Bauer
Posts: 830
Joined: 8/15/2006
Location: Orange County, CA USA
I spoke at length with John Gallagher yesterday about the decision. Here is what he said, and it makes perfect sense.
John was not in position to see RV, the lights, etc when it happened, but he immediately got a call on his radio from an AMA official who had a perfect view from the scoring tower, saying that "second place was committed" and there was no infraction. After the race, Jeremy Albrecht came to John while he was down by the podium and asked him to review the tape. They went up to the TV booth, where they waited a few minutes for Ralph, RC and Emig to wrap up, after which they reviewed the tape. One of the cameras had a perfect angle and view of the entire incident. Here's the deal:
First, the flashing yellow lights in the corner are programmed to come on when the red light at the top of the jump does. As we all know, the yellow lights require the rider to do nothing, other than proceed with caution. You can pass under a yellow flag. The yellow lights were what RV saw as he entered the turn and went over that little roller going into the turn. Obviously, to clear that jump the riders have to be committed going into the turn and totally on it as they exit, which is exactly what RV did. I made the point to John that technically none of the riders behind RV could have been penalized had they all jumped the triple, because they all could have made the same argument. Thankfully, no one did, because obviously they had more time than RV did to see what was going on and the red lights at the top of the jump etc.
John agreed, and everyone is grateful that there was no pile-up and they are rectifying the situation so it will not happen again. The obvious way to do that is to change the yellow lights in the turn to red, so that the riders will know sooner and have time to slow and roll the jumps. John already talked to Mike LaRocco, Sr, who does the wiring and they will have the change in place this weekend for any similar obstacles.
Another thing to consider is that the riders see flashing yellow lights a lot during a race, especially since the installation of the additional yellow lights that are placed between lanes. They used to have flaggers standing between lanes, but it was too dangerous for them, so those guys have been replaced with yellow lights. So the riders are pretty much numb to the flashing yellow lights, since they see them whenever someone falls in a turn after one of those straights.
So there's no conspiracy, it had nothing to do with who the rider was, or who his sponsor is. The AMA official that made the real-time call didn't even notice who the rider was, referring to him as "second place". Everyone involved understands and is in agreement. The officials were made aware of something that needs to be changed and are doing so. The best part is that no one got hurt in the process. That's how things evolve and are made better, especially safety-related items.
jtomasik
Posts: 13829
Joined: 8/17/2006
Location: Golden, CO USA
Yup. Makes perfect sense. I thought the yellow was just confusing the situation, and the layout of the track turned the red lights at the top of the jump useless. Glad to see the AMA is going to change this. Luckily no one was hurt, and they easily could've been.
I'm deathly afraid of marriage because statistics suggest 50% of American marriages last forever.
Moto East Mag
Posts: 3449
Joined: 9/4/2006
Location: Arlington, VA USA
No offense- but "Official word" comes from Steve Bauer on an Internet message board?
Ha ha...wow.
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DL
Posts: 1959
Joined: 8/20/2006
Location: Menifee, CA USA
Nice investigative work Steve. Case closed.
jbomx363
Posts: 1743
Joined: 9/4/2007
Location: Denham Springs, LA USA
Committed and no time? Aren't these guys pro's? Totally on it, on a 450? And no, I don't care who the rider is.
Obviously, the "red" lights are yellow lights, but you cannot miss those big blaring red lights on top of the triple either.
Plenty of time to roll them.
pilotdude
Posts: 2541
Joined: 1/12/2009
Location: Vancouver, WA USA
jbomx363 wrote: Committed and no time? Aren't these guys pro's? Totally on it, on a 450? And no, I don't care who the rider is.
Obviously, the "red" lights are yellow lights, but you cannot miss those big blaring red lights on top of the triple either.
Plenty of time to roll them.
Apparently, all the actual parties involved including the race officials and opposing team managers had far better information to evaluate than you, and were satisfied with the decision and the outcome.
But what is evidence, fact, and logic between a few conspiracy theorists and haters?
Four wheels move the body, two wheels move the soul.
GuyB
Posts: 18248
Joined: 7/10/2006
Location: Wherever I may roam, CA USA
Administrator
jbomx363 wrote: Committed and no time? Aren't these guys pro's? Totally on it, on a 450? And no, I don't care who the rider is.
Obviously, the "red" lights are yellow lights, but you cannot miss those big blaring red lights on top of the triple either.
Plenty of time to roll them.
Would you like a crack at that section, and you can tell us how easy it'd be?
Racer X reported that RD also jumped on red. If that is true, then they are full of shit about RV. If RD jumped, the explination makes perfect sense for the first guy through. But, RV being 3 seconds back had plenty of time.
GuyB
Posts: 18248
Joined: 7/10/2006
Location: Wherever I may roam, CA USA
Administrator
MotoChief Dos wrote: Racer X reported that RD also jumped on red. If that is true, then they are full of shit about RV. If RD jumped, the explination makes perfect sense for the first guy through. But, RV being 3 seconds back had plenty of time.
If they're sitting in the press box, they were likely looking at the lip of the jump, not the lights at the base.
From where RV's landing (and looking), it's a very short run-up to the lip of the triple.
I know you love thinking there's some kind of conspiracy, but jeez...give it a rest already.
Bauer
Posts: 830
Joined: 8/15/2006
Location: Orange County, CA USA
Moto East Mag wrote: No offense- but "Official word" comes from Steve Bauer on an Internet message board?
Ha ha...wow.
Hey assfuck, no offense- how about I call it, "the AMA official's words", since I obviously paraphrased what Gallagher told me? Would that be better for your sorry ass? Haha...wow
You are a fucking douchbag, no offense. You call yourself "Moto East Mag", whatever the fuck that is, so why didn't YOU, or one of your Moto East Rag journalists take the time to find out the AMA's take on the incident? Then I wouldn't have had to spend my time writing what he told me, because your top-notch journalism would have already had it covered.
jbomx363
Posts: 1743
Joined: 9/4/2007
Location: Denham Springs, LA USA
LOL. Deflection. Gotta love it. I couldn't make it over the roller safely most probably.
I think I had question marks behind my uh.. .questions...they weren't statements.
No matter, what's done is done.
It's just another dumb decision IMO.
GuyB
Posts: 18248
Joined: 7/10/2006
Location: Wherever I may roam, CA USA
Administrator
Bauer wrote: Hey assfuck, no offense- how about I call it, "the AMA official's words", since I obviously paraphrased what Gallagher told me? Would that be better for your sorry ass? Haha...wow
You are a fucking douchbag, no offense. You call yourself "Moto East Mag", whatever the fuck that is, so why didn't YOU, or one of your Moto East Rag journalists take the time to find out the AMA's take on the incident? Then I wouldn't have had to spend my time writing what he told me, because your top-notch journalism would have already had it covered.
And that's Bauer's official word on it.
peelout
Posts: 6392
Joined: 1/6/2011
Location: Ogden, UT USA
some people just love to bitch about everything. even once the explanation of the decision is put out there, for everyone to see, people still try to find a reason to bitch.
thanks for shedding some light on it Bauer. too bad it won't keep most of the cockgobblers from carrying on about it
Gym Briggs
Posts: 454
Joined: 10/16/2008
Location: Scottsville, NY USA
Bauer wrote: Hey assfuck, no offense- how about I call it, "the AMA official's words", since I obviously paraphrased what Gallagher told me? Would that be better for your sorry ass? Haha...wow
You are a fucking douchbag, no offense. You call yourself "Moto East Mag", whatever the fuck that is, so why didn't YOU, or one of your Moto East Rag journalists take the time to find out the AMA's take on the incident? Then I wouldn't have had to spend my time writing what he told me, because your top-notch journalism would have already had it covered.
I hope you feel better Bauer cause I sure do! LMAO!!
Bauer
Posts: 830
Joined: 8/15/2006
Location: Orange County, CA USA
Gym Briggs wrote: I hope you feel better Bauer cause I sure do! LMAO!!
I feel great! Glad you liked it! LOL
FlickitFlat
Posts: 1676
Joined: 8/15/2006
Location: ,, WV USA
Just a quick question. I know the difference between a yellow flag and the red lights. But, a yellow flag getting flagged and a yellow light that only comes on when the red light is on, leading up to a triple. What the hell other meaning could this have had other than someone is down on the triple and you shouldn't jump it? It is a triple. What is the situation that a rider would not be down or in harms way that a yellow flag would be waving in that situation
pilotdude
Posts: 2541
Joined: 1/12/2009
Location: Vancouver, WA USA
Moto East Mag wrote: No offense- but "Official word" comes from Steve Bauer on an Internet message board?
Ha ha...wow.
Bauer wrote: Hey assfuck, no offense- how about I call it, "the AMA official's words", since I obviously paraphrased what Gallagher told me? Would that be better for your sorry ass? Haha...wow
You are a fucking douchbag, no offense. You call yourself "Moto East Mag", whatever the fuck that is, so why didn't YOU, or one of your Moto East Rag journalists take the time to find out the AMA's take on the incident? Then I wouldn't have had to spend my time writing what he told me, because your top-notch journalism would have already had it covered.
Four wheels move the body, two wheels move the soul.
Outsider
Posts: 6408
Joined: 1/29/2009
Location: Dana Point, CA USA
Bauer's post is logical and makes sense. I'm glad they are changing the setup, as it did NOT make sense IMO.
500guy
Posts: 7237
Joined: 8/15/2006
Location: AZ, USA
Everyone except RV could see it and react but the current best rider in the world could not ?
I don't care what the ruling is but if I understand it correctly, RV jumped on Red, the rest did not ?
Greg903
Posts: 159
Joined: 9/20/2011
Location: Philadelphia, PA USA
He's the fastest man on the planet, faster than lights can blink. He did it and will do it again if he wants.
And ain't no computards gonna stop him.
dak446
Posts: 1002
Joined: 3/28/2011
Location: Laramie, WY USA
500guy wrote: Everyone except RV could see it and react but the current best rider in the world could not ?
I don't care what the ruling is but if I understand it correctly, RV jumped on Red, the rest did not ?
FastEddy wrote: From what RacerX is saying (making it sound), Dungey jumped on red also.
http://www.racerxonline.com/2012/02/26/racer-x-race-report-atlanta
"Stewart was charging from even further back. He started well outside the top ten but passed a slew of riders on the first lap to get to ninth. He kept creeping forward along with Villopoto, using an inside line through the first sweeper turn to make moves and get to third on lap 12. By then, only about four seconds separated Dungey, Villopoto and Stewart—the sold-out crowd had a race on its hands.
Then a rider went down near a triple jump, and the track officials turned the red caution lights on. Dungey and Villopoto jumped the jump, then Stewart rolled it as per the rules. He lost a ton of time there and essentially lost whatever chance he might have had of winning the race. Officials then ruled that Dungey and Villopoto had already committed to the triple by the time the lights came on, and they were not penalized for jumping."
Dungey isn't involved. They are saying that he was on the jump, but obviously totally committed to the jump before the lights came on. RV wasn't even close enough to be in the same frame as Dungey. He had more than enough time to get on his brakes. They are factory brakes, he had plenty of time to lock it up and roll it. He is the one of the baddest dudes on the planet on a motorcycle. Stewart had just as much time to react as RV did, and he followed the rules. The AMA is too chicken shit to enforce the rules that they have in place, that is all there is to it.
I broke my leg once because of a situation like this. Racing Arenacross, I landed on a down rider off of the Catapult. The flag came out after I was committed to the jump so I jumped it anyway. However, the guy behind me had time to react, locked up and rolled the jump. He had less time to react, and was far more committed to the jump than RV. He wasn't running factory parts.
Drfletcher
Posts: 324
Joined: 6/12/2008
Location: Acworth, GA USA
I'm more concerned about the official who didn't know who second was, how did he get that job?
