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Edited Date/Time
1/27/2012 8:53am
I don't want to be disrespecful to anyone, and while it's obvious that Ryan Dungey is a great guy and rider I don't think it's really a good judge to compare his results this year to other greats in years gone past.
I mean in second and third in the AMA Championship came Brett Metcalfe and Andrew Short, two really great guys and good riders, but.....how many Motocross overalls/races have these two won between them. Maybe one, or two in their whole career? Ben Townley was coming back from two years out and was clearly wanting it too much and making mistakes. and Alessi had the worst season of his career.
Give Cairoli credit, he beat the AMA Motocross Champion of 2009 at last years des Nations, won a moto on the 250cc machine in 2006 and is riding better than ever this year. He also beat former World Champions Philippaerts and Ramon.The riders Cairoli beat have probably 30 GP wins between them.
In my opinion the GP guys have improved more than the AMA guys and I can't wait for next weekend to see what the results will be. We might just be in for the shock of the decade as the GP riders dominate the motos.
Either way both Cairoli and Dungey deserve all the respect of the public, both are great champions. As are Musquin and Canard.
Geoff
I mean in second and third in the AMA Championship came Brett Metcalfe and Andrew Short, two really great guys and good riders, but.....how many Motocross overalls/races have these two won between them. Maybe one, or two in their whole career? Ben Townley was coming back from two years out and was clearly wanting it too much and making mistakes. and Alessi had the worst season of his career.
Give Cairoli credit, he beat the AMA Motocross Champion of 2009 at last years des Nations, won a moto on the 250cc machine in 2006 and is riding better than ever this year. He also beat former World Champions Philippaerts and Ramon.The riders Cairoli beat have probably 30 GP wins between them.
In my opinion the GP guys have improved more than the AMA guys and I can't wait for next weekend to see what the results will be. We might just be in for the shock of the decade as the GP riders dominate the motos.
Either way both Cairoli and Dungey deserve all the respect of the public, both are great champions. As are Musquin and Canard.
Geoff
You might be able to help me, but how many overall wins in the 450cc class from the top ten riders in the 450cc class. Dungey obviously has a lot from this year, but after him it's pretty thin pickings I think. Short might have a couple, Alessi might have two or three, then thats about it or not.
Geoff
Oh yeah, and how badly did AC smoke Reed last year at MXoN? It was a close race between those two. Guess how close the racing was between Reed & Dungey this year? Oh yeah that's right... Dungey never saw Reed. Dungey beat him every race of the Nationals with ease.
Dungey is the real deal and I don't think AC is even close to his level.
I have a feeling the MXoN is going to be a sad day for a lot of the GP fans.
The Shop
How many Bercy races did Cairoli win?
How many SX races can Cairoli get podiums or top 5's in? And do it vs. Bubba Reed Millsaps Windham Ferry Grant Wey etc
You are talking stupid.
Short is the more complete rider. Will that win him a GP title? Who know's until Short starts racing GP's
But who knows if Cairoli can score as many points as Short has the last few years.
Wins really don't mean shit when you talk about guy's from different series.
And the des Nations won't tell you shit either.
Dungey has been overshadowed by a couple of riders up untill last year. These past couple of years he has obviously found an extra little niche. We'll see whos fastest on the day of the des nations I guess. Although it would be a lot better to see some of the gp riders race a whole series to get an accurate comparison. C'mon atleast a series, then they can go back with or without a championship.
Canard has potential to be even faster than Dungey at times I believe. Actually a lot of the time.
We have yet to see the best of Short also IMO.
Roger made mention at the awards banquet that the crank in Dungey's bike at Hangtown was different than used previously...and that it wasn't for the better.
I get that you're trying to help out here (I think). But I'm not sure it's helping.
An on form 2009 Reed for Cairoli vs a VERY off form 2010 Reed for Dungey.
This is the problem with comparing riders through guaging what they've accomplished against other riders, at different times, different days, tracks and years.
I have no doubt that Dungey is light years faster than he was in 2009 but he has never beaten Cairoli on pure SPEED. Antonio hasn't been sitting around twiddlerling his thumbs this past year either. He's faster than he was on the Yamaha.
It's on if they start 1-2
As for Cairoli not going to America..... well, not everyone chases the money. Antonio LOVES the european lifestyle with a passion. Anything that speculates what's going on in someone elses mind is purely that, speculation.
Hmmm...
JMB - 3 x AMA titles
Albertyn - AMA MX title
Pichon - 2 x 125SX titles
Langston - 4 x AMA titles
Townley - SX title, nearly beat RV for 250 MX
Pourcel - 2 x SX titles, almost 2 x 250 MX titles
Of course there are others such as Tortelli, Vuillemin, Rattray etc who never won titles but won races and were consistently top 5 guys.
Pit Row
B. You can't judge riders based on how the do against their competition.
One thing you can judge, though, is the character of riders based on how they run their mouths.
I like Dungey, always have. He's a fantastic rider and generally presents himself impeccably, but did you see the Dungey - Lawrence clip in the other thread? If no body ever said a word life would be a pretty boring place.
He is allowed an opinion. I don't see the problem with it.
Geoff
These arguments have no resolution and inevitably devolve into an insult fest. It's too bad Cairoli let his mouth overload his ass.
people have crapped on dungey all year because bubba, villy ect weren't there....but he was there and took control od the yr from jan to sept like nobody but rc or bubba ever has. he showed, decimated the guys that came. cioroili is awsome, but he's a one dimentional racer. my money is on dungey. he's fit, on the best bike.....and knows how to control motos at the right time.
if dogger could go sleepless and show up with douchebags after practice and beat every legend in eurocross history at once.....a fit, fed and slept dungey should have no sweat taking care of one man with summer teeth!
I doubt it would have been such a close race with a 100 % fit Cairoli.
Let Dungey race 1 or 2 years the GP series. Why WE (the Euros) always should cross the pond and race the AMA races ?
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