Full Tilt TM Racing Two Stroke Build(s) Update: Dirt Magazine "Two Stroke Tuesday"

chuckdavies
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Coventry GB
3/18/2019 2:23am
Any reason for the rotor swap? I like the OEM rotors a lot - light and plenty strong once the brakes are bed in. PS I...
Any reason for the rotor swap?

I like the OEM rotors a lot - light and plenty strong once the brakes are bed in.

PS I followed you on instagram - you were in the search feed on a riding clip -
you looked to be ripping the thing!
I bought a spare set of wheels to take racing, so bought a second set of rotors too so they're built up ready to swap straight into the bike.

Decided to go for Galfer to match OEM, and liked the look of the slotted wave design the same as the Factory TM bikes use...

Appreciate the follow and comments, loving the bike!
cdoggy81
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St. Petersburg, FL US
3/18/2019 9:52am
Thank you very much for the info Derek. Confirms what I have thought for a while, specially with the 250 :-)

The Shop

blackdiamond
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Grapevine , TX US
3/27/2019 1:30pm
Yes the hard work is done now so get in touch with him and he can make you a set up.
What is the best way to get in touch with them? I sent them a message through the website 3 days ago and I still have not heard anything back yet.
chuckdavies
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3/28/2019 3:17am
What is the best way to get in touch with them? I sent them a message through the website 3 days ago and I still have...
What is the best way to get in touch with them? I sent them a message through the website 3 days ago and I still have not heard anything back yet.
Message Stevie Denton through Facebook.

Graphics look great - really clean look!
DerickYZ
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541
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Salamanca, NY US
4/12/2019 8:39pm
Dumb question, however what is the part availability like on these bikes? If I were to get another brand new bike I might get a TM or a YZ. 125/250 2 stroke model. I live in the Northeast and we have a dealer in PA.

Where do you find parts? Sweet build!
blackdiamond
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Grapevine , TX US
4/13/2019 11:38am
DerickYZ wrote:
Dumb question, however what is the part availability like on these bikes? If I were to get another brand new bike I might get a TM...
Dumb question, however what is the part availability like on these bikes? If I were to get another brand new bike I might get a TM or a YZ. 125/250 2 stroke model. I live in the Northeast and we have a dealer in PA.

Where do you find parts? Sweet build!
They have nearly everything here in the states, parts availability is better than KTM in most cases.
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DerickYZ
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Salamanca, NY US
4/14/2019 10:45am
DerickYZ wrote:
Dumb question, however what is the part availability like on these bikes? If I were to get another brand new bike I might get a TM...
Dumb question, however what is the part availability like on these bikes? If I were to get another brand new bike I might get a TM or a YZ. 125/250 2 stroke model. I live in the Northeast and we have a dealer in PA.

Where do you find parts? Sweet build!
They have nearly everything here in the states, parts availability is better than KTM in most cases.
Awesome to hear. Maybe one day I'll bite the bullet. However I'm a weekend warrior at the time. If I do get a bike new bike again, I will strongly consider a TM144.
blackdiamond
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Grapevine , TX US
4/14/2019 12:28pm
DerickYZ wrote:
Dumb question, however what is the part availability like on these bikes? If I were to get another brand new bike I might get a TM...
Dumb question, however what is the part availability like on these bikes? If I were to get another brand new bike I might get a TM or a YZ. 125/250 2 stroke model. I live in the Northeast and we have a dealer in PA.

Where do you find parts? Sweet build!
They have nearly everything here in the states, parts availability is better than KTM in most cases.
DerickYZ wrote:
Awesome to hear. Maybe one day I'll bite the bullet. However I'm a weekend warrior at the time. If I do get a bike new bike...
Awesome to hear. Maybe one day I'll bite the bullet. However I'm a weekend warrior at the time. If I do get a bike new bike again, I will strongly consider a TM144.
Honestly I think the 144 is the hidden gem in the TM lineup. That thing makes an honest 42 HP right out of the crate and will easily outrun a KTM 150.

TM did it right and instead of just using an over-bored 125 they built a completely different engine with a different crank, stroke, cylinder etc.
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blackdiamond
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5/29/2019 12:03am
I just wanted to post a few of the pics that fellow Vital member @FWYT took of these machines in the studio last week.

These pics came out amazing!















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5/29/2019 12:12am Edited Date/Time 5/29/2019 12:12am
Beautiful bikes BD. Been waiting for an update for long time
JMX82
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Hyllykallio FI
5/29/2019 12:19am
Have you had a change to ride those beauties yet?
1
blackdiamond
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Grapevine , TX US
5/29/2019 1:06pm
JMX82 wrote:
Have you had a change to ride those beauties yet?
Not much, just some basic testing so far. I am still dealing with some issues in my right knee so it will be a bit longer before I get them on the track myself.
1
nytsmaC
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Frig Off CA
6/23/2019 3:38pm
Honestly I think the 144 is the hidden gem in the TM lineup. That thing makes an honest 42 HP right out of the crate and...
Honestly I think the 144 is the hidden gem in the TM lineup. That thing makes an honest 42 HP right out of the crate and will easily outrun a KTM 150.

TM did it right and instead of just using an over-bored 125 they built a completely different engine with a different crank, stroke, cylinder etc.
The 144 is such a great bike, I barely ever rode my 250 while I owned both. Relatively no vibration, smooth broad powerband that really ripped and the handling was unreal. It’s gotta be my favorite bike of all time and the one I never should have sold.
Lasse
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DK
Fantasy
2966th
6/26/2019 6:37am
This is a vague question, with a lot of ifs and buts.

Would you say it's worth/possible upgrading an '05 YZ125 to operate on a somewhat equal level?

Debating whether to modernize the YZ that I already have or spend the 9.5k USD a TM costs here.

For the record I'd go for the 144.
blackdiamond
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6/26/2019 9:57am
Lasse wrote:
This is a vague question, with a lot of ifs and buts. Would you say it's worth/possible upgrading an '05 YZ125 to operate on a somewhat...
This is a vague question, with a lot of ifs and buts.

Would you say it's worth/possible upgrading an '05 YZ125 to operate on a somewhat equal level?

Debating whether to modernize the YZ that I already have or spend the 9.5k USD a TM costs here.

For the record I'd go for the 144.
You could get close to a stock TM with mods on the YZ but the chassis is much better on the TM in my opinion.
Lasse
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6/26/2019 12:29pm
You could get close to a stock TM with mods on the YZ but the chassis is much better on the TM in my opinion.
Thanks for replying.

Do you know if there are any major differences between the 2017 and 2019?
blackdiamond
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6/26/2019 12:33pm
You could get close to a stock TM with mods on the YZ but the chassis is much better on the TM in my opinion.
Lasse wrote:
Thanks for replying.

Do you know if there are any major differences between the 2017 and 2019?
To my knowledge there are very few changes on the 125 and 144.
Barbatos
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3
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BE
7/9/2019 2:23am
Lasse wrote:
Thanks for replying.

Do you know if there are any major differences between the 2017 and 2019?
Hi there,

Disclaimer: Sorry BD if this fills up your thread with unrelated things, please delete this or tell me to delete my post if you find it disturbing.

Anyways since most people here are from north america and are not so familiar with the TM's I'll try to chime in with some info. I live in Europe and here these things are still rare but more known than on your side of the pond. If you want to know the difference between any version of TM from the aluminium framed ones (from 2008 on), just go to the TM website and go to the download section. There you can find parts catalogues for every bike, frame and engine separate. Is there no catalogue, then go to the first catalogue from the year before and so on. Even then you'll see that when you compare parts numbers not a lot changes each year, it's more of a evolution each year. 4t is 4 stroke, 2t is 2 stroke. Frames are unchanged since 2008 except for 2019 because the 250/300 has the oil now in the frame. Still the same frame but now with sight glass and some other small changes. Engine cases cannot be found on the catalogues because of case numbers which need to match, so it's difficult to check changes there but with some google search you'll come a long way 🙂. In your case it seems not a lot has changed. The bikes from 2015 on are the same until 2019. This year the 250/300 frame is different like said earlier. Also at 2016 they change the type of aluminum used for the frame, only difference than this between 2015-18 and 2019 is some fork internals, which you can easily order online for cheap and the stickers + exhaust. Engine wise there are more differences. From 17/18 to 19 they changed crankcases, piston and rings. All the rest is the same. From 16 to 17/18 they changed some gearbox internals, and some clutch plates. 15-16 had changes in gearbox shafts. All in all it's easy to find usg the manuals and a little bit of common sense. TM clearly states which parts are different from the year before. I Hope I helped you a little bit and if you have any questions please DM me because I don't know if BD wants his thread filled with things not really related to his build. If he's okay with it just post and I'll try to help.

The website: https://www.tmracing.it/download-moto/?lang=en
Pirate421
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MA US
7/11/2019 6:50pm Edited Date/Time 7/11/2019 6:50pm
Efi coming in 2020? These came out awesome very intriguing
blackdiamond
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Grapevine , TX US
7/12/2019 9:32am
Pirate421 wrote:
Efi coming in 2020? These came out awesome very intriguing
The 2019 300 is already EFI in Europe.
blackdiamond
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Grapevine , TX US
8/31/2019 5:27pm
That is true and i’d definitely not want to harm that awesome power up-top. The only pic i have of a TM 144 with Ti2 silencer...
That is true and i’d definitely not want to harm that awesome power up-top.

The only pic i have of a TM 144 with Ti2 silencer looks a sensible length though. Even utilises the second subframe bracket too.
I was wrong about the PC silencer for the 125/144. It is actually longer than stock (not shorter like I thought it was)

I just did a ton of testing a few weeks ago at Varner Motorsports. We tested pipes, silencers, cylinder heads, fuel, jetting, cylinder porting, timing, ignitions, you name it. After 60 dyno runs (mostly on the 144) we picked up over 4 HP on both bikes.

The best combo on both the 144 was the stock pipe and PC silencer. On the 144 the HGS pipe that comes stock was clearly superior to the PC on the stock and modified cylinder. The stock pipe makes over 3/4 HP more and extends the power- band another 800 RPM.

This pic below is the PC pipe/PC silencer (red) vs the HGS pipe/PC silencer (blue)



3
H4L
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CA US
8/31/2019 7:41pm
Those are some good #’s out of the 144. Anticipating the 250 dyno run. Did Varner do the engine mods. on them ?
blackdiamond
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Grapevine , TX US
8/31/2019 8:05pm
H4L wrote:
Those are some good #’s out of the 144. Anticipating the 250 dyno run. Did Varner do the engine mods. on them ?
Yes, he did all of the porting and tuning.

The 250 dyno chart below shows a ported/tuned 2005 CR 250 vs a ported/tuned 2018 TM 250.

The bottom to mid is better on the high compression CR but the TM makes over 4 HP more on a very modest fuel (70% pump gas mixed with 30% Sunoco Supreme Leaded)





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H4L
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CA US
8/31/2019 8:15pm
Interesting I just talked to him about a week ago & he mentioned he can get 55 hp out of the 02-07 CR2. That’s on 50/50 good pump fuel & race gas. Going to be sending him an 03 cyl. / head to do.

Looking forward to a ride report..
2
blackdiamond
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9/2/2019 1:58pm Edited Date/Time 9/2/2019 2:03pm
Here is a pic of the dyno results on the TM 144 with the Varner engine package vs stock.


blackdiamond
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9/2/2019 2:02pm
Here is a pic of the dyno results of the Varner engine package on the TM 144 vs a stock KTM 150SX


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