2018 crf 250r Head

BurntToast43
Just got a new 250 this year and put about 30 hours on it and Always keep up on maintinence because i like my stuff to last. Im a local A rider here in illinois and ride the bike pretty hard (only way to get power out of the new honda). Regardless i went out yesterday and got about a lap into my first moto and the motor locked up. Tore it apart and found the cam bearings locked up. In the process it scratched the shit out of my head so it needs replaced as well. Called honda and its actually a problem they are aware of and are going to pick up the bill for all of it. Anyone else have that happen yet?
1
|
Wiztardo
Profile picture for user Wiztardo
Posts
89
Joined
5/3/2018
Location
Cuyahoga Falls, OH US
Wiztardo 5/11/2018 11:58am
5/11/2018 11:58am
That's pretty crazy. When you say "keep up on maintenance", you mean following the service manual exactly? What are the maintenance intervals like on the 2018 CRF250? (What have you done so far since you've owned the bike?)
BurntToast43 5/11/2018 12:08pm
5/11/2018 12:08pm
Wiztardo wrote:
That's pretty crazy. When you say "keep up on maintenance", you mean following the service manual exactly? What are the maintenance intervals like on the 2018...
That's pretty crazy. When you say "keep up on maintenance", you mean following the service manual exactly? What are the maintenance intervals like on the 2018 CRF250? (What have you done so far since you've owned the bike?)
I dont take it to the extreme and change fork oil and re-grease swing arm linkage and that stuff as often as they say i should but as far as the oil/filter and air filter i think they say like 10 hours or something then change the oil. I usually only go like 3 rides or so depening on if they are races. If im racing i will change it after the race day. Air filter after every ride its dusty here. When i talked to honda they said they have had people with this problem put it back together and it happens again i think thats why they are picking up the bill because it might. For the top end to by that dry it that quick im thinking it is an oil pump imo.
newmann
Profile picture for user newmann
Posts
24444
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
US
newmann 5/11/2018 12:20pm
5/11/2018 12:20pm
Shredded a cam chain tensioner block in ours way back when they first came out with about 10 hours on it. Plugged up the oil filter and ran everything dry. Cam was damn near welded to the head. Laughing Honda said "oh well".
MX915
Profile picture for user MX915
Posts
469
Joined
1/17/2018
Location
Central, NJ US
MX915 5/11/2018 12:23pm
5/11/2018 12:23pm
Damn that blows. Definitely sounds like something is keeping oil from reaching the head. Not good on a 14k RPM motor.

FWIW, if you followed the manual's recommendations you'd be on your third piston by now. I'd say their intervals are a little conservative.

The Shop

See All »
BurntToast43 5/11/2018 12:33pm
5/11/2018 12:33pm
MX915 wrote:
Damn that blows. Definitely sounds like something is keeping oil from reaching the head. Not good on a 14k RPM motor. FWIW, if you followed the...
Damn that blows. Definitely sounds like something is keeping oil from reaching the head. Not good on a 14k RPM motor.

FWIW, if you followed the manual's recommendations you'd be on your third piston by now. I'd say their intervals are a little conservative.

Yeah because even if it was low on oil, which it wasnt, it would have to be pretty much bone dry for it to go in a lap and a half. Even if it had half the amount it was supposed to it wouldnt have seized that quick which says it wasnt getting any oil period.
1
BurntToast43 5/11/2018 12:36pm
5/11/2018 12:36pm
newmann wrote:
Shredded a cam chain tensioner block in ours way back when they first came out with about 10 hours on it. Plugged up the oil filter...
Shredded a cam chain tensioner block in ours way back when they first came out with about 10 hours on it. Plugged up the oil filter and ran everything dry. Cam was damn near welded to the head. Laughing Honda said "oh well".
That sucks man. New motor shouldve figured there would be hidden problems.
1
yz133rider
Profile picture for user yz133rider
Posts
4467
Joined
8/1/2013
Location
Avondale, PA US
yz133rider 5/11/2018 12:38pm
5/11/2018 12:38pm
Theres more of that honda fit and finish and quality i always hear about...imagine the shit talking if this was ktm
5
5
BurntToast43 5/11/2018 12:51pm
5/11/2018 12:51pm
user760a wrote:
oil filter in backwards?
That was my first thought not going to lie. The cover wouldnt fit on correctly if it was though the spring would just jam into the rubber that the cover side goes into.
mattyhamz2
Profile picture for user mattyhamz2
Posts
10866
Joined
7/6/2015
Location
So Cal, CA US
Fantasy
767th
mattyhamz2 5/11/2018 1:06pm
5/11/2018 1:06pm
Wiztardo wrote:
That's pretty crazy. When you say "keep up on maintenance", you mean following the service manual exactly? What are the maintenance intervals like on the 2018...
That's pretty crazy. When you say "keep up on maintenance", you mean following the service manual exactly? What are the maintenance intervals like on the 2018 CRF250? (What have you done so far since you've owned the bike?)
BurntToast43 wrote:
I dont take it to the extreme and change fork oil and re-grease swing arm linkage and that stuff as often as they say i should...
I dont take it to the extreme and change fork oil and re-grease swing arm linkage and that stuff as often as they say i should but as far as the oil/filter and air filter i think they say like 10 hours or something then change the oil. I usually only go like 3 rides or so depening on if they are races. If im racing i will change it after the race day. Air filter after every ride its dusty here. When i talked to honda they said they have had people with this problem put it back together and it happens again i think thats why they are picking up the bill because it might. For the top end to by that dry it that quick im thinking it is an oil pump imo.
That's crazy! My uncle has 2 buddies with 18 crf250's and both quit running after 3 hours. They've swapped just about everything they could and still nothing. They're not too happy. Some sort of electrical issue with the cdi box they believe. No shops local to them have the program to check the electronics for codes or anything though.
omalley
Profile picture for user omalley
Posts
1528
Joined
7/27/2016
Location
Snohomish, WA US
omalley 5/11/2018 1:12pm
5/11/2018 1:12pm
Curious what the pump pickup screen looks like as far as plugging up (although it may be full of stuff from the failure rather than before).
Lastander
Profile picture for user Lastander
Posts
1181
Joined
10/9/2016
Location
SE
Lastander 5/11/2018 1:13pm
5/11/2018 1:13pm
My engine guy built a new engine for my bike dealer and made 46hp (stock 38 on the same dyno).
Worked great for 1 hour until a valve snapped and made a mess, my dad managed to fix the head and its up and running again but i think these -18s might have some babyissues
PTshox
Profile picture for user PTshox
Posts
1350
Joined
10/1/2011
Location
Highland Village, TX US
PTshox 5/11/2018 1:15pm
5/11/2018 1:15pm
Do yourself a favor and call Ron Hamp @ (989) 463-1267.

Get him the new parts... let him do his thing to keep it from happening again.
Rider608
Profile picture for user Rider608
Posts
5
Joined
8/22/2018
Location
De Forest, WI US
Rider608 8/22/2018 8:42am
8/22/2018 8:42am
BurntToast43 wrote:
Just got a new 250 this year and put about 30 hours on it and Always keep up on maintinence because i like my stuff to...
Just got a new 250 this year and put about 30 hours on it and Always keep up on maintinence because i like my stuff to last. Im a local A rider here in illinois and ride the bike pretty hard (only way to get power out of the new honda). Regardless i went out yesterday and got about a lap into my first moto and the motor locked up. Tore it apart and found the cam bearings locked up. In the process it scratched the shit out of my head so it needs replaced as well. Called honda and its actually a problem they are aware of and are going to pick up the bill for all of it. Anyone else have that happen yet?
What oil viscosity are you using? I am chasing the same issue here on a local A riders bike. I can ride it for 5 hours no problem, but I'm an old slow guy. He can lock the cams up in a lap. Trying to find similarities and differences in the issue.
Jerkolantern
Profile picture for user Jerkolantern
Posts
508
Joined
5/18/2016
Location
New Richland, MN US
Jerkolantern 8/22/2018 8:56am
8/22/2018 8:56am Edited Date/Time 8/22/2018 8:57am
newmann wrote:
Shredded a cam chain tensioner block in ours way back when they first came out with about 10 hours on it. Plugged up the oil filter...
Shredded a cam chain tensioner block in ours way back when they first came out with about 10 hours on it. Plugged up the oil filter and ran everything dry. Cam was damn near welded to the head. Laughing Honda said "oh well".
With the coin you must drop on bike parts and bikes I'd find a new dealer- anyone who wants Honda stuff should buy from Trimbles Honda in Austin Minnesota. I believe they're the second oldest Honda dealership in the country at this point. It's a family run business and I can't say enough about the great service I've gotten over the years. I actually owe them money for fixing my kids cr125 after hours and left it hidden outside for us to pick up. I get paid Friday and can't wait to pay them, can't say that about any other bills I get. If you do a decent amount of business with them they'll start giving you discounts. I don't work there, and I'm not related to them in any way, just a very solid dealership that goes the extra mile to keep a customer happy
flomiester
Profile picture for user flomiester
Posts
188
Joined
2/10/2012
Location
Elwell, MI US
flomiester 8/22/2018 11:25am
8/22/2018 11:25am
Hopfully when they replace the head and parts you will get the 2019 compnents there was border line problems with valve geometry. and the exhaust ports were just to big .i did not want to even touch 1 waiting and hoping the new compnents leave the engine guys somthing a bit beter than the 2018 .
usafwx
Profile picture for user usafwx
Posts
1377
Joined
7/19/2012
Location
Trussville, AL US
usafwx 8/22/2018 2:28pm
8/22/2018 2:28pm
Not to rub salt in the wound but glad I waited and picked up a YZ instead. This sucks because I love Honda too and my Hondas both proved reliable, though the old unicam engine.
1
1

Pit Row

See All »
Rider608
Profile picture for user Rider608
Posts
5
Joined
8/22/2018
Location
De Forest, WI US
Rider608 8/22/2018 3:51pm
8/22/2018 3:51pm
Radfonz wrote:
What sort of oil are you running?
Service manual calls out for 10w30. I have tried 15w50 but once I get it back together I'm going to do the 10w30.
Aceofspades 8/23/2018 11:29pm
8/23/2018 11:29pm
Radfonz wrote:
What sort of oil are you running?
Rider608 wrote:
Service manual calls out for 10w30. I have tried 15w50 but once I get it back together I'm going to do the 10w30.
15w50 seems pretty thick for that application.
Bkep73
Profile picture for user Bkep73
Posts
6
Joined
9/3/2019
Location
TX US
Bkep73 9/3/2019 7:32pm
9/3/2019 7:32pm
BurntToast43 wrote:
Just got a new 250 this year and put about 30 hours on it and Always keep up on maintinence because i like my stuff to...
Just got a new 250 this year and put about 30 hours on it and Always keep up on maintinence because i like my stuff to last. Im a local A rider here in illinois and ride the bike pretty hard (only way to get power out of the new honda). Regardless i went out yesterday and got about a lap into my first moto and the motor locked up. Tore it apart and found the cam bearings locked up. In the process it scratched the shit out of my head so it needs replaced as well. Called honda and its actually a problem they are aware of and are going to pick up the bill for all of it. Anyone else have that happen yet?
Hey man I’m a local A rider here in Texas my 2019 crf250r did the exact same thing (twice) my cam literally almost seized itself to the head and fried my cams and cam journals and I’m tired of throwing good money after bad any obvious fixes if you don’t mind sharing them with me I’m to much money in the hole for it to mess up again. Is it oil pump failure or a factory f*** up lol I’ve been chasing my tail for almost 2 months now. My bike did it at 33hours.
Rider608
Profile picture for user Rider608
Posts
5
Joined
8/22/2018
Location
De Forest, WI US
Rider608 9/4/2019 7:26am
9/4/2019 7:26am Edited Date/Time 9/4/2019 7:29am
BurntToast43 wrote:
Just got a new 250 this year and put about 30 hours on it and Always keep up on maintinence because i like my stuff to...
Just got a new 250 this year and put about 30 hours on it and Always keep up on maintinence because i like my stuff to last. Im a local A rider here in illinois and ride the bike pretty hard (only way to get power out of the new honda). Regardless i went out yesterday and got about a lap into my first moto and the motor locked up. Tore it apart and found the cam bearings locked up. In the process it scratched the shit out of my head so it needs replaced as well. Called honda and its actually a problem they are aware of and are going to pick up the bill for all of it. Anyone else have that happen yet?
Bkep73 wrote:
Hey man I’m a local A rider here in Texas my 2019 crf250r did the exact same thing (twice) my cam literally almost seized itself to...
Hey man I’m a local A rider here in Texas my 2019 crf250r did the exact same thing (twice) my cam literally almost seized itself to the head and fried my cams and cam journals and I’m tired of throwing good money after bad any obvious fixes if you don’t mind sharing them with me I’m to much money in the hole for it to mess up again. Is it oil pump failure or a factory f*** up lol I’ve been chasing my tail for almost 2 months now. My bike did it at 33hours.
You're not going to like my answer. After replacing the head and cams 3 times. Trying different things to solve the issue each time,(oil pump, different filters, different cam cap torques, splitting cases to check the scavenge pump, ect...) I finally replaced the cases, that being the last straw. The cases did it. He's been running it for the last 25 hours no problems. I just replaced the piston it it and its still humming along. FYI, if you do split the cases make sure you put the scavenge pump back together the correct way. Get a manual because it is not how you would expect it to go. We wound up having to buy everything.
Bkep73
Profile picture for user Bkep73
Posts
6
Joined
9/3/2019
Location
TX US
Bkep73 9/4/2019 8:07pm
9/4/2019 8:07pm
Rider608 wrote:
You're not going to like my answer. After replacing the head and cams 3 times. Trying different things to solve the issue each time,(oil pump, different...
You're not going to like my answer. After replacing the head and cams 3 times. Trying different things to solve the issue each time,(oil pump, different filters, different cam cap torques, splitting cases to check the scavenge pump, ect...) I finally replaced the cases, that being the last straw. The cases did it. He's been running it for the last 25 hours no problems. I just replaced the piston it it and its still humming along. FYI, if you do split the cases make sure you put the scavenge pump back together the correct way. Get a manual because it is not how you would expect it to go. We wound up having to buy everything.
Thanks man it’s gonna save me allot of time and money, any obvious damage to the cases anywhere that you noticed. This is gonna be the third head for me and I replaced valves timing chain piston and rings the whole head was redone completely. And fried the exact same place as the last one. I didn’t even get break the new top end all the way and ended up braking my collar bone on a table. Theirs is a oil screen I noticed in a schematic is inside the cases by the crank or can you access it without splitting them noticed someone said to check that screen for gunk build up. What piston are you running and oil fully synthetic or mineral? And are you using the manufacture oil amount or running 300cc over that I’ve heard of people doing. Sorry for the all the questions got to much and money invested in a bike I have barely had the joy of riding lol.
Rider608
Profile picture for user Rider608
Posts
5
Joined
8/22/2018
Location
De Forest, WI US
Rider608 9/5/2019 12:38pm
9/5/2019 12:38pm
Bkep73 wrote:
Thanks man it’s gonna save me allot of time and money, any obvious damage to the cases anywhere that you noticed. This is gonna be the...
Thanks man it’s gonna save me allot of time and money, any obvious damage to the cases anywhere that you noticed. This is gonna be the third head for me and I replaced valves timing chain piston and rings the whole head was redone completely. And fried the exact same place as the last one. I didn’t even get break the new top end all the way and ended up braking my collar bone on a table. Theirs is a oil screen I noticed in a schematic is inside the cases by the crank or can you access it without splitting them noticed someone said to check that screen for gunk build up. What piston are you running and oil fully synthetic or mineral? And are you using the manufacture oil amount or running 300cc over that I’ve heard of people doing. Sorry for the all the questions got to much and money invested in a bike I have barely had the joy of riding lol.
That's the thing. Everything looked new between the cases. Nothing obvious popped out. It killed me to just start changing stuff with no indication of faults. But what do ya do?

I put in a 306cc big bore stroker with the cases.

I tapped into the oil filter cover and mounted an oil pressure gauge to it to verify PSI after I put it all back together. It had about 6-7 at idle but just off idle and above it shot up to 30-40 psi if I remember right. I must have put 2-3 hours on it on the dyno just to give myself some piece of mind before I gave it back to the rider so he didn't kill himself on it.

The filter screen is between the cases and a pick up tube/plate sandwiches up against it. I actually used a light film of RTV on the case gasket where it touches the screen. In hope that it just sealed up that pick up area in case it was sucking air there somehow and cavitating the pump. I also pre-lubed the hell out of it and primed the oil galleys by rolling it over with a drill on the crank until I got some pressure on the gauge

We've been running Red line Synthetic 10W30 at the standard level with a stainless filter. I tried the extra oil level with one of the head changes and it made no difference.
Bkep73
Profile picture for user Bkep73
Posts
6
Joined
9/3/2019
Location
TX US
Bkep73 9/5/2019 1:44pm
9/5/2019 1:44pm
Rider608 wrote:
That's the thing. Everything looked new between the cases. Nothing obvious popped out. It killed me to just start changing stuff with no indication of faults...
That's the thing. Everything looked new between the cases. Nothing obvious popped out. It killed me to just start changing stuff with no indication of faults. But what do ya do?

I put in a 306cc big bore stroker with the cases.

I tapped into the oil filter cover and mounted an oil pressure gauge to it to verify PSI after I put it all back together. It had about 6-7 at idle but just off idle and above it shot up to 30-40 psi if I remember right. I must have put 2-3 hours on it on the dyno just to give myself some piece of mind before I gave it back to the rider so he didn't kill himself on it.

The filter screen is between the cases and a pick up tube/plate sandwiches up against it. I actually used a light film of RTV on the case gasket where it touches the screen. In hope that it just sealed up that pick up area in case it was sucking air there somehow and cavitating the pump. I also pre-lubed the hell out of it and primed the oil galleys by rolling it over with a drill on the crank until I got some pressure on the gauge

We've been running Red line Synthetic 10W30 at the standard level with a stainless filter. I tried the extra oil level with one of the head changes and it made no difference.
Sounds like the thing to do who makes the 306 kit is it with a stock crank and cams. I’m gonna end up changing the crank out while I have it cracked open just making sure. How is the power delivery? More bottom end hopefully lol.

Im running motul 10w-30 mineral in my 18 not the 19 I’m working on obviously.

Did you have to re-tune the motor to the 306? If you say that’s what it takes to make this motor breathe for again I’m in all the way just have no idea on where to start haha.
Rider608
Profile picture for user Rider608
Posts
5
Joined
8/22/2018
Location
De Forest, WI US
Rider608 9/6/2019 11:23am
9/6/2019 11:23am
Bkep73 wrote:
Sounds like the thing to do who makes the 306 kit is it with a stock crank and cams. I’m gonna end up changing the crank...
Sounds like the thing to do who makes the 306 kit is it with a stock crank and cams. I’m gonna end up changing the crank out while I have it cracked open just making sure. How is the power delivery? More bottom end hopefully lol.

Im running motul 10w-30 mineral in my 18 not the 19 I’m working on obviously.

Did you have to re-tune the motor to the 306? If you say that’s what it takes to make this motor breathe for again I’m in all the way just have no idea on where to start haha.
My company does the 306 mods. Max Power Engines. It makes a lot more power and torque. I got the dyno chart posted on our facebook page. I mapped it with the Athena WiFiGET. The stock head and cams work really good with the added displacement, I'm sure there is more there though.
Bkep73
Profile picture for user Bkep73
Posts
6
Joined
9/3/2019
Location
TX US
Bkep73 9/6/2019 4:28pm
9/6/2019 4:28pm
Bkep73 wrote:
Sounds like the thing to do who makes the 306 kit is it with a stock crank and cams. I’m gonna end up changing the crank...
Sounds like the thing to do who makes the 306 kit is it with a stock crank and cams. I’m gonna end up changing the crank out while I have it cracked open just making sure. How is the power delivery? More bottom end hopefully lol.

Im running motul 10w-30 mineral in my 18 not the 19 I’m working on obviously.

Did you have to re-tune the motor to the 306? If you say that’s what it takes to make this motor breathe for again I’m in all the way just have no idea on where to start haha.
Rider608 wrote:
My company does the 306 mods. Max Power Engines. It makes a lot more power and torque. I got the dyno chart posted on our facebook...
My company does the 306 mods. Max Power Engines. It makes a lot more power and torque. I got the dyno chart posted on our facebook page. I mapped it with the Athena WiFiGET. The stock head and cams work really good with the added displacement, I'm sure there is more there though.
Then my next question for you sir... feel like doing another 19 motor lol. Very interested! email me bkeplinger32@gmail.com
CarlinoJoeVideo
Profile picture for user CarlinoJoeVideo
Posts
7358
Joined
11/30/2013
Location
Portland/Los Angeles, CA US
Fantasy
2339th
CarlinoJoeVideo 9/6/2019 4:44pm
9/6/2019 4:44pm
Bkep73 wrote:
Sounds like the thing to do who makes the 306 kit is it with a stock crank and cams. I’m gonna end up changing the crank...
Sounds like the thing to do who makes the 306 kit is it with a stock crank and cams. I’m gonna end up changing the crank out while I have it cracked open just making sure. How is the power delivery? More bottom end hopefully lol.

Im running motul 10w-30 mineral in my 18 not the 19 I’m working on obviously.

Did you have to re-tune the motor to the 306? If you say that’s what it takes to make this motor breathe for again I’m in all the way just have no idea on where to start haha.
Rider608 wrote:
My company does the 306 mods. Max Power Engines. It makes a lot more power and torque. I got the dyno chart posted on our facebook...
My company does the 306 mods. Max Power Engines. It makes a lot more power and torque. I got the dyno chart posted on our facebook page. I mapped it with the Athena WiFiGET. The stock head and cams work really good with the added displacement, I'm sure there is more there though.
Heres the chart from Facebook

Post a reply to: 2018 crf 250r Head