Race fuel - 2 Stroke

Cliffy615
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Edited Date/Time 9/19/2015 8:41am
I am looking to run my bike on race fuel,

Don't know alot about it so looking for some advice,

I have a 2011 ktm 150, it's only done about 10 hours it has a boyesen rad valve a full fmf factory exhaust system.
May possibly look to get it ported at some time in the future.

Advice please on what is the best fuel and should i mix it 50/50 with pump gas (we can get hold of 99 octane super unleaded straight from the garage here)

done basic research but what are the pro's and cons of using such fuel. Cost not counting as a con as i am aware of what it'll cost.

Advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance
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cwtoyota
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Tacoma, WA US
9/7/2015 10:32am
Cliffy615 wrote:
I am looking to run my bike on race fuel, Don't know alot about it so looking for some advice, I have a 2011 ktm 150...
I am looking to run my bike on race fuel,

Don't know alot about it so looking for some advice,

I have a 2011 ktm 150, it's only done about 10 hours it has a boyesen rad valve a full fmf factory exhaust system.
May possibly look to get it ported at some time in the future.

Advice please on what is the best fuel and should i mix it 50/50 with pump gas (we can get hold of 99 octane super unleaded straight from the garage here)

done basic research but what are the pro's and cons of using such fuel. Cost not counting as a con as i am aware of what it'll cost.

Advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance
If money is no object, burn some VP C12 or other similar leaded race fuel and you'll find a few benefits. Race fuel doesn't load up a two stroke nearly as quickly or as bad as pump fuel. When you let the bike sit on the stand idling to warm up, you can walk over and just twist the throttle once or twice to clear it out. With pump fuel, it takes just a little bit more revving to clear out the engine. Good race fuel won't detonate nearly as easy, so it's cheap insurance for your engine especially if you ride deep sandy tracks and/or in a hot climate.

If you switch from typical pump fuel to a typical race fuel, you'll have to lean your jetting a bit.
So jet for the fuel that you can get consistently and stick with that fuel. If you have to drive 2 hours to a special shop to get fuel, forget it. Find a consistent, convenient, local supply and jet for that fuel.

For me, money is an object that I like to keep around. I mix a 50/50 blend of Trick 114 (R+M/2) and ethanol - free pump fuel 92 octane (R+M/2). Running the race fuel straight doesn't seem to have much added benefit over the 50/50 mix in my stock 125 or even in my ported, high compression 300cc two stroke.

That unleded 99 octane you have locally should actually work great if it's a consistent fuel (Batch to batch) and if it doesn't have all the Ethanol that we are stuck with here in the USA. (Up to 10% ethanol in most areas). Ethanol kills carburetors because it attracts moisture. It also has less energy.

In a stock two stroke, anything more than 96 octane is really not necessary.
More compression needs more octane and/or less timing, but most full race 2-strokes only need around 100 octane, sometimes less.

Two strokes and leaded race fuel go together like two things that go really well together [Simile School].

Charper732
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9/7/2015 11:11am Edited Date/Time 9/7/2015 11:32am
Good :VPR
Better: U4.4
Best: MRX02
The price tag more than doubles from good to best...

And just FYI, VPR IS T2... T2 is just a version that is already premixed.
Cliffy615
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9/7/2015 11:56pm
Thanks for taking the time out to give me all that info

The Shop

9/8/2015 6:56pm
Charper732 wrote:
Good :VPR Better: U4.4 Best: MRX02 The price tag more than doubles from good to best... And just FYI, VPR IS T2... T2 is just a...
Good :VPR
Better: U4.4
Best: MRX02
The price tag more than doubles from good to best...

And just FYI, VPR IS T2... T2 is just a version that is already premixed.
How hard is it to jet a 2 stroke to oxygenated fuel? I have a modded 15 300sx and run straight c12 is their a big gain with the oxygenated fuel with the smoker? If so thanks and ill give it a try
Charper732
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9/9/2015 8:39am
It's the same as jetting it for anything else.. I get them very close by just stand testing them. For me, jetting a 2t is a bit quicker than jetting a 4t.

MRX02 will blow your mind... But it cost...a LOT. I think it was $140 for a 5-gallon pail last time i checked...or maybe that was mr12...i dont remember.

U4.4 is considerably cheaper at like $70 for 5 gallons. It's not quite as good as mrx02 but its marginal, unless you need the best of the best..I'd stick with u4.4

Never let u4.4 or mrx02 sit in the carb for any length of time...or you will be replacing all the rubber/ o-rings.
mxb2
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Bowie, MD US
9/9/2015 12:57pm
Charper732 wrote:
It's the same as jetting it for anything else.. I get them very close by just stand testing them. For me, jetting a 2t is a...
It's the same as jetting it for anything else.. I get them very close by just stand testing them. For me, jetting a 2t is a bit quicker than jetting a 4t.

MRX02 will blow your mind... But it cost...a LOT. I think it was $140 for a 5-gallon pail last time i checked...or maybe that was mr12...i dont remember.

U4.4 is considerably cheaper at like $70 for 5 gallons. It's not quite as good as mrx02 but its marginal, unless you need the best of the best..I'd stick with u4.4

Never let u4.4 or mrx02 sit in the carb for any length of time...or you will be replacing all the rubber/ o-rings.
Thats the old u4 that used to do that, fuels are better now, but better safe than sorry.
BobPA
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PA US
9/9/2015 4:25pm
The 99 octane juice you have over there sounds perfect for your application. Stock compression/porting you would really not benefit from from running straight race fuel.
1
mxb2
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9/9/2015 5:35pm Edited Date/Time 9/9/2015 5:38pm
BobPA wrote:
The 99 octane juice you have over there sounds perfect for your application. Stock compression/porting you would really not benefit from from running straight race fuel.
Race fuel in pales, more consistent, burns cooler, crisper throttle reaponse, easier starting. pump fuel in my area is garbage for efi bikes.
9/16/2015 10:58am
Av gas $4.10 at my airport. Rejet and ride. Fuel last forever stored. Not forever juat a long time
9/16/2015 10:58am
Av gas $4.10 at my airport. Rejet and ride. Fuel last forever stored. Not forever juat a long time
IceMan446
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9/16/2015 11:53am Edited Date/Time 9/16/2015 11:53am
Av gas $4.10 at my airport. Rejet and ride. Fuel last forever stored. Not forever juat a long time
Any jetting changes for the AVgas?
IceMan446
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9/16/2015 12:03pm
And I cant find a damn place around here that will allow me to pump avgas into a can.

Every place wants me to have an aircraft present.
slackinoff
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9/16/2015 1:32pm
IceMan446 wrote:
And I cant find a damn place around here that will allow me to pump avgas into a can. Every place wants me to have an...
And I cant find a damn place around here that will allow me to pump avgas into a can.

Every place wants me to have an aircraft present.
Might be a California problem. How big are the airports you are trying? Find a tiny airport, no control towers, one strip kind of airport.
BobPA
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9/16/2015 6:58pm
IceMan446 wrote:
Any jetting changes for the AVgas?
Yes, but very minimal. Ran it in stand ups for a while with no issues. In PA they will let you pump it into a milk jug haha.
cwtoyota
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9/17/2015 10:09am
IceMan446 wrote:
And I cant find a damn place around here that will allow me to pump avgas into a can. Every place wants me to have an...
And I cant find a damn place around here that will allow me to pump avgas into a can.

Every place wants me to have an aircraft present.
slackinoff wrote:
Might be a California problem. How big are the airports you are trying? Find a tiny airport, no control towers, one strip kind of airport.
Smaller airports are better in my experience...

I used to buy it from the airport just outside of 29 Palms, CA when I was stationed on the Marine base there... That was back in 2006 - 2009. I can still get it at my local airport here in WA which happens to be on the same property as one of the local tracks. It really depends on the airport though.

Technically, they aren't supposed to sell it for motor vehicle use on the ground (aircraft only). The lead content and lack of road tax being charged are the primary reasons for that law...

If they hassle you, ask them "What if I own and Ultralight Aircraft and need some fuel for it?"

captmoto
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9/17/2015 6:40pm
cwtoyota wrote:
Smaller airports are better in my experience... I used to buy it from the airport just outside of 29 Palms, CA when I was stationed on...
Smaller airports are better in my experience...

I used to buy it from the airport just outside of 29 Palms, CA when I was stationed on the Marine base there... That was back in 2006 - 2009. I can still get it at my local airport here in WA which happens to be on the same property as one of the local tracks. It really depends on the airport though.

Technically, they aren't supposed to sell it for motor vehicle use on the ground (aircraft only). The lead content and lack of road tax being charged are the primary reasons for that law...

If they hassle you, ask them "What if I own and Ultralight Aircraft and need some fuel for it?"

Good idea on the ultra light. I have an airport near my moms house but it is getting harder to get on, more security and all. Another that was fairly close closed down. They had no problem at all letting me fill cans.
9/17/2015 8:21pm
I buy at french valley airport by my house. They have never questioned what its used for. Just figuring out how to use the pumps for the first time was challenging. Banning airport the guy helps you out. Just more expensive there
Matt Fisher
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9/17/2015 10:45pm
IceMan446 wrote:
And I cant find a damn place around here that will allow me to pump avgas into a can. Every place wants me to have an...
And I cant find a damn place around here that will allow me to pump avgas into a can.

Every place wants me to have an aircraft present.
I go to small airports. No issues at all.
You can do a search and find the gate codes for almost every airport since private plane owners sometimes need to leave after standard business hours.
slackinoff
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9/18/2015 5:37am
IceMan446 wrote:
And I cant find a damn place around here that will allow me to pump avgas into a can. Every place wants me to have an...
And I cant find a damn place around here that will allow me to pump avgas into a can.

Every place wants me to have an aircraft present.
I go to small airports. No issues at all. You can do a search and find the gate codes for almost every airport since private plane...
I go to small airports. No issues at all.
You can do a search and find the gate codes for almost every airport since private plane owners sometimes need to leave after standard business hours.
Good point!

Many small airports close at 5. If you go after hours and you have the gate code, you can get the gas after hours.
Ours is a bit of a procedure as the pump is absolutely massive and will fill a 5 gallon can in about 6 seconds flat.

If it asks for a tail number, I just put in six X's (xxxxxx)
If you hear the pump spin up after clearing your credit card, but wont actually pump, go look for a control box with a on/off switch. Make sure to return it to the off position when you are done.
9/18/2015 5:47pm
IceMan446 wrote:
And I cant find a damn place around here that will allow me to pump avgas into a can. Every place wants me to have an...
And I cant find a damn place around here that will allow me to pump avgas into a can.

Every place wants me to have an aircraft present.
I go to small airports. No issues at all. You can do a search and find the gate codes for almost every airport since private plane...
I go to small airports. No issues at all.
You can do a search and find the gate codes for almost every airport since private plane owners sometimes need to leave after standard business hours.
Good idea on the gate codes. Its a pain to make it home then to the airport by 5.
tzmike
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Warwick, NY US
9/19/2015 8:41am
Myself and the bikes I help support have had some great results using Klotz Hitrate. This is a concentrate that has a mix ratio of 9-1. So you mix a gallon of the Klotz with 9 gallons of 91-92 pump fuel. Yields a final of 103-105. And it hits the mark. Using Avgas will provide a yield of close to, or at 110. My 2 cents. We use it and have no need to place a minimum order of $1300. for VP to deliver to the shop. Klotz retails for 47 bucks a gallon. Good luck with whatever you chose.

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