CA 2 stroke ban

Permeance_Flux wrote:

Thanks for the response. Just to be clear, CARB wasn’t involved with registration in the past but they will be going forward in 22? Is that...

Thanks for the response.

Just to be clear, CARB wasn’t involved with registration in the past but they will be going forward in 22? Is that correct?

greenmx5 wrote:

I don't understand why anyone would want to live in California. You give all your money to taxes, so many restrictions, mask mandate and lockdowns galore...

I don't understand why anyone would want to live in California. You give all your money to taxes, so many restrictions, mask mandate and lockdowns galore, run by piss poor leadership, and you can't ride two strokes. What a dumpster fire.

sandhills wrote:

Our property taxes are lower than yours.

WhipMeister wrote:

Yeaahhhhh. Maybe. (Clever). But of course you know that the total tax burden is so far out of the stratosphere you'd need retro rockets and Elon...

Yeaahhhhh. Maybe. (Clever). But of course you know that the total tax burden is so far out of the stratosphere you'd need retro rockets and Elon Musk's booster recovery system to land.

WhipMeister wrote:

Yeaahhhhh. Maybe. (Clever). But of course you know that the total tax burden is so far out of the stratosphere you'd need retro rockets and Elon...

Yeaahhhhh. Maybe. (Clever). But of course you know that the total tax burden is so far out of the stratosphere you'd need retro rockets and Elon Musk's booster recovery system to land.

sandhills wrote:

It's a couple percent difference in tax burden, it really isn't the major factor you think it is. The reason California is critically unaffordable is the...

It's a couple percent difference in tax burden, it really isn't the major factor you think it is. The reason California is critically unaffordable is the property values and the knock on effects of that (If you want to hire an electrician, pay utilities, whatever it is you also have pay for them to be able afford the crazy property values). The reason the property values are astronomical is desirability, supply and demand.

TeamGreen wrote:

There is no "Carb Inspection" when you go to the DMV with a bike that has a...say...2009 frame. Especially if you get the title with the...

There is no "Carb Inspection" when you go to the DMV with a bike that has a...say...2009 frame. Especially if you get the title with the old frame. You just re-register it/re-title it as the new owner (I've seen this done).

Also, if you are going register the bike anew with the new motor in the old frame? You usually go to CHP to have them validate the frame # and they can help with how to "handle" the engine ID issue. A lot of those guys are on your side, too.

Permeance_Flux wrote:

Thanks for the response. Just to be clear, CARB wasn’t involved with registration in the past but they will be going forward in 22? Is that...

Thanks for the response.

Just to be clear, CARB wasn’t involved with registration in the past but they will be going forward in 22? Is that correct?

Brad460 wrote:

CA priorities seems a bit off...going after 2 strokes. [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2021/07/28/503273/s1200_CA_oil_depend.jpg[/img]

CA priorities seems a bit off...going after 2 strokes.

Alan Dove wrote:

I live in England, and even I want to move out of California.

swatdoc wrote:

I just picked up a '22 150SX. The dealer informed me of the new law but I didn't care. I only ride/race MX on a track...

I just picked up a '22 150SX. The dealer informed me of the new law but I didn't care. I only ride/race MX on a track. I've never really been interested in trail or other types of riding. When I was a kid there were lots of "tracks" to ride on around where I lived (Oceanside, CA) - they were just tracks we made that were located on someone's private property. Now all those places are gone - Home Depots, strip malls, etc. So for me, a race track is the only place to go. So the new law doesn't affect me right now. I do feel for all you guys who do the other types of off road riding though. I love California in general - but crap like this, the gun laws here, the liberals, definitely take away from the appeal for sure.

sandhills wrote:

Give us an update if you don't mind sharing when you find out what you do or don't get from the DMV. There are some rumors...

Give us an update if you don't mind sharing when you find out what you do or don't get from the DMV. There are some rumors of people having red stickers arrive in the mail anyway.

moto711 wrote:

Lets just say I know someone that has a 22 KTM 250f ;) and received a red sticker in the mail 2 weeks after purchase. I'm...

Lets just say I know someone that has a 22 KTM 250f and received a red sticker in the mail 2 weeks after purchase. I'm sure it will take years for the DMV/CA to catch up with their own rules. My dad always talks about when the green/red sticker changes went into effect he and many of his friends received green stickers on red sticker bikes for years as the state has no clue what they are doing.

sandhills wrote:

Yes, it is a misplaced priority to pursue two stroke emissions. But it's done on air quality grounds, not oil consumption. The two should be compared...

Yes, it is a misplaced priority to pursue two stroke emissions. But it's done on air quality grounds, not oil consumption. The two should be compared, but if you ask CARB the relevant body here they could give a shit about oil, carbon emissions, or climate change because as long as it's all clean co2 it's not an air quality issue.

This graph is sort of cherry picked to make a point, which point exactly isn't clear but just some kind of general critical view I guess. There are some valid ones and then some nonsensical ones thrown in for effect.

1. California gets 73% of energy from fossil fuel. Uh, pretty standard there. Only states doing better are hydro states.

2. California oil production / oil consumption ratio a bit under one third. Ok, also pretty standard, higher than many other states. Only the real production states like Texas, Gulf Coast, and North Dakota are going to flip that ratio.

3. "Energy Island" The lack of oil pipelines is true, but it's sort of a west coast thing up and down. While there has been political resistance to them it is also economically difficult to pipe oil across the expansive west. Graphic intentionally ignores the fact that we do have Natural gas pipelines, which comprise a significant percentage of our 73% fossil fuels.

4. Top 5 Foreign Oil Sources - Ok, this is just a list of countries that sell oil. Oh my god oil comes from the middle east! Who knew?! The numbers are 34.9% California 17.6% Alaska 47.5% Foreign.

I know this will get reflexive thumbs downs because it looks like a defense but it's not, it's just better to know the players and the game.

sandhills wrote:

Yes, it is a misplaced priority to pursue two stroke emissions. But it's done on air quality grounds, not oil consumption. The two should be compared...

Yes, it is a misplaced priority to pursue two stroke emissions. But it's done on air quality grounds, not oil consumption. The two should be compared, but if you ask CARB the relevant body here they could give a shit about oil, carbon emissions, or climate change because as long as it's all clean co2 it's not an air quality issue.

This graph is sort of cherry picked to make a point, which point exactly isn't clear but just some kind of general critical view I guess. There are some valid ones and then some nonsensical ones thrown in for effect.

1. California gets 73% of energy from fossil fuel. Uh, pretty standard there. Only states doing better are hydro states.

2. California oil production / oil consumption ratio a bit under one third. Ok, also pretty standard, higher than many other states. Only the real production states like Texas, Gulf Coast, and North Dakota are going to flip that ratio.

3. "Energy Island" The lack of oil pipelines is true, but it's sort of a west coast thing up and down. While there has been political resistance to them it is also economically difficult to pipe oil across the expansive west. Graphic intentionally ignores the fact that we do have Natural gas pipelines, which comprise a significant percentage of our 73% fossil fuels.

4. Top 5 Foreign Oil Sources - Ok, this is just a list of countries that sell oil. Oh my god oil comes from the middle east! Who knew?! The numbers are 34.9% California 17.6% Alaska 47.5% Foreign.

I know this will get reflexive thumbs downs because it looks like a defense but it's not, it's just better to know the players and the game.

Brad460 wrote:

This is about emissions from fossil fuels and another “feel good” action on an easy target..Now they can say- oh we are so environmentally conscious we...

This is about emissions from fossil fuels and another “feel good” action on an easy target..Now they can say- oh we are so environmentally conscious we banned 2 strokes..

In reality it’s just another ridiculous regulation...regulations are one main reason everything is so damn expensive in CA..(including housing)..

Meanwhile importing oil from countries with no regulations...You know, out of sight out of mind.

CA has simply pushed their emissions on to other states/countries so they can feel good and pretend to be green..

Just like banning natural gas hook-up on new construction- that actually results in more use of fossil fuel (e.g. using electric versus natural gas- You burn more natural gas to produce electricity to power a hot water heater, than to just heat water with natural gas)..But it sure feels good..

moto711 wrote:

Lets just say I know someone that has a 22 KTM 250f ;) and received a red sticker in the mail 2 weeks after purchase. I'm...

Lets just say I know someone that has a 22 KTM 250f and received a red sticker in the mail 2 weeks after purchase. I'm sure it will take years for the DMV/CA to catch up with their own rules. My dad always talks about when the green/red sticker changes went into effect he and many of his friends received green stickers on red sticker bikes for years as the state has no clue what they are doing.

sandhills wrote:

The last time it happened I think it was 98-2002 bikes that were supposed to be red stickered, and they ended up getting grandfathered in as...

The last time it happened I think it was 98-2002 bikes that were supposed to be red stickered, and they ended up getting grandfathered in as green sticker in the end. Hopefully the same will happen now, but it's quite a gamble to make still that they don't actually just end up revoking the stickers.

Brad460 wrote:

CA priorities seems a bit off...going after 2 strokes. [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2021/07/28/503273/s1200_CA_oil_depend.jpg[/img]

CA priorities seems a bit off...going after 2 strokes.

sandhills wrote:

Yes, it is a misplaced priority to pursue two stroke emissions. But it's done on air quality grounds, not oil consumption. The two should be compared...

Yes, it is a misplaced priority to pursue two stroke emissions. But it's done on air quality grounds, not oil consumption. The two should be compared, but if you ask CARB the relevant body here they could give a shit about oil, carbon emissions, or climate change because as long as it's all clean co2 it's not an air quality issue.

This graph is sort of cherry picked to make a point, which point exactly isn't clear but just some kind of general critical view I guess. There are some valid ones and then some nonsensical ones thrown in for effect.

1. California gets 73% of energy from fossil fuel. Uh, pretty standard there. Only states doing better are hydro states.

2. California oil production / oil consumption ratio a bit under one third. Ok, also pretty standard, higher than many other states. Only the real production states like Texas, Gulf Coast, and North Dakota are going to flip that ratio.

3. "Energy Island" The lack of oil pipelines is true, but it's sort of a west coast thing up and down. While there has been political resistance to them it is also economically difficult to pipe oil across the expansive west. Graphic intentionally ignores the fact that we do have Natural gas pipelines, which comprise a significant percentage of our 73% fossil fuels.

4. Top 5 Foreign Oil Sources - Ok, this is just a list of countries that sell oil. Oh my god oil comes from the middle east! Who knew?! The numbers are 34.9% California 17.6% Alaska 47.5% Foreign.

I know this will get reflexive thumbs downs because it looks like a defense but it's not, it's just better to know the players and the game.

yota wrote:

you're arguing that calif is no different than other states on these points but the other states aren't pissing and moaning like california and they aren't...

you're arguing that calif is no different than other states on these points but the other states aren't pissing and moaning like california and they aren't driving draconian measures that affect the rest of the states and california is.

yota wrote:

you're arguing that calif is no different than other states on these points but the other states aren't pissing and moaning like california and they aren't...

you're arguing that calif is no different than other states on these points but the other states aren't pissing and moaning like california and they aren't driving draconian measures that affect the rest of the states and california is.

Brad460 wrote:

CA is not like other states when it come to energy...they import 70%+ of their electricity, nearly twice any other state in the country. That electricity...

CA is not like other states when it come to energy...they import 70%+ of their electricity, nearly twice any other state in the country. That electricity comes from coal, natural gas and hydro.

Again, the point is they push off emissions on to others states and then they proclaim to be the leader in emissions reduction.

CA has plenty of their own oil and gas, but regulations have made it impossible to extract...so they pillage everyone else..

JOE_SPROCKETS#1 wrote:

I feel bad for You guys crying about transplanted Cali people. Almost like it is a planned attempt to infect the rest of the US. Jkn...

I feel bad for You guys crying about transplanted Cali people. Almost like it is a planned attempt to infect the rest of the US. Jkn. I would think if they had the balls to move they feel the same way your state does.

TR72Moto wrote:

I talked to my neighbor (called him) Don Amador this morning who works with the Blue Ribbon Coalition and just skimmed over some of the issues...

I talked to my neighbor (called him) Don Amador this morning who works with the Blue Ribbon Coalition and just skimmed over some of the issues, their having a meeting in Sacramento middle of August to iron out somethings because things happened pretty fast but it all actually started end of 2019 beginning 2020, just nobody heard about it until just recently. After the August meeting he said we'll meet and he'll get me the details and information but as it stands now new bikes 2022 are being sold with a M.S.O. (Manufacture Certificate of Origin) nothing else, no green no red stickers. New bikes will eventually be issued a "competition only sticker" so racing, practice before a race, private property, closed course practice tracks is it ! Period ! No green days, no red days just competition. He's going to explain more and in more detail to me once they get through the August get together so I'll pass it along. He did mention one of the issues C.A.R.B. had and specifically mentioned the 300cc bikes, that they sell a boat load of them and 95% are used for play riding and no racing. I had thought/heard they were doing away with the red sticker and green sticker and 2021 and earlier would all be grandfathered in with just a off road sticker but apparently that's not the case, there will still be a red season and a green season but not a red sticker or a green sticker, something new ?? That's one of the things there going to try and iron out come August. So once I find out more and get a good talking to I'll pass the info on but at this point in time it sounds like the water is still a little bit muddy.

burn1986 wrote:

CA just needs new management. Isn’t there a way to just get Newsom and all the cronies outta there? They’re destroying the state.

171motocross wrote:

I’m up here in Coeur d Alene and literally like every other car I see is California. Pisses me off so much lol. Housing market is...

I’m up here in Coeur d Alene and literally like every other car I see is California. Pisses me off so much lol. Housing market is insane and CDA is packed

Spudnut wrote:

SE wa is just as bad. Looking at 350k for a starter home... my cousin manages a home construction company up in cda and says exactly...

SE wa is just as bad. Looking at 350k for a starter home...

my cousin manages a home construction company up in cda and says exactly the same thing

It’s kind of sad seeing the pretty small town I grew up in turn In to a real city with real city problems

burn1986 wrote:

CA just needs new management. Isn’t there a way to just get Newsom and all the cronies outta there? They’re destroying the state.

Falcon wrote:

The recall election is on September 14th. We're going to vote that asshole out! B) (Sadly, I think the recall will fail. Too many people here...

The recall election is on September 14th. We're going to vote that asshole out!


(Sadly, I think the recall will fail. Too many people here are entrenched in one way of thinking and the left has a lock on the state. For good or bad, we're stuck with Democratic elected officials for a long time. I'd prefer some balance, but it is what it is.)

Falcon wrote:

The recall election is on September 14th. We're going to vote that asshole out! B) (Sadly, I think the recall will fail. Too many people here...

The recall election is on September 14th. We're going to vote that asshole out!


(Sadly, I think the recall will fail. Too many people here are entrenched in one way of thinking and the left has a lock on the state. For good or bad, we're stuck with Democratic elected officials for a long time. I'd prefer some balance, but it is what it is.)

MelonFan123 wrote:

I agree, I'll be surprised if the recall goes through. CA has one of the lowest thresholds for qualifications of a recall (only 12% of voting...

I agree, I'll be surprised if the recall goes through. CA has one of the lowest thresholds for qualifications of a recall (only 12% of voting population signatures required)

That being said, i think this has opened people's eyes and we have a better chance of flipping to a Republican Gov in the next general election. I won't be voting for Newsom again, but I sure hope the CA Republicans can bring a better candidate than John Cox or Caitlin Jenner

burn1986 wrote:

CA just needs new management. Isn’t there a way to just get Newsom and all the cronies outta there? They’re destroying the state.

Falcon wrote:

The recall election is on September 14th. We're going to vote that asshole out! B) (Sadly, I think the recall will fail. Too many people here...

The recall election is on September 14th. We're going to vote that asshole out!


(Sadly, I think the recall will fail. Too many people here are entrenched in one way of thinking and the left has a lock on the state. For good or bad, we're stuck with Democratic elected officials for a long time. I'd prefer some balance, but it is what it is.)