The 'wheel base' of todays bikes vs the 1980's

travis-grant
Edited Date/Time 12/25/2014 11:03am
I was watching ''Wild Magoo'' last night and noticed a visible difference in the bikes from back then. What i mean is they look a lot shorter than today's bikes.

Naturally bikes have evolved into light, slim machines but i'd never really noticed the wheelbase before last night. To me it looks like a 1986 cr 125 is the equiv of say a modern 85 (big wheel).

Am i onto something here or not? HAVE bikes gotten longer? taller even.





Maybe its just styling of fenders that deceive me
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garagedog
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garagedog 12/24/2014 7:19am
12/24/2014 7:19am Edited Date/Time 12/24/2014 7:32am
1984 CR 125 wheelbase = 56.3 in

1986 CR 125 wheelbase = 57.5 in

2007 CR 125 wheelbase = 57.9 inches)

2015 CRF250 wheelbase = 58.6 inches

2006 CR 85 Expert wheelbase = 50.7 inches

2014 CRF150R wheelbase = 49.6 inches


reded
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reded 12/24/2014 7:33am
12/24/2014 7:33am
Apparently there isn't much actual difference in wheelbase but when I ride a bike from say the mid 80's to early 90's, they feel very short, like the tire is directly under my ass. After 10 minutes I get used to it but at first it feels very weird.
yota
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yota 12/24/2014 7:35am
12/24/2014 7:35am
Pretty sure todays bikes have evolved into heavier bikes than in the 80's, not lighter.

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Uncle Tony
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Uncle Tony 12/24/2014 7:43am
12/24/2014 7:43am
I find the quality to be better on eighties bikes
mark_swart
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mark_swart 12/24/2014 9:29am
12/24/2014 9:29am
yota wrote:
Pretty sure todays bikes have evolved into heavier bikes than in the 80's, not lighter.
You got that right:

1990 CR 125: 192.5 lbs
2014 CRF 250: 231 lbs

travis-grant 12/24/2014 9:35am
12/24/2014 9:35am
yota wrote:
Pretty sure todays bikes have evolved into heavier bikes than in the 80's, not lighter.
mark_swart wrote:
You got that right:

1990 CR 125: 192.5 lbs
2014 CRF 250: 231 lbs

that's bizarre, so what were we talking back in the 80s? 150lbs
reded
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reded 12/24/2014 9:36am
12/24/2014 9:36am Edited Date/Time 12/24/2014 9:36am
Remember when 500 2 strokes weighed 230, made 55hp and everyone claimed that it took a real man to ride them?
ATKpilot99
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ATKpilot99 12/24/2014 10:32am
12/24/2014 10:32am
The weights have fluctuated over the years. The first liquid cooled CR and YZ 250s were porkers weighing in at over 230 lbs then got lighter from there. I remember the 85 KTM 250 mx weighed only around 214 lbs. These are weights with all fluids and no fuel.
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wow123 12/24/2014 10:39am
12/24/2014 10:39am
travis-grant wrote:
I was watching ''Wild Magoo'' last night and noticed a visible difference in the bikes from back then. What i mean is they look a lot...
I was watching ''Wild Magoo'' last night and noticed a visible difference in the bikes from back then. What i mean is they look a lot shorter than today's bikes.

Naturally bikes have evolved into light, slim machines but i'd never really noticed the wheelbase before last night. To me it looks like a 1986 cr 125 is the equiv of say a modern 85 (big wheel).

Am i onto something here or not? HAVE bikes gotten longer? taller even.





Maybe its just styling of fenders that deceive me

yes faster and higher but not lighter and slimmer

wow123
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wow123 12/24/2014 10:48am
12/24/2014 10:48am
dazzlindino wrote:
1973 CR125M...
The bike weighed 154 pounds dry....
the only bike ive been able to drag the bars in a corner and not crash.

when doing vintage i used to call them a small mtb with an engine.

newmann
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newmann 12/24/2014 10:51am
12/24/2014 10:51am
dazzlindino wrote:
1973 CR125M...
The bike weighed 154 pounds dry....
I think you meant 174 lbs. dry. Seems that is the number I've seen in print. Things feel like a mini bike in stock form!
newmann
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newmann 12/24/2014 10:54am
12/24/2014 10:54am
I often times have vintage and modern bikes loaded side by side in the truck. Some of the newer ones have to get kicked over a few inches to shut the tailgate in a F250 short bed while the 79 model sits in straight. Usually within an inch or so though of each other.
Crush
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Crush 12/24/2014 2:48pm
12/24/2014 2:48pm
reded wrote:
Remember when 500 2 strokes weighed 230, made 55hp and everyone claimed that it took a real man to ride them?
Yep.

Still think it's crazy 450s are the norm. Just because it's friendly, doesn't mean it's not 55plus hp!

I'd really like to see the 250effs become the prermier bike and 125 two stroke the small class.
Kawaboy14
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Kawaboy14 12/24/2014 2:53pm
12/24/2014 2:53pm
The rake on the old bike is definetly pulled back. Was that the stock rake of the front forks?

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hillbilly
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hillbilly 12/24/2014 8:34pm
12/24/2014 8:34pm
The pictures arent taken at 90 degrees to the fork along the centerline of the bike so it looks a lot different between bikes.

The front axels are located different though.
OldYZRider1
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OldYZRider1 12/25/2014 7:06am
12/25/2014 7:06am
My 1980 YZ250 has 30 degree rake angle. Most modern bikes are around 26-27 degrees. This by itself should reduce the horizontal distance from the front axle to the triple clamps by a couple of inches for a modern bike. I imagine they've increased the swing arm length on the newer bikes since the wheelbases haven't changed much.

Yamaha claimed 214 lbs wet for my YZ although I'm thinking Motocross Action back in the day weighed one at 205 lb. Of course this was an air cooled bike with 38mm forks.
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The Rock 12/25/2014 9:12am
12/25/2014 9:12am
From my experience the older bikes turn way better than the new bikes. Anyone else agree or disagree?

When I got off my 79 Wheelsmith 450 Maico and started racing my 88 CR500 it took me awhile to get used to having to get so far forward on the tank for turns.....also had never experienced headshake until my first time up the Carlsbad uphill. Can you say Scott's Steering Stabilizer? Best 400 bucks I ever spent.
travis-grant 12/25/2014 10:12am
12/25/2014 10:12am
yeah ive heard countless people on vital say how good their older bikes turned on a dime etc. Not exactly old, but my 98 rm125 cornered beautifully, i had softer springs put in as i was like 120 pounds and 5'8, i could lay that thing flat as a pancake round a deep corner.
hillbilly
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hillbilly 12/25/2014 10:22am
12/25/2014 10:22am
In 2000 and 01 I raced a TC610 in the 4 str class along with my cr250 in the plus classes.

The TC was a desert bike and was 3 inches longer in wheelbase. I never noticed it on track but spent a lot of time getting it setup.

It wa wide thru the middle and so different than my husky 250. Felt like straddling a 50 gallon drum with 70 horsepower.
Sheriff245 12/25/2014 10:43am
12/25/2014 10:43am
reded wrote:
Apparently there isn't much actual difference in wheelbase but when I ride a bike from say the mid 80's to early 90's, they feel very short...
Apparently there isn't much actual difference in wheelbase but when I ride a bike from say the mid 80's to early 90's, they feel very short, like the tire is directly under my ass. After 10 minutes I get used to it but at first it feels very weird.
The rider positioning has changed a lot since then, too. What you felt might have been due to this, as back then the bikes were steered mostly with the rear wheel, but nowadays you tend to ride more over the front and steer with the front wheel.
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WhipMeister 12/25/2014 11:03am
12/25/2014 11:03am Edited Date/Time 12/25/2014 11:03am
Consider the effect of taller seat height and longer 'legs' of modern bikes. The fork rake angle is still pretty much the same as it was(around 30deg). If the wheelbase is also essentially the same, it means that everything 'up top' gets pushed closer together as it gets taller. e.g. distance from top triple clamp to your butt, etc. I'm sure the OEMs have tweaked that relationship between pegs, seat and bars over the years looking for the magic CoG.

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