Dirt bike to super moto conversion

jonahc_42
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8/22/2021 3:39pm Edited Date/Time 9/10/2021 7:09pm
Hey guys I’ve been seeing these super moto bikes all around and they look like a blast on tracks but I have a motocross bike so I was curious if any of you guys do both or if that is even possible to have a 2 In 1
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scott_nz
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8/22/2021 4:12pm
It is possible to just out wheels and a big front brake on , but to get the motard handling properly you need to lower it, stiffen it and that makes changing back and forward a lot longer and needing another set of suspension
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8/22/2021 4:39pm
Mines a blast. Crf450r. I gotta spare set of dirtbike wheels I swap back and forth.

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SKIDLID
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8/22/2021 4:43pm
Always wanted to make a street legal supermoto bike to ride around on the street .
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8/22/2021 5:07pm Edited Date/Time 8/22/2021 5:10pm
If it’s dry out the slicks don’t go bad on powerline hard pack trails and gravel if you have throttle control but when it rains it’s s slip n slide.
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The Shop

4DAIVIPAI2K5
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8/22/2021 5:47pm
SKIDLID wrote:
Always wanted to make a street legal supermoto bike to ride around on the street .
I converted a 06 crf 450 back when I was younger... Most fun I ever had on the street. My triumph 675 sat and collected dust while I never hit 60mph ripping all over the country side lol.
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jonahc_42
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8/22/2021 6:47pm
scott_nz wrote:
It is possible to just out wheels and a big front brake on , but to get the motard handling properly you need to lower it...
It is possible to just out wheels and a big front brake on , but to get the motard handling properly you need to lower it, stiffen it and that makes changing back and forward a lot longer and needing another set of suspension
Okay well if I just want to put wheels, tires and big brake kit on it and stiffen the clickers could I track day it and still do decent and maybe do asphalt only race?
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scott_nz
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8/22/2021 7:05pm
scott_nz wrote:
It is possible to just out wheels and a big front brake on , but to get the motard handling properly you need to lower it...
It is possible to just out wheels and a big front brake on , but to get the motard handling properly you need to lower it, stiffen it and that makes changing back and forward a lot longer and needing another set of suspension
jonahc_42 wrote:
Okay well if I just want to put wheels, tires and big brake kit on it and stiffen the clickers could I track day it and...
Okay well if I just want to put wheels, tires and big brake kit on it and stiffen the clickers could I track day it and still do decent and maybe do asphalt only race?
Yep it will do it fine , and be a blast , Just when you want to go faster racing you need to find the advantages
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jbonemalone
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8/22/2021 7:24pm
I did an older 426 and custom milled spacer and brackets for some cbr wheels. Added a set of zx636 brakes and what a fun machine.

4
jonahc_42
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8/22/2021 7:25pm
scott_nz wrote:
It is possible to just out wheels and a big front brake on , but to get the motard handling properly you need to lower it...
It is possible to just out wheels and a big front brake on , but to get the motard handling properly you need to lower it, stiffen it and that makes changing back and forward a lot longer and needing another set of suspension
jonahc_42 wrote:
Okay well if I just want to put wheels, tires and big brake kit on it and stiffen the clickers could I track day it and...
Okay well if I just want to put wheels, tires and big brake kit on it and stiffen the clickers could I track day it and still do decent and maybe do asphalt only race?
scott_nz wrote:
Yep it will do it fine , and be a blast , Just when you want to go faster racing you need to find the advantages
Sweet yeah I just want to do it until I can afford a full on super moto bike like the ktm or something
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moto67e
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8/22/2021 10:40pm
I raced Supermoto for a little while and it was a lot of fun. I sold my Supermoto bike because there wasn't as many races as I wanted. To properly convert your dirt bike to a Supermoto for the track, you'll need wheels, tire warmers and a generator, Lower offset triple clamps, A big brake system including master cylinder, a slipper clutch, bark buster hand guards and taller gearing, I ran 13/44 on my 14 YZ450 and it went 84mph in 5th.

If you just want to cruise around at a track day, you could get away with DOT tires and supermoto wheels, a larger rotor and stiffen up the clickers.
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jonahc_42
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8/22/2021 10:56pm
moto67e wrote:
I raced Supermoto for a little while and it was a lot of fun. I sold my Supermoto bike because there wasn't as many races as...
I raced Supermoto for a little while and it was a lot of fun. I sold my Supermoto bike because there wasn't as many races as I wanted. To properly convert your dirt bike to a Supermoto for the track, you'll need wheels, tire warmers and a generator, Lower offset triple clamps, A big brake system including master cylinder, a slipper clutch, bark buster hand guards and taller gearing, I ran 13/44 on my 14 YZ450 and it went 84mph in 5th.

If you just want to cruise around at a track day, you could get away with DOT tires and supermoto wheels, a larger rotor and stiffen up the clickers.
Well I want to get into supermoto but I race motocross and I don’t have enough money to buy a whole new bike, so i was trying to see if I could somehow have parts that I could just swap between mx and supermoto, there’s a couple local tracks and races/series that I was interested in doing
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moto67e
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8/22/2021 11:02pm
moto67e wrote:
I raced Supermoto for a little while and it was a lot of fun. I sold my Supermoto bike because there wasn't as many races as...
I raced Supermoto for a little while and it was a lot of fun. I sold my Supermoto bike because there wasn't as many races as I wanted. To properly convert your dirt bike to a Supermoto for the track, you'll need wheels, tire warmers and a generator, Lower offset triple clamps, A big brake system including master cylinder, a slipper clutch, bark buster hand guards and taller gearing, I ran 13/44 on my 14 YZ450 and it went 84mph in 5th.

If you just want to cruise around at a track day, you could get away with DOT tires and supermoto wheels, a larger rotor and stiffen up the clickers.
jonahc_42 wrote:
Well I want to get into supermoto but I race motocross and I don’t have enough money to buy a whole new bike, so i was...
Well I want to get into supermoto but I race motocross and I don’t have enough money to buy a whole new bike, so i was trying to see if I could somehow have parts that I could just swap between mx and supermoto, there’s a couple local tracks and races/series that I was interested in doing
Sweet. It's a lot of fun. A good front brake system is a must for racing, as are tire warmers and a slipper clutch. If I was going to do it as cheaply as possible, that's the minimum I would do. But that's still close to 3k for those 3 things.

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FWYT
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8/22/2021 11:18pm
SKIDLID wrote:
Always wanted to make a street legal supermoto bike to ride around on the street .
I have a KTM Duke II (640) and it is a total blast on the street. I've taken it to the kart track some and while
it's not like a proper SM bike, it's still a total blast.

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Bruneval
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8/23/2021 2:21am
This is very common over in Europe- I have had a couple. I'd honestly recommend getting a purpose made one like those offered by TM, Husqvarna, KTM for convenience if you're going to do any road work. If it's to be a pure race/track machine, it doesn't matter. My experience:

YZ450F. I converted it to road use using a set of Talon ready made wheels with an oversize front brake disc, and the carrier to move the caliper. It was a blast to ride (was legal on the road using a daytime license in the UK), but the downside was that it was a nuisance any time I stopped for fuel (no stand), and no security measures like locks so I could never leave it unattended. I also found myself messing about more than I should have been on the road, pulling wheelies and attempting stoppies etc. The other main problem I found was the gearing - as a motocross bike it was too short, even with tiny supermoto sprockets. If I was to go down this route again, I'd choose a WR450F for the gearing, electric start and lighting, or alternatively a CRF450X although I do think the Yamaha is a more robust package.

DRZ400 SM. It was gutless and I couldn't stand it. Don't waste your time - you'd have to spend some serious money to get the thing to move at anything other than walking pace.
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gt80rider
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8/23/2021 11:56am
moto67e wrote:
I raced Supermoto for a little while and it was a lot of fun. I sold my Supermoto bike because there wasn't as many races as...
I raced Supermoto for a little while and it was a lot of fun. I sold my Supermoto bike because there wasn't as many races as I wanted. To properly convert your dirt bike to a Supermoto for the track, you'll need wheels, tire warmers and a generator, Lower offset triple clamps, A big brake system including master cylinder, a slipper clutch, bark buster hand guards and taller gearing, I ran 13/44 on my 14 YZ450 and it went 84mph in 5th.

If you just want to cruise around at a track day, you could get away with DOT tires and supermoto wheels, a larger rotor and stiffen up the clickers.
I just gotta ask... so why are bark busters a "must have" for super moto?????
jonahc_42
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8/23/2021 3:25pm
moto67e wrote:
I raced Supermoto for a little while and it was a lot of fun. I sold my Supermoto bike because there wasn't as many races as...
I raced Supermoto for a little while and it was a lot of fun. I sold my Supermoto bike because there wasn't as many races as I wanted. To properly convert your dirt bike to a Supermoto for the track, you'll need wheels, tire warmers and a generator, Lower offset triple clamps, A big brake system including master cylinder, a slipper clutch, bark buster hand guards and taller gearing, I ran 13/44 on my 14 YZ450 and it went 84mph in 5th.

If you just want to cruise around at a track day, you could get away with DOT tires and supermoto wheels, a larger rotor and stiffen up the clickers.
gt80rider wrote:
I just gotta ask... so why are bark busters a "must have" for super moto?????
I’d assume it’s because if you eat it and hold on ur hand doesn’t get crushed from the asphalt
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moto67e
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8/24/2021 1:45pm
moto67e wrote:
I raced Supermoto for a little while and it was a lot of fun. I sold my Supermoto bike because there wasn't as many races as...
I raced Supermoto for a little while and it was a lot of fun. I sold my Supermoto bike because there wasn't as many races as I wanted. To properly convert your dirt bike to a Supermoto for the track, you'll need wheels, tire warmers and a generator, Lower offset triple clamps, A big brake system including master cylinder, a slipper clutch, bark buster hand guards and taller gearing, I ran 13/44 on my 14 YZ450 and it went 84mph in 5th.

If you just want to cruise around at a track day, you could get away with DOT tires and supermoto wheels, a larger rotor and stiffen up the clickers.
gt80rider wrote:
I just gotta ask... so why are bark busters a "must have" for super moto?????
It protects the levers from grinding on the asphalt.
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scott_nz
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8/24/2021 2:17pm
moto67e wrote:
I raced Supermoto for a little while and it was a lot of fun. I sold my Supermoto bike because there wasn't as many races as...
I raced Supermoto for a little while and it was a lot of fun. I sold my Supermoto bike because there wasn't as many races as I wanted. To properly convert your dirt bike to a Supermoto for the track, you'll need wheels, tire warmers and a generator, Lower offset triple clamps, A big brake system including master cylinder, a slipper clutch, bark buster hand guards and taller gearing, I ran 13/44 on my 14 YZ450 and it went 84mph in 5th.

If you just want to cruise around at a track day, you could get away with DOT tires and supermoto wheels, a larger rotor and stiffen up the clickers.
gt80rider wrote:
I just gotta ask... so why are bark busters a "must have" for super moto?????
I never ran then as I hate them. Just had folding levers so they didn’t break
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ripper298
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8/24/2021 4:05pm


Had to sell it due to the fact that I need a drivers license to remain employed haha.
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Fireblade2k
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8/24/2021 4:28pm

2008 Husqvarna Te610 with 17"'s
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philG
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8/25/2021 3:38pm Edited Date/Time 8/25/2021 3:39pm
If you just want something to ride round the street, wheels and a bigger front disc , will be enough.

If you want to ride on the track, you will need a bigger disc, 4 pot caliper, and a decent master cylinder.

If you want to race competitively...

Then you will need lower offset clamps, possibly with a steeper head angle to get the geometry right, plus a complete fork revalve, for the tarmac.

On the rear you will need a SM specific shock, which will need to be much stiffer. and possibly have a ride height adjuster to jack up the rear to get it to turn better .

Motor wise, for MX , a stock 450 with a pipe is enough, but for Supermoto you will get slaughtered without a better pipe( possibly a twin sytem) and an inlet kit, we run a 3d printed inlet manifold on my 2018 450 Husqvarna, with a huge K&N filter , a proper Vertex ECU with SM specific maps.

Also you will need a slipper clutch and a quick shifter , because not having them means you have to gear the bike so you dont have to change gear mid turn , as it unsettles the bike too much ..

We shied away from a high comp piston as we wanted the bike to rev easier , and we have had better results running lower compression at high revs.


The picture below is from 2010, the bike is an Aprilia MXV450 converted to SM , i won the British Clubman Championship on this bike , and finished top 10 in the Elite class on it that day...

Motor was converted to 5 speed, lightened crank by GWR in Belgium, loads of internal parts lightened, polished and DLC coated, very slight port mods, all the power came from insane mapping , and a total loss ignition system, we saw 72hp out of the 450 on the dyno , the factory versions were over 80, but cost a fortune to build and run, this did a whole season with one refresh,

It was dripping with Ti and Carbon, had a BrakeTech Carbon rotor that weighed 850g and the thing turned on a dime.

16.5in front wheels were just coming in then, we run 16's now.

Nothing ever passed it me in a straight line.


You can put $25k into one , without trying to hard, i think the guys here starting with the new Hondas are into them for $15k to build a race ready unit , with a spare set of wheels.

As with all motorsport , speed costs.


7
philG
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8/25/2021 3:47pm
gt80rider wrote:
I just gotta ask... so why are bark busters a "must have" for super moto?????
Because when you crash , without them you will total a $500 Master cylinder, and also it means you never get you brake pulled on when you hit another rider, or anything at the side of the track,

And they need to be proper metal reinforced ones, plastic ones will shatter if you go down hard.
1
philG
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8/25/2021 3:58pm Edited Date/Time 8/25/2021 4:01pm

2016 TM300 with a 1997 Eric Gorr CR500 tuned motor CPI pipe and a lot of work by my sponsor.
Twin disc Cobra front end, with Cobra clamps, and Ohlins kitted forks

Motor was full on low compression, was like an electric motor to ride,no hit, just enough to allow you to get on it with melting the tyre and getting flicked off ... the original builder made an unrideable monster that was awful to ride, and useless to race, by the time we were done with it, it was spot on even in the wet .



TM300 with PVM Wheels, Pro Circuit pipe , and lot of tuning work..

By the time we were done, this was a match for anything on the tight and twisty tracks in Germany, with lots of offroad.. won a couple of races on it in the German Vets series.
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jonahc_42
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8/25/2021 5:22pm
philG wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2021/08/25/507452/s1200_TM.jpg[/img] 2016 TM300 with a 1997 Eric Gorr CR500 tuned motor CPI pipe and a lot of work by my sponsor. Twin disc Cobra front end...

2016 TM300 with a 1997 Eric Gorr CR500 tuned motor CPI pipe and a lot of work by my sponsor.
Twin disc Cobra front end, with Cobra clamps, and Ohlins kitted forks

Motor was full on low compression, was like an electric motor to ride,no hit, just enough to allow you to get on it with melting the tyre and getting flicked off ... the original builder made an unrideable monster that was awful to ride, and useless to race, by the time we were done with it, it was spot on even in the wet .



TM300 with PVM Wheels, Pro Circuit pipe , and lot of tuning work..

By the time we were done, this was a match for anything on the tight and twisty tracks in Germany, with lots of offroad.. won a couple of races on it in the German Vets series.
What about a 250 2 stroke super moto?
philG
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8/26/2021 12:10am
philG wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2021/08/25/507452/s1200_TM.jpg[/img] 2016 TM300 with a 1997 Eric Gorr CR500 tuned motor CPI pipe and a lot of work by my sponsor. Twin disc Cobra front end...

2016 TM300 with a 1997 Eric Gorr CR500 tuned motor CPI pipe and a lot of work by my sponsor.
Twin disc Cobra front end, with Cobra clamps, and Ohlins kitted forks

Motor was full on low compression, was like an electric motor to ride,no hit, just enough to allow you to get on it with melting the tyre and getting flicked off ... the original builder made an unrideable monster that was awful to ride, and useless to race, by the time we were done with it, it was spot on even in the wet .



TM300 with PVM Wheels, Pro Circuit pipe , and lot of tuning work..

By the time we were done, this was a match for anything on the tight and twisty tracks in Germany, with lots of offroad.. won a couple of races on it in the German Vets series.
jonahc_42 wrote:
What about a 250 2 stroke super moto?
Waste of time IMO... no good for the street, no good for racing, just not fast enough. The TM300 SMX comes built as an SM bike with proper suspension, brakes and wheels, and it needed a lot of work to get it up to speed.. we went up to 325cc but it wasnt any faster, because with the bigger piston it just didnt rev.

It isnt worth putting money in to .
1
dmm698
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8/26/2021 8:02am
I had a kx500 with a street plate and motard wheels (bought it this way) to give a try to riding aroudn on the roads for fun. After a week the novelty wore off and it sucked.
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AgentOrange
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9/10/2021 5:47pm

06 625 SMC, traded it to get back into moto. I do miss it. Street legal from the factory. I never got so many comments and questions from people at the gas station.
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lp223
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9/10/2021 7:00pm
A stock 450 with a good front brake and good slicks is all you need to have a blast at a track day. If you want to race tire warmers are a must.

Don’t let people tell you you need to dump a ton of money into a supermoto to have fun. Throw a set of wheels on and have a good time. If you really like it you can start adding parts like a slipper clutch and triple clamps.


2
lp223
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9/10/2021 7:06pm
Oh yea, takes about an hour to swap from sumo to dirt for my setup.
jonahc_42
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9/10/2021 7:09pm
lp223 wrote:
A stock 450 with a good front brake and good slicks is all you need to have a blast at a track day. If you want...
A stock 450 with a good front brake and good slicks is all you need to have a blast at a track day. If you want to race tire warmers are a must.

Don’t let people tell you you need to dump a ton of money into a supermoto to have fun. Throw a set of wheels on and have a good time. If you really like it you can start adding parts like a slipper clutch and triple clamps.


Yeah I only have a yz250 2 stroke

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