Acromioclavicular seperation how many of you have had this?/New helmet question (page 2, bottom.)

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3/20/2020 2:35 PM

So, to preface this a little, I'll give you the full story.
With work being shut down and my brand new bike sitting in the shop never ridden I decided to take it out and go for a ride. Fast forward, I decide I want to take "one more lap" (should have realized that was a bad idea) on this last lap I'm going through a section of whoops and bam my head and shoulder are stuffed into the ground. I pick the bike up feel a sharp pain in my shoulder, then felt my clavicle poking up.
Fast forward again, I go to the ER, get and xray, and talk to the doctor who informs me I have an AC joint seperation. He doesn't tell me what grade (I'm guessing grade 3) and sets me up with a referral to talk with a surgeon. I have an appointment with said surgeon this monday at 9am.
Now, the reason I tell you this is I would like to hear some of your experiences with this injury and your rehab. I've seen many many differing recoveries and fixes for this.
Let me know, please!
P.S. the bike is fine still looking pretty, she has my shoulder to thank for that!

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3/20/2020 2:52 PM

I just had a grade 3 separation in September. If it is grade 1 or 2 it will heal on it's own. Grade 3, all 3 ligaments are torn totally in half. Amazingly, most people only do therapy and function again. Mine was grade 3 and my shoulder was very loose. I asked my surgeon if it would always be loose and he said yes. IF you can get it fixed within the first 21 days (or something like that), the original ligaments can kinda scar back together. I had surgery. My shoulder feels solid and relatively normal. It is strange, in STL they have deferred all elective surgeries, so if this had happened to me this week, I'm not sure i could get it fixed. From what i gathered, people have relatively good functional outcomes with or without surgery, I just wanted mine to feel "normal" so I got it fixed. Good luck.

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Motocross....a once in a lifetime experience....every weekend.

3/20/2020 2:57 PM

mxjeff575 wrote:

I just had a grade 3 separation in September. If it is grade 1 or 2 it will heal on it's own. Grade 3, all 3 ligaments are torn totally in half. Amazingly, most people only do therapy and function again. Mine was grade 3 and my shoulder was very loose. I asked my surgeon if it would always be loose and he said yes. IF you can get it fixed within the first 21 days (or something like that), the original ligaments can kinda scar back together. I had surgery. My shoulder feels solid and relatively normal. It is strange, in STL they have deferred all elective surgeries, so if this had happened to me this week, I'm not sure i could get it fixed. From what i gathered, people have relatively good functional outcomes with or without surgery, I just wanted mine to feel "normal" so I got it fixed. Good luck.

Thank you!
At this point, I think it's still a go if they decide I need it. Hospital here is definitely not overwhelmed, yet. Within a week, or two, it might be a different story.
You say it feels loose? Is this an annoyance day to day, or do you not even feel it? Also, how long was your recovery?

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3/20/2020 3:01 PM

Was always told if I didn't want to re-tear anything fixed don't get it done. I did both of mine separate times and brace to keep moving it for a few weeks and then some rehab and back doing what I was doing before. That's my advise and my opinion but do what works best for you.

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3/20/2020 3:06 PM

Mine felt "loose" after the crash and before i had the surgery to fix it. Like my entire shoulder area was "floppy". Instead of feeling solidly attached to my body, it felt loose. After surgery and recovery, it feels normal (just like before). It should have been a 3 month recovery, but i rode again at 2.5 months. I'm at 5.5 months post op, and it feels great !!!

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Motocross....a once in a lifetime experience....every weekend.

3/20/2020 3:10 PM
Edited Date/Time: 3/20/2020 3:11 PM

I have a grade 3, opted not to get the surgery. It still grinds and clicks and sticks out and I can move it around, but I have zero pain and full ROM after 4 years

Best thing you can do is ice it for the first few days and rest it for awhile and then once it starts to feel better just jump right into the PT exercises and start building. Try to avoid heavy overheard lifting/pressing as that puts forces directly on the injured area.

This video helped me big time, I did all the PT bands exercises every day for at least a month and I really felt it helped my shoulder a ton.



Try to go to a physical therapist just once if you can, they'll show you some cool stuff. It's a very common injury and there are lots of great ways to improve shoulder/scapula stability which is important with an AC separation.


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3/20/2020 3:12 PM

Mr. Info wrote:

Was always told if I didn't want to re-tear anything fixed don't get it done. I did both of mine separate times and brace to keep moving it for a few weeks and then some rehab and back doing what I was doing before. That's my advise and my opinion but do what works best for you.

What grade of tear did you have? What kind of braces? And how long till you were functioning "normally" again?

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3/20/2020 3:15 PM

patrickadizzle wrote:

I have a grade 3, opted not to get the surgery. It still grinds and clicks and sticks out and I can move it around, but I have zero pain and full ROM after 4 years

Best thing you can do is ice it for the first few days and rest it for awhile and then once it starts to feel better just jump right into the PT exercises and start building. Try to avoid heavy overheard lifting/pressing as that puts forces directly on the injured area.

This video helped me big time, I did all the PT bands exercises every day for at least a month and I really felt it helped my shoulder a ton.



Try to go to a physical therapist just once if you can, they'll show you some cool stuff. It's a very common injury and there are lots of great ways to improve shoulder/scapula stability which is important with an AC separation.


Good video. I work for a gym and happen to know quite a few physical therapists, so I've been talking to one in particular since last night. I'm glad that it seems like I'm going the right direction, already.

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3/20/2020 3:23 PM
Edited Date/Time: 3/20/2020 3:25 PM

I had a grade 3 class 4 separation and didn’t get surgery. I was off the moto and couldn’t race mtbs for close to 5 months. The shoulder felt loose and I had to get use to the movement but within a year I was back to full strength. 16 years later and it feels solid.. not much movement in the AC joint and range of motion is 90%

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3/20/2020 4:24 PM

I busted 6 ribs, collapsed lung, torn peck, AC separation. Honestly not what you wanna hear but the shoulder was probably the most painful part, other than the occasional uncontrollable cough that obviously killed the ribs.

I left hospital undiagnosed at hospital on shoulder. Followed up with a second ortho who knew right away. They kept tossing around 2 grading tiers, one was 1-3 and other was 1-6. Mine was a “5” once They finally got me an MRI. They elected to send me to PT.

PT couldn’t believe I could even move my arm but it was all trap doing it. I was back riding with KT tape at 6.5 weeks, racing just shy of 8. I have a very pronounced lump where the clavicle is not down in the shoulder properly. I have full range of motion and no issues really. Every once in a while if I open a door by twisting the knob with that arm near my belly button and then push the door open, I notice my shoulder. Like laying your forearm across your stomach then swinging the door open from that point.

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3/20/2020 4:32 PM

I've had 5, all of em minor. Never had surgery just tried to work through the pain.

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3/20/2020 4:36 PM

Grade 4 here... Had it fixed and it became stronger than ever. Dr said if I didn't repair it, rotator cuff would suffer down the road. 6 weeks sling, 6 weeks PT. The secret is in the PT, you gotta bust your ass to get full range back!

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3/20/2020 6:22 PM

I’ve had AC separation on both shoulders. One diagnosed by doc and the other pretty much knew what happened. For treatment I just tried my best to push thru the pain and get range of motion and strength back as much Possible. Took about 2 months to feel normal again. Today they pop a bit when swinging my arms around full rotate but it’s nothing painful or anything I can’t live through. I will say my shoulders hang a bit lower than they used to, looks kinda cool in the mirror I guess

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3/21/2020 9:03 AM

Thank you for all the feedback everyone. You have all put my mind at ease.
I guess of all times for this to happen, right now would be the best. My only big worry right now is being able to work. I work as a personal trainer and have to be able to move properly. Luckily, I also work with some PT's. So I'll be talking to them a lot.

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3/21/2020 9:08 AM

I had a grade 4 it healed on its own without surgery. About 20 years later I had to get the rotator cuff fixed in that shoulder and that's when everything went horribly wrong. The dumbass surgeon totally disconnected my shoulder during the operation and then I had to have another operation to fix that.
Photo

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3/21/2020 9:11 AM

be glad it wasnt a labrum, bicep, and rotator cuff. those suck

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3/21/2020 9:21 AM

fatpurplepanda wrote:

be glad it wasnt a labrum, bicep, and rotator cuff. those suck

The operation to put my shoulder back together was extremely painful, they had to remove a bunch of bone due to the old injury to make things fit back together right. it was definitely the most painful surgery I ever had. And now there's noticeable difference in the width of my shoulders, after a full year of physical therapy they pretty much said there's nothing more they can do for me. my doctor strongly suggested that I never fall on that shoulder again. the operation they did to fix it has a 70% failure rate.

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3/21/2020 9:30 AM

I had one and had to have pins. It left a pretty big scar, but doesn't bother me.

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Take it to the limit, one more time!

3/21/2020 1:30 PM

I just had a grade 3 bordering grade 5 AC separation 7 weeks ago from a bad snowboarding fall. I read all the info on how most DR’s say wait a few months to see how it heals on its own. The DR I went to said that is a good option but, if I do need surgery at that time, it’s much more invasive and has a higher failure rate than if I just get the surgery within 3 weeks of the accident. So, I decided on having surgery 1 week after the fall. That was 6 weeks ago. I had the surgery and then wore a sling for 6 weeks to let the tendons heal. I have been without the sling for 2.5 days and can already raise my arm about 45 degrees above horizontal.

The first four weeks after surgery I was not supposed to move my arm at all, and had no physical therapy. Week 5 and 6 I started PT where I still was not supposed to use my muscles but could lift my arm assisted up to 90 degrees. I’m on week 7 and now I have no dr restricted movements but am only allowed to pick up objects up to about 2 pounds for 6 weeks. After that I will start strength training.

i can tell already rhat I will be close to normal by the time I see the dr again in 6 weeks.

My surgery was not painful at all. They gave me this nerve blocker before surgery and I had to leave it in for 4 days after surgery. https://myon-q.com it’s a nerve blocker that removes all pain. After the medicine ran out after 4 days, I had no pain at all.

I’m super happy with my decision to have surgery even though it seems most people don’t have it.


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3/21/2020 3:27 PM

I had a grade 3 to 5 ac separation in 2016 and chose to have surgery. I’m very happy with the results and the decision to have the surgery. My doctor and I decided to put a cadaver tendon to take place of the torn ligaments and also installed a Kevlar piece to stabilize the injury while the cadaver tendon healed into place. I crash tested the same shoulder 5 months ago and it held strong. Took a hard enough hit to break my shoulder blade but did not re-injure the AC joint. Pic below illustrates the repair that was made. Photo

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3/21/2020 3:41 PM

Got hit by a car while bicycling 13 years ago at age 29, grade 2 AC separation and some other stuff. Rest, PT and was fine eventually. Honestly it was probably a full year before it felt “right” but no surgery was required. Good luck!

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3/21/2020 4:02 PM

Rocket164 wrote:

I had a grade 3 to 5 ac separation in 2016 and chose to have surgery. I’m very happy with the results and the decision to have the surgery. My doctor and I decided to put a cadaver tendon to take place of the torn ligaments and also installed a Kevlar piece to stabilize the injury while the cadaver tendon healed into place. I crash tested the same shoulder 5 months ago and it held strong. Took a hard enough hit to break my shoulder blade but did not re-injure the AC joint. Pic below illustrates the repair that was made. Photo

that's how they put everything back into place for me, I don't think I got that pen like you though. The used the cadaver tendon on me also.

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3/21/2020 6:59 PM

So, I got my xray results back. I have a grade 5 seperation. My AC distance is 17mm and my CC distance is 35mm

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3/21/2020 7:59 PM
Edited Date/Time: 3/21/2020 8:05 PM

This is the specific procedure I just had My surgery was one week after the separation so my temdons will heal back and less hardware is needed than if you wait for more than three weeks.
Photo

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3/21/2020 8:04 PM

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3/21/2020 8:45 PM

fatpurplepanda wrote:

be glad it wasnt a labrum, bicep, and rotator cuff. those suck

I am going through those 3 problems right now, and yeah, they absolutely suck, no doubt

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3/21/2020 11:14 PM

I had my AC joint repaired in 1981 after suffering multiple separations because the ligaments were wasted from the first separation. I could grab my collar bone and move it up and down and back and forth a lot! I did a experimental surgery which used a synthetic ligament that showed promise with foot ball players. I am turning 58 soon and it is still holding up. My point of this post is I believe that a grade 3 separation will need to be fixed sooner or later. Listen to your doctor and get a second opinion. I believe that if I would have gotten mine fixed right away I would have been much better off. Good luck.

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3/22/2020 5:26 AM
Edited Date/Time: 3/22/2020 5:27 AM

CR92 - I can't stress this enough. Don't ask a bunch of moto guys for health advice. Most of us will tell you you to tape it up, suck it up, and finish the moto! LOL.

Seriously though, DON'T START MOVING THAT SHOULDER AROUND TOO MUCH. You could have ligament damage. Go to your regular doc and get an MRI script. X-rays won't tell you much.

I'm still healing from a big getoff in October. AC separation (grade 3), SLAP tear, & super-massive full thickness tear in the top rotator ligament with retraction. Had surgery in Dec.

IMO...isolate that sucker from movement, LOTS of ice therapy, and get a good ortho doc to look at an MRI.

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3/23/2020 8:19 AM

SCAM124 wrote:

CR92 - I can't stress this enough. Don't ask a bunch of moto guys for health advice. Most of us will tell you you to tape it up, suck it up, and finish the moto! LOL.

Seriously though, DON'T START MOVING THAT SHOULDER AROUND TOO MUCH. You could have ligament damage. Go to your regular doc and get an MRI script. X-rays won't tell you much.

I'm still healing from a big getoff in October. AC separation (grade 3), SLAP tear, & super-massive full thickness tear in the top rotator ligament with retraction. Had surgery in Dec.

IMO...isolate that sucker from movement, LOTS of ice therapy, and get a good ortho doc to look at an MRI.

Scam124, the reason I started this topic was to see what others experiences were. I learned long ago that some people have the mentality of "just rub some dirt in it" and others have the mentality of "I need to meet with 19 surgeons, have 3 PT's, and a home nurse for my sprained pinky". That said, on this specific topic I started there has actually been some solid advice, yours included.
Currently I am moving it around as much as I've been told to do. I'm very lucky to have a few friends who are physical therapist's and have a few clients who are in the health care field who have given me things to do to help my situation.
Also, I have an appointment today to talk with an ortho surgeon today.
Thank you for the solid advice, too.

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3/23/2020 8:24 AM

On top of all this, I also got a concussion and destroyed my helmet. So, time to get a new one!
I'm currently looking at the fox v3 and v2, bell helmets, and LS2. I've chosen these helmets because they all seem to have good protection and comfort wise, I like them. If something is uncomfortable, I'm more likely to crash
Questions for you guys:
1. Is there much of a difference between the v2 and v3? Aside from the look and "fluid" stuff?
2. What is the order of quality for bell helmets? Their line up is confusing to me.
3. How many have you used the LS2 subverter? I see reviews and they're either that the helmet is the greatest thing ever, or they're "ok"

Any thoughts are appreciated.

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