Did MXoN really prove anything??

thekendogg
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9/19/2011 11:11am Edited Date/Time 1/27/2012 12:13am
To get started, congratulation to America who won. I was at the race and what an awesome weekend!

Or was it France that lost it? I was at the race, and in that final moto, Pourcel was seriously hauling ass and pulling in on the leaders. Then bike problems... France only needed a top 5, if even, from Pourcel, who looked like he was going to challenge for the moto win. People can argue Bagget had 2 bad motos and USA still won, but it's his fault he crashed. Pourcel's problem was out of his hands.

Secondly, in the first moto Roczen was UNBELIEVABLE!! Roczen (17 years old) coming from a 6th place start, to catch and pass Dungey and finish 2nd on a 250 is just astonishing. I think Dungey's podium interview said it all, complaining about getting a bad start and having to battle through the pack - HE WAS 3RD ON THE FIRST LAP!! Sour grapes if you ask me...

Then, race 2. I thought Roczen was going to beat Villopoto this time!! Got past him but couldn't stay in front, . But what about Herlings?? This kid has just turned 17, first race on the "sh*t underpowered" 350 (words of Americans, not my own) and he beats your very own national champ? And being stuck in 3rd gear for the majority of the race?? All this is forgetting Paulin is an MX2 rider and beat them all, but hey...

Lets not forget Roczen lapping Bagget both motos either.

And I've already read the AMA vs. GP threads - a loada BS if you ask me. Cairolli's bars came off moto 1, and fell in the 3rd moto. Anyone who was there on the saturday would have seen Cairolli easily had the beating of Dungey.

Then let's look at the injury list of the GP riders who definitely would have been up there:
Frossard
Phillipaerts
Desalle
Nagl
Ramon
(Bobryshev was supposed to be out the rest of the season, but gave a spirited performance and showed his speed. He ran with the top AMA guys and is far from being the best in the GPs).

Already looking forward to next year and hopefully get a full gate with no injuries!! Call me a US hater, or call me a Europe fan, I just love the racing!!!!

Anyway, everyone knows team Ireland should have won... Wink
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lumpy790
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9/19/2011 11:14am Edited Date/Time 9/19/2011 11:16am
What officially happened to Pourcels bike?

I think this year showed that a country can win and not dominate but I thought We should have lost it this year.
lucero10x
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9/19/2011 11:17am
He got goggles in the first moto what stopped him from knocking out a rear wheel replacement in the second. You can't tell me they weren't prepared for such an occurrence.
kongols
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9/19/2011 11:20am
lucero10x wrote:
He got goggles in the first moto what stopped him from knocking out a rear wheel replacement in the second. You can't tell me they weren't...
He got goggles in the first moto what stopped him from knocking out a rear wheel replacement in the second. You can't tell me they weren't prepared for such an occurrence.
Perhaps he wouldn`t be able to ride it to the pits, and if he cut across the track and went straight to the pits he would have been DQ anyway. His rear wheel foam tube was out of the tire.
lucero10x
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9/19/2011 11:21am
lucero10x wrote:
He got goggles in the first moto what stopped him from knocking out a rear wheel replacement in the second. You can't tell me they weren't...
He got goggles in the first moto what stopped him from knocking out a rear wheel replacement in the second. You can't tell me they weren't prepared for such an occurrence.
kongols wrote:
Perhaps he wouldn`t be able to ride it to the pits, and if he cut across the track and went straight to the pits he would...
Perhaps he wouldn`t be able to ride it to the pits, and if he cut across the track and went straight to the pits he would have been DQ anyway. His rear wheel foam tube was out of the tire.
So you are saying it was impossible for him to get to the pits? Or are you saying it wasn't that important to him?

The Shop

motogrady
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9/19/2011 11:25am Edited Date/Time 9/19/2011 11:26am
thekendogg wrote:
To get started, congratulation to America who won. I was at the race and what an awesome weekend! Or was it France that lost it? I...
To get started, congratulation to America who won. I was at the race and what an awesome weekend!

Or was it France that lost it? I was at the race, and in that final moto, Pourcel was seriously hauling ass and pulling in on the leaders. Then bike problems... France only needed a top 5, if even, from Pourcel, who looked like he was going to challenge for the moto win. People can argue Bagget had 2 bad motos and USA still won, but it's his fault he crashed. Pourcel's problem was out of his hands.

Secondly, in the first moto Roczen was UNBELIEVABLE!! Roczen (17 years old) coming from a 6th place start, to catch and pass Dungey and finish 2nd on a 250 is just astonishing. I think Dungey's podium interview said it all, complaining about getting a bad start and having to battle through the pack - HE WAS 3RD ON THE FIRST LAP!! Sour grapes if you ask me...

Then, race 2. I thought Roczen was going to beat Villopoto this time!! Got past him but couldn't stay in front, . But what about Herlings?? This kid has just turned 17, first race on the "sh*t underpowered" 350 (words of Americans, not my own) and he beats your very own national champ? And being stuck in 3rd gear for the majority of the race?? All this is forgetting Paulin is an MX2 rider and beat them all, but hey...

Lets not forget Roczen lapping Bagget both motos either.

And I've already read the AMA vs. GP threads - a loada BS if you ask me. Cairolli's bars came off moto 1, and fell in the 3rd moto. Anyone who was there on the saturday would have seen Cairolli easily had the beating of Dungey.

Then let's look at the injury list of the GP riders who definitely would have been up there:
Frossard
Phillipaerts
Desalle
Nagl
Ramon
(Bobryshev was supposed to be out the rest of the season, but gave a spirited performance and showed his speed. He ran with the top AMA guys and is far from being the best in the GPs).

Already looking forward to next year and hopefully get a full gate with no injuries!! Call me a US hater, or call me a Europe fan, I just love the racing!!!!

Anyway, everyone knows team Ireland should have won... Wink
Thanks for the congrats.

Prove anything? Sure it did.

It proved that in the year 2011, the USA had the strongest, fastest, most consistant guys on the planet.

You wanna throw in lucky, that's okay also, but I wouldn't bank on a rabbit's foot. With the record the
USA has at the moment, any country that beat's us would have to be called lucky.

What did that cowboy used to say, 'no brag, just fact."
kongols
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9/19/2011 11:25am
lucero10x wrote:
He got goggles in the first moto what stopped him from knocking out a rear wheel replacement in the second. You can't tell me they weren't...
He got goggles in the first moto what stopped him from knocking out a rear wheel replacement in the second. You can't tell me they weren't prepared for such an occurrence.
kongols wrote:
Perhaps he wouldn`t be able to ride it to the pits, and if he cut across the track and went straight to the pits he would...
Perhaps he wouldn`t be able to ride it to the pits, and if he cut across the track and went straight to the pits he would have been DQ anyway. His rear wheel foam tube was out of the tire.
lucero10x wrote:
So you are saying it was impossible for him to get to the pits? Or are you saying it wasn't that important to him?
Did you see how steep those hills were? Explain to me how can you ride up on it without a tire?
Ddavis
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9/19/2011 11:28am
Every year there's always questions left unanswered. So we wait another year for the next Des Nations, then ask the same questions.
lucero10x
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9/19/2011 11:31am
kongols wrote:
Perhaps he wouldn`t be able to ride it to the pits, and if he cut across the track and went straight to the pits he would...
Perhaps he wouldn`t be able to ride it to the pits, and if he cut across the track and went straight to the pits he would have been DQ anyway. His rear wheel foam tube was out of the tire.
lucero10x wrote:
So you are saying it was impossible for him to get to the pits? Or are you saying it wasn't that important to him?
kongols wrote:
Did you see how steep those hills were? Explain to me how can you ride up on it without a tire?
Without a tire? I literally have done it (bad bad day but I get her back), but he did have a tire.
kongols
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9/19/2011 11:34am
lucero10x wrote:
So you are saying it was impossible for him to get to the pits? Or are you saying it wasn't that important to him?
kongols wrote:
Did you see how steep those hills were? Explain to me how can you ride up on it without a tire?
lucero10x wrote:
Without a tire? I literally have done it (bad bad day but I get her back), but he did have a tire.
With a foam tube out you basically ride on a rim, perhaps even worse.
Titan1
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9/19/2011 11:36am
Yes. It proved that the AMA Riders that showed up are faster than the GP riders that showed up, because AMA riders had a better weekend.

7 of the 9 riders on the top three teams currently ride in the AMA! 7!!!!

AMA riders went 1-2-3 in the MX1/MX3 moto....

AMA riders dominated the event.

mechanicals, crashes, injuries, bad starts....they are all part of racing.


I love the GP's...I'm a huge AC fan...but this raced proved AGAIN, that the AMA riders are better.
9/19/2011 11:37am
thekendogg wrote:
To get started, congratulation to America who won. I was at the race and what an awesome weekend! Or was it France that lost it? I...
To get started, congratulation to America who won. I was at the race and what an awesome weekend!

Or was it France that lost it? I was at the race, and in that final moto, Pourcel was seriously hauling ass and pulling in on the leaders. Then bike problems... France only needed a top 5, if even, from Pourcel, who looked like he was going to challenge for the moto win. People can argue Bagget had 2 bad motos and USA still won, but it's his fault he crashed. Pourcel's problem was out of his hands.

Secondly, in the first moto Roczen was UNBELIEVABLE!! Roczen (17 years old) coming from a 6th place start, to catch and pass Dungey and finish 2nd on a 250 is just astonishing. I think Dungey's podium interview said it all, complaining about getting a bad start and having to battle through the pack - HE WAS 3RD ON THE FIRST LAP!! Sour grapes if you ask me...

Then, race 2. I thought Roczen was going to beat Villopoto this time!! Got past him but couldn't stay in front, . But what about Herlings?? This kid has just turned 17, first race on the "sh*t underpowered" 350 (words of Americans, not my own) and he beats your very own national champ? And being stuck in 3rd gear for the majority of the race?? All this is forgetting Paulin is an MX2 rider and beat them all, but hey...

Lets not forget Roczen lapping Bagget both motos either.

And I've already read the AMA vs. GP threads - a loada BS if you ask me. Cairolli's bars came off moto 1, and fell in the 3rd moto. Anyone who was there on the saturday would have seen Cairolli easily had the beating of Dungey.

Then let's look at the injury list of the GP riders who definitely would have been up there:
Frossard
Phillipaerts
Desalle
Nagl
Ramon
(Bobryshev was supposed to be out the rest of the season, but gave a spirited performance and showed his speed. He ran with the top AMA guys and is far from being the best in the GPs).

Already looking forward to next year and hopefully get a full gate with no injuries!! Call me a US hater, or call me a Europe fan, I just love the racing!!!!

Anyway, everyone knows team Ireland should have won... Wink
The competition was close and GP riders are fast, but you are bad at math. Even if Pourcel had won the last moto, the US still would have won by one point.
lucero10x
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9/19/2011 11:38am
kongols wrote:
With a foam tube out you basically ride on a rim, perhaps even worse.
So he didn't have a tire still on the rim?
morning_stiffy
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9/19/2011 11:41am Edited Date/Time 9/19/2011 11:50am
Lots of people had goggle problems in the first race. Dyngey dtiched his, Reed ditched his, so that's no excuse for Pourcel. The bottom line is USA kicked ass. I'm sick of hearing tue excuses from the Euros after every MXdN, try harder next year.


And all this bullshit about the "top" GP riders being out, how is that our fault? They crashed, and put themselves out. Your "top" guy was there, Antonio Cairoli, he was beat by Dungey straight up in the qualifyers, and Dungey's never raced the track before.

In both motos, Cairoli couldn't keep it on both wheels, he crashed at the start, and then crashed himself out in the same moto. The only people that were able to compete with Dungey this weekend was Reed and Roczen, but if you want to get technical, it's clear after Roczen got close and passed Dungey, he let him go... 1, because he didn't have goggles, and didnt want to get caught in the roost, 2, 3rd place is good for your first moto at the MXdN, no need to try and speed up and risk crashing.

The bottom line is, your top GP rider in the 450s was there and got beat in qualifyers straight up, and crashed himself out of contention in the first moto. Your top GP rider couldn't beat our guys, so what makes you think the guys below him could? In race 2, Villopoto started clear back in 15th and damn near caught Paulin who was in 1st most of the race... Villopoto also had the fastest lap time that race. If he would have gotten a good start like Paulin did, Paulin wouldn't have stood a chance (like how he didn't stand a chance in the qualifyers)

Baggest crashed in both motos and worked his way up. In the 2nd moto he crashed all the way back to 34th, and caught up to 17th. Which isn't bad.

3rd moto, Dungey passed Bobryshev like he was sitting still. Villopoto had some problems, but who cares, he won by a HUGE margin. The Americans were ahead by so far, they had time to wait for each other to cross the finish line together.

Like I said, try harder next year, I hope you win so we don't have to hear the bullshit excuses like we do every year.
kongols
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9/19/2011 11:44am
kongols wrote:
With a foam tube out you basically ride on a rim, perhaps even worse.
lucero10x wrote:
So he didn't have a tire still on the rim?
Are you slow or something? If the foam is out that means at least one side of tire is of the rim. WTF. I`m done here.
kongols
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9/19/2011 11:46am
And there should be no excuses for why USA won. They were superior TEAM. Period.
9/19/2011 11:57am
HIS TIRE WAS OFF THE RIM.

USA had the best team, but didn't dominate.

You don't have to, you just have to win. Last year, they were somewhat lucky, this year they won by give or take 10 points.
peelout
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9/19/2011 12:00pm
pourcel made a gamble to pull over for new goggles in the first moto and it bit him, too bad the flat rear in the second, he was hauling ass
lucero10x
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9/19/2011 12:03pm Edited Date/Time 9/19/2011 12:05pm
kongols wrote:
With a foam tube out you basically ride on a rim, perhaps even worse.
lucero10x wrote:
So he didn't have a tire still on the rim?
kongols wrote:
Are you slow or something? If the foam is out that means at least one side of tire is of the rim. WTF. I`m done here.
I guess I have spent too much time out in the desert beating myself and bikes to death, but when you are out there, there is one quickest way back to the pits and that is on your bike following the trail. So suck it up and get it back in.

Dude needed to finish and I truly believe he could have got that bike back to the pits (I would love to see pics of his rear wheel but it didn't look to me like the tire was completely off the rim). It's sad for him, they probably wouldn't have won, anyway, but at least he would have finished the game.
kongols
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9/19/2011 12:04pm
lucero10x wrote:
I guess I have spent too much time out in the desert beating myself and bikes to death, but when you are out there, there is...
I guess I have spent too much time out in the desert beating myself and bikes to death, but when you are out there, there is one quickest way back to the pits and that is on your bike following the trail. So suck it up and get it back in.

Dude needed to finish and I truly believe he could have got that bike back to the pits (I would love to see pics of his rear wheel but it didn't look to me like the tire was completely off the rim). It's sad for him, they probably wouldn't have won, anyway, but at least he would have finished the game.
Switch
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9/19/2011 12:05pm
Kind of ironic that the best weekend in racing brings out the worst in the fans.

America won, their fans will be happy. Everyone else lost, their fans will make up all kinds of excuses as to why they lost and how the winner got lucky. Happens every year.
lucero10x
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9/19/2011 12:07pm
kongols wrote:
[img]http://i41.tinypic.com/2vb3ec7.jpg[/img]
Haven't you used that one today, already?
9/19/2011 12:08pm
i really cant understand why all you americans are saying that USA dominated... they really didnt, they had to fight for it
9/19/2011 12:10pm
Switch wrote:
Kind of ironic that the best weekend in racing brings out the worst in the fans. America won, their fans will be happy. Everyone else lost...
Kind of ironic that the best weekend in racing brings out the worst in the fans.

America won, their fans will be happy. Everyone else lost, their fans will make up all kinds of excuses as to why they lost and how the winner got lucky. Happens every year.
Yeah, US fans are humble winners, right.
shuggs
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9/19/2011 12:11pm
The only thing it did prove was that USA were able to handle their 'problems' better than anyone else.

Lots of disappointments with a few riders (Musquin wtf???) but this is MX and the only guarantee is that you are gonna have a problem at SOMETIME.

You could start a list of which teams had what problems but it dont change the result (sadly)
Tbteam
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9/19/2011 12:22pm
Combining Saturday and Sunday, The US went 1-1-1-1-2-3-3-17-17

With any "luck" as you guys put it, Baggett easily runs top 8 either moto and the rest of the world looks like... well, like you look every year come time for the MXdN.

Luck goes both ways. We won it decisively. Look at the final points. It wasn't close after the third moto.
FastEddy
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9/19/2011 12:38pm Edited Date/Time 9/19/2011 12:44pm
Bobryshev is hardcore!
He has single-handedly put Russia back on the map in the World of Moto.
The guy was a great starter all weekend and great at the beginning of every race he rode.
He proved that he wants to do well and he wants to win.
I hope he trains his ass off during the off-season (and stays away from his moms cooking lol) and comes back and battles AC & Desalle for the World Championship next year. I got a feeling those are gonna be the Top 3 MX1 guys next year in the GP's. Wink
Only time will tell though.

I would also like to see what he could do with a decent ride here in the States.
Or just maybe even come over for a national or 2....maybe at a place like Dilla or Washougal.
He seemed to also do very well at the USGP...I think he got a podium.
I'm definitely a fan us his...after watching him do well in some GP's this year and also standing out at the MXoN at the beginning of every one of his races.
lucero10x
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9/19/2011 12:45pm
Bobryshev did absolutely kill it!
Switch
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9/19/2011 12:49pm Edited Date/Time 9/19/2011 12:49pm
Switch wrote:
Kind of ironic that the best weekend in racing brings out the worst in the fans. America won, their fans will be happy. Everyone else lost...
Kind of ironic that the best weekend in racing brings out the worst in the fans.

America won, their fans will be happy. Everyone else lost, their fans will make up all kinds of excuses as to why they lost and how the winner got lucky. Happens every year.
brakkeman_ wrote:
Yeah, US fans are humble winners, right.
Most Americans aren't humble in victory, just as most Euro's aren't humble in defeat.

Just following your logic...
Titan1
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9/19/2011 12:50pm Edited Date/Time 9/19/2011 1:05pm
Tbteam wrote:
Combining Saturday and Sunday, The US went 1-1-1-1-2-3-3-17-17 With any "luck" as you guys put it, Baggett easily runs top 8 either moto and the rest...
Combining Saturday and Sunday, The US went 1-1-1-1-2-3-3-17-17

With any "luck" as you guys put it, Baggett easily runs top 8 either moto and the rest of the world looks like... well, like you look every year come time for the MXdN.

Luck goes both ways. We won it decisively. Look at the final points. It wasn't close after the third moto.
That's a whole bunch of top 3's there.

I NEVER would have guessed Baggett would have been outside the top 15 ONCE let alone twice! I thought that even on a bad moto he'd of been inside the top 10 (with the possibility to be top 3 or 5 in the other), and had he done that in even one of his moto's it would have been a different story going into the last moto.
1-forty-8
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9/19/2011 12:54pm
lucero10x wrote:
Bobryshev did absolutely kill it!
And he's still hurt! Imagine if he was healthy. He could of stole a moto.He had the second fastest lap time to RV in the mx1/mx3 race.

And yes the MXoN did prove something.

It proved motocross is the greatest sport on the planet.

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