350 2T ?

Sly_mx15
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Sly_mx15
Hi ! In the past, there was 125, 250 and 500 2T. Now, no more 500. I know it was too much power, vibrations...
But instead of kill them, they could downsizing them like a 350. Because big guys are wide open with a 250.
Brands like KTM, TM make a 250 and a 300. I think the difference is not enough. A 350 could make a good torque.
I know 450 4T is the best machine, but i speak for 2T lovers (cheaper, ligther and funnier)
A 350 could be good for enduro where we still see 2T...
What do you think about it ?
|
a22
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a22 6/15/2016 1:18pm
6/15/2016 1:18pm Edited Date/Time 6/15/2016 1:20pm
KTM already did it in the 90's, think it was a 380 or 360, think Trampas Parker may also have rode one in the GPs.
From what I heard people who owned them, liked them.

Its not such a new idea really, Yam and Suz made 400cc I think way back in the 70's era. Think Bultaco also made a 370 also in the 70's.

For sure though nowdays a modern 350cc 2T probably would be quite popular.
Ted722
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Ted722 6/15/2016 1:18pm
6/15/2016 1:18pm Edited Date/Time 6/15/2016 1:19pm
When I read KTM was putting a counterbalancer on their 250, the first thing I thought of was its application on a larger displacement 2T. Seems like a no-brainer to make a 350cc-400cc 2 stroke. A bit more bore and stroke sure is nice. I had a KX327 and it was absolutely golden off-road.
kiwifan
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kiwifan 6/15/2016 1:35pm
6/15/2016 1:35pm
a22 wrote:
KTM already did it in the 90's, think it was a 380 or 360, think Trampas Parker may also have rode one in the GPs. From...
KTM already did it in the 90's, think it was a 380 or 360, think Trampas Parker may also have rode one in the GPs.
From what I heard people who owned them, liked them.

Its not such a new idea really, Yam and Suz made 400cc I think way back in the 70's era. Think Bultaco also made a 370 also in the 70's.

For sure though nowdays a modern 350cc 2T probably would be quite popular.
Shane King won the world 500cc champinship on a KTM380 2 stroke in 1996
a22
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a22 6/15/2016 1:42pm
6/15/2016 1:42pm Edited Date/Time 6/15/2016 1:43pm
kiwifan wrote:
Shane King won the world 500cc champinship on a KTM380 2 stroke in 1996
Did not know that, for some reason I never remember Shane King as well as some other riders probably far less accomplished. Did he have a brother also- was it Daryl ? Think they were both very good riders.

Think KTM also made a 360 2T in the 70's era also and were making the more modern 380 into the 2000's and beyond.

The Shop

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C-Rock
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C-Rock 6/15/2016 1:45pm
6/15/2016 1:45pm
kiwifan wrote:
Shane King won the world 500cc champinship on a KTM380 2 stroke in 1996
a22 wrote:
Did not know that, for some reason I never remember Shane King as well as some other riders probably far less accomplished. Did he have a...
Did not know that, for some reason I never remember Shane King as well as some other riders probably far less accomplished. Did he have a brother also- was it Daryl ? Think they were both very good riders.

Think KTM also made a 360 2T in the 70's era also and were making the more modern 380 into the 2000's and beyond.
http://www.vitalmx.com/forums/Moto-Related,20/KTM-SX-380-1999-2006,1245…
philG
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philG 6/15/2016 1:57pm
6/15/2016 1:57pm
a22 wrote:
KTM already did it in the 90's, think it was a 380 or 360, think Trampas Parker may also have rode one in the GPs. From...
KTM already did it in the 90's, think it was a 380 or 360, think Trampas Parker may also have rode one in the GPs.
From what I heard people who owned them, liked them.

Its not such a new idea really, Yam and Suz made 400cc I think way back in the 70's era. Think Bultaco also made a 370 also in the 70's.

For sure though nowdays a modern 350cc 2T probably would be quite popular.
kiwifan wrote:
Shane King won the world 500cc champinship on a KTM380 2 stroke in 1996
My sponsor built a killer TM300, out to 330cc, with a flywheel weight, never road it as an MX bike , but it was mint as an SM bike.
Gukamonster
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Gukamonster 6/15/2016 2:49pm
6/15/2016 2:49pm
a22 wrote:
KTM already did it in the 90's, think it was a 380 or 360, think Trampas Parker may also have rode one in the GPs. From...
KTM already did it in the 90's, think it was a 380 or 360, think Trampas Parker may also have rode one in the GPs.
From what I heard people who owned them, liked them.

Its not such a new idea really, Yam and Suz made 400cc I think way back in the 70's era. Think Bultaco also made a 370 also in the 70's.

For sure though nowdays a modern 350cc 2T probably would be quite popular.
kiwifan wrote:
Shane King won the world 500cc champinship on a KTM380 2 stroke in 1996
philG wrote:
My sponsor built a killer TM300, out to 330cc, with a flywheel weight, never road it as an MX bike , but it was mint as...
My sponsor built a killer TM300, out to 330cc, with a flywheel weight, never road it as an MX bike , but it was mint as an SM bike.
There is a lot of potential in a brand new large displacement 2 stroke. One of the many problems is that it requires expensive new engineering and the manufacturers and sanctioning bodies have no interest in having this technology in pro racing. The number of units sold would suffer. The rulebook as late as 2002 allowed 550cc four strokes to race 250 2 strokes to encourage new 4 stroke development. You will not see similar rules to encourage new 2 stroke development, likely ever in either class.

There might be enough of a niche market for a new big 2 stroke for someone to try though. Maybe KTM, Husqvarna or TM would try something larger than the 300cc you can get now.

The last one tried was the 1996 KTM 360 that replaced the '95 version of the 500cc for KTM. They made it all the way until 2001 where it was called the KTM 380SX

kiwifan
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kiwifan 6/15/2016 4:08pm
6/15/2016 4:08pm
a22 wrote:
Did not know that, for some reason I never remember Shane King as well as some other riders probably far less accomplished. Did he have a...
Did not know that, for some reason I never remember Shane King as well as some other riders probably far less accomplished. Did he have a brother also- was it Daryl ? Think they were both very good riders.

Think KTM also made a 360 2T in the 70's era also and were making the more modern 380 into the 2000's and beyond.
Daryll raced KX500's in the 500c World champs, I think he got 3rd overall one year, they also have a younger brother called Damian who was also fast but never raced in World GP...I think he did MXdN tho.
kiwifan
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kiwifan 6/15/2016 4:09pm
6/15/2016 4:09pm
philG wrote:
My sponsor built a killer TM300, out to 330cc, with a flywheel weight, never road it as an MX bike , but it was mint as...
My sponsor built a killer TM300, out to 330cc, with a flywheel weight, never road it as an MX bike , but it was mint as an SM bike.
*thumbs up* Smile
FI2T
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FI2T 6/15/2016 6:04pm
6/15/2016 6:04pm

I finally got my ESR 345 with some new port work. It was amazing down low but horrible up top (slower then my bolt on yz250). I hope the cylinder revisions bring it to life.

I would buy a new big bore tomorrow. Hard to believe TM or Beta couldn't see the benefits of building one. The aftermarket says there is a demand!

resetjet
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resetjet 6/15/2016 6:55pm
6/15/2016 6:55pm
My .02. You cannot ride a 300+ around on the pipe. That being said, you can make it very 4 stroke like and if u actually stroke the motor, have a heavy crank and have a counterbalancer, you may have something that could go up against a 450 4t. I dunno, noone has ever produced one.
just James
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just James 6/15/2016 7:07pm
6/15/2016 7:07pm
KTM 450SX (not SX-F) is what I would like to see, and I think it would sell quite well.
Bearuno
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Bearuno 6/15/2016 8:58pm
6/15/2016 8:58pm
While I'd love to see a 350-450cc 2T, whilst factories can get away with making a 'big bore' by simply squaring up a 250, all we'll see is 300s. Quite the easy money maker, they are.

A modern 350, 350+ 2t could be a thing of wonder.
SDTony YZ ESR 325 6/15/2016 9:00pm
6/15/2016 9:00pm Edited Date/Time 6/15/2016 9:06pm








Yamaha YZ ESR 325 Setup (2007)
Purpose - Motocross and Off Road rider – Intermediate to Novice Level
-Eddie Sanders Racing 325 - S7 (Woods Porting), Race Gas Dome (use 50 Pump/50 Race Fuel) ($900)
-No - Fly Wheel Weight - None
-Race Tech Suspension ($600)
-Moto Tassinari Reed Valve ($250)
-Rekluse Clutch - Core EXP 2.0 ($900)
-FMF Gnarly Expansion Chamber ($250)
-FMF Q Silencer ($100)
-Vortex Ignition ($250)
-Dunlop MX 52 90/21 Front, MX 52 Rear - 120/19
-TU-BLISS -Traction Control System ($200)
-Geared 14 – 48
-Jetting 162 Main, 42 Pilot (Adjusted for 4,000’)


$3,500 Used 2007 YZ 250 plus $3,450 = $6,950
mb
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mb 6/15/2016 10:28pm
6/15/2016 10:28pm
Would buy a new 500 in a heartbeat.
scott_nz
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scott_nz 6/15/2016 10:41pm
6/15/2016 10:41pm Edited Date/Time 6/15/2016 10:44pm
a22 wrote:
Did not know that, for some reason I never remember Shane King as well as some other riders probably far less accomplished. Did he have a...
Did not know that, for some reason I never remember Shane King as well as some other riders probably far less accomplished. Did he have a brother also- was it Daryl ? Think they were both very good riders.

Think KTM also made a 360 2T in the 70's era also and were making the more modern 380 into the 2000's and beyond.
kiwifan wrote:
Daryll raced KX500's in the 500c World champs, I think he got 3rd overall one year, they also have a younger brother called Damian who was...
Daryll raced KX500's in the 500c World champs, I think he got 3rd overall one year, they also have a younger brother called Damian who was also fast but never raced in World GP...I think he did MXdN tho.
Damian ran a number of seasons in 500 GP's, both on Honda 500's and later KTM four strokes, i think he may have got a top 10 in a GP at one time, but normally ran top 15,

i cant remember him running the des nations tho, he may have tho,

there was also another brother Jason, who between Shayne and Damian, he was killed in a car crash in the 90's, but had not raced since he was on 80's, he was pretty quick on 80's they tell me,

Darryll raced KX500;s early, then CR500 and then factory Husqvarna four strokes, he was second twice in the championship,

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racerhansen 6/15/2016 11:00pm
6/15/2016 11:00pm
The KTM 380 is an awesome bike. One day I'm going to put one of these engines in a 12-16 SX 250 frame

kiwifan
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kiwifan 6/16/2016 3:08am
6/16/2016 3:08am
scott_nz wrote:
Damian ran a number of seasons in 500 GP's, both on Honda 500's and later KTM four strokes, i think he may have got a top...
Damian ran a number of seasons in 500 GP's, both on Honda 500's and later KTM four strokes, i think he may have got a top 10 in a GP at one time, but normally ran top 15,

i cant remember him running the des nations tho, he may have tho,

there was also another brother Jason, who between Shayne and Damian, he was killed in a car crash in the 90's, but had not raced since he was on 80's, he was pretty quick on 80's they tell me,

Darryll raced KX500;s early, then CR500 and then factory Husqvarna four strokes, he was second twice in the championship,
thanks Scott, I didnt know Damian went overseas too....impressive family for sure
kiwifan
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kiwifan 6/16/2016 3:09am
6/16/2016 3:09am
resetjet wrote:
My .02. You cannot ride a 300+ around on the pipe. That being said, you can make it very 4 stroke like and if u actually...
My .02. You cannot ride a 300+ around on the pipe. That being said, you can make it very 4 stroke like and if u actually stroke the motor, have a heavy crank and have a counterbalancer, you may have something that could go up against a 450 4t. I dunno, noone has ever produced one.
really? I remember the 500's being raced on the pipe...Leichen never short shifted his bike thats for sure
C-Rock
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C-Rock 6/16/2016 4:52am
6/16/2016 4:52am
racerhansen wrote:
The KTM 380 is an awesome bike. One day I'm going to put one of these engines in a 12-16 SX 250 frame [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2016/06/15/139491/s1200_11038245_10207717601757462_2311970484592911631_n.jpg[/img]
The KTM 380 is an awesome bike. One day I'm going to put one of these engines in a 12-16 SX 250 frame

Here you are.
Wink


bvm111
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bvm111 6/17/2016 10:30pm
6/17/2016 10:30pm Edited Date/Time 6/17/2016 10:34pm
Cant believe no one has mentioned the Noleen/Ohlins 360 kit for the YZ250.... Believe it was stroked as well, i believe they ran pretty good if i rememeber the tests on it in the mags back then!
cmotodad
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cmotodad 6/17/2016 10:41pm
6/17/2016 10:41pm
I have a 2000 KTM 380 in a 2013 125 SX frame. The motor is as close to a 4 stroke as possible. It is light, handles great and is a blast to ride. Not as fast on it as a 450 but so much more fun. You should be seeing an article in dirt bike on it in the near future.
eric513anderson 6/18/2016 5:56am
6/18/2016 5:56am
You could always cram a Banshee engine in a bike frame. Not very desirable tho. No bottom end, super hard hitting midrange but top end power that pulls like no other. Be a fun dune bike. Great in a straight line. I love mine
rpktm17
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rpktm17 6/18/2016 6:05am
6/18/2016 6:05am
rpktm17 wrote:
Is that a 2006 ktm 380
racerhansen wrote:
2001, but with some mods and a 2006 subframe/airbox/seat
Dang that cool I really like it the 06 was cool looking bikes

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