Remember the CEO who raised all his workers pay to 70K

lostboy819
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Edited Date/Time 8/13/2015 6:11am
Well I guess socialism doesnt work, who would have thought.Pinch


http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/08/01/seattle-ceo-who-set-firm-minimum-w…

Seattle CEO who set firm's minimum wage to $70G says he has hit hard times
Published August 01, 2015FoxNews.com
Facebook551 Twitter176 livefyre594 Email Print

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CEO explains dramatic solution to company's wage gap
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The Seattle CEO who reaped a publicity bonanza when he boosted the salaries of his employees to a minimum of $70,000 a year says he has fallen on hard times.

Dan Price, 31, tells the New York Times that things have gotten so bad he’s been forced to rent out his house.

Only three months ago Price was generating headlines—and accusations of being a socialist -- when he announced the new salary minimum for all 120 employees at his Gravity Payments credit card processing firm. Price said he was doing it, and slashing his $1 million pay package to pay for it, to address the wealth gap.

“I’m working as hard as I ever worked to make it work,” he told the Times in a video that shows him sitting on a plastic bucket in the garage of his house. “I’m renting out my house right now to try and make ends meet myself.”

The Times article said Price’s decision ended up costing him a few customers and two of his “most valued” employees, who quit after newer employees ended up with bigger salary hikes than older ones.

“He gave raises to people who have the least skills and are the least equipped to do the job, and the ones who were taking on the most didn’t get much of a bump,” Gravity financial manager Maisey McMaster, 26, told the paper.

She said when she talked to Price about it, he treated her as if she was being selfish and only thinking about herself.

“That really hurt me,” she said. “I was talking about not only me, but about everyone in my position.”

Approaching burnout, she quit.

Grant Moran, 29, also quit, saying the new pay-scale was disconcerting

“Now the people who were just clocking in and out were making the same as me,” he told the paper. “It shackles high performers to less motivated team members.”

Price said McMaster and Moran, or even critic Rush Limbaugh, the talk show host, were not wrong.

“There’s no perfect way to do this and no way to handle complex workplace issues that doesn’t have any downsides or trade-offs,” he said.

The Times said customers who left were dismayed at what Price did, viewing it as a political statement. Others left fearful Gravity would soon hike fees to pay for salary increases.

Brian Canlis, co-owner of a family restaurant, already worried about how to deal with Seattle’s new minimum wage, told Price the pay raise at Gravity “makes it harder for the rest of us.”

“It pains me to hear Brian Canlis say that,” Price said. “The last think I would ever want to do is make a client feel uncomfortable.”

The Times said Price has dozens of new clients inspired by his move but those accounts won’t start generating profits for at least another year.

Making matters worse for Price is a lawsuit his older brother filed two weeks after the pay hike announcement.

Lucas Price, who owns 30 percent of the company, accuses his brother of taking millions of dollars out of the company while denying him the benefits of his minority ownership.

The lawsuit has forced Gravity to pay mounting legal fees at a time when the new salary scale is being eaten up by profits.

“We don’t have a margin of error to pay those legal fees,” Dan Price said.

Click for more from The New York Times






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500guy
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8/1/2015 2:15pm
pay the stock boy 70k and suddenly He doesn't need to turn up for work, busy out looking for toys
Tiki
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8/1/2015 7:47pm
Never heard about this, There is NOTHING wrong with making $10 an hour. It builds character. These are not career jobs. No one goes to college or vocational school to learn this skill, that alone should be an indicator. Additionally any CEO making over $200,000 is OVER Freaking Paid! I would say over $150,000 but some areas cost more to live. Top positions being paid salary and packages over $500K are stupid freaking owners. They should be putting that money back into the business and savings for slow times. HELLO? Sound familiar?
Brad460
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8/1/2015 8:19pm
Tiki wrote:
Never heard about this, There is NOTHING wrong with making $10 an hour. It builds character. These are not career jobs. No one goes to college...
Never heard about this, There is NOTHING wrong with making $10 an hour. It builds character. These are not career jobs. No one goes to college or vocational school to learn this skill, that alone should be an indicator. Additionally any CEO making over $200,000 is OVER Freaking Paid! I would say over $150,000 but some areas cost more to live. Top positions being paid salary and packages over $500K are stupid freaking owners. They should be putting that money back into the business and savings for slow times. HELLO? Sound familiar?
A CEO making $200k is overpaid? Laughing You wouldn't find anyone willing to do that job for $200k!! I am thinking you have no idea what a CEO does....
lostboy819
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8/1/2015 10:42pm
Brad460 wrote:
A CEO making $200k is overpaid? :laugh: You wouldn't find anyone willing to do that job for $200k!! I am thinking you have no idea what...
A CEO making $200k is overpaid? Laughing You wouldn't find anyone willing to do that job for $200k!! I am thinking you have no idea what a CEO does....
X2

The Shop

500guy
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8/2/2015 7:16am
lostboy819 wrote:
X2
I have no problem with CEO's making big money, the only issue I have is a CEO making huge money while the company is going down the shitter.
8/2/2015 9:20am
lostboy819 wrote:
Well I guess socialism doesnt work, who would have thought.:pinch: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/08/01/seattle-ceo-who-set-firm-minimum-wage-to-70g-rents-house-to-make-ends-meet/?intcmp=hpbt4 Seattle CEO who set firm's minimum wage to $70G says he has hit hard times...
Well I guess socialism doesnt work, who would have thought.Pinch


http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/08/01/seattle-ceo-who-set-firm-minimum-w…

Seattle CEO who set firm's minimum wage to $70G says he has hit hard times
Published August 01, 2015FoxNews.com
Facebook551 Twitter176 livefyre594 Email Print

NOW PLAYING
CEO explains dramatic solution to company's wage gap
Never autoplay videos
The Seattle CEO who reaped a publicity bonanza when he boosted the salaries of his employees to a minimum of $70,000 a year says he has fallen on hard times.

Dan Price, 31, tells the New York Times that things have gotten so bad he’s been forced to rent out his house.

Only three months ago Price was generating headlines—and accusations of being a socialist -- when he announced the new salary minimum for all 120 employees at his Gravity Payments credit card processing firm. Price said he was doing it, and slashing his $1 million pay package to pay for it, to address the wealth gap.

“I’m working as hard as I ever worked to make it work,” he told the Times in a video that shows him sitting on a plastic bucket in the garage of his house. “I’m renting out my house right now to try and make ends meet myself.”

The Times article said Price’s decision ended up costing him a few customers and two of his “most valued” employees, who quit after newer employees ended up with bigger salary hikes than older ones.

“He gave raises to people who have the least skills and are the least equipped to do the job, and the ones who were taking on the most didn’t get much of a bump,” Gravity financial manager Maisey McMaster, 26, told the paper.

She said when she talked to Price about it, he treated her as if she was being selfish and only thinking about herself.

“That really hurt me,” she said. “I was talking about not only me, but about everyone in my position.”

Approaching burnout, she quit.

Grant Moran, 29, also quit, saying the new pay-scale was disconcerting

“Now the people who were just clocking in and out were making the same as me,” he told the paper. “It shackles high performers to less motivated team members.”

Price said McMaster and Moran, or even critic Rush Limbaugh, the talk show host, were not wrong.

“There’s no perfect way to do this and no way to handle complex workplace issues that doesn’t have any downsides or trade-offs,” he said.

The Times said customers who left were dismayed at what Price did, viewing it as a political statement. Others left fearful Gravity would soon hike fees to pay for salary increases.

Brian Canlis, co-owner of a family restaurant, already worried about how to deal with Seattle’s new minimum wage, told Price the pay raise at Gravity “makes it harder for the rest of us.”

“It pains me to hear Brian Canlis say that,” Price said. “The last think I would ever want to do is make a client feel uncomfortable.”

The Times said Price has dozens of new clients inspired by his move but those accounts won’t start generating profits for at least another year.

Making matters worse for Price is a lawsuit his older brother filed two weeks after the pay hike announcement.

Lucas Price, who owns 30 percent of the company, accuses his brother of taking millions of dollars out of the company while denying him the benefits of his minority ownership.

The lawsuit has forced Gravity to pay mounting legal fees at a time when the new salary scale is being eaten up by profits.

“We don’t have a margin of error to pay those legal fees,” Dan Price said.

Click for more from The New York Times






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America is by and large, a capitalist society and as such our economy will reflect that. Any type of socialist model will struggle in that type of economy. Saying that this shows that socialism doesn't work well is nonsense; thousands of businesses run on capitalist ideals fail as well. The two employees who quit are acting like entitled brats, with Price's brother getting into the mix as well. If anything, this shows the bad side of capitalism by showcasing the entitlement that some feel for their work and the value they will put on others -- as usual it all comes down to money. CEO's making millions while employees make $40,000 a year is an abuse of the system. More equality is needed and what Price did for his employees is a good thing but he probably should have went about it more cautiously and with a more thought out plan of action.
borg
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8/2/2015 9:28am
The Fox News story is missing too much info to draw any conclusions. The fact that he has to rent out his house just means that his cut in pay doesn't leave him enough money to handle the mortgage on a house he bought when he was making 1 mil a year. The story didn't talk about the hit to the company's payroll when he jacked up everybody's salary. How big a hit was it? What effect did it have on profits? The story seems to suggest that his cut financed the increase. If that's the case then the average increase was about $8,000/year. I'm guessing that some got no increase and some got a huge increase. Really stupid idea BTW but hey, at least he's walking the walk.
Tiki
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8/2/2015 11:56am
Tiki wrote:
Never heard about this, There is NOTHING wrong with making $10 an hour. It builds character. These are not career jobs. No one goes to college...
Never heard about this, There is NOTHING wrong with making $10 an hour. It builds character. These are not career jobs. No one goes to college or vocational school to learn this skill, that alone should be an indicator. Additionally any CEO making over $200,000 is OVER Freaking Paid! I would say over $150,000 but some areas cost more to live. Top positions being paid salary and packages over $500K are stupid freaking owners. They should be putting that money back into the business and savings for slow times. HELLO? Sound familiar?
Brad460 wrote:
A CEO making $200k is overpaid? :laugh: You wouldn't find anyone willing to do that job for $200k!! I am thinking you have no idea what...
A CEO making $200k is overpaid? Laughing You wouldn't find anyone willing to do that job for $200k!! I am thinking you have no idea what a CEO does....
OK, Ill play. Lets put some rubber to the road.

Since you appear to exhibit more knowledge than I: Ill ask you this? Whats the definition of a Small Business? A large business? Why does anyone deserve greater than $200K in any position? If making over $200K What percentage should the annual income be to warrant that?

If you can answer one of these, I will possibility take stock in what you are saying. If unable this is why America is entitled. Morons feel morons that are a scoche smarter are entitled to some magical number because they are making decisions.
AS64
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8/2/2015 12:33pm
Tiki wrote:
Never heard about this, There is NOTHING wrong with making $10 an hour. It builds character. These are not career jobs. No one goes to college...
Never heard about this, There is NOTHING wrong with making $10 an hour. It builds character. These are not career jobs. No one goes to college or vocational school to learn this skill, that alone should be an indicator. Additionally any CEO making over $200,000 is OVER Freaking Paid! I would say over $150,000 but some areas cost more to live. Top positions being paid salary and packages over $500K are stupid freaking owners. They should be putting that money back into the business and savings for slow times. HELLO? Sound familiar?
Sounds like you've got it all figured out! Laughing
8/2/2015 4:07pm Edited Date/Time 8/2/2015 4:08pm
Tiki wrote:
OK, Ill play. Lets put some rubber to the road. Since you appear to exhibit more knowledge than I: Ill ask you this? Whats the definition...
OK, Ill play. Lets put some rubber to the road.

Since you appear to exhibit more knowledge than I: Ill ask you this? Whats the definition of a Small Business? A large business? Why does anyone deserve greater than $200K in any position? If making over $200K What percentage should the annual income be to warrant that?

If you can answer one of these, I will possibility take stock in what you are saying. If unable this is why America is entitled. Morons feel morons that are a scoche smarter are entitled to some magical number because they are making decisions.
If you could pay a guy a few % of your earnings in bonuses, and that guy would make you a freaking millionaire, would you be complaining he made that much money? I would be throwing more money at him so he stays around.
500guy
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8/2/2015 5:47pm
If you could pay a guy a few % of your earnings in bonuses, and that guy would make you a freaking millionaire, would you be...
If you could pay a guy a few % of your earnings in bonuses, and that guy would make you a freaking millionaire, would you be complaining he made that much money? I would be throwing more money at him so he stays around.
He paid people that were doing menial work as much as he paid his skilled employee's and it back fired.

Lets not kid ourselves that equal pay or lots of money will equal good hard work when most of the time more money for nothing equals the opposite.
MxKing809
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8/2/2015 6:08pm
Reminds me of the minimum wage earners that now what their hours reduced, because 15 bucks an hour for 40 hours a week disqualifies them for government aid.....
Sully
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8/2/2015 6:18pm
America is by and large, a capitalist society and as such our economy will reflect that. Any type of socialist model will struggle in that type...
America is by and large, a capitalist society and as such our economy will reflect that. Any type of socialist model will struggle in that type of economy. Saying that this shows that socialism doesn't work well is nonsense; thousands of businesses run on capitalist ideals fail as well. The two employees who quit are acting like entitled brats, with Price's brother getting into the mix as well. If anything, this shows the bad side of capitalism by showcasing the entitlement that some feel for their work and the value they will put on others -- as usual it all comes down to money. CEO's making millions while employees make $40,000 a year is an abuse of the system. More equality is needed and what Price did for his employees is a good thing but he probably should have went about it more cautiously and with a more thought out plan of action.
I'm trying to wrap my head around how two people with obvious education/experience objecting to being paid the same as the janitor makes them entitled. There's a reason why people bust their asses to gain that education/experience.
8/2/2015 6:44pm Edited Date/Time 8/2/2015 6:47pm
Sully wrote:
I'm trying to wrap my head around how two people with obvious education/experience objecting to being paid the same as the janitor makes them entitled. There's...
I'm trying to wrap my head around how two people with obvious education/experience objecting to being paid the same as the janitor makes them entitled. There's a reason why people bust their asses to gain that education/experience.
They are acting entitled because it's only an arbitrary assumption that others deserve less or work less. Janitors can work just as hard as web designers or anyone else. People in the construction trades often worker harder and longer hours than people with degrees in an office and yet they don't get payed nearly as much on average. What defines working "hard" is arbitrary. One of the workers was going to be getting more (from $14,000 to $70,000) and he still quit because it upset him that others, who he felt were less qualified, would be getting the same. It sounds to me like he thinks he is worth more, or put another way, is entitled to more. It seems that everyone thinks they work harder than the next guy and deserves more. What that really is, is a bunch of sheep buying into a system with the belief that if they work hard and put in their dues, they can have a house and car and a nice big tv. What that really is, is getting up and going to work to make someone else rich while you get to take on a lot of debt and because you've taken on a lot of debt, you get to get up and go to work some more to pay off your debt. I think the janitor should have just as good a quality of life as the next guy and so I am all for not only higher minimum wages (which WERE intended to be sustainable) but more evenness in the work place pay grade scale. Now I know some of you think you bust your asses and deserve everything you have, but again, it's all arbitrary. One can be softer on those models and have fluctuations between pay scales but the way capitalism has been abused, the balance has been lost.
Sully
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8/2/2015 7:02pm Edited Date/Time 8/2/2015 11:45pm
They are acting entitled because it's only an arbitrary assumption that others deserve less or work less. Janitors can work just as hard as web designers...
They are acting entitled because it's only an arbitrary assumption that others deserve less or work less. Janitors can work just as hard as web designers or anyone else. People in the construction trades often worker harder and longer hours than people with degrees in an office and yet they don't get payed nearly as much on average. What defines working "hard" is arbitrary. One of the workers was going to be getting more (from $14,000 to $70,000) and he still quit because it upset him that others, who he felt were less qualified, would be getting the same. It sounds to me like he thinks he is worth more, or put another way, is entitled to more. It seems that everyone thinks they work harder than the next guy and deserves more. What that really is, is a bunch of sheep buying into a system with the belief that if they work hard and put in their dues, they can have a house and car and a nice big tv. What that really is, is getting up and going to work to make someone else rich while you get to take on a lot of debt and because you've taken on a lot of debt, you get to get up and go to work some more to pay off your debt. I think the janitor should have just as good a quality of life as the next guy and so I am all for not only higher minimum wages (which WERE intended to be sustainable) but more evenness in the work place pay grade scale. Now I know some of you think you bust your asses and deserve everything you have, but again, it's all arbitrary. One can be softer on those models and have fluctuations between pay scales but the way capitalism has been abused, the balance has been lost.
The only money figures I noticed in the original article were the CEO's former million dollar salary, and the $70,000 everyone now makes, where did you get the info on the guy quitting because he went from $14k to $70k?

"What that really is, is a bunch of sheep buying into a system with the belief that if they work hard and put in their dues, they can have a house and car and a nice big tv. What that really is, is getting up and going to work to make someone else rich while you get to take on a lot of debt and because you've taken on a lot of debt, you get to get up and go to work some more to pay off your debt."

I'm not even sure what you're talking about here. Are you saying that it's the CEO's fault if you take on massive debt you can't afford? That's ridiculous. Have the best day ever.
Brad460
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8/2/2015 7:03pm
Tiki wrote:
OK, Ill play. Lets put some rubber to the road. Since you appear to exhibit more knowledge than I: Ill ask you this? Whats the definition...
OK, Ill play. Lets put some rubber to the road.

Since you appear to exhibit more knowledge than I: Ill ask you this? Whats the definition of a Small Business? A large business? Why does anyone deserve greater than $200K in any position? If making over $200K What percentage should the annual income be to warrant that?

If you can answer one of these, I will possibility take stock in what you are saying. If unable this is why America is entitled. Morons feel morons that are a scoche smarter are entitled to some magical number because they are making decisions.
Based on your questions it is clear you don't have enough knowledge of any business with a CEO...My answer to you is: Go get yourself hired as a CEO and then report back...easy enough, no?
watson
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8/2/2015 7:17pm
lostboy819 wrote:
X2
500guy wrote:
I have no problem with CEO's making big money, the only issue I have is a CEO making huge money while the company is going down...
I have no problem with CEO's making big money, the only issue I have is a CEO making huge money while the company is going down the shitter.
Pretty much this.

Income inequality is a particularly tough issue to tackle (primarily in addressing our dwindling middle class). It'll continue to be a federal-level stalemate until some meaningful change happens in our retarded hyper-partisan/corporation and union-centered (think super-PACS and lobbying) political system.

The irony is that as our middle class gets smaller (due to inflation, rising college costs, and no overtime pay for middle class salary workers), these corporations make less and less money since most consumer spending is done by the middle class (and consumer spending makes up most of our economy). Shortsighted stupidity at its finest.
borg
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8/2/2015 7:36pm
Sully wrote:
I'm trying to wrap my head around how two people with obvious education/experience objecting to being paid the same as the janitor makes them entitled. There's...
I'm trying to wrap my head around how two people with obvious education/experience objecting to being paid the same as the janitor makes them entitled. There's a reason why people bust their asses to gain that education/experience.
They are acting entitled because it's only an arbitrary assumption that others deserve less or work less. Janitors can work just as hard as web designers...
They are acting entitled because it's only an arbitrary assumption that others deserve less or work less. Janitors can work just as hard as web designers or anyone else. People in the construction trades often worker harder and longer hours than people with degrees in an office and yet they don't get payed nearly as much on average. What defines working "hard" is arbitrary. One of the workers was going to be getting more (from $14,000 to $70,000) and he still quit because it upset him that others, who he felt were less qualified, would be getting the same. It sounds to me like he thinks he is worth more, or put another way, is entitled to more. It seems that everyone thinks they work harder than the next guy and deserves more. What that really is, is a bunch of sheep buying into a system with the belief that if they work hard and put in their dues, they can have a house and car and a nice big tv. What that really is, is getting up and going to work to make someone else rich while you get to take on a lot of debt and because you've taken on a lot of debt, you get to get up and go to work some more to pay off your debt. I think the janitor should have just as good a quality of life as the next guy and so I am all for not only higher minimum wages (which WERE intended to be sustainable) but more evenness in the work place pay grade scale. Now I know some of you think you bust your asses and deserve everything you have, but again, it's all arbitrary. One can be softer on those models and have fluctuations between pay scales but the way capitalism has been abused, the balance has been lost.
You are one confused dude. Nothing is arbritrary. If you make yourself valuable to somebody with money, you will get some of it. The more valuable you become, the more you will get. If you think you are more valuable than the guy is paying you, test the market. You may find somebody that thinks you are more valuable, or, you may not. But it's not arbitrary. Is the price of your home arbitrary? No. What your home is worth is exactly what somebody is willing to pay you for it. Wages are no different.

You have some issues with basic economics.
Tiki
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8/2/2015 10:08pm
Tiki wrote:
OK, Ill play. Lets put some rubber to the road. Since you appear to exhibit more knowledge than I: Ill ask you this? Whats the definition...
OK, Ill play. Lets put some rubber to the road.

Since you appear to exhibit more knowledge than I: Ill ask you this? Whats the definition of a Small Business? A large business? Why does anyone deserve greater than $200K in any position? If making over $200K What percentage should the annual income be to warrant that?

If you can answer one of these, I will possibility take stock in what you are saying. If unable this is why America is entitled. Morons feel morons that are a scoche smarter are entitled to some magical number because they are making decisions.
Brad460 wrote:
Based on your questions it is clear you don't have enough knowledge of any business with a CEO...My answer to you is: Go get yourself hired...
Based on your questions it is clear you don't have enough knowledge of any business with a CEO...My answer to you is: Go get yourself hired as a CEO and then report back...easy enough, no?
You didn't even look on the web, to which you are connected. http://bfy.tw/17L8 How are you this dense?

The correct answer to question 1. What is the definition of a small business. As determined by the SBA (Small Business Assoication) and NAICS North American Industry Classification. A small business determination is set by either annual sales and or employees.

2. A large business is that one of which that exceeds the small business guidelines and is now a large business. WHY is this important? Taxes? Employees?

Wouldn't that be something a CEO, someone worth $200K a year should know? After all, that might be a bit of important information to know when a CEO is negotiating that next project or extending the company bonds or purchasing additional assets.

But I should go get hired as a CEO first, huh?
Tiki
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8/2/2015 10:58pm
They are acting entitled because it's only an arbitrary assumption that others deserve less or work less. Janitors can work just as hard as web designers...
They are acting entitled because it's only an arbitrary assumption that others deserve less or work less. Janitors can work just as hard as web designers or anyone else. People in the construction trades often worker harder and longer hours than people with degrees in an office and yet they don't get payed nearly as much on average. What defines working "hard" is arbitrary. One of the workers was going to be getting more (from $14,000 to $70,000) and he still quit because it upset him that others, who he felt were less qualified, would be getting the same. It sounds to me like he thinks he is worth more, or put another way, is entitled to more. It seems that everyone thinks they work harder than the next guy and deserves more. What that really is, is a bunch of sheep buying into a system with the belief that if they work hard and put in their dues, they can have a house and car and a nice big tv. What that really is, is getting up and going to work to make someone else rich while you get to take on a lot of debt and because you've taken on a lot of debt, you get to get up and go to work some more to pay off your debt. I think the janitor should have just as good a quality of life as the next guy and so I am all for not only higher minimum wages (which WERE intended to be sustainable) but more evenness in the work place pay grade scale. Now I know some of you think you bust your asses and deserve everything you have, but again, it's all arbitrary. One can be softer on those models and have fluctuations between pay scales but the way capitalism has been abused, the balance has been lost.
In regard to labor and the sheep buying into the system; much of it has already been set by the US Department of Labor and this is specifically done so it is NOT arbitrary. US Labor provides the difference between the Janitor and Web Designer and it is up to the business if they wish to follow. This is why we have minimum wage and a wage for those whom are educated at what they do.

For Example Dallas Texas:
11150 - Janitor $9.70 + health and welfare
15080 - Graphic Artist $22.70

The differences are substantial but then again, what is known to push a broom and clean dirt vs what is known about four color printing, pre-press or web design and SEO optimization? The two are just as distant. So then to define working hard? Is that hours or sweat? That's where rewards come in.

To note where I agree with you and how the balance was lost. Entitlement is a huge issue. Before 1990, it was standard for a company to have one manager and three workers. More would get done, less was paid in HR. In today's entitlement society we have one worker to three managers. Each manager wants profit sharing, bonuses, wages, kickbacks and commission pre and post gross. That's an issue. Because they don't earn it or warrant it. Neither do CEO's IMO They are paid employees. Executive staff yes and they are reward based on their performance but they are still employees. The problem that this brought was illustrated perfectly from 2001 to 2010. Businesses folded because they had no savings. Then they lowered rates to keep business going through the door to either: boost shareholders (they lied) or stay in business and hope things get better. They didn't survive that long. The CEO should have directed the savings for slow times.

Then Minimum is just that. Minimum schooling, knowledge and time. It was meant to be a starting place. Do fast food workers need more than minimum? I suppose if they are moved from basic positions sure. For most It's not arbitrary, for some it is.

And as long as you are an employee you are making someone else rich. Figure it out how it can be the other way around.
J.F.S
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Stockholm SE
8/12/2015 1:42am
I heard a story, about a banker, a worker and an immigrant. They sat at a table with 20 cookies, the banker took 19 of the cookies and then told the worker to watch out so that the immigrant does not take his cookie.

I think it is related in a way, because it shows the skewed thinking with some people.
8/12/2015 7:01am
Raising wages is not "socialism." It's still capitalism. Some Americans label pretty much anything that helps the everyday worker as "socialism."
Modern CEOs have pretty much one goal- increasing quarterly profits for shareholders. So they tend to make short-term changes to increase those profits, and maybe even escape with a "golden parachute" when the whole company goes south as a result of short-term thinking.
hvaughn88
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8/12/2015 7:13am
Tiki wrote:
Never heard about this, There is NOTHING wrong with making $10 an hour. It builds character. These are not career jobs. No one goes to college...
Never heard about this, There is NOTHING wrong with making $10 an hour. It builds character. These are not career jobs. No one goes to college or vocational school to learn this skill, that alone should be an indicator. Additionally any CEO making over $200,000 is OVER Freaking Paid! I would say over $150,000 but some areas cost more to live. Top positions being paid salary and packages over $500K are stupid freaking owners. They should be putting that money back into the business and savings for slow times. HELLO? Sound familiar?
Just curious, how did you arrive at $200K?
newmann
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8/12/2015 7:34am Edited Date/Time 8/12/2015 7:39am
Tiki wrote:
Never heard about this, There is NOTHING wrong with making $10 an hour. It builds character. These are not career jobs. No one goes to college...
Never heard about this, There is NOTHING wrong with making $10 an hour. It builds character. These are not career jobs. No one goes to college or vocational school to learn this skill, that alone should be an indicator. Additionally any CEO making over $200,000 is OVER Freaking Paid! I would say over $150,000 but some areas cost more to live. Top positions being paid salary and packages over $500K are stupid freaking owners. They should be putting that money back into the business and savings for slow times. HELLO? Sound familiar?
hvaughn88 wrote:
Just curious, how did you arrive at $200K?
CEO for that? No way, you guys can have those headaches. I would like to figure out how to make 200k a year and not have to show up to work. If only I were edumacated....

And I will agree that there is nothing wrong with making $10.00 an hour. The only problem is when the individual has zero desire to advance beyond that point.
KTMShane699
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Colchester, CT US
8/12/2015 7:45am
They are acting entitled because it's only an arbitrary assumption that others deserve less or work less. Janitors can work just as hard as web designers...
They are acting entitled because it's only an arbitrary assumption that others deserve less or work less. Janitors can work just as hard as web designers or anyone else. People in the construction trades often worker harder and longer hours than people with degrees in an office and yet they don't get payed nearly as much on average. What defines working "hard" is arbitrary. One of the workers was going to be getting more (from $14,000 to $70,000) and he still quit because it upset him that others, who he felt were less qualified, would be getting the same. It sounds to me like he thinks he is worth more, or put another way, is entitled to more. It seems that everyone thinks they work harder than the next guy and deserves more. What that really is, is a bunch of sheep buying into a system with the belief that if they work hard and put in their dues, they can have a house and car and a nice big tv. What that really is, is getting up and going to work to make someone else rich while you get to take on a lot of debt and because you've taken on a lot of debt, you get to get up and go to work some more to pay off your debt. I think the janitor should have just as good a quality of life as the next guy and so I am all for not only higher minimum wages (which WERE intended to be sustainable) but more evenness in the work place pay grade scale. Now I know some of you think you bust your asses and deserve everything you have, but again, it's all arbitrary. One can be softer on those models and have fluctuations between pay scales but the way capitalism has been abused, the balance has been lost.
Utilizing your model, there is no incentive to better yourself. We are all "equal" and ENTITLED to the same quality of life, regardless of our roles in the world. Society needs pay scales. You need to have another step to reach for if you want it. A large reason many people change employers while staying in the same injury is opportunity for advancement. To be honest, it's what lead me to my career. Where I was working, I was at a plateau. So I made a change and took on something that allows me to advance. It allows financial advancement as well as new challenges and career advancement. Where I am currently, there will always be a "next step" for me if I want to take it. It's partially what keeps me engaged in my career (besides that I truly love what I do).

And I do buy into the belief that if I work hard, I can have nice things that I want. It's how I live my life. And as far as finances and debt, you throw a lot of assumptions out there when you know nothing about the finances of the guy sitting next to you. Or the guys on this forum. Some are well off. Some struggle. Some own companies. Some work for companies. It doesn't make one better than the other, but to say we all deserve the same quality of life based on what we do is asinine.

As for working to make someone else rich, there will be owners and employees. If the owner does a good job, they're rewarded with a successful business and hopefully some financial benefit. They took the risk of starting a business. They put an investment into their company. In no way would I assume an employee is entitled to the same compensation as an owner. And for the record, in most successful businesses there was a startup period where the employees did actually make more than the owners. But the success of the business is when the payoff comes.

When I see my surgeon on Monday, I'll be sure to tell the receptionist that she should have an equal lifestyle to the doctor. After all, it's only fair...

Shane
hvaughn88
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8/12/2015 7:49am
We can go back and forth all day about this, but I just assume that when you raise the minimum wage a substantial amount, then your milk will cost $20 a gallon

(obviously i'm using arbitrary numbers and milk as an example, but you get the picture)
IWreckALot
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Fort Worth, TX US
8/12/2015 9:41am
J.F.S wrote:
I heard a story, about a banker, a worker and an immigrant. They sat at a table with 20 cookies, the banker took 19 of the...
I heard a story, about a banker, a worker and an immigrant. They sat at a table with 20 cookies, the banker took 19 of the cookies and then told the worker to watch out so that the immigrant does not take his cookie.

I think it is related in a way, because it shows the skewed thinking with some people.
Your opinions all make so much more sense after learning you're paid in cookies. Tell your grandma to give you 30 minutes of free time out of her basement and an additional 5 cookie per hour raise.
Titan1
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8/12/2015 10:12am Edited Date/Time 8/12/2015 10:13am
Owners (and share holders) profit margins are determined by demand for the product, and competition (they have to make sure their product is priced competitively with the competition) and what most people seem to forget is that they are constant for any reason outside of demand and competition. Companies simply add their profit margin to their overhead, unless demand decreases or the competition drops their prices, to determine the price of the product.

If their overhead is increased (increase in taxes, increase in wages, increase in anything), they simply increase the price of their product. Since things like wage increases and taxes are applied across the board (meaning their competition is also experiencing the same increases so they all raise their prices together), those kinds of things just get passed on to the consumer, across the board.

So increase the minimum wage to $20 (to go with hvaughn88's example) and see what happens to the price of your value meal at McDonalds, or the cost of your oil change at Jiffy Lube. Granted something like a minimum wage increase will largely only affect the industries that are dependent on minimum wage employees (Increasing the Minimum wage likely wouldn't affect an engineering firm, for example, because none of their employees actually make minimum wage...where McDonalds and Jiffy Lube would be affected because the majority of their employees are probably at, or near, minimum wage).

huck
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8/12/2015 10:29am
As the owner of my business, it's not ANY of my employees business what I make. If they think they are underpaid, or can get more somewhere else...they are all free to go. (for the record, we have only had 3 people quit in the last 10 years. 2 of them moved out of state and the other always wanted to be a police officer).


What business is it of theirs if I make $200,000, $500,000, or $10,000,000 per year??
Titan1
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Lehi, UT US
8/12/2015 10:55am
huck wrote:
As the owner of my business, it's not ANY of my employees business what I make. If they think they are underpaid, or can get more...
As the owner of my business, it's not ANY of my employees business what I make. If they think they are underpaid, or can get more somewhere else...they are all free to go. (for the record, we have only had 3 people quit in the last 10 years. 2 of them moved out of state and the other always wanted to be a police officer).


What business is it of theirs if I make $200,000, $500,000, or $10,000,000 per year??
YUP!

As a business owner you hold all the risk, and all the stress. There should be no ceiling on what a business owner can earn (as long as the company is healthy and profitable), and its none of their employees business.

Post a reply to: Remember the CEO who raised all his workers pay to 70K

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