Why can't the U S A build a competitive MX bike?

Julian
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Edited Date/Time 10/29/2014 7:47pm
The first MX bike I bought was a 1974 CR 125, quality product.

I have owned a ton of cars, the best were the Civic and Accord

The Kentucky Toyota Camry I bought new rattled and was hard to resell.

Chevy, Ford, GM, are you kidding, never owned em - why would I ? I like quality products.

Some of you know what I am talking about

Some of you WANT to think we make good cars in the USA and will respond with your stories about your great USA cars. (more power to you, but I know better, so save it)

Some of you are thinking our strength is not in producing cars/motorcycles but in fields like Apple, Yahoo, Google, etc. you are right.

Everybody knows that German cars are light years better than American cars, AUDI against Chevy - are you kidding me? Of course the Germans kill us.

But guess what, the Japanese kill the Germans. Lexus vs Mercedes, Infiniti vs BMW.

So, lets all get over it, The USA is way down the list, that is just the way it is.

Now to the post. Everyone who knows MX knows the bike must be top quality to be competitive.

Will the USA EVER build a competitive (= quality and reliable) MX motorcycle?
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O___o
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10/27/2014 11:59am
Julian,

Why cant Poland build ANYTHING?
Skippie
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10/27/2014 12:02pm
So what to you is quality? An American truck that runs for 500k miles isn't quality? Have you driven a new MB s550? I wouldn't quite say the Japanese destroy the Germans either. But I don't think any American companies will come in. There isn't really any room for another brand in the market here. Even up until a few years ago KTM had nowhere near the sales as their Japanese competition.

The Shop

10/27/2014 12:04pm
If those vins on your Honda's started with either a 1 or 2, they came from America just as your yota did.
philG
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10/27/2014 12:06pm Edited Date/Time 10/27/2014 12:15pm
It ok saying that they do 500k miles , but i drove 25 in a Dodge Dually and it was the worst thing i ever drove in my life.... and believe me when i say i have a ceiling budget of £600 for a car ..and that is still enough to buy something that i would rather drive
moto38
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10/27/2014 12:07pm
because whoever builds it would use ancient suspension, a v-twin harley engine and more gimmick "performance" design features than you can shake a stick at in the name of "America"

lookin at you, Buell
Skippie
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10/27/2014 12:10pm
philG wrote:
It ok saying that they do 500k miles , but i drove 25 in a Dodge Dually and it was the worst thing i ever drove...
It ok saying that they do 500k miles , but i drove 25 in a Dodge Dually and it was the worst thing i ever drove in my life.... and believe me when i say i have a ceiling budget of £600 for a car ..and that is still enough to buy something that i would rather drive
It's a dually haha, wasn't exactly meant to ride smooth.
Julian
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10/27/2014 12:10pm
i know there will be plenty of you who LIKE your Chevy and that is all well and good, our economy needs you.....

but I am trying to address the QUALITY issue here

an MX bike has no where to hide, it must be spot on when it comes to quality, or it gets left behind like Canondale.

again

Why can't the USA build a competitive MX bike?
MxKing809
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10/27/2014 12:15pm Edited Date/Time 10/27/2014 12:16pm
Have you ever owned a chevy pickup? Or ridden in one Julian?
Skippie
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10/27/2014 12:15pm
Julian wrote:
i know there will be plenty of you who LIKE your Chevy and that is all well and good, our economy needs you..... but I am...
i know there will be plenty of you who LIKE your Chevy and that is all well and good, our economy needs you.....

but I am trying to address the QUALITY issue here

an MX bike has no where to hide, it must be spot on when it comes to quality, or it gets left behind like Canondale.

again

Why can't the USA build a competitive MX bike?
And why do you say a Chevy isn't quality? It's not a question about why can't America build a quality MX bike, it's from a business side there is no reason to so they won't. Why spend Millions in R/D in a shrinking market that already has 6 other well established successful brands?
BAMX
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10/27/2014 12:16pm
Julian wrote:
i know there will be plenty of you who LIKE your Chevy and that is all well and good, our economy needs you..... but I am...
i know there will be plenty of you who LIKE your Chevy and that is all well and good, our economy needs you.....

but I am trying to address the QUALITY issue here

an MX bike has no where to hide, it must be spot on when it comes to quality, or it gets left behind like Canondale.

again

Why can't the USA build a competitive MX bike?
What about Cobra? Don't they make a competitive bike in America?
hvaughn88
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10/27/2014 12:16pm
Not that it matters, but my little sister had a BMW that was a heaping pile of shit from the day it came off the dealership lot. Brand new car and crap was breaking on it all the time. I mean stuff like the moon roof tracking, the door handles, hell even the bmw badge fell off the hood. And I can assure you, we come from a family that is religious about vehicle maintenance and taking care of our vehicles. This was a few years back, so perhaps things are different now. But it was bad enough that it turned me off from ever considering them for a vehicle.
Spartacus
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10/27/2014 12:18pm
Our pork BBQ is awesome, why bother with a MX bike?



BAMX
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10/27/2014 12:19pm
MxKing809 wrote:
Have you ever owned a chevy pickup? Or ridden in one Julian?
I have and it was a POS...At this point, they would have to give me one to make up for all of the money and trouble from that truck.
huck
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10/27/2014 12:23pm
Julian wrote:
The first MX bike I bought was a 1974 CR 125, quality product. I have owned a ton of cars, the best were the Civic and...
The first MX bike I bought was a 1974 CR 125, quality product.

I have owned a ton of cars, the best were the Civic and Accord

The Kentucky Toyota Camry I bought new rattled and was hard to resell.

Chevy, Ford, GM, are you kidding, never owned em - why would I ? I like quality products.

Some of you know what I am talking about

Some of you WANT to think we make good cars in the USA and will respond with your stories about your great USA cars. (more power to you, but I know better, so save it)

Some of you are thinking our strength is not in producing cars/motorcycles but in fields like Apple, Yahoo, Google, etc. you are right.

Everybody knows that German cars are light years better than American cars, AUDI against Chevy - are you kidding me? Of course the Germans kill us.

But guess what, the Japanese kill the Germans. Lexus vs Mercedes, Infiniti vs BMW.

So, lets all get over it, The USA is way down the list, that is just the way it is.

Now to the post. Everyone who knows MX knows the bike must be top quality to be competitive.

Will the USA EVER build a competitive (= quality and reliable) MX motorcycle?
So you've never owned a Chevy, Ford, GM...but you can comment on them... Seems logical!
TF212
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Sun Prairie, WI US
10/27/2014 12:25pm
Define Quality.

Quality can mean quite a few different things depending on who you are talking to.

Does it mean meeting design specifications and tolerances?
Does it mean low cost to produce?
Does it mean good durability?
Good aesthetics?
Most features?
Easy to work on?

I bet a number of the above definitions can be applied to US, German, and Japanese cars. Finding an all encompassing definition to Quality like you are trying to say is next to impossible.
Pembroke36
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10/27/2014 12:29pm
O___o wrote:
Julian,

Why cant Poland build ANYTHING?
Poland builds some nice racks. There was this website I was on once and the women were all "above average" on size and build quality.
roughneck
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10/27/2014 12:39pm
BECAUSE" The japs are smarter then us..duh!

at least we don't all have black hair Smile
Skippie
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10/27/2014 12:40pm
roughneck wrote:
BECAUSE" The japs are smarter then us..duh!

at least we don't all have black hair Smile
Hey man that's racist.

/sarcasm
Brad460
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10/27/2014 12:47pm Edited Date/Time 10/27/2014 12:48pm
While not impossible, it is very difficult to jump into a mature product offering such as motocross bikes. As we know USA is competitive with ATVs, snowmobiles and street motorcycles, but for some reason mx bikes are elusive.

As you can see most of your responses are the typical vital jackass responses...but it would be nice to hear the perspective from someone with more historical background on this...someone intelligent who has been around the industry for 30+ years.



wanglimp
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10/27/2014 12:48pm
"Some of you WANT to think we make good cars in the USA..."
"Some of you are thinking our strength..."
"Of course the Germans kill us."

Is anyone else catching that he is speaking as if he is an American....I am confused.
roughneck
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10/27/2014 12:49pm
look how famous the USA made all the foreign bikes! Smile

USA...USA...USA!!!
hvaughn88
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10/27/2014 12:49pm Edited Date/Time 10/27/2014 12:51pm
wanglimp wrote:
"Some of you WANT to think [b]we[/b] make good cars in the USA..." "Some of you are thinking [b]our[/b] strength..." "Of course the Germans kill [b]us[/b]."...
"Some of you WANT to think we make good cars in the USA..."
"Some of you are thinking our strength..."
"Of course the Germans kill us."

Is anyone else catching that he is speaking as if he is an American....I am confused.
He is American, right? I thought he said that in a thread a while back. I think it was when he was blowing his gasket about the RV "would/should/could/have/has" fiasco.
wanglimp
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10/27/2014 12:53pm Edited Date/Time 10/27/2014 12:54pm
wanglimp wrote:
"Some of you WANT to think [b]we[/b] make good cars in the USA..." "Some of you are thinking [b]our[/b] strength..." "Of course the Germans kill [b]us[/b]."...
"Some of you WANT to think we make good cars in the USA..."
"Some of you are thinking our strength..."
"Of course the Germans kill us."

Is anyone else catching that he is speaking as if he is an American....I am confused.
hvaughn88 wrote:
He is American, right? I thought he said that in a thread a while back. I think it was when he was blowing his gasket about...
He is American, right? I thought he said that in a thread a while back. I think it was when he was blowing his gasket about the RV "would/should/could/have/has" fiasco.
Didn't catch that one.
10/27/2014 12:55pm
Julian you sir are an idiot! Its people like you who do not understand quality and belittle the america products that piss people like me off! My family has been building gm cars for years and they are some of the best quality in the world. Honda and toyota are nothing more than tin can fuel economy cars. You know how many tundras I've seen go up in the air on a 2 post lift and watched the frame snap in half and almost kill the guy working on them? Too many. And your German engineering isn't much better BMWs have more electrical problems and quirky crap wrong with them than most.
Julian
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10/27/2014 12:57pm
Julian wrote:
i know there will be plenty of you who LIKE your Chevy and that is all well and good, our economy needs you..... but I am...
i know there will be plenty of you who LIKE your Chevy and that is all well and good, our economy needs you.....

but I am trying to address the QUALITY issue here

an MX bike has no where to hide, it must be spot on when it comes to quality, or it gets left behind like Canondale.

again

Why can't the USA build a competitive MX bike?
Skippie wrote:
And why do you say a Chevy isn't quality? It's not a question about why can't America build a quality MX bike, it's from a business...
And why do you say a Chevy isn't quality? It's not a question about why can't America build a quality MX bike, it's from a business side there is no reason to so they won't. Why spend Millions in R/D in a shrinking market that already has 6 other well established successful brands?
wow, what sort of thinking is that?
KTM did not say, oh my gosh, there are already 4 giant Japanese producers in the market and no room for another brand
and on top of that
then after they had become number 5, they did not say, oh my gosh, there are already 5 brands in the market - there is no room for six,
they said, sure there is room, so they re-introduced Husqvarna
and soon there will be six
So, ????
Julian
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10/27/2014 1:00pm
MxKing809 wrote:
Have you ever owned a chevy pickup? Or ridden in one Julian?
BAMX wrote:
I have and it was a POS...At this point, they would have to give me one to make up for all of the money and trouble...
I have and it was a POS...At this point, they would have to give me one to make up for all of the money and trouble from that truck.
yes I had a Chevy Truck, and no it is not the quality of a Honda Civic, Honda Accord, Audi, Mercedes, BMW, Infiniti, Lexus.

You understand what I am getting at.

As I said, if you want to build an MX Bike, it has to be top quality, or it will fall to the side like Canondale.
Skippie
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10/27/2014 1:01pm
Julian wrote:
wow, what sort of thinking is that? KTM did not say, oh my gosh, there are already 4 giant Japanese producers in the market and no...
wow, what sort of thinking is that?
KTM did not say, oh my gosh, there are already 4 giant Japanese producers in the market and no room for another brand
and on top of that
then after they had become number 5, they did not say, oh my gosh, there are already 5 brands in the market - there is no room for six,
they said, sure there is room, so they re-introduced Husqvarna
and soon there will be six
So, ????
No my point was that KTM (and Husqvarna now as well) have both been around for decades and have been competing and developing bikes all that time. But up until recently, neither has had as big a marketshare or success as their Japanese competitors. They took years to get to the point where they are at now. So for an American company to completely start brand new right now (especially in this economy where the sport is arguably at it's worst money wise), just wouldn't make sense. It's a lot of investment for a small niche in an already unstable market.
gharmon
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10/27/2014 1:02pm
I don't know what to tell you but my Fords have had excellent reliability. About the competitive dirt bike? I have no idea what to tell you. Although I bought a used Cobra for my grandson last week. I'll let you know how that turns out.

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