Are "WORKS" 250F's coming soon?

nrosso391
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nrosso391
Edited Date/Time 7/27/2018 1:34pm
I can't be the only person who thinks that a WORKS 450 is just a useless, overpriced concept right? I mean the real money of the sport is in the 250 class. Why aren't these Manufacturers making WORKS 250F's? Lets face it, you can run a stock 450 and be competitive since half of the guys can't ride them to their potential. But you CANNOT run a stock 250F and think you're going to be competitive at a Pro-Am trying to get your pro license. I don't know one A rider who hasn't put a minimum of $3K into the engine. Its a sad truth to where our sport has gone. So why wouldn't they offer a mod 250F? That's all they would sell...cha ching$$$$$$$$$$$$
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zehn
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zehn 7/26/2018 6:48am
7/26/2018 6:48am
coastlinecascot wrote:
The works crf450 is completely worth it
Look, I found the Honda employee
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kkawboy14
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kkawboy14 7/26/2018 7:05am
7/26/2018 7:05am
Kawasaki stock 250 is already a Works bike fresh off the showroom floor!
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nrosso391
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nrosso391 7/26/2018 7:13am
7/26/2018 7:13am
eric513anderson wrote:
I’d probably go broke if Yamaha did a something like that for a Star Racing bike
Yeah no kidding! They obviously wouldn't make it as modded as their actual racebikes. But even if it was close i'm sure that bike would cost $15K.
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eric513anderson 7/26/2018 7:15am
7/26/2018 7:15am
eric513anderson wrote:
I’d probably go broke if Yamaha did a something like that for a Star Racing bike
nrosso391 wrote:
Yeah no kidding! They obviously wouldn't make it as modded as their actual racebikes. But even if it was close i'm sure that bike would cost...
Yeah no kidding! They obviously wouldn't make it as modded as their actual racebikes. But even if it was close i'm sure that bike would cost $15K.
A man can dream right? Lol
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kb228
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kb228 7/26/2018 7:20am
7/26/2018 7:20am
Im pretty sure aaron plessinger can hop on a stock 250F and win lorettas dude.
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nrosso391
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nrosso391 7/26/2018 7:59am
7/26/2018 7:59am
kb228 wrote:
Im pretty sure aaron plessinger can hop on a stock 250F and win lorettas dude.
He's talented. You can't take that from him. BUT that bike is about 75% of why he is doing so well. If he was on a tld ktm he would not have the red plate right now.
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mx216
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mx216 7/26/2018 8:01am
7/26/2018 8:01am
kb228 wrote:
Im pretty sure aaron plessinger can hop on a stock 250F and win lorettas dude.
nrosso391 wrote:
He's talented. You can't take that from him. BUT that bike is about 75% of why he is doing so well. If he was on a...
He's talented. You can't take that from him. BUT that bike is about 75% of why he is doing so well. If he was on a tld ktm he would not have the red plate right now.
Lol
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c0ncEpT
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c0ncEpT 7/26/2018 8:02am
7/26/2018 8:02am
kb228 wrote:
Im pretty sure aaron plessinger can hop on a stock 250F and win lorettas dude.
No offence to Aaron but he couldn't even win a moto on a Star bike in the A class in his last year at Lorettas...

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Kyle_McNab
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Kyle_McNab 7/26/2018 8:03am
7/26/2018 8:03am
kb228 wrote:
Im pretty sure aaron plessinger can hop on a stock 250F and win lorettas dude.
nrosso391 wrote:
He's talented. You can't take that from him. BUT that bike is about 75% of why he is doing so well. If he was on a...
He's talented. You can't take that from him. BUT that bike is about 75% of why he is doing so well. If he was on a tld ktm he would not have the red plate right now.
I wouldn’t say it’s that much of an advantage. But they are the strongest 250 outdoor bike hands down. I like both the Martins but I think they would do better on the star bike
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eric513anderson 7/26/2018 8:06am
7/26/2018 8:06am
kb228 wrote:
Im pretty sure aaron plessinger can hop on a stock 250F and win lorettas dude.
c0ncEpT wrote:
No offence to Aaron but he couldn't even win a moto on a Star bike in the A class in his last year at Lorettas...

I’d say it’s called progression.....
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nrosso391
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nrosso391 7/26/2018 8:07am
7/26/2018 8:07am
Kyle_McNab wrote:
I wouldn’t say it’s that much of an advantage. But they are the strongest 250 outdoor bike hands down. I like both the Martins but I...
I wouldn’t say it’s that much of an advantage. But they are the strongest 250 outdoor bike hands down. I like both the Martins but I think they would do better on the star bike
Yes for sure. I would have loved to hear the conversations the Martins had with their new teams when they left Star Yamaha and hopped on their new steeds. They must have said, "WOW...you guys need to find some more power,my Yamaha could eat this POS for breakfast"
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make1go
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make1go 7/26/2018 8:08am
7/26/2018 8:08am
kb228 wrote:
Im pretty sure aaron plessinger can hop on a stock 250F and win lorettas dude.
nrosso391 wrote:
He's talented. You can't take that from him. BUT that bike is about 75% of why he is doing so well. If he was on a...
He's talented. You can't take that from him. BUT that bike is about 75% of why he is doing so well. If he was on a tld ktm he would not have the red plate right now.
so the 75% rider 25% bike (and thats generous) is completely wrong?



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Jeremy Macbeth 7/26/2018 8:09am
7/26/2018 8:09am Edited Date/Time 7/26/2018 8:12am
I don't understand your argument. Even the "Works" 450s don't have truly "works" engine mods. They have works suspension, a pipe and some anodized bling. They don't touch the motors, at least in a "works" sense. No high compression piston. The valves and cam are stock. Maybe an extra special ECU map. Big deal. Hand polished ports are not expensive to do. These bikes are not truly "works" bikes. As we have seen with the factory 250's of late, they are far too sensitive to sell a truly "works" engine to the general public (e.g. polished ports, high compression piston, valves, cam, etc...).

Your argument for cost doesn't make sense either. If people are already putting $3000 into a stock 250 to be competitive, how is that any different than buying a slightly modified "works" 250, which would surely be $2k-$3k over the standard edition?
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nrosso391
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nrosso391 7/26/2018 8:28am
7/26/2018 8:28am
Jeremy Macbeth wrote:
I don't understand your argument. Even the "Works" 450s don't have truly "works" engine mods. They have works suspension, a pipe and some anodized bling. They...
I don't understand your argument. Even the "Works" 450s don't have truly "works" engine mods. They have works suspension, a pipe and some anodized bling. They don't touch the motors, at least in a "works" sense. No high compression piston. The valves and cam are stock. Maybe an extra special ECU map. Big deal. Hand polished ports are not expensive to do. These bikes are not truly "works" bikes. As we have seen with the factory 250's of late, they are far too sensitive to sell a truly "works" engine to the general public (e.g. polished ports, high compression piston, valves, cam, etc...).

Your argument for cost doesn't make sense either. If people are already putting $3000 into a stock 250 to be competitive, how is that any different than buying a slightly modified "works" 250, which would surely be $2k-$3k over the standard edition?
From a business standpoint, "Lets tell them its (WORKS) and we'll get extra $$ from very little modification"

From a consumer standpoint, "These bikes are too expensive to buy and then dump the retail cost of the bike back into mods for the bike to be competitive"

NO I agree with you, they call it "WORKS" but its no where near a fully modded motor or suspension. Hell i'd be fine with them just giving me a mod engine and exhaust and leaving the rest stock.
c0ncEpT
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c0ncEpT 7/26/2018 8:28am
7/26/2018 8:28am
kb228 wrote:
Im pretty sure aaron plessinger can hop on a stock 250F and win lorettas dude.
c0ncEpT wrote:
No offence to Aaron but he couldn't even win a moto on a Star bike in the A class in his last year at Lorettas...

eric513anderson wrote:
I’d say it’s called progression.....
You're right. So why talk about him winning Lorettas now that he's a pro?

What kb228 said doesn't even pertain to this conversation.

If you're on a stock bike in the mod B or A classes at Loretta's your gonna get your clock cleaned no matter who you are.
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TymeMoto
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TymeMoto 7/26/2018 8:31am
7/26/2018 8:31am
Honestly ML512 sold me on the crf450 works than Honda ever could. To go through the differences in parts and explain the individual price differences of them compared to the overall price of the works edition and then to do a ride review with full analysis of power delivery and suspension was incredible.
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fourfourone
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fourfourone 7/26/2018 8:39am
7/26/2018 8:39am
think about if a company hopped up the motor and made a works bike. You would have a ton of people buying them and then get pissed when the motor pops because they didn't maintain the motor like a true race motor.
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nrosso391
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nrosso391 7/26/2018 8:43am
7/26/2018 8:43am
fourfourone wrote:
think about if a company hopped up the motor and made a works bike. You would have a ton of people buying them and then get...
think about if a company hopped up the motor and made a works bike. You would have a ton of people buying them and then get pissed when the motor pops because they didn't maintain the motor like a true race motor.
^^^^
Also true!
Honda Man 66 7/26/2018 8:46am
7/26/2018 8:46am
Those “works” 250’s are time bombs. I am not sure anyone wants to sell a production bike with a 5 hour life span.
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nrosso391
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nrosso391 7/26/2018 8:50am
7/26/2018 8:50am
Honda Man 66 wrote:
Those “works” 250’s are time bombs. I am not sure anyone wants to sell a production bike with a 5 hour life span.
Yes a TRUE WORKS bike is a time bomb for sure. But I'm talking about the "WORKS" ones there selling the public which have just enough mods for you to spend the money to own it.
Honda Man 66 7/26/2018 8:56am
7/26/2018 8:56am
Honda Man 66 wrote:
Those “works” 250’s are time bombs. I am not sure anyone wants to sell a production bike with a 5 hour life span.
nrosso391 wrote:
Yes a TRUE WORKS bike is a time bomb for sure. But I'm talking about the "WORKS" ones there selling the public which have just enough...
Yes a TRUE WORKS bike is a time bomb for sure. But I'm talking about the "WORKS" ones there selling the public which have just enough mods for you to spend the money to own it.
I hear you.
Maybe there should be a better name for these bikes. Maybe the “Poser” edition.
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Arrowangel 7/26/2018 8:56am
7/26/2018 8:56am
nrosso391 wrote:
I can't be the only person who thinks that a WORKS 450 is just a useless, overpriced concept right? I mean the real money of the...
I can't be the only person who thinks that a WORKS 450 is just a useless, overpriced concept right? I mean the real money of the sport is in the 250 class. Why aren't these Manufacturers making WORKS 250F's? Lets face it, you can run a stock 450 and be competitive since half of the guys can't ride them to their potential. But you CANNOT run a stock 250F and think you're going to be competitive at a Pro-Am trying to get your pro license. I don't know one A rider who hasn't put a minimum of $3K into the engine. Its a sad truth to where our sport has gone. So why wouldn't they offer a mod 250F? That's all they would sell...cha ching$$$$$$$$$$$$
well, i thought KTM had a factory edition 250F.... isn't that ''works'' enough?
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nrosso391
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nrosso391 7/26/2018 9:01am
7/26/2018 9:01am
Arrowangel wrote:
well, i thought KTM had a factory edition 250F.... isn't that ''works'' enough?
Laughing That's cute. An exhaust system, and graphics...really?
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Johnny Depp
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Johnny Depp 7/26/2018 9:08am
7/26/2018 9:08am Edited Date/Time 7/26/2018 9:08am
This issue highlights a big problem with the sport.

Why spend more $, end up with something far less reliable, just to have a chance of being competitive in the 250f class, and run the same lap times as 2t's and 450's?
mxtech1
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mxtech1 7/26/2018 9:13am
7/26/2018 9:13am
By your explanation of a "works" bike - you are asking for a mildly modified 250F.

Yamaha - GYTR
Kawi - Pro Circuit race package
KTM/Husky - Factory Editions & KTM Factory Services (I believe no longer around though)
Honda - Works 450 & I believe they will follow suite with a 250F

What I am getting at - you can already obtain what you are asking for. Order a bike from PC and tell them you want it a race package. Buy a Yamaha and have the dealership install the optional GYTR go-fast parts.Etc.

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BroFoSho
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BroFoSho 7/26/2018 9:31am
7/26/2018 9:31am Edited Date/Time 7/26/2018 9:33am
nrosso391 wrote:
Yes a TRUE WORKS bike is a time bomb for sure. But I'm talking about the "WORKS" ones there selling the public which have just enough...
Yes a TRUE WORKS bike is a time bomb for sure. But I'm talking about the "WORKS" ones there selling the public which have just enough mods for you to spend the money to own it.
Anything that substantially increases performance either costs a lot and/or reduces reliability.
When you starting adding aggressive cams, timing and pistons you're riding a grenade with the pin already pulled. Plus it would be a race gas only motor. When adding fancy kit suspension and electronics, you've nearly doubled the price of the motorcycle (not to mention if you don't know how to set it up, its no better than stock stuff).

So either the "fake works" bikes you are talking about are, in reality, only marginally better than a stock bike and won't effect finishing results. Or a real one will cost $15,000 and will require a rebuild twice a month.
make1go
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make1go 7/26/2018 9:32am
7/26/2018 9:32am
think the "A kit like" forks on production bikes they are sperming out atm.

well gotta do something to cover the we dont want to provide springs (they are $) so AIR is muc much betterer, marketing ploy they used..
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