if posting to instagram and tagging the companies is as scabby as giving photos for free to those companies and undercutting the pros. There are really good pro shooters who no longer invest as much in pro MX/SX in part because of how digital photography facilitated a flood of images "good enough" for some companies, especially if the prices is right at free.

What's a bit crazy is that the half life value for 99.9% of moto photos is about 12 hours now with the speed clients demand photos, and really the big players are going to 10 or so guys who are at every race reliably delivering work product on the schedule demanded by clients now. If as a amateur you publish stuff to the internet it's largely valueless commercially by the time you manage that unless it's a really one-off iconic money shot.

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Twitter: @ftemoto
Instagram: @mstusiak

2/12/2019 3:32 PM

jreed530 wrote:

Feld is now upset that a photographer gave away and tagged companies in pictures. As they put it. They control who gets tagged in pictures from SX. You are allowed to tag riders but you cannot tag companies unless you are paid by said company. I find it hard to believe that a company would be upset with free advertising on social media.

Seems like Feld has a lot of other things they could focus on instead of telling photographers how to run their business. Are they telling riders no stickers on their bikes unless the companies are paying the riders a minimum cash fee?

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2/12/2019 3:32 PM

Thanks, FTE. How about if an amateur photographer takes photos without a credential, from the stands? He wouldn't be constrained by any agreement other than what appears on his ticket, right?

Unless the ticket expressly forbids his posting of said images on his personal website, how can Feld even pretend to have any ability to stop him? Furthermore, if he wants to tag companies in his post, either out of deference or obligation, how is that any business of Feld's? The photographer was there as a "private citizen," not as a paid professional.

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Braaapin' aint easy.

2/12/2019 3:38 PM

theprizefighter wrote:

His username is FTE.

Does the E stand for Esquire?

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2/12/2019 4:07 PM

HAHAHH Good luck trying to press that case in a court of law Feld. Photographer isn't making money off those tags (ie: commercialization/sales because of the tags) nor is tagging falsely portraying an 'official' relationship with those brands.

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2/12/2019 4:18 PM

FreshTopEnd wrote:

Apparently you can because he did. blush Allowed and should are different questions.

I've done it occasionally on instagram, but largely dated old pics and its unlikely I'll be shooting races any more (it's become too physically hard for me). I hadn't thought if posting to instagram and tagging the companies is as scabby as giving photos for free to those companies and undercutting the pros. There are really good pro shooters who no longer invest as much in pro MX/SX in part because of how digital photography facilitated a flood of images "good enough" for some companies, especially if the prices is right at free.

What's a bit crazy is that the half life value for 99.9% of moto photos is about 12 hours now with the speed clients demand photos, and really the big players are going to 10 or so guys who are at every race reliably delivering work product on the schedule demanded by clients now. If as a amateur you publish stuff to the internet it's largely valueless commercially by the time you manage that unless it's a really one-off iconic money shot.

I just don't understand how Feld would be able to or try to control who was tagged in photo's taken from the stands.

I get they want to protect their rights and the credentialed photog's but this seems excessive and maybe not legal too.

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2/12/2019 4:23 PM

Just tell Feld to kick rocks and move on, what are they gonna do sue you over an IG post?laughing

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2/12/2019 4:27 PM

Is Jessica Reed a hottie? Most important question

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