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6/20/2019 8:21 PM

Erzberg Rodeo 19
What’s with the lack of Japanese manufacturers at enduro races?







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6/21/2019 7:42 AM

Considering its Erzberg, why NOT pick up a pumpkin fresh from the tap?

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"A link is only as long as your longest strong chain"

6/21/2019 7:58 AM

The Japanese companies don’t make a bike that can compete with the KTMs/Huskys/Shercos/Betas/GasGas offroad 300s. Anyone who tells you anything different is either a liar or has never done a legitimate extreme enduro event.

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6/21/2019 8:13 AM
Edited Date/Time: 6/21/2019 8:19 AM

The only Japanese manufacturer producing a modern two stroke bike is Yamaha. Good luck competing against any of the Euro 300cc variants on a YZ250.

Graham Jarvis attempted his first Erzberg on a Sherco 450 and finished 6th. Not sure we've seen another four stroke in the top ranks since. That doesn't leave many other options but a Euro 300cc two stroke.

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6/21/2019 9:23 AM

Jeremy Macbeth wrote:

The only Japanese manufacturer producing a modern two stroke bike is Yamaha. Good luck competing against any of the Euro 300cc variants on a YZ250.

Graham Jarvis attempted his first Erzberg on a Sherco 450 and finished 6th. Not sure we've seen another four stroke in the top ranks since. That doesn't leave many other options but a Euro 300cc two stroke.

A few guys run 250s. Wade Young is one. He prefers the 250 over 300

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6/21/2019 9:25 AM
Edited Date/Time: 6/21/2019 9:25 AM

As much as I like my two stroke enduros and I want to agree, with the more recent Honda RX and Yamaha FX offerings it excites me that things might start to heat up a bit in the off-road world.

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6/21/2019 10:38 AM

Jeremy Macbeth wrote:

The only Japanese manufacturer producing a modern two stroke bike is Yamaha. Good luck competing against any of the Euro 300cc variants on a YZ250.

Graham Jarvis attempted his first Erzberg on a Sherco 450 and finished 6th. Not sure we've seen another four stroke in the top ranks since. That doesn't leave many other options but a Euro 300cc two stroke.

Kennyfreemoney wrote:

A few guys run 250s. Wade Young is one. He prefers the 250 over 300

It isn't as much to do with 250 vs 300 as it is the type of power that they produce. Having a balancer makes a world of difference. Having E Start is a must. Besides the obvious energy savings, how are you going to kick start a bike when you can barely stand next to it?

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6/21/2019 10:54 AM

Jeremy Macbeth wrote:

The only Japanese manufacturer producing a modern two stroke bike is Yamaha. Good luck competing against any of the Euro 300cc variants on a YZ250.

Graham Jarvis attempted his first Erzberg on a Sherco 450 and finished 6th. Not sure we've seen another four stroke in the top ranks since. That doesn't leave many other options but a Euro 300cc two stroke.

Kennyfreemoney wrote:

A few guys run 250s. Wade Young is one. He prefers the 250 over 300

BAMX wrote:

It isn't as much to do with 250 vs 300 as it is the type of power that they produce. Having a balancer makes a world of difference. Having E Start is a must. Besides the obvious energy savings, how are you going to kick start a bike when you can barely stand next to it?

Balancer's are overrated. Flywheel weight and CB's are 2 ways of achieving the same thing.

I'm not looking for an argument, just making the point that CB's have not transformed the 2t World to the point that they are a must have. See Sherco and Beta.

1500 riders is mind blowing, the lack of Japanese product is low on the give a shit meter about that event.

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2015 Beta 500 RS, history: 99 KTM 300, 87 CR250, 84 KLR 600, 82 GPZ 550, 81 KX 250, 80 KX 250, 79 Montesa 414 VE, 78 250 VB, 77 360 VB, 76 360 VA, 75 YZ 125, 74 TM 125, 72 TS 125, 60's West Bend Go Boy Kart

6/21/2019 1:34 PM

Jeremy Macbeth wrote:

The only Japanese manufacturer producing a modern two stroke bike is Yamaha. Good luck competing against any of the Euro 300cc variants on a YZ250.

Graham Jarvis attempted his first Erzberg on a Sherco 450 and finished 6th. Not sure we've seen another four stroke in the top ranks since. That doesn't leave many other options but a Euro 300cc two stroke.

Graham can kill it on his 250F. He loves the little thumper.

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6/21/2019 1:36 PM

Kennyfreemoney wrote:

A few guys run 250s. Wade Young is one. He prefers the 250 over 300

BAMX wrote:

It isn't as much to do with 250 vs 300 as it is the type of power that they produce. Having a balancer makes a world of difference. Having E Start is a must. Besides the obvious energy savings, how are you going to kick start a bike when you can barely stand next to it?

Johnny Depp wrote:

Balancer's are overrated. Flywheel weight and CB's are 2 ways of achieving the same thing.

I'm not looking for an argument, just making the point that CB's have not transformed the 2t World to the point that they are a must have. See Sherco and Beta.

1500 riders is mind blowing, the lack of Japanese product is low on the give a shit meter about that event.

Beta is coming out with a CB motor next year. That 300 motor will shake the teeth right out of you.

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6/21/2019 1:37 PM

Jeremy Macbeth wrote:

The only Japanese manufacturer producing a modern two stroke bike is Yamaha. Good luck competing against any of the Euro 300cc variants on a YZ250.

Graham Jarvis attempted his first Erzberg on a Sherco 450 and finished 6th. Not sure we've seen another four stroke in the top ranks since. That doesn't leave many other options but a Euro 300cc two stroke.

Kennyfreemoney wrote:

A few guys run 250s. Wade Young is one. He prefers the 250 over 300

Mario used to as well but moved to a 300.

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6/21/2019 1:46 PM

Ebs wrote:

As much as I like my two stroke enduros and I want to agree, with the more recent Honda RX and Yamaha FX offerings it excites me that things might start to heat up a bit in the off-road world.

The RX and FX bikes aren’t designed to compete in extreme enduro. GNCCs and other standard harescrambles, sure.

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6/21/2019 1:56 PM

Ebs wrote:

As much as I like my two stroke enduros and I want to agree, with the more recent Honda RX and Yamaha FX offerings it excites me that things might start to heat up a bit in the off-road world.

agn5009 wrote:

The RX and FX bikes aren’t designed to compete in extreme enduro. GNCCs and other standard harescrambles, sure.

My little 250 FX holds its own pretty good with the 300’s I ride the gnar with. Definitely rips on the 300’s in the more fast flowy stuff. Nice to hop on the smoker though for certain terrain.

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6/21/2019 5:45 PM
Edited Date/Time: 6/21/2019 5:46 PM

BAMX wrote:

It isn't as much to do with 250 vs 300 as it is the type of power that they produce. Having a balancer makes a world of difference. Having E Start is a must. Besides the obvious energy savings, how are you going to kick start a bike when you can barely stand next to it?

Johnny Depp wrote:

Balancer's are overrated. Flywheel weight and CB's are 2 ways of achieving the same thing.

I'm not looking for an argument, just making the point that CB's have not transformed the 2t World to the point that they are a must have. See Sherco and Beta.

1500 riders is mind blowing, the lack of Japanese product is low on the give a shit meter about that event.

Tuna wrote:

Beta is coming out with a CB motor next year. That 300 motor will shake the teeth right out of you.

I hope they don't, Beta is killing it with what they have and KTM went backwards after they did it. I would not expect it before 2024 if E5 is still the rule forcing FI. They'll F it up all at once, I'd rather have a U.S. carb model without all that showroom performance stuff. Just a simple 2t the way God intended.

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2015 Beta 500 RS, history: 99 KTM 300, 87 CR250, 84 KLR 600, 82 GPZ 550, 81 KX 250, 80 KX 250, 79 Montesa 414 VE, 78 250 VB, 77 360 VB, 76 360 VA, 75 YZ 125, 74 TM 125, 72 TS 125, 60's West Bend Go Boy Kart

6/21/2019 8:16 PM

Ebs wrote:

As much as I like my two stroke enduros and I want to agree, with the more recent Honda RX and Yamaha FX offerings it excites me that things might start to heat up a bit in the off-road world.

agn5009 wrote:

The RX and FX bikes aren’t designed to compete in extreme enduro. GNCCs and other standard harescrambles, sure.

Tuna wrote:

My little 250 FX holds its own pretty good with the 300’s I ride the gnar with. Definitely rips on the 300’s in the more fast flowy stuff. Nice to hop on the smoker though for certain terrain.

I didn't realize 250Fs were faster than 300 2 strokes. Might have to give them another look.

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6/22/2019 6:19 AM

Problem with the 4t is keeping them cool. Some of these events the bike just wont make it. They melt the clutch and game over even with a fan.

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sponsored by zip tie, JB weld and peanut butter and jelly

6/22/2019 7:34 AM

Jeremy Macbeth wrote:

The only Japanese manufacturer producing a modern two stroke bike is Yamaha. Good luck competing against any of the Euro 300cc variants on a YZ250.

Graham Jarvis attempted his first Erzberg on a Sherco 450 and finished 6th. Not sure we've seen another four stroke in the top ranks since. That doesn't leave many other options but a Euro 300cc two stroke.

Tuna wrote:

Graham can kill it on his 250F. He loves the little thumper.

I’m willing to bet a 250F can’t finish Erzberg.

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6/22/2019 8:03 AM

agn5009 wrote:

The RX and FX bikes aren’t designed to compete in extreme enduro. GNCCs and other standard harescrambles, sure.

Tuna wrote:

My little 250 FX holds its own pretty good with the 300’s I ride the gnar with. Definitely rips on the 300’s in the more fast flowy stuff. Nice to hop on the smoker though for certain terrain.

Broseph wrote:

I didn't realize 250Fs were faster than 300 2 strokes. Might have to give them another look.

Wow!! A 250F faster than a 300 in the fast and flowy stuff?!? I didn't realize that either!! Guess I need to sell my 300 and go get me one of those fire breathin 250F's.

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