Bike Build Electric RMZ

cmotodad
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cmotodad 12/9/2020 6:24pm
12/9/2020 6:24pm Edited Date/Time 12/9/2020 6:24pm
21700's @ 20s 10p. Trying to set up for a easily removable pack. After testing, I will build a couple more if the pack supplies enough power and long enough ride time.
Maico4
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Maico4 12/9/2020 9:34pm
12/9/2020 9:34pm
rivvs wrote:
Little update we finished the bike. weight: 255 lbs but it feels way lighter than that when moving it around.Feels lighter than my ktm. I have...
Little update we finished the bike.
weight: 255 lbs but it feels way lighter than that when moving it around.Feels lighter than my ktm.
I have a lot of tuning but as of now it feels like a 125 but with more power down low.


Nice build, there is a lot of work there. The motor is QS 138-H90, and that is only rated at 20KW. I know you can over drive almost any motor, I've done it, but that motor melted the brush blocks. A ME0909 motor I ran at 400A 48V. It ran good for a while, then 4 or 5 laps and smoke from the motor. It lasted about a year. I upgraded that motor to a ME1004 and it is still running on 2008 KTM SX frame. I am now finishing my build of a 2008YZ F framed E bike. The motor now is a ME1302, it can handle 660A, but I am only supplying 630A at 72V. It is a water cooled motor. I am using a Kelly KLS72701 IPS 8080 controller. The Kelly controller monitors Controller temp and, and motor temp, but not battery temp.
What batteries are you using? I am using Sony 18650 VTC6 20S21P. Your weight is about normal for electrics 255lbs.
My battery packs are quick change. I live in Lake Havasu AZ, and have had it at the track a few times, getting the bugs worked out. My quick change packs are in three packs of 20S7P cells. I only have the 2 installed now, above the motor. The 3rd pack is close to being finished. It will fit in the airbox. The controller sits inside the old gas tank. With the controller limited to 350A now, it is fast, I am anxious to put the full 630 to it soon.
I know how much work goes into one of these. I applaud your work. They are so fun to ride. We will see you at the first all electric race some where, as soon as this Covid thing passes.
I will get a post started about my build with more pictures.

10
StevieTimes
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StevieTimes 12/9/2020 11:40pm
12/9/2020 11:40pm
I was thinking about the clutch thing. I could get used to riding without a clutch, as I don't use mine a ton on my 250F. On the street only I could probably live without one. It's only in the dirt for the whisky throttle that I want it. The clutch has saved me numerous times. I'd LIKE it for other reasons; but I feel like my most important reason is safety.

So how about accomplishing the same task, but slightly differently? What if the "universal set up" became that the right lever (throttle side) was the front brake, like it is on your dirt machine now. The left lever is the back brake; when applied, the first 10mm (or so) of travel pulls the pin away from the throttle engagement. As long as you're pulling in the left brake lever, even a little bit, the throttle does nothing.

When you let off the left lever, you'd have to let off the throttle completely, which lets the pin go over the bump (the pin folds freely one direction), and it re-engages the accelerator again.

I can see this not being desirable for people who like to use the rear brake while on the throttle. It's also another point of failure in the throttle area. It doesn't solve all the wants of a clutch. Still it gives you a little ability to shut it all down.

...or am I overthinking this, and the left bar has an easily reachable toggle button that shuts everything down? Would my body hit the toggle button at some point, or is that a myth? Can I reach the button when I'm out of control?
rivvs
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rivvs 12/10/2020 6:21am
12/10/2020 6:21am
StevieTimes wrote:
I was thinking about the clutch thing. I could get used to riding without a clutch, as I don't use mine a ton on my 250F...
I was thinking about the clutch thing. I could get used to riding without a clutch, as I don't use mine a ton on my 250F. On the street only I could probably live without one. It's only in the dirt for the whisky throttle that I want it. The clutch has saved me numerous times. I'd LIKE it for other reasons; but I feel like my most important reason is safety.

So how about accomplishing the same task, but slightly differently? What if the "universal set up" became that the right lever (throttle side) was the front brake, like it is on your dirt machine now. The left lever is the back brake; when applied, the first 10mm (or so) of travel pulls the pin away from the throttle engagement. As long as you're pulling in the left brake lever, even a little bit, the throttle does nothing.

When you let off the left lever, you'd have to let off the throttle completely, which lets the pin go over the bump (the pin folds freely one direction), and it re-engages the accelerator again.

I can see this not being desirable for people who like to use the rear brake while on the throttle. It's also another point of failure in the throttle area. It doesn't solve all the wants of a clutch. Still it gives you a little ability to shut it all down.

...or am I overthinking this, and the left bar has an easily reachable toggle button that shuts everything down? Would my body hit the toggle button at some point, or is that a myth? Can I reach the button when I'm out of control?
Personnaly It was my first time ridding an electric bike and I felt comfortable right away without a clutch. And if you have a problem you can just reach the killswitch with your thumb.

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rivvs
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rivvs 12/10/2020 6:24am
12/10/2020 6:24am
rivvs wrote:
Little update we finished the bike. weight: 255 lbs but it feels way lighter than that when moving it around.Feels lighter than my ktm. I have...
Little update we finished the bike.
weight: 255 lbs but it feels way lighter than that when moving it around.Feels lighter than my ktm.
I have a lot of tuning but as of now it feels like a 125 but with more power down low.


Maico4 wrote:
Nice build, there is a lot of work there. The motor is QS 138-H90, and that is only rated at 20KW. I know you can over...
Nice build, there is a lot of work there. The motor is QS 138-H90, and that is only rated at 20KW. I know you can over drive almost any motor, I've done it, but that motor melted the brush blocks. A ME0909 motor I ran at 400A 48V. It ran good for a while, then 4 or 5 laps and smoke from the motor. It lasted about a year. I upgraded that motor to a ME1004 and it is still running on 2008 KTM SX frame. I am now finishing my build of a 2008YZ F framed E bike. The motor now is a ME1302, it can handle 660A, but I am only supplying 630A at 72V. It is a water cooled motor. I am using a Kelly KLS72701 IPS 8080 controller. The Kelly controller monitors Controller temp and, and motor temp, but not battery temp.
What batteries are you using? I am using Sony 18650 VTC6 20S21P. Your weight is about normal for electrics 255lbs.
My battery packs are quick change. I live in Lake Havasu AZ, and have had it at the track a few times, getting the bugs worked out. My quick change packs are in three packs of 20S7P cells. I only have the 2 installed now, above the motor. The 3rd pack is close to being finished. It will fit in the airbox. The controller sits inside the old gas tank. With the controller limited to 350A now, it is fast, I am anxious to put the full 630 to it soon.
I know how much work goes into one of these. I applaud your work. They are so fun to ride. We will see you at the first all electric race some where, as soon as this Covid thing passes.
I will get a post started about my build with more pictures.

Right now I am at 450 battery amp and 600 phase amp with no problem. We will see during the summer if it overheat but right now it don't even get warm. My battery is 20s20p molicel p26a.
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Maico4
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Maico4 12/10/2020 9:23am
12/10/2020 9:23am
StevieTimes wrote:
I was thinking about the clutch thing. I could get used to riding without a clutch, as I don't use mine a ton on my 250F...
I was thinking about the clutch thing. I could get used to riding without a clutch, as I don't use mine a ton on my 250F. On the street only I could probably live without one. It's only in the dirt for the whisky throttle that I want it. The clutch has saved me numerous times. I'd LIKE it for other reasons; but I feel like my most important reason is safety.

So how about accomplishing the same task, but slightly differently? What if the "universal set up" became that the right lever (throttle side) was the front brake, like it is on your dirt machine now. The left lever is the back brake; when applied, the first 10mm (or so) of travel pulls the pin away from the throttle engagement. As long as you're pulling in the left brake lever, even a little bit, the throttle does nothing.

When you let off the left lever, you'd have to let off the throttle completely, which lets the pin go over the bump (the pin folds freely one direction), and it re-engages the accelerator again.

I can see this not being desirable for people who like to use the rear brake while on the throttle. It's also another point of failure in the throttle area. It doesn't solve all the wants of a clutch. Still it gives you a little ability to shut it all down.

...or am I overthinking this, and the left bar has an easily reachable toggle button that shuts everything down? Would my body hit the toggle button at some point, or is that a myth? Can I reach the button when I'm out of control?
rivvs wrote:
Personnaly It was my first time ridding an electric bike and I felt comfortable right away without a clutch. And if you have a problem you...
Personnaly It was my first time ridding an electric bike and I felt comfortable right away without a clutch. And if you have a problem you can just reach the killswitch with your thumb.
StevieTime
In most Ebike controllers, even bicycles, there are switches in the brake levers that turn off the motor. On my E dirt bikes I have a smaller lever on the clutch side of the bars, (off an e-bicycle) that engages Regen braking, but also shuts the motor power off. In the Kelly controllers, you can then define how much regen you want. On a moto track it is great, you just keep slowing down using regen and brakes together. Here is a pic of my eKTM
I have the same regen control on my new Yamaha Electric.
4
Bearuno
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Bearuno 12/10/2020 9:36pm
12/10/2020 9:36pm
Maico4 wrote:
StevieTime In most Ebike controllers, even bicycles, there are switches in the brake levers that turn off the motor. On my E dirt bikes I have...
StevieTime
In most Ebike controllers, even bicycles, there are switches in the brake levers that turn off the motor. On my E dirt bikes I have a smaller lever on the clutch side of the bars, (off an e-bicycle) that engages Regen braking, but also shuts the motor power off. In the Kelly controllers, you can then define how much regen you want. On a moto track it is great, you just keep slowing down using regen and brakes together. Here is a pic of my eKTM
I have the same regen control on my new Yamaha Electric.
I've ridden the KTM FreerideE quite a few times during my trips to Europe, and didn't notice that switch ( knowing the picture is Your self made E-KTM).

Perhaps that's why it seemed so controllable?

I've been of the opinion that I really want a Clutch on an E bike, for Safety and more Rider control.

But, as a bloke that has used LHR brakes for decades on his bikes, I can see how such a switch on the brake, might deliver what I want.

Though, I'd still like a clutch. I'm used to 2 levers on the LH side :




I can see how there might have to be some sort of Rev Limiter / Control over the speed of rev rise when you pull in a Clutch on an E Bike - it sure would rev much, much quicker under no load than an ICE bike would! WoohooSillyWoohoo

Could you put up more pictures of your E-KTM, please?
Maico4
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Maico4 12/10/2020 10:08pm
12/10/2020 10:08pm
This is a home made eKTM. It started life as a 2008 KTM 250SX. The lever on the left side on my eKTM is only a switch that turns on Regen braking, not a rear brake. I have a normal rear foot brake on the right. It is too confusing to go back and forth on my gas bikes and the eKTM, having the rear brake on the Left hand side of the bars. But you can control rear braking real well with the regen only. The other plus is the throttle is turned off in the controller when Regen is on.
There is more info on this eKTM build on EVablum #3817. evalbum.com
Bearuno
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Bearuno 12/11/2020 3:02am
12/11/2020 3:02am
Thanks for that link !

Your E-Yamaha not on there? I couldn't find it.

Once a fair few other Bicycle and Motorcycle frames I'm committed to make, and a Sports Sedan Chassis project I'm involved with are done, I hope to find a bit of personal time to do my own E assist bicycle. Damage I've accumulated of the decades has left my pedaling power at around the 5 years olds level. Whistling

Then, with one of my riders being a E vehicle fanatic, and an accomplished Battery Pack maker, and another being an E Tech Master (which I sure as hell am Not) , I'll do a full sized Dirt Bike, using a current (when I / We finally do it) rolling chassis. I've absolutely No interest in a glorified MTB type of E Motorcycle, only a real, full sized bike.
vansnxtweek489 12/11/2020 3:04am
12/11/2020 3:04am
Sweet bike man!! Totally cool.

I’m gonna need you to do up a Suzuki rendition of this!!!


cmotodad
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cmotodad 12/11/2020 4:45pm
12/11/2020 4:45pm
I have ridden Maico4 's YZE bike. At the time he was working out throttle issues but it was very fun to ride. Having also ridden a Alta. the YZE bike had more power than the Alta. Riding 2 and 4 stroke bikes regularly, I look forward to getting my CRFE bike finished and ride some laps with Maico4. His bike was easy to ride and like I said, very fun. Can't wait
Crossup
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Crossup 12/11/2020 8:24pm
12/11/2020 8:24pm
These guys from EVDrive converted a Honda CRF over 11 years ago and I thought it was pretty damn good at the time. Not sure if they're still making a conversion kit or not. They do make some awesome car conversions. Here's the video.

pmessino
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pmessino 8/5/2021 9:27pm
8/5/2021 9:27pm
Do you have a video on this conversion or would you post details how to replicate? I have a 450 with a blown motor. Would be a great father son project.

Looks very cool!
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