why is the 2012 SUZUKI frame better?

BobbyM
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BobbyM
Edited Date/Time 5/21/2014 4:49pm
Anyone.....
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PJ205
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PJ205 5/20/2014 9:15pm
5/20/2014 9:15pm
All that Ive heard is that it isnt as rigid as the current ones. A little more flex in it, apparently.
Socket946
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Socket946 5/20/2014 9:20pm
5/20/2014 9:20pm
Ask Tony Alessi - He knew more than the factory did in 2012.
bvm111
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bvm111 5/20/2014 9:42pm
5/20/2014 9:42pm
And tony was so smart he evidently bought up all the 2012 frames, he "planned ahead" since he is so smart!

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Crush
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Crush 5/20/2014 9:51pm
5/20/2014 9:51pm
They added I think 5-8mm height in the Frame head and regusseted it, similar to what they did with the 13 generation Honda I think.

Sounds like James and Alessi are running the old one and RCH are on the current version.
Jeff alessi
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Jeff alessi 5/20/2014 10:14pm
5/20/2014 10:14pm
I've road the 13s and 14s, I didn't like them the slightest. The 12 to me isn't so aggressive and corners so well. The 13 grabbed your feet in ruts n kicked so hard.
fullfloater
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fullfloater 5/20/2014 10:38pm
5/20/2014 10:38pm
Jeff, I think that was those Spanish speaking fellas grabbing your feet in the ruts, not the Suzuki.
ML512
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ML512 5/20/2014 10:49pm
5/20/2014 10:49pm
As stated above the head stay and tubes are stiffer on 13-14 chassis, making it more rigid and has more feedback from the front end etc.
Jeff alessi
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Jeff alessi 5/20/2014 11:07pm
5/20/2014 11:07pm Edited Date/Time 5/20/2014 11:08pm
fullfloater wrote:
Jeff, I think that was those Spanish speaking fellas grabbing your feet in the ruts, not the Suzuki.
Hahaha now that's funny! Tho I think it was more my front brake they were grabbing for lol
Ryan_Roberts
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Ryan_Roberts 5/20/2014 11:18pm
5/20/2014 11:18pm
fullfloater wrote:
Jeff, I think that was those Spanish speaking fellas grabbing your feet in the ruts, not the Suzuki.
Jeff alessi wrote:
Hahaha now that's funny! Tho I think it was more my front brake they were grabbing for lol
good thing none of them had a laser pointer down there huh
Aceofspades 5/20/2014 11:29pm
5/20/2014 11:29pm
Ryan_Roberts wrote:
good thing none of them had a laser pointer down there huh
What a topical and wonderfully hilarious joke. *golf clap*
shredder22
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shredder22 5/21/2014 3:44am
5/21/2014 3:44am
fullfloater wrote:
Jeff, I think that was those Spanish speaking fellas grabbing your feet in the ruts, not the Suzuki.
Jeff alessi wrote:
Hahaha now that's funny! Tho I think it was more my front brake they were grabbing for lol
Ryan_Roberts wrote:
good thing none of them had a laser pointer down there huh
lol
Aceofspades 5/21/2014 4:57am
5/21/2014 4:57am
Harry Backmon wrote:
Way past time to let it go.
No, jeff will hear about it til doomsday on vital because this place is filled with a bunch of perfect motherfuckers that have never done anything wrong or stupid in their own lives. Their perfection forces them to constantly point out the flaws of other, non-perfect people.
Racer92
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Racer92 5/21/2014 5:41am
5/21/2014 5:41am
BobbyM wrote:
Anyone.....
Because the 2012 is the closest they have come to making that crappy aluminum work as well as this did straight outta the crate.




WhiteKnuckleV2.1 5/21/2014 6:02am
5/21/2014 6:02am
BobbyM wrote:
Anyone.....
Racer92 wrote:
Because the 2012 is the closest they have come to making that crappy aluminum work as well as this did straight outta the crate. [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2014/05/21/54411/s1200_csteel63_4.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2014/05/21/54412/s1200_csteel63_2.jpg[/img]
Because the 2012 is the closest they have come to making that crappy aluminum work as well as this did straight outta the crate.




We hear "New and Improved!" so much that we think "New" = "Improved". Ever since MC refused to ride the '97 Honda, we should have been suspicious about aluminum frames. Just because it works on a road racer doesn't mean it works on a motocross bike.

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Aceofspades 5/21/2014 6:29am
5/21/2014 6:29am
BobbyM wrote:
Anyone.....
Racer92 wrote:
Because the 2012 is the closest they have come to making that crappy aluminum work as well as this did straight outta the crate. [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2014/05/21/54411/s1200_csteel63_4.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2014/05/21/54412/s1200_csteel63_2.jpg[/img]
Because the 2012 is the closest they have come to making that crappy aluminum work as well as this did straight outta the crate.




Jesus those RM's were beautiful.
MtnBoy
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MtnBoy 5/21/2014 6:33am
5/21/2014 6:33am
Ryan_Roberts wrote:
good thing none of them had a laser pointer down there huh
Douche move
Racer92
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Racer92 5/21/2014 6:47am
5/21/2014 6:47am Edited Date/Time 5/21/2014 6:54am
WhiteKnuckleV2.1 wrote:
We hear "New and Improved!" so much that we think "New" = "Improved". Ever since MC refused to ride the '97 Honda, we should have been...
We hear "New and Improved!" so much that we think "New" = "Improved". Ever since MC refused to ride the '97 Honda, we should have been suspicious about aluminum frames. Just because it works on a road racer doesn't mean it works on a motocross bike.
Yessir, that was my point. In the pursuit of making "new & improved" they have been stubborn to admit that perhaps aluminum just might not be the answer. Some of the steel frame designs in the past just hit the sweet spot, and there is no reason to change it. The '93-'96 Honda is a good example as well. In the sprint car world the chassis is called the "5th Spring" because how the chromoly chassis bends and flexes makes ALL the difference on how the car behaves and hooks up. And like dirt bike builders, there were years where sprint chassis manufacturers just flat got it right. To this day, the 1989 Gambler chassis design still is one of the favs by non-wing racers, decades after its design came out. IMHO anything that is raced off-road will work better with a steel frame/chassis.

I have to add, however, that I was speaking only to bikes ridden by Expert/Pro's. Slow weekend wannabe and old guys like me would never ride a bike fast enough to truly realize the differences.
Moto75
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Moto75 5/21/2014 7:41am
5/21/2014 7:41am
WhiteKnuckleV2.1 wrote:
We hear "New and Improved!" so much that we think "New" = "Improved". Ever since MC refused to ride the '97 Honda, we should have been...
We hear "New and Improved!" so much that we think "New" = "Improved". Ever since MC refused to ride the '97 Honda, we should have been suspicious about aluminum frames. Just because it works on a road racer doesn't mean it works on a motocross bike.
Racer92 wrote:
Yessir, that was my point. In the pursuit of making "new & improved" they have been stubborn to admit that perhaps aluminum just might not be...
Yessir, that was my point. In the pursuit of making "new & improved" they have been stubborn to admit that perhaps aluminum just might not be the answer. Some of the steel frame designs in the past just hit the sweet spot, and there is no reason to change it. The '93-'96 Honda is a good example as well. In the sprint car world the chassis is called the "5th Spring" because how the chromoly chassis bends and flexes makes ALL the difference on how the car behaves and hooks up. And like dirt bike builders, there were years where sprint chassis manufacturers just flat got it right. To this day, the 1989 Gambler chassis design still is one of the favs by non-wing racers, decades after its design came out. IMHO anything that is raced off-road will work better with a steel frame/chassis.

I have to add, however, that I was speaking only to bikes ridden by Expert/Pro's. Slow weekend wannabe and old guys like me would never ride a bike fast enough to truly realize the differences.
I generally agree with you, but there's always exceptions to the rule... Wasn't Reed leaning towards the KTM until they started to put more power in the bike & found the Steel frame wasn't to his liking.
EMARacing
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EMARacing 5/21/2014 7:56am
5/21/2014 7:56am
Jeff alessi wrote:
I've road the 13s and 14s, I didn't like them the slightest. The 12 to me isn't so aggressive and corners so well. The 13 grabbed...
I've road the 13s and 14s, I didn't like them the slightest. The 12 to me isn't so aggressive and corners so well. The 13 grabbed your feet in ruts n kicked so hard.
"A redesigned frame increases rigidity and reduces weight by 4% from the previous model."

And now the 2015 is going to be even more rigid?
Racer92
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Racer92 5/21/2014 8:59am
5/21/2014 8:59am Edited Date/Time 5/21/2014 9:13am
EMARacing wrote:
"A redesigned frame increases rigidity and reduces weight by 4% from the previous model."

And now the 2015 is going to be even more rigid?
Makes you wonder who is their test riders and who is saying what feels 'better' at the Factory. When they had Ricky riding for them, they got good feedback that ended up on the following year production bikes.

I talked with DeCoster at Rio this year about why they added that piece of reinforcement steel at the top-neck of the steering stem of the 2005 RM250. (this strap was not on the 2004 and with the location of this new reinforcement, I could not put a Scotts 'bolt-on' damper post on my 2005) Roger told me they had several test bikes with various frame configurations, they had Ricky ride them in testing and they went with the designs that Ricky said felt better.
NorcalVet
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NorcalVet 5/21/2014 12:50pm
5/21/2014 12:50pm Edited Date/Time 5/21/2014 4:16pm
I like having one of each for different tracks/ conditions
RMZ when your feeln lazy or for rutted hard pack
Rm when you want to ride more aggressive or sand

Newer RMZ has more flex then my ole '05. But I miss the 4 speed w/ cams and hcomp piston
---- it pulled & tracked like a real tractor Smile
harrowguy 5/21/2014 3:58pm
5/21/2014 3:58pm Edited Date/Time 5/21/2014 4:03pm
Ryan Roberts say that to Jeffs face.
Away from the spot light bet ya $1000.00 you won't.
I can't stand internet tough guys.
like everyone makes mistakes give it a rest
BAMX
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BAMX 5/21/2014 4:03pm
5/21/2014 4:03pm
Ryan_Roberts wrote:
good thing none of them had a laser pointer down there huh
MtnBoy wrote:
Douche move
Agreed but then again, don't do the crime if you don't want the time.

I did like his input on this though. He obviously has some experience and insight into the topic.
harrowguy 5/21/2014 4:49pm
5/21/2014 4:49pm
Well bitching at him like little girls isn't the best way to ask for someones input is it?

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