Really Sad Story...

TDeath21
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6523
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Location
Somewhere, MO US
Edited Date/Time 6/4/2012 7:59pm
... So I thought I would share it with my moto buddies to get your opinion on this deal. It's kind of long so bear with me here. All time periods are estimations.

A friend of mine has a husband who is a veteran of the Iraq War. Due to the things he saw in that war, he suffers from PTSD. He has medication for it and everything, but I guess sometimes that isn't even enough to completely help him. About 8 months ago, he was pulled over and arrested for driving under the influence of alcohol. I'm not sure if this had anything to do with the PTSD or if it was just a stupid mistake on his part. Obviously I never asked her about the details of her husband's DUI. After this arrest, he was put on probation (not sure for how long).

Well about a month or so ago he had a severe episode of PTSD. I guess he was outside with his guns thinking Iraqi soldiers were attacking him. It was bad from what I heard. His wife (my friend) called his dad and his dad came over and tried to get him under control. The police were eventually called and he was brought under control. After he was brought under control, the police arrested him and just recently a judge ruled that this PTSD episode violated his DUI probation and he now has to spend 95 days in jail.

My question to you guys is this. Is it right to jail a guy who got PTSD from serving this country and subsequently violated his probation because of it? Like I said, I'm not sure if the DUI was his bad or was caused by the PTSD. What I do know is that his wife is an awesome person, and I highly doubt she would marry a guy that would do things like this had he not served our country and developed PTSD. I have not met her husband though, so I honestly can't be 100% sure. I think it's total bullshit that the justice system is doing this to him. I guess in their mind, he was a threat to society and needed to be taken off the streets for awhile.

It gets even worse though. The medication that he was on that helped tremendously, but obviously not 100% effective, is not allowed in the jail, because no medications are allowed in there for any reason. I'm not sure when his sentence starts (or if it already has) but what I do know is it really does make me sad to see the kind of shit our soldiers go through both in war and after it. On top of that, for the justice system to make the ruling they did is just pathetic in my opinion. These soldiers risk their lives for our freedom, pay the price during and after the war, then come back home and have shit like this happen.

I just thought I would share this with my moto buddies. PTSD is a very serious thing that really isn't talked about all that much. It is very serious though, as the story I just told you shows, and I'm sure this is only one example of many.
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S.Loyer
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Location
Palmer, AK US
6/3/2012 11:31pm
In all honesty this is a pretty tough one.

I understand he suffers from PTSD and he was suffering from and episode of it but if I was a judge, that would be such a hard thing to decide. I mean what if he had actually shot someone?

Along with that, what is someone with that amount of PTSD doing with guns?

The no medication in jails is pretty shitty.
I wish a exception could be made for that, I don't know to much about PTSD besides what I learned in some lower level Physiology classes. Maybe something could be arranged for some therapy or something as I think thats his best bet.
6/3/2012 11:57pm
I'm sorry to hear of your friends situation. I have delt with the legal system concerning mental health issues and can tell you that it has little to no concern for the mentally ill. Most police officers have little to no training dealing with the mentally ill and the police departments are just now requiring training because of the large number of lawsuits being brought against them. Unfortunately, our nation has decided it is easier and cheaper to just incarcerate the mentally ill than to actually help them. There is something wrong with the issue of his medication. My sister worked as a nurse in a large jail and it was her job to administer medications to the prisoners. If you could P.M. more specifics, I'll run the information by her and try and see if there is a way to rectify the situation. Our son is just finishing up his first deployment to Afghanistan. He has seen a fellow platoon member take a bullet to the head just yards from him, a truck full of Afghan soldiers blown up in front of him with their body parts landing all over his vehicle. Been in the blast zone of several IED's and has had the windshield of his MWRAP nearly blown out twice. He was home recently for R&R and seemed to be doing pretty good. The time in Afghanistan has changed him. He no longer feels comfortable being in confined spaces with a large number of people. This being his first 18 months of a eight year commitment, only time will tell the long term effect it will have on him. I hope for the best for your friends husband, he truley deserves better.
6/4/2012 1:42am
No it's not right. Of course it isn't right.

There's a difference between a criminal, a person that knows they're doing wrong but just doesn't care, and someone with a genuine mental illness who's suffering terribly and is in effect, crying out for help. I realise people can sometimes use it (mental illness) as an excuse to escape jail time but in this instance it should be pretty obvious to the authorities that he's the real deal. No one was harmed either.

I would however suggest taking his guns away though, at least until he's given professional help and deemed stable again.
BobbyM
Posts
21449
Joined
8/15/2006
Location
AZ US
6/4/2012 1:58am
TDeath21 wrote:
... So I thought I would share it with my moto buddies to get your opinion on this deal. It's kind of long so bear with...
... So I thought I would share it with my moto buddies to get your opinion on this deal. It's kind of long so bear with me here. All time periods are estimations.

A friend of mine has a husband who is a veteran of the Iraq War. Due to the things he saw in that war, he suffers from PTSD. He has medication for it and everything, but I guess sometimes that isn't even enough to completely help him. About 8 months ago, he was pulled over and arrested for driving under the influence of alcohol. I'm not sure if this had anything to do with the PTSD or if it was just a stupid mistake on his part. Obviously I never asked her about the details of her husband's DUI. After this arrest, he was put on probation (not sure for how long).

Well about a month or so ago he had a severe episode of PTSD. I guess he was outside with his guns thinking Iraqi soldiers were attacking him. It was bad from what I heard. His wife (my friend) called his dad and his dad came over and tried to get him under control. The police were eventually called and he was brought under control. After he was brought under control, the police arrested him and just recently a judge ruled that this PTSD episode violated his DUI probation and he now has to spend 95 days in jail.

My question to you guys is this. Is it right to jail a guy who got PTSD from serving this country and subsequently violated his probation because of it? Like I said, I'm not sure if the DUI was his bad or was caused by the PTSD. What I do know is that his wife is an awesome person, and I highly doubt she would marry a guy that would do things like this had he not served our country and developed PTSD. I have not met her husband though, so I honestly can't be 100% sure. I think it's total bullshit that the justice system is doing this to him. I guess in their mind, he was a threat to society and needed to be taken off the streets for awhile.

It gets even worse though. The medication that he was on that helped tremendously, but obviously not 100% effective, is not allowed in the jail, because no medications are allowed in there for any reason. I'm not sure when his sentence starts (or if it already has) but what I do know is it really does make me sad to see the kind of shit our soldiers go through both in war and after it. On top of that, for the justice system to make the ruling they did is just pathetic in my opinion. These soldiers risk their lives for our freedom, pay the price during and after the war, then come back home and have shit like this happen.

I just thought I would share this with my moto buddies. PTSD is a very serious thing that really isn't talked about all that much. It is very serious though, as the story I just told you shows, and I'm sure this is only one example of many.
jail never ever helps anybody but the folks that make money off the jail.

The Shop

TDeath21
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Somewhere, MO US
6/4/2012 6:28am
S.Loyer wrote:
In all honesty this is a pretty tough one. I understand he suffers from PTSD and he was suffering from and episode of it but if...
In all honesty this is a pretty tough one.

I understand he suffers from PTSD and he was suffering from and episode of it but if I was a judge, that would be such a hard thing to decide. I mean what if he had actually shot someone?

Along with that, what is someone with that amount of PTSD doing with guns?

The no medication in jails is pretty shitty.
I wish a exception could be made for that, I don't know to much about PTSD besides what I learned in some lower level Physiology classes. Maybe something could be arranged for some therapy or something as I think thats his best bet.
I agree that there shouldn't have been guns in their house. I'm not sure if they didn't realize how severe his PTSD was or what. I know this is the first major occurrence of it, and it just happened to be while he was on probation so that makes it even worse.

Being a judge on that ruling would be super hard. You have to ensure the safety of the public, but I just wish there were a better thing to do than put him in a jail cell.

You have to look at it from another perspective though. If he was my neighbor and he was outside doing this stuff, I would want safety for my family no matter what. To a neighbor or somebody that doesn't know him or his situation, he is probably just labeled as an alcoholic who got a DUI and then went crazy with a gun and could have potentially harmed my family or myself.

Like I said, I'm not sure if his PTSD contributed to his DUI or not. If it did, it makes this situation more shitty. If it didn't, then really it was his fault for putting himself in that situation in the first place. If I were to guess, I would say that PTSD did have something to do with his DUI as well, but that's pure speculation so nobody can really be sure.
jtomasik
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12898
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Location
Golden, CO US
6/4/2012 7:18am
I think the treatment of veterans/military is pure bullshit. Our country and government use the military without even considering that they're fucking around with the lives of people, both our American troops and the places we attack. I've been trying to push my congressman (started with Tancredo, now with Coffman) to start a bill that requires that ANYTIME the military is used outside of our borders, there is an immediate draft of all people, ages 21-35, with NO exceptions. I recently changed the draft minimum to 21 because 18 year olds are less the rational thinkers than 21 year olds (it's pretty well known that's one major reason why the military goes after them young), and because if you're not old enough to drink, then you're sure as shit not old enough to be ordered to put your life in a threatening situation. We need ownership by both the politicians and the American public in these stupid wars.


That young man needs to be helped and not jailed.
motosmith
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Location
Washougal, WA US
6/4/2012 8:10am
Are you sure medication is not allowed in Jail? That doesn't seem right.
BUTCH
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5091
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Location
WA US
6/4/2012 9:38am
You would think, the judge would have commited him to psychiatric care for 90 days, rather than jai!Shocked
6/4/2012 9:42am
jtomasik wrote:
I think the treatment of veterans/military is pure bullshit. Our country and government use the military without even considering that they're fucking around with the lives...
I think the treatment of veterans/military is pure bullshit. Our country and government use the military without even considering that they're fucking around with the lives of people, both our American troops and the places we attack. I've been trying to push my congressman (started with Tancredo, now with Coffman) to start a bill that requires that ANYTIME the military is used outside of our borders, there is an immediate draft of all people, ages 21-35, with NO exceptions. I recently changed the draft minimum to 21 because 18 year olds are less the rational thinkers than 21 year olds (it's pretty well known that's one major reason why the military goes after them young), and because if you're not old enough to drink, then you're sure as shit not old enough to be ordered to put your life in a threatening situation. We need ownership by both the politicians and the American public in these stupid wars.


That young man needs to be helped and not jailed.
This^.
MBBadgers
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1173
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10/6/2010
Location
Madison, WI US
6/4/2012 10:00am
PTSD is a horrible thing, I actually hate the government for sending our 18-24 (or older) boys into battle and then letting them suffer with this disease. I have spoken to some therapists and I hear yoga (hot yoga) is really good for veterans that suffer from PTSD, something to maybe pass along.
pitbike502
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12/26/2007
Location
Syracuse, NY US
6/4/2012 1:06pm
Honestly, my best friends have been through similiar stories, its hard. My almost brother / friend just got out of a va mental health hospital, he is active duty army, SSG at Hood. Had a breakfown, spent 4 months in.. all i can say is god bless him, and may your family ties stay strong as ever
Torco1
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Location
Corona, CA US
6/4/2012 1:28pm
Most of the medications used to treat stuff like that cant be stopped abruptly.....they need to be tapered or else he could have some serious adverse affects. I'm almost positive a doctor would go to bat for him explaining that......so he can at least taper of them before he goes in, if he hasn't already.
6/4/2012 1:33pm
TDeath21 wrote:
... So I thought I would share it with my moto buddies to get your opinion on this deal. It's kind of long so bear with...
... So I thought I would share it with my moto buddies to get your opinion on this deal. It's kind of long so bear with me here. All time periods are estimations.

A friend of mine has a husband who is a veteran of the Iraq War. Due to the things he saw in that war, he suffers from PTSD. He has medication for it and everything, but I guess sometimes that isn't even enough to completely help him. About 8 months ago, he was pulled over and arrested for driving under the influence of alcohol. I'm not sure if this had anything to do with the PTSD or if it was just a stupid mistake on his part. Obviously I never asked her about the details of her husband's DUI. After this arrest, he was put on probation (not sure for how long).

Well about a month or so ago he had a severe episode of PTSD. I guess he was outside with his guns thinking Iraqi soldiers were attacking him. It was bad from what I heard. His wife (my friend) called his dad and his dad came over and tried to get him under control. The police were eventually called and he was brought under control. After he was brought under control, the police arrested him and just recently a judge ruled that this PTSD episode violated his DUI probation and he now has to spend 95 days in jail.

My question to you guys is this. Is it right to jail a guy who got PTSD from serving this country and subsequently violated his probation because of it? Like I said, I'm not sure if the DUI was his bad or was caused by the PTSD. What I do know is that his wife is an awesome person, and I highly doubt she would marry a guy that would do things like this had he not served our country and developed PTSD. I have not met her husband though, so I honestly can't be 100% sure. I think it's total bullshit that the justice system is doing this to him. I guess in their mind, he was a threat to society and needed to be taken off the streets for awhile.

It gets even worse though. The medication that he was on that helped tremendously, but obviously not 100% effective, is not allowed in the jail, because no medications are allowed in there for any reason. I'm not sure when his sentence starts (or if it already has) but what I do know is it really does make me sad to see the kind of shit our soldiers go through both in war and after it. On top of that, for the justice system to make the ruling they did is just pathetic in my opinion. These soldiers risk their lives for our freedom, pay the price during and after the war, then come back home and have shit like this happen.

I just thought I would share this with my moto buddies. PTSD is a very serious thing that really isn't talked about all that much. It is very serious though, as the story I just told you shows, and I'm sure this is only one example of many.
Just spoke with my sister. She said it depends on where he is being held. Larger jails like where she worked have 24/7 medical staff. Smaller jails leave it to the discretion of the correction staff. Her advice was to contact an attorney or public defender to get it corrected. Do not waste time going back and forth with the jail.
TDeath21
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6523
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Location
Somewhere, MO US
6/4/2012 2:08pm
motosmith wrote:
Are you sure medication is not allowed in Jail? That doesn't seem right.
That's what I was told. Maybe that was the original ruling but now he does get them. Or maybe he was on more than one medication and just one isn't allowed. I'm not sure of all the details like that, but hopefully they realized he needs those medications and he continues to receive them while in jail. I will try to get more information so I can pass the advice I've gotten from the responses in this thread to his wife.
S.Loyer
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Location
Palmer, AK US
6/4/2012 2:20pm
I think if a punishment needs to be dealt for whatever reason, I think a house arrest with mandatory counseling would make more sense. A jail cell surrounded by the amazing people there won't do him much good specially without meds.
jndmx
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9659
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South Kingston, RI US
6/4/2012 2:44pm
The armed forces have really dropped the ball on PTSD, some folks die before they get help because of it.

Sorry to hear about your friend man, my thoughts and prayers are with him.
brogge
Posts
76
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4/1/2008
Location
Poway, CA US
6/4/2012 7:59pm
Check out IAVA.org, founded by a good friend I grew up with. Focused on soldiers' welfare both during and after they return, they might have some input or advice and be able to help your friend and/or his wife with support.

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