2000 YZ 250 Smoker Project & Garage Update

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ruskymx

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10/22/2014 3:35 PM

I picked this up locally. I've been watching CL and Facebook groups to find a project for the winter. The previous owner said it starting bogging and locked up on him. He started the tear down but this is as far as he got.


The cylinder is toast. One of the "ears" (not sure what you call them) on the bottom of the cylinder is broken off. Not sure if it was done at the time of the "kaboom" or during his removal. If the damage is too bad in the bottom end, I may just part it out, but as of now the plans are to get it running again.

I got it home and started to take more parts off it to remove the engine from the frame. I ran into two snags. First, the oil drain bolt is rounded and I can't remove it normally. Any tips? I was planning on heating up the case around the bolt to expand the metal and hammer on a smaller size socket.

The second issue is the rear engine mount bolt that goes through the swingarm. I hammered the crap out of that bastard and it did not budge. I sprayed it down with wd40 and used heat from a small propane torch. I tried it with the nut off and on a few threads. I think it's seized in the swingarm. The engine will rotate on it with the two front bolts out. I tried it on the stand and on its side.

My plans for the bike are to tear it down to just the frame and clean everything up and replace what needs to be replaced. Wouldn't mind making a Yamaha of Troy replica. For a few hundred bucks it was worth a shot to try and save it. Plus he threw in a brand new tire, ( too bad it's a paddle), Fox Comp 5 boots and 2 helmets. I'll try to document my progress here.

Ruskymx

DBerg

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10/22/2014 8:10 PM

I removed a stripped drain bolt with a left hand threaded tap. It was a pain, I clamped it with some vice grips, pushed on that drill as hard as I could, and had to go really slow while turning on the vice grips at the same time. It worked but I'd rather not do that again, that's for sure.

2 Stroke Beast

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10/23/2014 7:19 AM

I removed a stripped bolt from a head power valve side by drilling I hole on the edge of the bolt and then with a punch and a hammer beat it lose till I could turn it off. Although I don't know it this method would be good for a drain bolt because you might end up cracking the case.

OldnBroken

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10/23/2014 12:12 PM

You could try to grind some flats on what is left of that oil drain bolt and then grab it with vice-grips. You will have more room to work on the oil drain once the engine is removed from the frame.

ruskymx

Vital MX member ruskymx
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10/23/2014 7:24 PM

I've been spraying it up up with WD40 and what I had left of PB Blaster last night and today. Going to spray it up again tomorrow and but some of that CRC Freeze. I am going to apply heat to the swing arm, engine cases and then spray the inside of the bolt with the freeze stuff to see if that will work. I'm going to try and see if I can make a puller-type tool by buying a threaded bolt/rod that is long enough to go all the way through the inside of the swingarm bolt. The thinking is that if I can get a piece of steel plate that will cover the swingarm bolt hole and have the bolt go throught the plate and then through the bolt. I'll put a nut on the other side large enough that it won't pull through. I'll try to get pictures of the setup. From everything thing I have read, getting these swingarm bolts out can be a serious adventure.

I'm going to try the tip of grinding flat spots and see if that works. Maybe even see if I can grind a flat spot on the edge of the bolt and use a punch to tap it loose.

It sucks to hit these snags so quickly but I guess it's part of restoring an older bike that wasn't maintained very well. I am anxious to get the cases split to see what I am dealing with. It's going to be my first time splitting cases so it should be interesting. I watched some videos on YT so I should be a pro at it now. I figure it will be a good learning experience plus I can get the satisfaction of knowing I did it myself (and saved some coin). I already learned one thing. Clean and grease the swingarm bolt often!

Ruskymx

RM250racer

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10/23/2014 10:55 PM

looks alot like the 01 yz i just picked up. same story. i have it all torn apart right now. i also have a 2000 yz250 and it rips! i love the bike and its going to be taken to the frame after the 01 is finished. i modded 2014 front end on it. looking forward to seeing your progress!



RM250racer

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10/23/2014 11:00 PM

My 01 pile



Fresh frame



Let me know if you want me to get my pictures off your thread, I think it's cool your building the same bike as me right now

FGR01

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10/24/2014 3:26 PM

Frozen swingarm pivots are a bitch. The problem is that the shaft is frozen solid to the steel collars that are inside the bearings. So heating the swingarm itself is pretty ineffective. If you applied enough heat to actually get to the steel collars and expand them you would basically have to melt the aluminum of the swingarm.

The threaded rod puller method you described is your best bet. Make sure to stack up hardened nuts on the rod to spread the load across more threads or else you will just pull the threads right out of the nut.

My friend had a bike that was totally frozen solid. He ended up stripping it down to just the frame, engine, and swingarm. Took it to a machine shop. They mounted it up in a big industrial drill press and drilled it out with increasingly larger bits until they were able to knock it apart.

Powerband in every gear !

ruskymx

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10/24/2014 7:38 PM

RM250Racer - Your pics are welcome here

FGR01 - I hope I don't have to resort to drilling or cutting it out. I'm going to start attacking it again tomorrow after work and see what I can do. I'm stopping at Lowe's on the way home from work and see what I can get to make my rod puller. I'm hoping that with the puller on and with some heat and coercion with a BFH that I can get it to break loose. I'm going to attach the puller deal and put a good bit of tension on it and whack the hell out of it if it doesn't break loose with the puller. If that doesn't work I'll keep the tension on it overnight and try again Sunday. I'm going to resort to cutting/drilling as a last ditch effort

Hoping to report some good news tomorrow!

Ruskymx

ruskymx

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10/25/2014 8:06 PM



Solved both issues tonight! Woo hoo!

I used some heat and sacrificed a 7/16 socket and hammered that bad boy on to the drain bolt. If the bolt comes out of the socket, I doubt the socket is any good.



Here's the puller setup that I tried and it didn't work because he threaded rod just snapped a few times. It may have helped, but it wasn't the final solution. I had this attached with tension on it and tapped the swingarm and engine cases and applied heat. It finally snapped again and was too short to use so I resorted to the old fashioned method. 4lb sledge and brute force!





Here's the bastard that I cursed the last few days.



The engine is out. My case splitter tool should be here by Wednesday so I'll use the next few days to clean up an area in my basement to split the cases and see what I'm dealing with. Judging by the second picture below, it's not going to be pretty.





I am SOOOOOO glad I didn't have to cut it out! Time for a beer! Oh, and I found a guy a few hours from me hard up for cash and is selling a 2000 YZ 125 with a new top and bottom end. Namura top and Wiseco bottom. The Wiseco bottom scares me a bit because I haven't read anything good about them yet. It runs goods accrording to him and he wants $500 for it. I checked the VIN on one of those online sites for stolen bikes and it comes back clean. I now it's not a guarantee but I think I'm going to pull the trigger on it and grab it tomorrow. Maybe do the 125 as the YoT and the 250 as an MC replica

Ruskymx

lumpy790

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10/26/2014 11:24 AM
Edited Date/Time: 10/26/2014 11:31 AM

The older YZ's make good solid reliable bikes. I used Race Tech kits on my 2001 YZ250 when it was new and still 100% love it. For power I used the FMF SST pipe & silencer + V Force intake.... added power from bottom to top with more over rev.

when I started my last make over.

pCp 252

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10/26/2014 3:41 PM

I've got a messed up drain bolt on my 07 yz250 too. Did you heat the socket to expand and then hammer it on to let it shrink around the bolt? Or did you heat the nut or case? I'm confused because in my head it wouldn't seem effective to heat the case or bolt. I want to keep the motor in the frame as I'm still riding the bike quite a bit at the moment. Thanks!

ruskymx

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10/26/2014 5:52 PM

pCp 252 wrote:

I've got a messed up drain bolt on my 07 yz250 too. Did you heat the socket to expand and then hammer it on to let it shrink around the bolt? Or did you heat the nut or case? I'm confused because in my head it wouldn't seem effective to heat the case or bolt. I want to keep the motor in the frame as I'm still riding the bike quite a bit at the moment. Thanks!

I applied heat to the case around the bolt and then hammered on the socket. I used a breaker bar to get max leverage and it came off. I'm pretty sure the socket is ruined. I didn't try to get the bolt out yet because after I drained the oil, I put it back in hand-tight with the socket still attached.

Ruskymx

ruskymx

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10/26/2014 6:16 PM
Edited Date/Time: 10/26/2014 6:17 PM

lumpy790 wrote:

The older YZ's make good solid reliable bikes. I used Race Tech kits on my 2001 YZ250 when it was new and still 100% love it. For power I used the FMF SST pipe & silencer + V Force intake.... added power from bottom to top with more over rev.

when I started my last make over.

I am working on getting mine to the point where you started. Really only have the linkage to take apart and remove the forks and disassemble the front end. My case splitter should be in on Tuesday so I can see what the bottom end looks like.

I also took a trip today and picked up a 2000 YZ 125 for $500 as well. The difference is that this one runs and is still together! I was told 6 hours on the top end and 10 hours on the bottom. It has a pretty much brand new FMF Fatty pipe and Shorty silencer. It does need fork seals, brake pads F&R, front brake lever and the shrouds, front fender, number plate and fork guards were all painted white.





I know I REALLY need to clean my garage out big time! I still have boxes and parts from when I sold axle swapped my 93 4Runner, which, BTW isn't finished yet...lol (I have ADD when it comes to projects sometimes). I won't be splitting the cases in there. I'm going to tackle that in my basement where I have heat, more room and better lighting. I also need to buy proper bike stands.



Ruskymx

Matt Fisher

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10/26/2014 6:42 PM

pCp 252 wrote:

I've got a messed up drain bolt on my 07 yz250 too. Did you heat the socket to expand and then hammer it on to let it shrink around the bolt? Or did you heat the nut or case? I'm confused because in my head it wouldn't seem effective to heat the case or bolt. I want to keep the motor in the frame as I'm still riding the bike quite a bit at the moment. Thanks!

ruskymx wrote:

I applied heat to the case around the bolt and then hammered on the socket. I used a breaker bar to get max leverage and it came off. I'm pretty sure the socket is ruined. I didn't try to get the bolt out yet because after I drained the oil, I put it back in hand-tight with the socket still attached.

Ruskymx

Well, that should make it easy to get the plug back out next time...

lumpy790

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10/28/2014 2:18 PM

isnt it funny how every used bike just had a top end put in?

ruskymx

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10/28/2014 6:16 PM

lumpy790 wrote:

isnt it funny how every used bike just had a top end put in?

Around here it's either "fresh top end" or blown and needs a top end.

ruskymx

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10/28/2014 6:47 PM

My case puller came in today so after running some errands during the day, I got to work around 4:00. I started to disassemble the flywheel side and remembered that I forgot to order the flywheel puller and the clutch basket tool as well. DOH! Luckily a friend of mine has his own shop that he opened up after high school and even though I just left there, (picked up some parts for the 125), I headed back and he let me borrow a flywheel puller and the clutch tool.

Here's what the flywheel side looked like. It was a mess! The cover had a dent in it and it either broke the seal of the gasket when it happened or dust, grime and moisture made it's way in through the crack on the inside. I had to use a fine pick to clean out the threads and lube it up with WD40 to even use the flywheel puller. I couldn't get the stater screw to loosen and I didn't want to risk stripping them so I ended up splitting the cases with the stater still attached.



The clutch side came apart easily after borrowing the tool. The basket has notches worn into is where the plates contact it. No sharp edges, but there are definitely grooves.



Here's the flywheel side of the case with piston bits.



Here's the clutch side of the case.





Carnage!



This is the clutch side again with the crank completely removed. I could not find any cracks in either side of the cases, but this side does have some scuffing which you can see in the picture. Looking for feedback here. Can this still be used as long as there are no sharp edges that can catch something? If I hit it with some fine sandpaper to smooth it out, will it be ok, or should I get a new(er) case halve? Both crank bearings are seized. Not like I was going to reuse them anyway. Everything in the transmission looked good with no nicks on and of the cogs. The only thing I noticed was the shift rod was bent at the end where it sticks out of the case and the lever attaches to it.



I plan on cleaning everything up really good this weekend and getting a better look at the cases to make sure I didn't miss anything. I'm going to price and OEM crank assembly from my local Yamaha dealer and see what they want compared to what I can get one online.

Ruskymx

lumpy790

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10/29/2014 6:52 AM

are the cases broken?

ruskymx

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10/29/2014 8:08 AM

lumpy790 wrote:

are the cases broken?

Not that I have found yet. Just the scrapes and scuffs near the top of the last picture above. I don't see how that would hurt anything, but this is the first time I'm doing this so I'm learning. The way I see it, the scuffing increases the capacity for more oil!

2 Stroke Beast

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10/29/2014 6:07 PM

lumpy790 wrote:

are the cases broken?

ruskymx wrote:

Not that I have found yet. Just the scrapes and scuffs near the top of the last picture above. I don't see how that would hurt anything, but this is the first time I'm doing this so I'm learning. The way I see it, the scuffing increases the capacity for more oil!

You could try to blast the cases with baking soda to make them look new again its good to use baking soda because it washes away with ease. Also remember to check on the gears where they connect to make sure all sharp if they aren't it will slip into false neutral often.

OldnBroken

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10/30/2014 12:10 PM
Edited Date/Time: 10/30/2014 12:14 PM

I wouldn't hesitate to re-use those cases. Most cases look like that after a top-end failure, and I've never had a problem with using them again. For your stator screws, the best tool for getting those out is something like this: http://store.snapon.com/Impact-Drivers-3-8--Set-Impact-Driver-8-pcs--P631500.aspx
Doesn't have to be a Snap-On of course, lol. If you take material out of the crank case, technically you would be altering the primary compression ratio of the engine, but I don't think smoothing them out would have much effect on that.

kijen

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10/30/2014 3:35 PM

OldnBroken wrote:

I wouldn't hesitate to re-use those cases. Most cases look like that after a top-end failure, and I've never had a problem with using them again. For your stator screws, the best tool for getting those out is something like this: http://store.snapon.com/Impact-Drivers-3-8--Set-Impact-Driver-8-pcs--P631500.aspx
Doesn't have to be a Snap-On of course, lol. If you take material out of the crank case, technically you would be altering the primary compression ratio of the engine, but I don't think smoothing them out would have much effect on that.

yep, to the above post, I have split more then a few YZ cases, those scuffs in the crank should be no problem, sand em a bit to make it look pretty....I know you said the tranny looks good, but i would pull off the gears and take a look at the dogs for roundness, be a shame to do all that and have crappy shifting....

ruskymx

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10/30/2014 8:05 PM

OldnBroken wrote:

I wouldn't hesitate to re-use those cases. Most cases look like that after a top-end failure, and I've never had a problem with using them again. For your stator screws, the best tool for getting those out is something like this: http://store.snapon.com/Impact-Drivers-3-8--Set-Impact-Driver-8-pcs--P631500.aspx
Doesn't have to be a Snap-On of course, lol. If you take material out of the crank case, technically you would be altering the primary compression ratio of the engine, but I don't think smoothing them out would have much effect on that.

kijen wrote:

yep, to the above post, I have split more then a few YZ cases, those scuffs in the crank should be no problem, sand em a bit to make it look pretty....I know you said the tranny looks good, but i would pull off the gears and take a look at the dogs for roundness, be a shame to do all that and have crappy shifting....

I am going to take the transmission out this weekend and check all the bearings, gears, seals, etc and clean everything up really good. I also want to make sure and flush out all ports, holes, and wherever else, little bits of the piston could have found it's way to. I am relieved to see the guts look as good as they do. I was worried that the cases broke between the crank and the transmission and messed the tranny up as well. Since I am going to be fixing the 250, I am probably going to flip the 125 after cleaning it up a bit and fixing some of the issues. I may just hold on to it and sell it in the spring. It will be easier to sell and I don't think the value will change a whole bunch. I bought it because it was a good deal and in case the 250 ended up being a part out.

The gameplan now is to rebuild the 250 and fix/replace anything that needs it. I'm going to get a new clutch basket. From what I read, it's not good to file down the grooves in the basket because it will create more room for "play" with the clutch plates. Since the cases are apart, I'm probably going to replace all the seals just to be safe. Project YZ2Kfiddy is officially underway! If anyone comes across the 2000-2001 version of the Yamaha of Troy graphics, let me know.

I found these on eBay, but I think these are circa 2003 or so. I am looking for this:



Ruskymx

ruskymx

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11/1/2014 6:55 PM

So I spent about and hour or so scrubbing the clutch side case and cleaning it up and noticed this little crack on the tranny side of the case around the crank. It's not all the way through and looks like it could be fixable but I'm not sure since I never did this before.



Fixable or toast?

Ruskymx

ruskymx

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11/2/2014 9:38 AM

After some more cleaning(leftover Yamabond or sealer was hiding some secrets), I found some more bad news....

Flywheel side of the case in the same area of the crack on the clutch side.





Clutch side of the case has another small crack



I bought an impact driver and 2 of the 3 screws came out easy. The third ended up getting stripped. I used the largest phillips bit and hammered it onto the screw and then used the driver again. It broke loose after that.

From researching last night and this morning, I think I'm going to take the cases to a machine shop and see if they can fix the cracks and see what that costs. I also read that the cracks can be filled in with JB Weld and then put the cases in the oven to cure it.

Out of curiosity, I looked to see what new cases cost..... OUCH!

Ruskymx

ruskymx

Vital MX member ruskymx
43580 ruskymx http://p.vitalmx.com/photos/users/43580/avatar/c50_eli_tomac_10_1494648108.jpg?1494648092 http://www.vitalmx.com/community/ruskymx,43580/all 06/22/14 4 34 516 11

Posts: 550

Joined: 6/22/2014

Location: Orwigsburg, PA USA

11/7/2014 8:48 PM

I've been at a standstill the last few days. The more I cleaned the cases up, the more problems I found. Three cracks around the crank in the cases, plus the surface where the cylinder mounts had damage from a screw driver (most likely) from when the previous owner removed the top end. The shop I spoke to told me that if it was his bike, he really wouldn't suggest repairing them. So now I am at the point that I need to decide that if I want to put all this money into a 14 year old bike or part it out. I jumped the gun and ordered and received a bottom end kit already. I'm going to throw it on eBay and see if I can unload it there

I'm leaning towards parting out the 250 now because I think if I'm going to sink a ton into a bike, it's going to be a newer bike. I priced out parts that I would need and hit $2k quickly and that doesn't include some of the upgrades I wanted to do along the way. I also learned how expensive a stater is too. $850 for cases, $375 cylinder (my cylinder can't be used as a core since it is broken), $180 stater, $40-50 flywheel, $300-400 for clutch basket assembly, plus all the bearings for the bottom end, and anything else I come across along the way.

Pretty bummed about this but as I cleaned off more of the Yamabond or whatever sealer was used, it uncovered more and more issues with the cases that scared me away from reusing them and putting all the money and effort into building this.

I bought a carb rebuild kit or the 125. Gas leaks out the over flow so I think the floats are either stuck or need to be adjusted and the air screw is jacked up and a few other minor things so may as well take it apart and clean it up really good. I already found a 2003 YZ250 that could be a project if the guy would ever respond.

If you are looking for any parts, I should have a thread up in the Bazaar this weekend.

Ruskymx

Aceofspades

Vital MX member Aceofspades
40261 Aceofspades http://p.vitalmx.com/photos/users/40261/avatar/c50_20170328_191835_1491356067.jpg?1491355650 http://www.vitalmx.com/community/Aceofspades,40261/all 08/30/13 3 http://www.vitalmx.com/community/Aceofspades,40261/setup 152 2462 28 2

Posts: 2614

Joined: 8/30/2013

Location: KY, USA

11/7/2014 9:48 PM

New cases are around $600. If this is a bike u will keep for years, I would buy new cases. I'm restoring a 2000 kx250 and am buying new cases as well. If I weren't keeping the bike I wouldn't bother. In the long run having a good set of airtight cases will save headaches down the road. The cases are the base and backbone of the engine so it makes sense to me to have them be solid.

DBerg

Vital MX member DBerg
22953 DBerg http://p.vitalmx.com/photos/users/22953/avatar/c50_image_1395547390.jpg?1395546614 http://www.vitalmx.com/community/DBerg,22953/all 10/10/10 26 311 2

Posts: 337

Joined: 10/10/2010

Location: San Marcos, TX USA

11/9/2014 7:05 PM

Bummer to hear man. I ran into a similar deal where the grease and grime uncovered more and more issues. Like Ace, I plan on keeping this bike a long time, so replacing a side case and cylinder is in my future. Definitely a bummer because it's going to be a little more money and time than anticipated. My $1,000 - $1,500 budget to build a bike with some nice extras has turned into more like $2,000 + just to freshen it up and make it rideable/reliable. Ironically, running a motocross track has been the main reason I haven't been able to ride or work on my bike because I just haven't had the time. While my cylinder and case has been repaired, I don't exactly trust the previous owner to have had anything done well. All the external bearings are shot, flywheel rusted, covers cracked, just generally poorly taken care of.

Here's basically my whole bike as it is now. Not really anything to get excited about, haha.

ruskymx

Vital MX member ruskymx
43580 ruskymx http://p.vitalmx.com/photos/users/43580/avatar/c50_eli_tomac_10_1494648108.jpg?1494648092 http://www.vitalmx.com/community/ruskymx,43580/all 06/22/14 4 34 516 11

Posts: 550

Joined: 6/22/2014

Location: Orwigsburg, PA USA

11/10/2014 7:17 PM

I'm still pondering what I want to do with it. I did list the cylinder on eBay just because if I do fix it, I'm buying a brand new one anyway. Deep down, I really want to rebuild it and have basically a "brand new" 2000 YZ250. I just need to get myself to come to grips of plunking about $3k into a 14-15 year old bike. I think I may wait to see what I can get out of the 2000 YZ 125 that I picked up. I just rebuilt the carb and stopped the overflowing gas issue, put new brakes on it and threw a new brake lever as well. I have new vent hoses and plastic kit coming for it too. If i can get out of it what I want, it will give me more $$ to redo the 250 so I'm going to put this project on hold and move the 125 before I rush into a decision to part out the 250.

In the mean time, I'll still keep my eyes out for someone wanting to unload a newer blown up YZ250 to rebuild just in case. Someone listed a 2003 that looks clean by the pictures and has a bunch of new parts, but the knucklehead won't return calls, text, or emails from CL. Drives me nuts....lol

The cheapest I found for cases so far has been partzilla.com for $400+ range for each side. If anyone stumbles across them for less, I'm all ears!

Ruskymx