Turning a 1979 CR250 "barn find" into a 1978 RC250 replica

PK97
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Huntsville, AL US
10/17/2018 7:52pm
Mike,

Still slowly working on mine, motor is almost together minus the clutch and kick starter gears going in.
2
10/18/2018 11:17pm
Such a beautiful bike PK! I have to say that every time I see it. I don't think mine will look that good because I have decided not to repaint everything. Yesterday I cleaned the engine cases with alcohol then polished with compound, next a touch up of the scratches/ small chips with a fine paint brush, and will finish up with a coat of wax on the old engine paint. It wont look as pristine as yours but will be a nice example of the original paint.

My company just announced a major reorganization and major global job cuts to boost profits and it looks like I may be forced to take the early retirement package. Another big company isn't going to hire anyone in their late 50's so I will soon probably have plenty of free time to work on the bike.
1
10/18/2018 11:59pm
Here is me riding the very same bike in 1979. I think I was 18 at the time and my leather pants were a size 28...


3
swatdoc
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10/19/2018 1:17am
Mike - this is me back in ‘78


5

The Shop

10/19/2018 7:31am
Both you and the bike looked good John! Oh the nostalgia!
2
PK97
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10/19/2018 8:37am


Thanks Mike! You have a great bike though and everything was there and in good shape. Mine won’t look like that after the first ride. You have been getting all of the goodies from Holy and PDE for yours! What kind of leathers were those in the picture? Hope the early retirement doesn’t adversely affect you.

Both you and swatdoc look good on those bikes! I had a 125 in’79, wish I had gone to the 250 back then instead of waiting until ‘81.

Swatdoc, I bought one of those Hondaline jerseys off of eBay about three years ago along with the standard red white and blue one. Had to put a Bel-Ray patch on each one.

PK
10/19/2018 9:34am
PK97 wrote:
Thanks Mike! You have a great bike though and everything was there and in good shape. Mine won’t look like that after the first ride. You...


Thanks Mike! You have a great bike though and everything was there and in good shape. Mine won’t look like that after the first ride. You have been getting all of the goodies from Holy and PDE for yours! What kind of leathers were those in the picture? Hope the early retirement doesn’t adversely affect you.

Both you and swatdoc look good on those bikes! I had a 125 in’79, wish I had gone to the 250 back then instead of waiting until ‘81.

Swatdoc, I bought one of those Hondaline jerseys off of eBay about three years ago along with the standard red white and blue one. Had to put a Bel-Ray patch on each one.

PK
I still have my Hondaline Jersey in those pics.. still in great condition, too.

I was trying to remember the name of those leathers myself yesterday.. they weren't Bates.. if I heard the name I might recall it. They were yellow leathers with blue patches on the knees and ass area. They had a zipper that allowed you to put the knee pads in which was much more comfortable than Velcro strapping pads to your knees like today. They were yellow because I had an RM250 just before this bike. I later bought red and blue Honda leathers and that was the best looking set of MX gear ever! The boots are Tony D boots. I also had the Scott boots.


PK97
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10/19/2018 12:42pm
I was stupid and didn’t save any of my old gear, got new stuff every year back then. I have been kicking myself for the last ten years about it and have been trying to find stuff on eBay. Got some nice Trim leathers two years ago. Have some Hondaline pants I got five years ago but are a little too small
RF145
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Rutherford, NJ US
10/19/2018 5:07pm
I still have my Hondaline Jersey in those pics.. still in great condition, too. I was trying to remember the name of those leathers myself yesterday...
I still have my Hondaline Jersey in those pics.. still in great condition, too.

I was trying to remember the name of those leathers myself yesterday.. they weren't Bates.. if I heard the name I might recall it. They were yellow leathers with blue patches on the knees and ass area. They had a zipper that allowed you to put the knee pads in which was much more comfortable than Velcro strapping pads to your knees like today. They were yellow because I had an RM250 just before this bike. I later bought red and blue Honda leathers and that was the best looking set of MX gear ever! The boots are Tony D boots. I also had the Scott boots.


Hard to tell from the phone, as I try to rotate to see your leathers, you flip upside down Mike.
They could be Bill Walters leathers though.
Richard
swatdoc
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10/19/2018 10:11pm
PK - yea me too, just hadnt put it on in those pics.

I also had some recreated a couple years ago. I had them do the red stripe down the sleeves like the factory guys had. Only bummer was I had to have 6 jerseys made - minimum order.
10/21/2018 10:53pm
Paul,

Did you clearance the bottom shock brackets for the Fox air shocks? I just test fitted them today and the shocks fit on there no problem. I vaguely recall that back in 1979, I had to clearance slightly with a file. With my current set up, the chain side lower inner shock bracket tab is a bit close and would probably hit upon full compression. The next somewhat tight clearance spot is the shifter side lower outer shock bracket tab. Looking to see how much others cut away.. don't want to remove anymore than I have to.

mike
PK97
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10/22/2018 6:22am
Swatdoc,

That jersey looks really nice!!!
PK97
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10/22/2018 6:28am
Mike,

I used this I got off of the Thor-Lawson website, don't know if it came from Fox or someone else made it. I used a dremel to make it nice and smooth, just kind of dished it out.


PK97
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10/22/2018 6:29am

10/22/2018 11:38pm
RF145 wrote:
Hard to tell from the phone, as I try to rotate to see your leathers, you flip upside down Mike. They could be Bill Walters leathers...
Hard to tell from the phone, as I try to rotate to see your leathers, you flip upside down Mike.
They could be Bill Walters leathers though.
Richard
Hi Richard,

Hmm.. they could have been Bill Walters.. it was so long ago. I do remember they were amazing quality.. never had another pair of MX pants as nice as those. I just remembered that they also had a blue stripe running down the side of each leg, too. They were sharp looking. MX gear today often looks like kids pajamas Smile

mike
PK97
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10/27/2018 6:50pm
Mike,

If you are looking for any motor mounts or aluminum parts, the guy on eBay is back selling stuff again, search Honda Elsinore. That is where I got all of my motor mounts and brake stay arm.
10/27/2018 7:53pm Edited Date/Time 10/27/2018 7:56pm
Thanks Paul.. I have all my parts now and getting ready for assembly soon after I paint the swing arm (as soon as I get a day off when it is not raining Sad ).

I haven't posted my progress lately as cleaning and prepping parts doesn't make for exciting pictures, but I have got a lot done and will start posting lots of pics soon and throughout the assembly process.

I polished and detailed the paint on the engine cases and touched up a few minor chips. I am really happy the way that came out. Looks great. I modified the chassis for the Fox Air Shox.. I did the swing arm brackets like in the pics above and turned the left side shock around so the top air valve is facing forward and the bottom one facing back. I very slightly dimpled the frame on the left side only where the top of the shock body was just barely touching the frame. What I didn't do is cut the top shock mount bracket back by 1/4". It was not necessary on my bike as the shock could go almost horizontal before it touched the bracket and it would never be at that extreme angle even fully bottomed out (I looked at a few pics of 1979's with their Fox Shox fully bottomed to confirm). what I did do is take the dremel tool with a small stone grinder bit to smooth out a little lip on the inside of the bracket. This gives it a little extra room that it probably doesn't even need, but easy to do and no modification is visible to the eye.

I spent 3.5 hours sanding the swing arm the other night and it is all primed with same dark gray/black primer that Honda used and ready for paint.

What has really paid off is taking the extra time and money to match the engine and frame paint perfectly. I cant even see where the small rock chips were that I touched up.

The air box, fenders, fuel tank, and number plates are all done and ready to bolt right on. Assembly is the fun part!

Bike should look good and somewhat unique with all the original parts and paint that the bike will retain. Almost every fastener will be replaced by either stainless or titanium bolts and nuts. The swing arm spindle is titanium. Lots of new aluminum parts, too... brackets, stays, etc.

I am wondering if I should polish the engine brackets slightly or leave them raw machined aluminum. what do you think?

mike
1
PK97
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10/27/2018 8:26pm
Sounds good Mike, and your bike will be awesome! I left all of my motor mounts and aluminum air box and seat brackets raw. I would like to get the three pipe mounts from PDE. You went big with the titanium spindles and al, of the other goodies, will be looking forward to seeing pictures. I still need to get my Fox Shoxs re-anodized and rebuilt.

I have been slowed some in the ‘79 build. Bought a ‘80 CR125 ride as is bike about six months ago and just got all of the riding gear. Will have the ‘73 CR250 and ‘74 MR50 from my friend that passed away home after the first of the year. Also, just bought a ‘78 XR75 for my wife to learn to ride on. Will post pictures of my colllection after the new year when I get everything back home. Hopefully Stevie will have fully tested the new arm by then and ready for production.
1
10/27/2018 9:12pm
Hey Paul,

I think it was Swat Doc's bike? that had a polished front engine mount.. just noticed it the other day. Some things look good polished and some parts become a bit too flashy. I did polish the air box support ring.. that looks good.. but not so sure on the engine mounts. Your buddy had such a cool vintage bike collection. I would like to try a ride on a 73 or 74 CR250 again.. it has been 44 years since I last rode one! I remember cornering was so much fun on those things. The long travel suspension from 1978 made you change your style a bit in the corners.

Stevie will get it done, but may take a while.. he always has so much going on at once.

mike
1
swatdoc
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10/27/2018 10:01pm
Mike on my aluminum mounts, I had them clear anodized to keep them nice looking and not oxidize
10/27/2018 10:56pm
swatdoc wrote:
Mike on my aluminum mounts, I had them clear anodized to keep them nice looking and not oxidize
That is a great idea, John! They look like they were polished a little before anodizing, too. I just set up a complete anodizing line a month ago to start anodizing my own stuff. I just did a few pieces for my 2001 RC250M build and they came out great. Now that you put that idea in my head, I am going to do the exact same thing and clear anodize them since I have all the equipment and chemicals.

mike
1
10/27/2018 10:57pm
John, do you have a close up picture of your mounts?
swatdoc
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10/27/2018 11:32pm
Here’s a shot of everything after anodizing
2
10/27/2018 11:58pm
Many thanks John. Looks nice and will stay that way for a long time. I will do my front and rear engine mounts and my chain guide. My upper mount (PDE) might already be clear anodized and it has a steel insert pressed into the bolt holes, so if you tried to put that into an acid tank the steel would be dissolved in minutes and I don't want to mess things up trying to press the insert back out. My tanks are not big enough to do a long brake stay.. would need a 10 to 20 gallon tank at least for that. My tanks are about 3.5 to 4.5 gallons each, just enough to do most parts in my hobbies.

My chain guide is from Holley in Japan and looks similar to yours. I think it may already be clear anodized. The surface has that feel to it.

mike
10/28/2018 3:11am
Do you guys know if the clutch actuater arm can be pulled out of the cases just by removing the retainer screw, but not removing the pushrod itself? I wanted to take the arm out for a little polishing, but if it is too much of a hassle, I will polish it on the engine.
PK97
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Huntsville, AL US
10/28/2018 3:16am
Not sure on that one Mike, one of the other guys probably knows.
10/28/2018 4:12am Edited Date/Time 10/28/2018 5:05am
Here are some pics of my progress..
The original frame paint is all detailed and ready to go. Just needs a coat wax for a final shine. I left the minor boot rub on the frame rails alone since I thought any paint touch up would just wear off the first ride around the yard and look worse.

The plastic is also ready to mount. I may not use these VMX fenders unless I ride her in the dirt. My refinished original fenders should be ready in about a week. We will see how they compare. I cut the corner of the side plate decal to show the original Elsinore decals. The left side was in great condition and the right side is an NOS decal. The OEM decals are paper thin and tricky to apply without tearing

As I was sanding the swing arm with 320 grit paper, you could see the very dark gray, almost black primer that Honda used. I decided to use the same color primer as I prep for paint.

Here are a couple of shots of the engine cases. All the case bolts will be replaced with HRC replica bolts. I have the right side bolts, but still waiting on the left side bolts from Stevie.



As I work on the bike, the direction I want to take the bike is becoming more clear. The original intent was to make it look as much like a 1978 RC250 as possible. I am still going in that direction, but I could not bring myself to paint over that pristine original air box and carb, so those parts will not get the RC treatment. I will keep all the parts in labelled baggies in case someone ever wants to make it a 100% original resto.

I probably should leave the original Honda "claw" tires on there, but have been toying with the idea of replacing them with new Metzler tires. When I raced back in the 70's, if I had a new Metzler on the back, I almost always got the holeshot. If I also, replaced the front with a new Metzler tire, it meant that I would probably get the holeshot and make it all the way around the first turn or two Smile . I loved those tires back in those days.

mike
PK97
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10/28/2018 4:24am
Looks real good Mike! You found a nice original bike and with all of the trick parts you are adding it is going to be hot.
10/28/2018 5:50am
Thanks Paul.

I got all new fuel tank and carb hoses, but one thing I am having trouble finding is the right size hose for the crankcase breather hose. I looked for the NOS 4.5mm X 6.5mm hose but couldn't find it. I ended up with some clear hose from China that was supposed to be the same diameter, but couldn't get it to fit. I also tried some extra Honda carb vent hose I had, but diameter was again a bit too small. It is a tricky size.

mike

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