2020 yz450f or factory edition ktm 450 sxf?

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5/27/2020 10:41 PM
Edited Date/Time: 5/27/2020 10:45 PM

Price aside, which bike do you buy for robust reliability and overall confidence and comfort on tracks? Currently have 2 2018 rmz450's just looking to try something else for reference and see what I'm actually missing. Thanks

Fyi I'm 6'4, 259 pre quarantine, 280 currently. Mid c class skill rider at best.

2020 yz450f vs ktm factory edition 450sxf

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5/27/2020 10:49 PM

Both are very good bikes, but they have completely different characteristics. So i would strongly recommend that you try to get an opportunity to try both bikes before making a purchase.

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5/27/2020 11:12 PM
Edited Date/Time: 5/27/2020 11:13 PM

2 completely different animals. I ride a RMZ 450 for track and have 2- KTM off road bikes. I had a KTM 450 back on ‘16 and loved it, but after breaking me back, I took a year off, thought I was done riding. Bought a RZR, that lasted for a year, then bought another bike (RMZ 450). I love it !! But I also love my EXC 500 and my 300 TPI, so I’m not much help to you.
Try and ride them both and see what feels better. Being a big guy, you may like that Yamaha !!

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5/27/2020 11:34 PM
Edited Date/Time: 5/27/2020 11:39 PM

Well, I agree with both of you guys, but unfortunately don't have a way to test ride either. Likely pulling the trigger tomorrow or Friday...

Sorry about your back man, thoughts of injuries like that keep me slow lol. Just sold my rzr too. Haha

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5/27/2020 11:40 PM

On the engine side, yzf is worse:
35 hours top end, 70 hours rod, if you're lucky to not break it first.
With the sxf you can go till 120/130 hours on the rod. Top end at 70 hours.
I better like also the sxf, which would come with clamps and stuff

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5/27/2020 11:47 PM
Edited Date/Time: 5/27/2020 11:50 PM

Okay, you'll be happy with either but here are my thoughts on the bikes. I got to try both when they got released last summer on the same day on the same track. Keep in mind that i'm way shorter and lighter (175cm/77kg).

Yamaha:
Great suspension
Insane bottom end and torque in the engine, a bit too much if you ask me on hard packed/intermediate tracks. But this can be adjusted with the Powertuner app that is a major advantage over the KTM.
Very predictable cornering.
The bike is a bit wider than the KTM but it's not an issue for me.
The bike feels smaller than the KTM because the gap between the footpegs and the seat is much shorter than on the KTM. So considering that you're tall, you will want to get a taller seat if you buy the Yamaha

KTM:
Suspension is ok. The shock is good (although it gets hot and fades for really fast riders) but the fork is not for everyone. The plus with the air fork is that the front end is light (although some doesn't like that).
Engine is incredibly linear and easy to ride with lots of raw HP. It's kinda deceiving because the exhaust is not loud and the engine character is so linear that you almost think it's slow, but it's really fast.
Corners really good, maybe not as predictable as the Yamaha but it feels sharper.
Really narrow.
For me, it feels like you have way more room in the "cockpit" because of the footpeg to seat ratio that i mentioned earlier.
Hydraulic clutch is awesome.
The clutch is by far the best of all bikes when it comes to longevity. Not a big deal if you aren't a clutch abuser but still a plus!

Both bikes are fantastic in their own way!

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5/27/2020 11:58 PM

Motofinne wrote:

Okay, you'll be happy with either but here are my thoughts on the bikes. I got to try both when they got released last summer on the same day on the same track. Keep in mind that i'm way shorter and lighter (175cm/77kg).

Yamaha:
Great suspension
Insane bottom end and torque in the engine, a bit too much if you ask me on hard packed/intermediate tracks. But this can be adjusted with the Powertuner app that is a major advantage over the KTM.
Very predictable cornering.
The bike is a bit wider than the KTM but it's not an issue for me.
The bike feels smaller than the KTM because the gap between the footpegs and the seat is much shorter than on the KTM. So considering that you're tall, you will want to get a taller seat if you buy the Yamaha

KTM:
Suspension is ok. The shock is good (although it gets hot and fades for really fast riders) but the fork is not for everyone. The plus with the air fork is that the front end is light (although some doesn't like that).
Engine is incredibly linear and easy to ride with lots of raw HP. It's kinda deceiving because the exhaust is not loud and the engine character is so linear that you almost think it's slow, but it's really fast.
Corners really good, maybe not as predictable as the Yamaha but it feels sharper.
Really narrow.
For me, it feels like you have way more room in the "cockpit" because of the footpeg to seat ratio that i mentioned earlier.
Hydraulic clutch is awesome.
The clutch is by far the best of all bikes when it comes to longevity. Not a big deal if you aren't a clutch abuser but still a plus!

Both bikes are fantastic in their own way!

Thanks for that in- depth info. The idea of a cramped ride doesn't appeal at all, and being in so. Nevada it's usually hardpack with loose sand or slick whatever it is on top. Not tacky east coast dirt for sure.

I appreciate the maintenance schedule listed above too. I admit that I forego the factory rebuild schedules generally. The less stuff is tampered with, the better imo. I have probably 70 hrs on my one rmz and only change the oil, filters, chain and tires. It feels fresh still. Changed the fork oil when I resprung. Clutch still holds well. Can i get away with either of these brands being this lax? I'm used to hondas and Suzuki's.

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5/28/2020 12:11 AM

MZ193 wrote:

On the engine side, yzf is worse:
35 hours top end, 70 hours rod, if you're lucky to not break it first.
With the sxf you can go till 120/130 hours on the rod. Top end at 70 hours.
I better like also the sxf, which would come with clamps and stuff

Is that the recommendations in the manual?
I have a mate with well over 100 hours on his 20...zero problems and he is a hard rider..

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2020 YZ450F
2006 YZ125
2013 YZ 250F special edition
2017 YZ 250
2015 YZ 250f soecial edition
2019 KTM 85 big wheel

5/28/2020 12:22 AM
Edited Date/Time: 5/28/2020 12:24 AM

Keefer inc testing owns both and gives detailed info on who the bike is suitable for in his podcasts. I highly recommend hearing what Kris has to say as it depends on your size, riding style and budget.
check out his podcast on what 450 is best for you. He rides the heck out of both and raced both so he is a reliable source

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5/28/2020 12:30 AM
Edited Date/Time: 5/28/2020 12:33 AM

MZ193 wrote:

On the engine side, yzf is worse:
35 hours top end, 70 hours rod, if you're lucky to not break it first.
With the sxf you can go till 120/130 hours on the rod. Top end at 70 hours.
I better like also the sxf, which would come with clamps and stuff

PJRAUS wrote:

Is that the recommendations in the manual?
I have a mate with well over 100 hours on his 20...zero problems and he is a hard rider..

Well, not recommendations in the manual.
But a friend of mine, which is a expert regional rider, on his 19 yzf 450, when he opened the cases he found the present. He was at 65 hours and probably with more 5 hours the rod would probably have destroyed the whole engine. The rod was on the way to its end. Oil changes every 6 hours including oil filter change. Bike was always warmed up before riding. Air filter done every ride.
Here's the rod. 65 hours. 65.

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5/28/2020 12:31 AM

Photo
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5/28/2020 4:31 AM

MZ193 wrote:

On the engine side, yzf is worse:
35 hours top end, 70 hours rod, if you're lucky to not break it first.
With the sxf you can go till 120/130 hours on the rod. Top end at 70 hours.
I better like also the sxf, which would come with clamps and stuff

PJRAUS wrote:

Is that the recommendations in the manual?
I have a mate with well over 100 hours on his 20...zero problems and he is a hard rider..

MZ193 wrote:

Well, not recommendations in the manual.
But a friend of mine, which is a expert regional rider, on his 19 yzf 450, when he opened the cases he found the present. He was at 65 hours and probably with more 5 hours the rod would probably have destroyed the whole engine. The rod was on the way to its end. Oil changes every 6 hours including oil filter change. Bike was always warmed up before riding. Air filter done every ride.
Here's the rod. 65 hours. 65.

Shiiiit well, better call Yamaha and let them know that every yz450 lets go at 70 hours, stat. whistling

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5/28/2020 4:34 AM

PJRAUS wrote:

Is that the recommendations in the manual?
I have a mate with well over 100 hours on his 20...zero problems and he is a hard rider..

MZ193 wrote:

Well, not recommendations in the manual.
But a friend of mine, which is a expert regional rider, on his 19 yzf 450, when he opened the cases he found the present. He was at 65 hours and probably with more 5 hours the rod would probably have destroyed the whole engine. The rod was on the way to its end. Oil changes every 6 hours including oil filter change. Bike was always warmed up before riding. Air filter done every ride.
Here's the rod. 65 hours. 65.

tobz wrote:

Shiiiit well, better call Yamaha and let them know that every yz450 lets go at 70 hours, stat. whistling

Right, I guess I’ll be selling mine soon because of that picture and some dude’s friend who’s fast.

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5/28/2020 6:00 AM

Ahahahaha i don't care what ya all sayin
I told the truth, it's up to you to sell it before it blows up under your ass.
I'm on a kawi so i don't mind if yamaha and it's rods last 70 or 120 hours

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5/28/2020 6:45 AM

MZ193 wrote:

Ahahahaha i don't care what ya all sayin
I told the truth, it's up to you to sell it before it blows up under your ass.
I'm on a kawi so i don't mind if yamaha and it's rods last 70 or 120 hours

I have 70 hours on my 19, with the original clutch so there’s that.

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5/28/2020 7:31 AM
Edited Date/Time: 5/30/2020 6:03 AM

so this happened last night!

Photo

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Never try to argue with idiots; they will only bring you down to their level.....and being more experienced, they will beat you at their own game!

2020.5 KTM 450 SXF FE
2006 KX250

5/28/2020 8:43 AM

For your height and weight, Yamaha all day. Engine is smooth like sewing machine and strong like ox. You will also really appreciate the cockpit of a YZ, very roomy and comfortable. Buyuuut, if you want to turn the bike competitively get a KTM.

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Life's a garden, dig it.

1996 CR250R
2016 YZ450F
2001 Suzuki Bandit 600

5/28/2020 8:45 AM

What kind of reliability do you ktm guys experience? Yamaha guys?

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5/28/2020 9:27 AM

MZ193 wrote:

On the engine side, yzf is worse:
35 hours top end, 70 hours rod, if you're lucky to not break it first.
With the sxf you can go till 120/130 hours on the rod. Top end at 70 hours.
I better like also the sxf, which would come with clamps and stuff

PJRAUS wrote:

Is that the recommendations in the manual?
I have a mate with well over 100 hours on his 20...zero problems and he is a hard rider..

MZ193 wrote:

Well, not recommendations in the manual.
But a friend of mine, which is a expert regional rider, on his 19 yzf 450, when he opened the cases he found the present. He was at 65 hours and probably with more 5 hours the rod would probably have destroyed the whole engine. The rod was on the way to its end. Oil changes every 6 hours including oil filter change. Bike was always warmed up before riding. Air filter done every ride.
Here's the rod. 65 hours. 65.

Well I don't know....but myself...I change the oil on my yz 450 at about 1.5 hrs and oil filter at 3 hrs.
Just no way I would ever go as long as six hours without changing oil.
The oil isnt just lubricating the motor like in a car...its also the transmission oil and it has a wet clutch in there too.
The transmition and clutch heavily contaminate the oil at a very rapid rate...especially with riders who are hard on the clutch and jam their shifts through without backing off the throttle
From what I've read, the Yamaha is generally regarded as very durable

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2020 YZ450F
2006 YZ125
2013 YZ 250F special edition
2017 YZ 250
2015 YZ 250f soecial edition
2019 KTM 85 big wheel

5/28/2020 9:34 AM

sf702/410 wrote:

What kind of reliability do you ktm guys experience? Yamaha guys?

Both are reliable. My personal preference is the Yamaha. I've never had any issues with any of my Yamaha 4 strokes. I have friends that have and haven't had issues with their KTM's. Maintenance is always one of the biggest factors.

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2017 RMZ450
2005 YZ250-sold :,(
1998 YZ250
2005 KX250F

80% of the time it works every time
IG @hamdaddyof2 & @2HRacing
Thanks to : Factory Effex, N2Dirt, Acerbis, DT1, Fasthouse, Matix, FMF, ASV, 100% & Mika Metals

5/28/2020 9:35 AM

Flip a coin...cannot go wrong either way

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Tomac and/or Anderson for 2020.....

5/28/2020 10:21 AM

I have a 2018 yz450 and love it. I'm around 6'4" and run a tall seat from guts and would not go back to the stock seat. I love the engine and suspension. Maybe if I could have a bit more top end pull but I think the 2020 yz has addressed this.

If I was doing more supercross type riding I might consider the KTM but otherwise I dont think the mind of the weight of the yz while riding motocross. The KTM FE is a great looking bike though and probably better if you want the top of the line 450 performance.

I'm looking to get a new bike in a few months. I had seriously considered a new KTM FE but I'm probably gonna do a new yz450f instead. I'm not looking to race and I love the Yamaha suspension.

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5/28/2020 10:27 AM
Edited Date/Time: 5/28/2020 10:29 AM

I was a long term KTM 450 man, but now on a Yamaha 450 2020.

Either bike is great, i personally just got fed up with the air forks and pump every outing.....Yamaha suspension is mega right out the box.

Maybe go with the best deal & location?....as a decider option if y'all can't decide on the bike as you can not test any out?.

Good luck with what ever you decide on, enjoy!.

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2020 Yamaha YZ 450
2014 KTM 250 SX / Full Ohlins

imoto34 wrote:
Look at all that torque. The kid on the lawnmower may have laughed so hard he shat his pants.

5/28/2020 10:56 AM

Alrighty I appreciate the insight. Fyi Vegas dealers absolutely blow on pricing. It's a drive for either. I'm basically 3 grand less on the Yamaha and leaning towards that. I like a balanced bike, not light in the front. I dislike what I've read about air fork set up and I imagine the lighter bike has sacrificed strength somewhere along the lines. If it was an overwhelming response pro-ktm, I'd probably fork it over. I trust jap cars over euro. The list ktm I rode was a new 03 250sx and I remember a rock hard seat, chassis, vibrating handle bars and a violent motor. I guess I can't justify 3k in this instance, or shouldn't...

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5/28/2020 11:00 AM

sf702/410 wrote:

Alrighty I appreciate the insight. Fyi Vegas dealers absolutely blow on pricing. It's a drive for either. I'm basically 3 grand less on the Yamaha and leaning towards that. I like a balanced bike, not light in the front. I dislike what I've read about air fork set up and I imagine the lighter bike has sacrificed strength somewhere along the lines. If it was an overwhelming response pro-ktm, I'd probably fork it over. I trust jap cars over euro. The list ktm I rode was a new 03 250sx and I remember a rock hard seat, chassis, vibrating handle bars and a violent motor. I guess I can't justify 3k in this instance, or shouldn't...

Yeah the 03 has absolutely nothing in common or relatable to the new ktm 450. But you will like either choice. Ktm easier/less tiring to ride. Yamaha stronger more snappy roll on tq. Ktm 15lbs lighter. Yamaha suspension better out of box.

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5/28/2020 11:22 AM

sf702/410 wrote:

Alrighty I appreciate the insight. Fyi Vegas dealers absolutely blow on pricing. It's a drive for either. I'm basically 3 grand less on the Yamaha and leaning towards that. I like a balanced bike, not light in the front. I dislike what I've read about air fork set up and I imagine the lighter bike has sacrificed strength somewhere along the lines. If it was an overwhelming response pro-ktm, I'd probably fork it over. I trust jap cars over euro. The list ktm I rode was a new 03 250sx and I remember a rock hard seat, chassis, vibrating handle bars and a violent motor. I guess I can't justify 3k in this instance, or shouldn't...

yz133rider wrote:

Yeah the 03 has absolutely nothing in common or relatable to the new ktm 450. But you will like either choice. Ktm easier/less tiring to ride. Yamaha stronger more snappy roll on tq. Ktm 15lbs lighter. Yamaha suspension better out of box.

See, that's a big deal though. I feel like my bike pumps up my arms so bad and is generally considered to be harsh in all the shootouts... so is ktm more plush than the yami???

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5/28/2020 11:25 AM

Unpopular opinion: Buy 2 more RMZs

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5/28/2020 11:27 AM

seth505 wrote:

Unpopular opinion: Buy 2 more RMZs

Lol, nice

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5/28/2020 11:41 AM

sf702/410 wrote:

Alrighty I appreciate the insight. Fyi Vegas dealers absolutely blow on pricing. It's a drive for either. I'm basically 3 grand less on the Yamaha and leaning towards that. I like a balanced bike, not light in the front. I dislike what I've read about air fork set up and I imagine the lighter bike has sacrificed strength somewhere along the lines. If it was an overwhelming response pro-ktm, I'd probably fork it over. I trust jap cars over euro. The list ktm I rode was a new 03 250sx and I remember a rock hard seat, chassis, vibrating handle bars and a violent motor. I guess I can't justify 3k in this instance, or shouldn't...

yz133rider wrote:

Yeah the 03 has absolutely nothing in common or relatable to the new ktm 450. But you will like either choice. Ktm easier/less tiring to ride. Yamaha stronger more snappy roll on tq. Ktm 15lbs lighter. Yamaha suspension better out of box.

sf702/410 wrote:

See, that's a big deal though. I feel like my bike pumps up my arms so bad and is generally considered to be harsh in all the shootouts... so is ktm more plush than the yami???

With suspension work the ktm can be as plush as any thing. Its moreso the engine character and light weight that is less tiring on the ktm than really the rest of the 450s.

If you prefer a smooth roll on and linear delivery the ktm is it. If you want stronger sharper roll on, thats the yz. But with the stronger low end power comes more fatigue at times as well.

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5/28/2020 11:44 AM

MZ193 wrote:

Ahahahaha i don't care what ya all sayin
I told the truth, it's up to you to sell it before it blows up under your ass.
I'm on a kawi so i don't mind if yamaha and it's rods last 70 or 120 hours

crowe176 wrote:

I have 70 hours on my 19, with the original clutch so there’s that.

Sell it tomorrow!

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