17' Kawi or KTM 450 'smaller/nimbler' feeling?

kiwifan
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kiwifan 7/6/2017 1:41pm
7/6/2017 1:41pm
MyersAvionics wrote:
This wasn't a completely stock Kawasaki. I actually thought the stock Kawasaki hit too hard off the bottom, whereas the KTM was much more linear off...
This wasn't a completely stock Kawasaki. I actually thought the stock Kawasaki hit too hard off the bottom, whereas the KTM was much more linear off the bottom. Midrange, I think the KTM is similar in map 1 w/TC on. On Map-2 it pulls quite a bit harder through the mid.
ah that explains it Smile thanks!! Yes the KTM has a smoother transition off the bottom but with some pretty decent power and torque, I would agree that midrange is closer but no contest on top end, KTM wins that hands down
JB 19
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JB 19 7/6/2017 2:17pm
7/6/2017 2:17pm
Dizzy714 wrote:
I've thought about the 350, just feared the more aggressive riding on the motor would harness the longevity.
Actually you don't have to ride the 350 like a 250F. I ride mine almost like a 450....or basically a 250 2stroke. Go up one or two on the rear and it will lug just fine. Handles exactly like a 250F. Far less "oh shit" moments on the 350 than a 450.

If you are in this boat you should try one, but ride it long enough to understand the engine. It isn't a 250 or a 450 so it feels strange at first.
racer495a
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racer495a 7/6/2017 3:11pm
7/6/2017 3:11pm
Dizzy714 wrote:
I've thought about the 350, just feared the more aggressive riding on the motor would harness the longevity.
JB 19 wrote:
Actually you don't have to ride the 350 like a 250F. I ride mine almost like a 450....or basically a 250 2stroke. Go up one or...
Actually you don't have to ride the 350 like a 250F. I ride mine almost like a 450....or basically a 250 2stroke. Go up one or two on the rear and it will lug just fine. Handles exactly like a 250F. Far less "oh shit" moments on the 350 than a 450.

If you are in this boat you should try one, but ride it long enough to understand the engine. It isn't a 250 or a 450 so it feels strange at first.
Agreed especially if you have it set to the aggressive map you hardly need to get past mid range like a 450. The main difference I feel in handling compared to a 450 is the entrance of corners. The 350 changes direction and settles into a line much easier than a 450. That and I can actually be aggressive and not just be along for the ride. I am a good B moto rider skill wise. The KTM is finished off so nice with quality parts it feels weird to not have to toss money at a new bike like I've done with jap bikes.
RCMXracing
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RCMXracing 7/6/2017 4:00pm
7/6/2017 4:00pm
JB 19 wrote:
Actually you don't have to ride the 350 like a 250F. I ride mine almost like a 450....or basically a 250 2stroke. Go up one or...
Actually you don't have to ride the 350 like a 250F. I ride mine almost like a 450....or basically a 250 2stroke. Go up one or two on the rear and it will lug just fine. Handles exactly like a 250F. Far less "oh shit" moments on the 350 than a 450.

If you are in this boat you should try one, but ride it long enough to understand the engine. It isn't a 250 or a 450 so it feels strange at first.
Agree the 350 is strange at first in that it's different. Absolutely disagree that it handles like a 250F. Great package but to me feels closer to the 450 in it's cornering, whereas the 250F is way more flickable.
To the OP: hunt down a KTM demo day and all will be revealed.

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TeamGreen
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TeamGreen 7/6/2017 4:07pm
7/6/2017 4:07pm Edited Date/Time 7/6/2017 7:58pm
Highsider wrote:
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"Summer Super Savings Sale! 2017 Husqvarna models have been drastically marked down. ** While supplies last. Call us at 816-478-9393 for pricing."

Donnell's Motorcycles in Independence, Missouri


Yup

I'd go for the FC or FX 350...the FX can do it all...



Dizzy714
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Dizzy714 7/7/2017 10:37am
7/7/2017 10:37am Edited Date/Time 7/7/2017 10:40am
It looks like KTM is having a demo ride in Hangtown late August, a bit later than I'd of liked and a 7 hour drive but if waiting it out is what it's going to take for the right decision that's what I'll have to do. I just hope new 17's still exist by that time. I do freeride and dune ride equally as much as track, if that should steer the 350 vs 450 in a particular direction because of that.

So the verdict is that the newer Kawi's in stock form are really that much heavier feeling in comparison?
RCMXracing
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RCMXracing 7/7/2017 3:24pm
7/7/2017 3:24pm
Dizzy714 wrote:
It looks like KTM is having a demo ride in Hangtown late August, a bit later than I'd of liked and a 7 hour drive but...
It looks like KTM is having a demo ride in Hangtown late August, a bit later than I'd of liked and a 7 hour drive but if waiting it out is what it's going to take for the right decision that's what I'll have to do. I just hope new 17's still exist by that time. I do freeride and dune ride equally as much as track, if that should steer the 350 vs 450 in a particular direction because of that.

So the verdict is that the newer Kawi's in stock form are really that much heavier feeling in comparison?
If you do the demo you will get $500 KTM bucks towards parts if you purchase a bike within a year. Check out the details. A buddy took advantage of this.
Dizzy714
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Dizzy714 7/17/2017 11:11am
7/17/2017 11:11am
Not to compare moto and these ramp hitters, but it seems damn near everybody in the X Game's were on Kawi's. Is there something about the Kawi's that make them great in the air?
theycallmeebryan 7/17/2017 11:51am
7/17/2017 11:51am
I haven't ridden a 17' Kawi but i sat on one. I will say that the 17 kawi is slimmer than my 15 kawi and i feel like the 17' KTM is wider in the boot/rear number plate area than my 15 kawi. So the 17 kawi will definitely feel slimmer where you grip the bike compared to the 17 KTM.
Dizzy714
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Dizzy714 7/31/2017 8:39pm
7/31/2017 8:39pm
I have a couple of questions now that I'm semi-nearing the demo ride and will be making my decision immediately after and picking up a bike.

How does the KTM rebate work? Is this something every dealership honors? And then how much should a new 17' 450/350 cost OTD after CA taxes and the rebate included?
theycallmeebryan 7/31/2017 10:51pm
7/31/2017 10:51pm
Dizzy714 wrote:
I have a couple of questions now that I'm semi-nearing the demo ride and will be making my decision immediately after and picking up a bike...
I have a couple of questions now that I'm semi-nearing the demo ride and will be making my decision immediately after and picking up a bike.

How does the KTM rebate work? Is this something every dealership honors? And then how much should a new 17' 450/350 cost OTD after CA taxes and the rebate included?
Where is there a KTM demo ride coming up in CA?
Dizzy714
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Dizzy714 8/1/2017 10:13am
8/1/2017 10:13am
Dizzy714 wrote:
I have a couple of questions now that I'm semi-nearing the demo ride and will be making my decision immediately after and picking up a bike...
I have a couple of questions now that I'm semi-nearing the demo ride and will be making my decision immediately after and picking up a bike.

How does the KTM rebate work? Is this something every dealership honors? And then how much should a new 17' 450/350 cost OTD after CA taxes and the rebate included?
theycallmeebryan wrote:
Where is there a KTM demo ride coming up in CA?
Hangtown on the 25th of this month. There's just two asterisk's I'm in question of.

1) Entry Fee Needed
2) Dealership Invitation Needed.

I'm trying to get clarification on those. As well as how that KTM rebate works on the 17's.
dedi684
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dedi684 8/1/2017 11:04am
8/1/2017 11:04am
Dizzy714 wrote:
I have a couple of questions now that I'm semi-nearing the demo ride and will be making my decision immediately after and picking up a bike...
I have a couple of questions now that I'm semi-nearing the demo ride and will be making my decision immediately after and picking up a bike.

How does the KTM rebate work? Is this something every dealership honors? And then how much should a new 17' 450/350 cost OTD after CA taxes and the rebate included?
theycallmeebryan wrote:
Where is there a KTM demo ride coming up in CA?
Dizzy714 wrote:
Hangtown on the 25th of this month. There's just two asterisk's I'm in question of. 1) Entry Fee Needed 2) Dealership Invitation Needed. I'm trying to...
Hangtown on the 25th of this month. There's just two asterisk's I'm in question of.

1) Entry Fee Needed
2) Dealership Invitation Needed.

I'm trying to get clarification on those. As well as how that KTM rebate works on the 17's.
I didn't get any rebate just a card for 500 in parts and accessories. I just rode them a few weeks ago.
Brent
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Brent 8/1/2017 11:12am
8/1/2017 11:12am
I sold my 16 Kawi for my first KTM

Best thing I have done in a while. The KXF is not a bad bike as much as the KTM is a superior motorcycle in almost every aspect. I will never buy another four stroke without e start...

erik_94COBRA
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erik_94COBRA 8/1/2017 1:51pm
8/1/2017 1:51pm
Dizzy714 wrote:
I was hoping I'd luck out and come across a few who have ridden both and have some feedback regarding the two. I'm coming off a...
I was hoping I'd luck out and come across a few who have ridden both and have some feedback regarding the two. I'm coming off a lifetime of 250 2 strokers and hoping the transition will be as seemless as possible. I'm very sensitive to light & nimble handling/flickability of a bike, granted these 450's are much heavier than what I'm coming off of - which is the reason I'm looking for the bike that has that smaller, lighter, and most manueverable feel to it. I believe I read somebody say that the Kawi feels longer than other bikes, which would steer me away from it, but that could be a botched memory. Any feedback would be appreciated! I'm also still in debate in regards to buying new vs playing the Craigslist lottery, leaning towards buying new but some Craigslist listings do look promising at times.
What 250 2 stroke do you currently have? The 2017+ KTM 250SX and TC250 are significantly better than basically any other one available. Fun and performance at the same time. I'm sure the 350/450 is faster, but I doubt it's more fun.
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aroark247 8/1/2017 2:49pm
8/1/2017 2:49pm
twotwosix wrote:
The KTM not only feels lighter and more flickable, it is physically lighter by a large margin. The '17 KTM does everything right. I fell in...
The KTM not only feels lighter and more flickable, it is physically lighter by a large margin. The '17 KTM does everything right. I fell in love when I spent some time on it. I almost bought one last month, but I couldn't justify the money. I could nearly buy two clean 16 YZ450s or KX450s for the $9000 the new SXF costs. The KX450 is a good bike. It does nothing great, but everything very well. The 16 I rode had a full FMF 4.1 and it was a nice handling, quick bike.
False. The KTM is about 4 pounds lighter. With 1 gallon of gas weighing approximately 7 lbs and the KTM has approximately a 1.85 gallon tank- that adds on 12 pounds to their advertised weight. which is not significantly different than the KX (which doesn't misleading advertise their weight)
Dizzy714
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Dizzy714 8/1/2017 2:58pm
8/1/2017 2:58pm
Dizzy714 wrote:
I was hoping I'd luck out and come across a few who have ridden both and have some feedback regarding the two. I'm coming off a...
I was hoping I'd luck out and come across a few who have ridden both and have some feedback regarding the two. I'm coming off a lifetime of 250 2 strokers and hoping the transition will be as seemless as possible. I'm very sensitive to light & nimble handling/flickability of a bike, granted these 450's are much heavier than what I'm coming off of - which is the reason I'm looking for the bike that has that smaller, lighter, and most manueverable feel to it. I believe I read somebody say that the Kawi feels longer than other bikes, which would steer me away from it, but that could be a botched memory. Any feedback would be appreciated! I'm also still in debate in regards to buying new vs playing the Craigslist lottery, leaning towards buying new but some Craigslist listings do look promising at times.
erik_94COBRA wrote:
What 250 2 stroke do you currently have? The 2017+ KTM 250SX and TC250 are significantly better than basically any other one available. Fun and performance...
What 250 2 stroke do you currently have? The 2017+ KTM 250SX and TC250 are significantly better than basically any other one available. Fun and performance at the same time. I'm sure the 350/450 is faster, but I doubt it's more fun.
04' CR. What makes a two stroke so much more fun than a four? I see this statement being made all of the time. I was actually leaning more towards the 350 as of recent because I have seen many reports that it just has a 'fun factor' over its big brother. Seems like a perfect middle ground on paper. I do a lot of Glamis riding, though, so I do fear the extra wear on the 350 may be something to consider as well.
erik_94COBRA
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erik_94COBRA 8/1/2017 3:09pm
8/1/2017 3:09pm
Dizzy714 wrote:
I was hoping I'd luck out and come across a few who have ridden both and have some feedback regarding the two. I'm coming off a...
I was hoping I'd luck out and come across a few who have ridden both and have some feedback regarding the two. I'm coming off a lifetime of 250 2 strokers and hoping the transition will be as seemless as possible. I'm very sensitive to light & nimble handling/flickability of a bike, granted these 450's are much heavier than what I'm coming off of - which is the reason I'm looking for the bike that has that smaller, lighter, and most manueverable feel to it. I believe I read somebody say that the Kawi feels longer than other bikes, which would steer me away from it, but that could be a botched memory. Any feedback would be appreciated! I'm also still in debate in regards to buying new vs playing the Craigslist lottery, leaning towards buying new but some Craigslist listings do look promising at times.
erik_94COBRA wrote:
What 250 2 stroke do you currently have? The 2017+ KTM 250SX and TC250 are significantly better than basically any other one available. Fun and performance...
What 250 2 stroke do you currently have? The 2017+ KTM 250SX and TC250 are significantly better than basically any other one available. Fun and performance at the same time. I'm sure the 350/450 is faster, but I doubt it's more fun.
Dizzy714 wrote:
04' CR. What makes a two stroke so much more fun than a four? I see this statement being made all of the time. I was...
04' CR. What makes a two stroke so much more fun than a four? I see this statement being made all of the time. I was actually leaning more towards the 350 as of recent because I have seen many reports that it just has a 'fun factor' over its big brother. Seems like a perfect middle ground on paper. I do a lot of Glamis riding, though, so I do fear the extra wear on the 350 may be something to consider as well.
For me, the fun factor comes from the quality of power along with the lighter weight.

I will say that I had an '05 CR 250 that was well setup and my TC does everything better: power, suspension, handling, brakes, clutch, etc. I still have an '03 CR 250 with an '01 engine that I'm going to go through eventually. I've ridden it zero times since getting my TC.

Also to note, a buddy has a '17 KTM 350 SXF. Pretty sure he's faster around a track on it than his 250SX, but looks faster and has more fun riding the 250 vs. 350.

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Giygas
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Giygas 8/1/2017 6:13pm
8/1/2017 6:13pm
yz133rider wrote:
Don't do it.

Get a 250f or a newer 250 smoker.450s kill the fun for me.
450s kill the fun for you?

Wut?
bvm111
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bvm111 8/1/2017 7:40pm
8/1/2017 7:40pm
yz133rider wrote:
Don't do it.

Get a 250f or a newer 250 smoker.450s kill the fun for me.
Giygas wrote:
450s kill the fun for you?

Wut?
Exactly my thought?

I have both, a 06 KX250 with full TMR motorwork and PC exhaust and 16 KX450 with suspension and Ecu remap... I LOVE both! However, saying the 450 is boring is just not an honest statement. The Torque is sooooo much fun as it pulls you around the track, I honestly have not had the motivation to rip my 06 lately!
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wreckitrandy 8/2/2017 5:50am
8/2/2017 5:50am
twotwosix wrote:
The KTM not only feels lighter and more flickable, it is physically lighter by a large margin. The '17 KTM does everything right. I fell in...
The KTM not only feels lighter and more flickable, it is physically lighter by a large margin. The '17 KTM does everything right. I fell in love when I spent some time on it. I almost bought one last month, but I couldn't justify the money. I could nearly buy two clean 16 YZ450s or KX450s for the $9000 the new SXF costs. The KX450 is a good bike. It does nothing great, but everything very well. The 16 I rode had a full FMF 4.1 and it was a nice handling, quick bike.
aroark247 wrote:
False. The KTM is about 4 pounds lighter. With 1 gallon of gas weighing approximately 7 lbs and the KTM has approximately a 1.85 gallon tank-...
False. The KTM is about 4 pounds lighter. With 1 gallon of gas weighing approximately 7 lbs and the KTM has approximately a 1.85 gallon tank- that adds on 12 pounds to their advertised weight. which is not significantly different than the KX (which doesn't misleading advertise their weight)
False. The MXA shootout says the Kawasaki is 9 pounds heavier than the KTM.
aroark247
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aroark247 8/5/2017 12:10pm
8/5/2017 12:10pm
twotwosix wrote:
The KTM not only feels lighter and more flickable, it is physically lighter by a large margin. The '17 KTM does everything right. I fell in...
The KTM not only feels lighter and more flickable, it is physically lighter by a large margin. The '17 KTM does everything right. I fell in love when I spent some time on it. I almost bought one last month, but I couldn't justify the money. I could nearly buy two clean 16 YZ450s or KX450s for the $9000 the new SXF costs. The KX450 is a good bike. It does nothing great, but everything very well. The 16 I rode had a full FMF 4.1 and it was a nice handling, quick bike.
aroark247 wrote:
False. The KTM is about 4 pounds lighter. With 1 gallon of gas weighing approximately 7 lbs and the KTM has approximately a 1.85 gallon tank-...
False. The KTM is about 4 pounds lighter. With 1 gallon of gas weighing approximately 7 lbs and the KTM has approximately a 1.85 gallon tank- that adds on 12 pounds to their advertised weight. which is not significantly different than the KX (which doesn't misleading advertise their weight)
wreckitrandy wrote:
False. The MXA shootout says the Kawasaki is 9 pounds heavier than the KTM.
NOPE. MXA doesn't research shit. Don't trust them, do a little of your own research.

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