Additional $1225 in fees over MSRP for new bikes? Really?

8tensolutions wrote:

I would love to know what some of you jerky's do for a living and what the margin is on the work/product/service you're responsible for. Margins...

I would love to know what some of you jerky's do for a living and what the margin is on the work/product/service you're responsible for. Margins on new bikes are garbage to start with, the manufacturer charges the freight (not the dealer), a doc fee pays the office staff to handle the title app/financing/mso etc, and the assembly pays for just that. How is any of that unfair? If it is so bad, then other dealers likely aren't charging it ,so go see them or buy a used bike.

agn5008 wrote:

Some dealers aren’t charging it. And I found a good one who doesn’t. See here’s the thing, I have been spending A LOT of money on...

Some dealers aren’t charging it. And I found a good one who doesn’t. See here’s the thing, I have been spending A LOT of money on this sport for a really long time. And I’m gonna continue to spend a lot of money until I’m gone. I’m a lifer, much like a ton of other people here. We are the ones who will be here til the end. These dealers are taking advantage of the new comers who buy a bike then sell it after they figure out they aren’t that into it. All that’s doing is pissing the “lifers” off. We will remember which dealers tried to bone us when all this passes. My closest Gas Gas dealer tried selling me a 300 for $12,500. I burst out laughing then told him I’ll never spend another penny there. Then found a place to sell me a KTM 300 for $10k OTD. Now put that into perspective once. I got a bike that costs almost $1000 more MSRP for $2500 cheaper. That’s a $3500 swing between the two dealers. Don’t you think that’s a little excessive on a $9600 MSRP item? How much do you expect these guys to make? Like I said, they can take advantage of the newbies who will buy one bike then never buy another again. That’s fine, but us lifers won’t forget it. This is making it very easy to figure out who the honorable dealers are.

8tensolutions wrote:

I would love to know what some of you jerky's do for a living and what the margin is on the work/product/service you're responsible for. Margins...

I would love to know what some of you jerky's do for a living and what the margin is on the work/product/service you're responsible for. Margins on new bikes are garbage to start with, the manufacturer charges the freight (not the dealer), a doc fee pays the office staff to handle the title app/financing/mso etc, and the assembly pays for just that. How is any of that unfair? If it is so bad, then other dealers likely aren't charging it ,so go see them or buy a used bike.

CKNY wrote:

It’s unfair if they charge a $300 admin fee to title my bike because I’m pretty sure they are not paying their admin person $600 an...

It’s unfair if they charge a $300 admin fee to title my bike because I’m pretty sure they are not paying their admin person $600 an hour. I shouldn’t have to pay for someone to do paperwork on a finance deal either when they are making $500 off of it. Also shouldn’t have to pay the shop jockey $600 an hour to uncrate the bike and assemble. Luckily my dealer has some class and doesn’t try to rape their customers. They are also fortunate enough to have a successful equipment company to begin with, the bikes are an add on biz. I’ve sent over a half dozen guys there this season for new bikes and will send more.

8tensolutions wrote:

I would love to know what some of you jerky's do for a living and what the margin is on the work/product/service you're responsible for. Margins...

I would love to know what some of you jerky's do for a living and what the margin is on the work/product/service you're responsible for. Margins on new bikes are garbage to start with, the manufacturer charges the freight (not the dealer), a doc fee pays the office staff to handle the title app/financing/mso etc, and the assembly pays for just that. How is any of that unfair? If it is so bad, then other dealers likely aren't charging it ,so go see them or buy a used bike.

CKNY wrote:

It’s unfair if they charge a $300 admin fee to title my bike because I’m pretty sure they are not paying their admin person $600 an...

It’s unfair if they charge a $300 admin fee to title my bike because I’m pretty sure they are not paying their admin person $600 an hour. I shouldn’t have to pay for someone to do paperwork on a finance deal either when they are making $500 off of it. Also shouldn’t have to pay the shop jockey $600 an hour to uncrate the bike and assemble. Luckily my dealer has some class and doesn’t try to rape their customers. They are also fortunate enough to have a successful equipment company to begin with, the bikes are an add on biz. I’ve sent over a half dozen guys there this season for new bikes and will send more.

agn5008 wrote:

Exactly. I don’t understand how some people here are justifying these ridiculous fees. They act like it’s a privilege for me to purchase a dirt bike...

Exactly. I don’t understand how some people here are justifying these ridiculous fees. They act like it’s a privilege for me to purchase a dirt bike with my hard earned money off of a dealer. No, it’s a privilege that I’m spending MY money at your dealership. If you take advantage of me and charge ridiculous prices then I will go somewhere else and quite honestly, I’ll never come back to your dealership. I want dealerships to make money but I also don’t want screwed over. Like I said before, charge me full MSRP during these times. I am totally fine with that since these bikes are selling like hot cakes right now. But if you try to charge me over MSRP I’m gonna go to a more honorable dealer and give them the privilege of taking my money.

MXer391 wrote:

Here's how to buy a new bike: Call dealer, ask out the door price, write down price, hang up and call the next dealer and ask...

Here's how to buy a new bike: Call dealer, ask out the door price, write down price, hang up and call the next dealer and ask the same thing. I couldn't give a sh*t less what fees they charge for this and that. All that matters is the out the door price. Once you find a reasonable out the door price, go buy your bike or negotiate with dealer you want. I dunno how you guys get all wrapped up in this dealer fees stuff. Who cares.

mattyhamz2 wrote:

Not sure about your area, but maybe 5% of dealerships here will actually give an OTD price over the phone. The other 95% tell you that...

Not sure about your area, but maybe 5% of dealerships here will actually give an OTD price over the phone. The other 95% tell you that you need to come in first.

MXer391 wrote:

Here's how to buy a new bike: Call dealer, ask out the door price, write down price, hang up and call the next dealer and ask...

Here's how to buy a new bike: Call dealer, ask out the door price, write down price, hang up and call the next dealer and ask the same thing. I couldn't give a sh*t less what fees they charge for this and that. All that matters is the out the door price. Once you find a reasonable out the door price, go buy your bike or negotiate with dealer you want. I dunno how you guys get all wrapped up in this dealer fees stuff. Who cares.

mattyhamz2 wrote:

Not sure about your area, but maybe 5% of dealerships here will actually give an OTD price over the phone. The other 95% tell you that...

Not sure about your area, but maybe 5% of dealerships here will actually give an OTD price over the phone. The other 95% tell you that you need to come in first.

8tensolutions wrote:

I would love to know what some of you jerky's do for a living and what the margin is on the work/product/service you're responsible for. Margins...

I would love to know what some of you jerky's do for a living and what the margin is on the work/product/service you're responsible for. Margins on new bikes are garbage to start with, the manufacturer charges the freight (not the dealer), a doc fee pays the office staff to handle the title app/financing/mso etc, and the assembly pays for just that. How is any of that unfair? If it is so bad, then other dealers likely aren't charging it ,so go see them or buy a used bike.

agn5008 wrote:

Some dealers aren’t charging it. And I found a good one who doesn’t. See here’s the thing, I have been spending A LOT of money on...

Some dealers aren’t charging it. And I found a good one who doesn’t. See here’s the thing, I have been spending A LOT of money on this sport for a really long time. And I’m gonna continue to spend a lot of money until I’m gone. I’m a lifer, much like a ton of other people here. We are the ones who will be here til the end. These dealers are taking advantage of the new comers who buy a bike then sell it after they figure out they aren’t that into it. All that’s doing is pissing the “lifers” off. We will remember which dealers tried to bone us when all this passes. My closest Gas Gas dealer tried selling me a 300 for $12,500. I burst out laughing then told him I’ll never spend another penny there. Then found a place to sell me a KTM 300 for $10k OTD. Now put that into perspective once. I got a bike that costs almost $1000 more MSRP for $2500 cheaper. That’s a $3500 swing between the two dealers. Don’t you think that’s a little excessive on a $9600 MSRP item? How much do you expect these guys to make? Like I said, they can take advantage of the newbies who will buy one bike then never buy another again. That’s fine, but us lifers won’t forget it. This is making it very easy to figure out who the honorable dealers are.

8tensolutions wrote:

If you have been spending "all this money for a long time", how do you not have a relationship with a local shop.....or have you just...

If you have been spending "all this money for a long time", how do you not have a relationship with a local shop.....or have you just been spending all this money wherever was cheapest etc? And if you think a 35% margin is excessive I will ask again what you do for a living.

MXer391 wrote:

Here's how to buy a new bike: Call dealer, ask out the door price, write down price, hang up and call the next dealer and ask...

Here's how to buy a new bike: Call dealer, ask out the door price, write down price, hang up and call the next dealer and ask the same thing. I couldn't give a sh*t less what fees they charge for this and that. All that matters is the out the door price. Once you find a reasonable out the door price, go buy your bike or negotiate with dealer you want. I dunno how you guys get all wrapped up in this dealer fees stuff. Who cares.

mattyhamz2 wrote:

Not sure about your area, but maybe 5% of dealerships here will actually give an OTD price over the phone. The other 95% tell you that...

Not sure about your area, but maybe 5% of dealerships here will actually give an OTD price over the phone. The other 95% tell you that you need to come in first.

lostboy819 wrote:

Exactly, people are wasting their time calling and trying to get a OTD price over the phone. Most sales people wont waste time on people over...

Exactly, people are wasting their time calling and trying to get a OTD price over the phone. Most sales people wont waste time on people over the phone because 90% of them are blowhards with no money or kids. If you are serious about buys a bike you go to the shop.

8tensolutions wrote:

I would love to know what some of you jerky's do for a living and what the margin is on the work/product/service you're responsible for. Margins...

I would love to know what some of you jerky's do for a living and what the margin is on the work/product/service you're responsible for. Margins on new bikes are garbage to start with, the manufacturer charges the freight (not the dealer), a doc fee pays the office staff to handle the title app/financing/mso etc, and the assembly pays for just that. How is any of that unfair? If it is so bad, then other dealers likely aren't charging it ,so go see them or buy a used bike.

CKNY wrote:

It’s unfair if they charge a $300 admin fee to title my bike because I’m pretty sure they are not paying their admin person $600 an...

It’s unfair if they charge a $300 admin fee to title my bike because I’m pretty sure they are not paying their admin person $600 an hour. I shouldn’t have to pay for someone to do paperwork on a finance deal either when they are making $500 off of it. Also shouldn’t have to pay the shop jockey $600 an hour to uncrate the bike and assemble. Luckily my dealer has some class and doesn’t try to rape their customers. They are also fortunate enough to have a successful equipment company to begin with, the bikes are an add on biz. I’ve sent over a half dozen guys there this season for new bikes and will send more.

8tensolutions wrote:

It's not about "fair" and who cares how much somebody makes an hour. If you don't find the value in what they are charging go elsewhere...

It's not about "fair" and who cares how much somebody makes an hour. If you don't find the value in what they are charging go elsewhere. Do you think it's unfair that Chick Filet makes an 80% margin on that sandwich and 95% margin on the Dr Pepper you happily pay for?

Once again, if you built a relationship with the dealer, they would work with you. Call the nearest dealer and make your best deal in total cost. Who cares where the $'s go if you are happy with the final price. If you are not happy with that price, don't buy it. Simple.

mark_swart wrote:

I'm the original poster - thanks everyone for your insights. I'm going to follow up on a positive note. First, again, having not bought a brand...

I'm the original poster - thanks everyone for your insights. I'm going to follow up on a positive note.

First, again, having not bought a brand new bike in a long time, I think it's pretty crappy for the manufacturers to tack on that $485 mandatory shipping fee and then make the dealers the bad guys who have to break that news to customers.

I used to work at a dealership, and I certainly know they have to make a profit and that margins aren't huge. But no, I'm not going to feel bad about calling someone out who is blatantly marking up a product just because they can.

But I took some advice from this thread. As I continued to call around, I paid attention who who was nice and who didn't seem to give a shit that I wanted to buy a $10K TOY from them. I found the best price at a dealer about 5 hours from me, and I was willing to drive it. But I took a shot by calling back a closer dealer, one of the ones that was actually FRIENDLY and RESPONSIVE when I contacted them at first, and asked if they could come close to the other dealer's price. They couldn't match, but they came close enough that I'm sure it would offset my time, gas, etc., to get to the other dealer. Plus, I'm hopefully starting a great relationship with a dealer closer to home. I sent them a deposit and I should have a '22 350 SXF as soon as it arrives.

I am SO ready to get this process over with and speak with my wallet!!

MXer391 wrote:

Here's how to buy a new bike: Call dealer, ask out the door price, write down price, hang up and call the next dealer and ask...

Here's how to buy a new bike: Call dealer, ask out the door price, write down price, hang up and call the next dealer and ask the same thing. I couldn't give a sh*t less what fees they charge for this and that. All that matters is the out the door price. Once you find a reasonable out the door price, go buy your bike or negotiate with dealer you want. I dunno how you guys get all wrapped up in this dealer fees stuff. Who cares.

mattyhamz2 wrote:

Not sure about your area, but maybe 5% of dealerships here will actually give an OTD price over the phone. The other 95% tell you that...

Not sure about your area, but maybe 5% of dealerships here will actually give an OTD price over the phone. The other 95% tell you that you need to come in first.

lostboy819 wrote:

Exactly, people are wasting their time calling and trying to get a OTD price over the phone. Most sales people wont waste time on people over...

Exactly, people are wasting their time calling and trying to get a OTD price over the phone. Most sales people wont waste time on people over the phone because 90% of them are blowhards with no money or kids. If you are serious about buys a bike you go to the shop.

LungButter wrote:

I don't agree with unfair business practices by any means but some of ya'll sound like the epitome of the "racer" who thinks they deserve a...

I don't agree with unfair business practices by any means but some of ya'll sound like the epitome of the "racer" who thinks they deserve a discount on everything

CKNY wrote:

Sound more to me like people are happy to pay a fair price or MSRP, they just don’t agree with paying an inflated opportunistic cash grab...

Sound more to me like people are happy to pay a fair price or MSRP, they just don’t agree with paying an inflated opportunistic cash grab that was most likely not being charged a year ago.

LungButter wrote:

I don't agree with unfair business practices by any means but some of ya'll sound like the epitome of the "racer" who thinks they deserve a...

I don't agree with unfair business practices by any means but some of ya'll sound like the epitome of the "racer" who thinks they deserve a discount on everything

CKNY wrote:

Sound more to me like people are happy to pay a fair price or MSRP, they just don’t agree with paying an inflated opportunistic cash grab...

Sound more to me like people are happy to pay a fair price or MSRP, they just don’t agree with paying an inflated opportunistic cash grab that was most likely not being charged a year ago.

mark_swart wrote:

I'm the original poster - thanks everyone for your insights. I'm going to follow up on a positive note. First, again, having not bought a brand...

I'm the original poster - thanks everyone for your insights. I'm going to follow up on a positive note.

First, again, having not bought a brand new bike in a long time, I think it's pretty crappy for the manufacturers to tack on that $485 mandatory shipping fee and then make the dealers the bad guys who have to break that news to customers.

I used to work at a dealership, and I certainly know they have to make a profit and that margins aren't huge. But no, I'm not going to feel bad about calling someone out who is blatantly marking up a product just because they can.

But I took some advice from this thread. As I continued to call around, I paid attention who who was nice and who didn't seem to give a shit that I wanted to buy a $10K TOY from them. I found the best price at a dealer about 5 hours from me, and I was willing to drive it. But I took a shot by calling back a closer dealer, one of the ones that was actually FRIENDLY and RESPONSIVE when I contacted them at first, and asked if they could come close to the other dealer's price. They couldn't match, but they came close enough that I'm sure it would offset my time, gas, etc., to get to the other dealer. Plus, I'm hopefully starting a great relationship with a dealer closer to home. I sent them a deposit and I should have a '22 350 SXF as soon as it arrives.

I am SO ready to get this process over with and speak with my wallet!!

lostboy819 wrote:

Have you bought any lumber from Home Depot lately.

sandhills wrote:

At least they put the price on the website, if they acted like powersports dealers you'd have to call to find out what the freight charge...

At least they put the price on the website, if they acted like powersports dealers you'd have to call to find out what the freight charge, forklift fee, and receipt surcharge are for your 2x4 while they explain that "we gotta spend time doing all that you know when it arrives, and we gotta enter it into the register, process your payment, we can't just do that for free".

lostboy819 wrote:

Have you bought any lumber from Home Depot lately.

sandhills wrote:

At least they put the price on the website, if they acted like powersports dealers you'd have to call to find out what the freight charge...

At least they put the price on the website, if they acted like powersports dealers you'd have to call to find out what the freight charge, forklift fee, and receipt surcharge are for your 2x4 while they explain that "we gotta spend time doing all that you know when it arrives, and we gotta enter it into the register, process your payment, we can't just do that for free".

Falcon wrote:

The problem I have with dealer fees is that they are so dishonest. You are not paying "freight and setup," you are paying "dealer markup." The...

The problem I have with dealer fees is that they are so dishonest. You are not paying "freight and setup," you are paying "dealer markup."
The dealer gets a check at the end of the year for every unit sold. It is called "holdback," and it is basically a reduction in invoice cost. I don't know exactly what the dollar amount is on an MX machine, but it's a few hundy on each bike. Hmmm, the same few hundy that it costs to ship the machine to the dealer? Maybe....
So there goes the freight, for the most part.

As for "setup," they pay a low-tier mechanic $40 per flagged hour to do that job. The service department "charges" the sales department a half hour or full hour of labor to do the PDI on the unit. That's $20-$40 actual dollars going out to somebody, but $40-$80 dollars charged to the sales department. If they charged me $80 in "setup," I'd understand; they are covering their department's costs. $300/$400/$500 in "setup" is a markup, however.

Let's be honest and call it a markup. That said, every dealer has the right to markup their product how they see fit, just as AGN is free to buy at any another dealer.

Pistonslap wrote:

They should just say MSRP plus that stimulus check we know you got.

mark_swart wrote:

I'm the original poster - thanks everyone for your insights. I'm going to follow up on a positive note. First, again, having not bought a brand...

I'm the original poster - thanks everyone for your insights. I'm going to follow up on a positive note.

First, again, having not bought a brand new bike in a long time, I think it's pretty crappy for the manufacturers to tack on that $485 mandatory shipping fee and then make the dealers the bad guys who have to break that news to customers.

I used to work at a dealership, and I certainly know they have to make a profit and that margins aren't huge. But no, I'm not going to feel bad about calling someone out who is blatantly marking up a product just because they can.

But I took some advice from this thread. As I continued to call around, I paid attention who who was nice and who didn't seem to give a shit that I wanted to buy a $10K TOY from them. I found the best price at a dealer about 5 hours from me, and I was willing to drive it. But I took a shot by calling back a closer dealer, one of the ones that was actually FRIENDLY and RESPONSIVE when I contacted them at first, and asked if they could come close to the other dealer's price. They couldn't match, but they came close enough that I'm sure it would offset my time, gas, etc., to get to the other dealer. Plus, I'm hopefully starting a great relationship with a dealer closer to home. I sent them a deposit and I should have a '22 350 SXF as soon as it arrives.

I am SO ready to get this process over with and speak with my wallet!!

CKNY wrote:

It’s unfair if they charge a $300 admin fee to title my bike because I’m pretty sure they are not paying their admin person $600 an...

It’s unfair if they charge a $300 admin fee to title my bike because I’m pretty sure they are not paying their admin person $600 an hour. I shouldn’t have to pay for someone to do paperwork on a finance deal either when they are making $500 off of it. Also shouldn’t have to pay the shop jockey $600 an hour to uncrate the bike and assemble. Luckily my dealer has some class and doesn’t try to rape their customers. They are also fortunate enough to have a successful equipment company to begin with, the bikes are an add on biz. I’ve sent over a half dozen guys there this season for new bikes and will send more.

8tensolutions wrote:

It's not about "fair" and who cares how much somebody makes an hour. If you don't find the value in what they are charging go elsewhere...

It's not about "fair" and who cares how much somebody makes an hour. If you don't find the value in what they are charging go elsewhere. Do you think it's unfair that Chick Filet makes an 80% margin on that sandwich and 95% margin on the Dr Pepper you happily pay for?

Once again, if you built a relationship with the dealer, they would work with you. Call the nearest dealer and make your best deal in total cost. Who cares where the $'s go if you are happy with the final price. If you are not happy with that price, don't buy it. Simple.

CKNY wrote:

If Chick Fillet all the sudden decided to add on a bunch of bullshit fees or bury extra cost in their products then yeah, I might...

If Chick Fillet all the sudden decided to add on a bunch of bullshit fees or bury extra cost in their products then yeah, I might think it was unfair and say fuck em.
Same with a dealer, retailer, service provider etc.
There is something called fair business practices. There have been plenty of times I could jack up prices to a customer or client and give them a BS excuse or just not tell them but I don’t because most of my accounts are repeat business.
No one here is saying a dealer cannot charge what they want, we just most likely don’t agree and are half coherent enough to realize it’s a money grab.