JUST ANOTHER 2016 KTM 250SXF CHASSIS KX500 ENGINE CONVERSION GONE MAD!

David934
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806
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CZ
1/2/2018 4:53am
Using a Power Dynamo Ignition on this conversion will only require a new mounting bracket and a bit of trimming.. [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2017/12/28/234627/s1200_KX_GURU_RACING.COM_2016_KTX500_BUILD_194.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2017/12/28/234628/s1200_KX_GURU_RACING.COM_2016_KTX500_BUILD_195.jpg[/img]
Using a Power Dynamo Ignition on this conversion will only require a new mounting bracket and a bit of trimming..





you are using things from our Czech republic, cool
Sandblaster
Posts
414
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Location
Eugene, OR US
1/2/2018 7:26am
Yes, Power Dynamo makes great ignition systems for the KX500 and as a bonus you have 100 watts of power to play with.
I own 4 systems, one for each of my KX500's Cool

Makes having a Supermoto a piece of cake..



Sandblaster
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Eugene, OR US
1/2/2018 2:03pm
I received this head from my buddy Motorrad..
Fresh out of the Vapor Blaster and the oven...
Prepping it for the machinist Adam Millar who will re-cut the head, add a decomp, and change the location of the water outlet.
For some reason he likes them clean before he works on them Wink





Yes, the guy cutting my head is building the bike I'll be running against so he knows a lot about my engine... But not everything.. Shocked
Sandblaster
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1/3/2018 7:58am
Spent a bit of time cleaning up that ugly pipe...



I will have to do a few mods to pipe so that it will fit around the E-start but I don't want to put to much effort into it until I decide if I'm going to use it or not...

The Shop

Sandblaster
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1/4/2018 10:34am
Still polishing and pimping but you can see the direction I'm going for the brakes :-)



Sandblaster
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Eugene, OR US
1/5/2018 7:46am Edited Date/Time 1/5/2018 7:47am
Here is some pics of TSR Products first ever Billet KX500 Engine cases.
As far as I know these are the first billet KX500 engine cases on the planet...





My race team had talked about developing billet KX500 engine cases just to give us the option as new cases are no longer available from Kawasaki.
I'm glad that TSR stepped up and made it happen.
They should retail for about 1750 USD when they come to market...

And yes, that's a hydraulic clutch.. Lol
Shredder
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182
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Location
Concord, NC US
Fantasy
1242nd
1/5/2018 10:44am
That's awesome. If they have the ability to make cases, couldn't they put the mounts in the spot where they'd fit in whatever frame you want to use so you don't have to modify the frame or make new mounts?
Bigfoot
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UT US
1/5/2018 10:51am
Here is some pics of TSR Products first ever Billet KX500 Engine cases. As far as I know these are the first billet KX500 engine cases...
Here is some pics of TSR Products first ever Billet KX500 Engine cases.
As far as I know these are the first billet KX500 engine cases on the planet...





My race team had talked about developing billet KX500 engine cases just to give us the option as new cases are no longer available from Kawasaki.
I'm glad that TSR stepped up and made it happen.
They should retail for about 1750 USD when they come to market...

And yes, that's a hydraulic clutch.. Lol
I feel funny....down there.
Sandblaster
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414
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Location
Eugene, OR US
1/5/2018 11:18am
Shredder wrote:
That's awesome. If they have the ability to make cases, couldn't they put the mounts in the spot where they'd fit in whatever frame you want...
That's awesome. If they have the ability to make cases, couldn't they put the mounts in the spot where they'd fit in whatever frame you want to use so you don't have to modify the frame or make new mounts?
Yes they could.
In fact they made several mods for me already, but moving the mounts on the cases would take them extra time so for this build it was easy enough for me to move the mounts to fit the cases.
shuggs
Posts
1574
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8/6/2008
Location
Dunfermline GB
1/5/2018 11:50am
Here is some pics of TSR Products first ever Billet KX500 Engine cases. As far as I know these are the first billet KX500 engine cases...
Here is some pics of TSR Products first ever Billet KX500 Engine cases.
As far as I know these are the first billet KX500 engine cases on the planet...





My race team had talked about developing billet KX500 engine cases just to give us the option as new cases are no longer available from Kawasaki.
I'm glad that TSR stepped up and made it happen.
They should retail for about 1750 USD when they come to market...

And yes, that's a hydraulic clutch.. Lol
This build is getting serious???
Sandblaster
Posts
414
Joined
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Location
Eugene, OR US
1/5/2018 12:19pm
A big part of this build is because I want it...
The other part is because it's KX500 against CR500 in a International spotlight Cool
I know I have my work cut out for me because Adam Millar is a mechanical genius..
I am no where near his level...
But I do have a few small tricks up my sleeve that should prove to make it a interesting competition.
Plus I'm starting with a advantage... KX500 Woohoo
I just hope I can do this build justice to put in a good showing...
Time will tell...
Sidecar
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GB
1/5/2018 12:49pm
Looking rad... I’m gonna have to get a set of billet cases I think... I can’t stop looking at the pictures of them...
Bigfoot
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UT US
1/5/2018 1:02pm
Shredder wrote:
That's awesome. If they have the ability to make cases, couldn't they put the mounts in the spot where they'd fit in whatever frame you want...
That's awesome. If they have the ability to make cases, couldn't they put the mounts in the spot where they'd fit in whatever frame you want to use so you don't have to modify the frame or make new mounts?
Yes they could. In fact they made several mods for me already, but moving the mounts on the cases would take them extra time so for...
Yes they could.
In fact they made several mods for me already, but moving the mounts on the cases would take them extra time so for this build it was easy enough for me to move the mounts to fit the cases.
Have they looked into incorporating e-start?
144rider
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12/3/2017
Location
AU
1/5/2018 1:38pm
A big part of this build is because I want it... The other part is because it's KX500 against CR500 in a International spotlight B) I...
A big part of this build is because I want it...
The other part is because it's KX500 against CR500 in a International spotlight Cool
I know I have my work cut out for me because Adam Millar is a mechanical genius..
I am no where near his level...
But I do have a few small tricks up my sleeve that should prove to make it a interesting competition.
Plus I'm starting with a advantage... KX500 Woohoo
I just hope I can do this build justice to put in a good showing...
Time will tell...
Forget about it!

You're killing it Cool
Sandblaster
Posts
414
Joined
8/11/2016
Location
Eugene, OR US
1/5/2018 6:07pm
Shredder wrote:
That's awesome. If they have the ability to make cases, couldn't they put the mounts in the spot where they'd fit in whatever frame you want...
That's awesome. If they have the ability to make cases, couldn't they put the mounts in the spot where they'd fit in whatever frame you want to use so you don't have to modify the frame or make new mounts?
Yes they could. In fact they made several mods for me already, but moving the mounts on the cases would take them extra time so for...
Yes they could.
In fact they made several mods for me already, but moving the mounts on the cases would take them extra time so for this build it was easy enough for me to move the mounts to fit the cases.
Bigfoot wrote:
Have they looked into incorporating e-start?
I don't know.
After seeing the quality of their work I wish they would.
Sandblaster
Posts
414
Joined
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Location
Eugene, OR US
1/5/2018 6:09pm
A big part of this build is because I want it... The other part is because it's KX500 against CR500 in a International spotlight B) I...
A big part of this build is because I want it...
The other part is because it's KX500 against CR500 in a International spotlight Cool
I know I have my work cut out for me because Adam Millar is a mechanical genius..
I am no where near his level...
But I do have a few small tricks up my sleeve that should prove to make it a interesting competition.
Plus I'm starting with a advantage... KX500 Woohoo
I just hope I can do this build justice to put in a good showing...
Time will tell...
144rider wrote:
Forget about it!

You're killing it Cool
Thanks!
I appreciate that...
Sandblaster
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414
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Eugene, OR US
1/6/2018 11:30am Edited Date/Time 1/6/2018 11:31am
Since I am using an electric starter the pipe needs to stick out just a bit further then any pipe I have Sad
You can see here where they all hit.



My solution is to get a new cone pipe made.
But I don't want them to use my fancy pants electric starter for a template to work around.
When all else fails I turn back to wood working.



It bolts right up and simulates the Electric starter perfectly



It's crude but effective
Now I can send the template to the pipe maker and they have something to work with..
Sandblaster
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Eugene, OR US
1/7/2018 8:20am
Any time you put together a prototype you can expect to run into some issues... Unsure
This is a minor issue that will only effect you if you are using the TSR cases with the Panthera E-Start.



As you can see there is quite a gap between the cases and the starter housing.
The Panthera starter housing has a lip around the outside edge.
The lip goes most of the way around.
I suspect that it is there for alignment.
The issue is that part of the lip hits on the case.



So a little material has to removed from the starter housing lip area.





Sandblaster
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Eugene, OR US
1/8/2018 7:50am
I've got the starter housing ready to machine... Except I put a piece of tape over the vent area that is not shown in this pic..



In this pic you can see the area of the Engine cases that is interfering with the starter housing.



Here is what a stock case looks like in the same area.
As you can see it has much more recess in it then does the TSR cases do.



Kkawi
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Location
Northville, MI US
1/8/2018 8:07pm
I've got the starter housing ready to machine... Except I put a piece of tape over the vent area that is not shown in this pic...
I've got the starter housing ready to machine... Except I put a piece of tape over the vent area that is not shown in this pic..



In this pic you can see the area of the Engine cases that is interfering with the starter housing.



Here is what a stock case looks like in the same area.
As you can see it has much more recess in it then does the TSR cases do.



Wow man. This is probably the coolest build Ive ever seen. You are totally killing it! And getting to be in MXA is so cool!! I want to do a build like this one day...

Is this gonna be your "daily driver" or what do you intend to ride with this bike?

The frame and engine stuff is pretty genius, shit is overwhelming to me. Id really like to learn all the fab stuff.
Sandblaster
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414
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Location
Eugene, OR US
1/8/2018 8:22pm
Thanks!
To be honest it's like being struck by lightning.
It's really cool... but kinda scary Dizzy
I plan on riding it hard... but taking good care of it.
It will likely see some woods occasionally but likely desert and dunes is where it will live.
The bottom end will stay with this chassis.
The top end may get moved around depending on how I like it when it is done.
I have some really cool motor mods that I've dreamed up so we'll see how it works out.
The goal is to maintain or increase stock bottom end power but have significantly more top end...
Go ahead... Flame me... I love it... Lol..
I've talked to a few industry leaders including Stewart who has the current KX500 Land speed record about my approach and although none have tried it themselves they say that my idea's should work... But time will tell.. Cool
Bearuno
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AU
1/9/2018 12:19am Edited Date/Time 1/9/2018 12:35am
Things like that small section of interference of the P case to another manufacturers set of cases is to be expected.The manufacturer of the main cases just has to make it so std items fit, or they let people know of any mods required to fit std items to their product

Looks like 5 minutes with a file / a few seconds with a linisher to rectify it. Unless I've missed something, I'd not bother with saddling it up to my mill myself, but, I've fabricated things for decades now, so things like that don't faze me. But, on the other hand, my 'puter or 'phone goes 'Ping', and I freeze with fear......Woohoo Horses for courses, as they say.

Have you checked the intermediate / back torque limiting gear for 'true'? (if you recall my video from a few pages ago).

I'd be really interested in if they've made decent part(s) yet.

The noise from my massively out of wack (2 of them) parts is horrendous, and they are bound to fail / cause other parts to fail. I've not had an answer from Panthera on how bad it is and, when they will provide part(s) that are safe to use.Those Gears, the ES motor carrier/ sprocket cover that fits so badly , and a sprag clutch / rotor (that won't rub against each other without the thrust shims I've had to fit) are dreadful - They seem not to give a damn.

See how thin the 'ears' of the gear carrier case are - mine arrived damaged, and with 7mm holes to accommodate 6mm bolts. I made a reinforcement plate to take care of both problems - problems, together with the other Numerous , far worse problems that should never exist on something that cost over $2,500.

PS : re that breather they have.

It's neat little thing,and it's higher than the std case 'slot'.

But , if you plan to get near any water, you'd be wise the replace that fitting, which If I recall correctly is 1/8"NPT, with a 10mm x 1mm banjo bolt and fitting to take a hose. I live by a River and have many creek crossings, so I 'submarine' to the airbox top fairly often. A line up into the back bone, with my topmount airfilter/ airbox I have, and you have non watered / emulsified oil ignition / gear casing.

A 10mm x 1mm tap will go straight in, it's pretty much the same initial pitch as the 1/8"NPT, without the taper, so it 'cuts' in perfectly. Just make sure you don't use an overly long banjo bolt, that may interfere with the crown wheeled gear.
Sandblaster
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Eugene, OR US
1/9/2018 7:48am
Bearuno wrote:
Things like that small section of interference of the P case to another manufacturers set of cases is to be expected.The manufacturer of the main cases...
Things like that small section of interference of the P case to another manufacturers set of cases is to be expected.The manufacturer of the main cases just has to make it so std items fit, or they let people know of any mods required to fit std items to their product

Looks like 5 minutes with a file / a few seconds with a linisher to rectify it. Unless I've missed something, I'd not bother with saddling it up to my mill myself, but, I've fabricated things for decades now, so things like that don't faze me. But, on the other hand, my 'puter or 'phone goes 'Ping', and I freeze with fear......Woohoo Horses for courses, as they say.

Have you checked the intermediate / back torque limiting gear for 'true'? (if you recall my video from a few pages ago).

I'd be really interested in if they've made decent part(s) yet.

The noise from my massively out of wack (2 of them) parts is horrendous, and they are bound to fail / cause other parts to fail. I've not had an answer from Panthera on how bad it is and, when they will provide part(s) that are safe to use.Those Gears, the ES motor carrier/ sprocket cover that fits so badly , and a sprag clutch / rotor (that won't rub against each other without the thrust shims I've had to fit) are dreadful - They seem not to give a damn.

See how thin the 'ears' of the gear carrier case are - mine arrived damaged, and with 7mm holes to accommodate 6mm bolts. I made a reinforcement plate to take care of both problems - problems, together with the other Numerous , far worse problems that should never exist on something that cost over $2,500.

PS : re that breather they have.

It's neat little thing,and it's higher than the std case 'slot'.

But , if you plan to get near any water, you'd be wise the replace that fitting, which If I recall correctly is 1/8"NPT, with a 10mm x 1mm banjo bolt and fitting to take a hose. I live by a River and have many creek crossings, so I 'submarine' to the airbox top fairly often. A line up into the back bone, with my topmount airfilter/ airbox I have, and you have non watered / emulsified oil ignition / gear casing.

A 10mm x 1mm tap will go straight in, it's pretty much the same initial pitch as the 1/8"NPT, without the taper, so it 'cuts' in perfectly. Just make sure you don't use an overly long banjo bolt, that may interfere with the crown wheeled gear.
You are right... all things considered, the fix was simple...
I didn't use a hand file but I used my elcheapo milling machine.. Laughing



I have not checked the gears yet but intent to in the near future.
I did note that they used some very short bolts for the cover so I ordered some longer bolts.
My general rule is that with aluminum I like to have at least twice the diameter of the bolt in thread engagement.
These were not even close... And since I love titanium I'm sure you can guess what sort of bolts I ordered Cool

I don't have any water crossings where I generally ride (Desert and dunes) but I think it is something that I should take a close look at.

I really appreciate all the heads up that you have given me. Hopefully I can cobble something together that actually works Dry
shuggs
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1574
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8/6/2008
Location
Dunfermline GB
1/9/2018 8:25am
I for one cannot wait to see finished bike - if you can get a real photo shoot done
Sandblaster
Posts
414
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Location
Eugene, OR US
1/9/2018 9:19am
shuggs wrote:
I for one cannot wait to see finished bike - if you can get a real photo shoot done
I'm hoping to get some video as well Woohoo
144rider
Posts
140
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Location
AU
1/9/2018 2:39pm
For your viewing pleasure... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/01/09/236937/s1200_KX_GURU_RACING.COM_2016_KTX500_BUILD_226.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/01/09/236938/s1200_KX_GURU_RACING.COM_2016_KTX500_BUILD_227.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/01/09/236939/s1200_KX_GURU_RACING.COM_2016_KTX500_BUILD_228.jpg[/img]
For your viewing pleasure...









2
David934
Posts
806
Joined
8/17/2016
Location
CZ
1/10/2018 3:59am Edited Date/Time 1/10/2018 4:00am
For your viewing pleasure... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/01/09/236937/s1200_KX_GURU_RACING.COM_2016_KTX500_BUILD_226.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/01/09/236938/s1200_KX_GURU_RACING.COM_2016_KTX500_BUILD_227.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/01/09/236939/s1200_KX_GURU_RACING.COM_2016_KTX500_BUILD_228.jpg[/img]
For your viewing pleasure...







you tried to fold it together with gearbox and crank? If yes, no problem, good quality? I think I would have ordered them too for my CR
Sandblaster
Posts
414
Joined
8/11/2016
Location
Eugene, OR US
1/10/2018 8:00am
For your viewing pleasure... [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/01/09/236937/s1200_KX_GURU_RACING.COM_2016_KTX500_BUILD_226.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/01/09/236938/s1200_KX_GURU_RACING.COM_2016_KTX500_BUILD_227.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/01/09/236939/s1200_KX_GURU_RACING.COM_2016_KTX500_BUILD_228.jpg[/img]
For your viewing pleasure...







David934 wrote:
you tried to fold it together with gearbox and crank? If yes, no problem, good quality? I think I would have ordered them too for my...
you tried to fold it together with gearbox and crank? If yes, no problem, good quality? I think I would have ordered them too for my CR
TSR assembled before they sent them to me.
What neither of us has done yet is run it Shocked

But we'll get to that soon enough.

The TSR CR500 cases are awesome as well and they have been totally tested and they work great.
Adam Millar the builder of the CR500/KTM hybrid that I'm competing against is also using TSR cases in his build...









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