The IV issue

Crisp BRAAAP!
Edited Date/Time 8/16/2014 8:01pm
It's clear that there is a major incentive to have an IV between motos. It's not clear how to stop it.

Why not force riders to stay in view between moots? I know it's hot outside of their RVs but if everyone has to do it, it's the same for everyone. Maybe they have to take a leak at a common bathroom or a porta potty. This would make it much harder to sneak the IV.
|
MxKing809
Profile picture for user MxKing809
Posts
6380
Joined
10/13/2013
Location
Big Sand Whoops, MI US
Fantasy
334th
MxKing809 8/1/2014 1:55pm
8/1/2014 1:55pm
I picture a white fence corral with all the riders inside Huh
dazzlindino 8/1/2014 2:02pm
8/1/2014 2:02pm Edited Date/Time 8/1/2014 2:03pm
how will this work in SX in the winter, say in jersey....
DonM
Profile picture for user DonM
Posts
6760
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
US
DonM 8/1/2014 2:04pm
8/1/2014 2:04pm
dazzlindino wrote:
how will this work in SX in the winter, say in jersey....
Pretty sure it's not happening in the SX season....
dazzlindino 8/1/2014 2:06pm
8/1/2014 2:06pm
dazzlindino wrote:
how will this work in SX in the winter, say in jersey....
DonM wrote:
Pretty sure it's not happening in the SX season....
so what your sayin is that a cheater dosnt always cheat.....

The Shop

See All »
firemedic301
Profile picture for user firemedic301
Posts
215
Joined
2/9/2009
Location
Lake Havasu, AZ US
firemedic301 8/1/2014 2:10pm
8/1/2014 2:10pm
I think personally there should be a set criteria for HEAT and HUMIDITY that riders SHOULD be allowed to get IV fluids between motos. If say, it is 105 degree day with 80% humidity (or something close) the track medics and Doc Bodner and DC should allow 2 liters normal saline or Lactated Ringers. Would that have helped Josh Lictle? I don't know, but simple IV fluids are NOT PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS, just fluids to help your organs function properly. I know the Vidtards will blow me up for my opinion, but HYDRATION at the track should be a priority for all riders.
DonM
Profile picture for user DonM
Posts
6760
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
US
DonM 8/1/2014 4:29pm
8/1/2014 4:29pm
dazzlindino wrote:
how will this work in SX in the winter, say in jersey....
DonM wrote:
Pretty sure it's not happening in the SX season....
dazzlindino wrote:
so what your sayin is that a cheater dosnt always cheat.....
Nope....I'm saying it probably doesn't happen in SX
TankSlapper
Profile picture for user TankSlapper
Posts
475
Joined
3/6/2007
Location
Van, down by the river, CA US
TankSlapper 8/1/2014 4:31pm
8/1/2014 4:31pm
MxKing809 wrote:
I picture a white fence corral with all the riders inside Huh
Meet me over at the IV Garden....
JM485
Profile picture for user JM485
Posts
5409
Joined
10/1/2013
Location
Davis, CA US
JM485 8/1/2014 4:35pm
8/1/2014 4:35pm
firemedic301 wrote:
I think personally there should be a set criteria for HEAT and HUMIDITY that riders SHOULD be allowed to get IV fluids between motos. If say...
I think personally there should be a set criteria for HEAT and HUMIDITY that riders SHOULD be allowed to get IV fluids between motos. If say, it is 105 degree day with 80% humidity (or something close) the track medics and Doc Bodner and DC should allow 2 liters normal saline or Lactated Ringers. Would that have helped Josh Lictle? I don't know, but simple IV fluids are NOT PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS, just fluids to help your organs function properly. I know the Vidtards will blow me up for my opinion, but HYDRATION at the track should be a priority for all riders.
As I understand the rules, you are allowed to get an IV if it is deemed medically necessary, however you will not be able to race afterwards. You might already know this, but my point is there is nothing stopping riders who NEED an IV from getting one if it is necessary for their health. Hydration is incredibly important, which is one of the reasons the Asterisk unit is so important to have on hand, so they can deliver fluid if necessary. Nothing is stopping them from recieving treatment, they just have to make the decision to end their day for the necessity of their health.
TripleFive 8/1/2014 4:46pm
8/1/2014 4:46pm
According to some members here, there is "no evidence" that riders are using IVs between motos.

I guess noting should be done.
implicate order 8/1/2014 5:02pm
8/1/2014 5:02pm Edited Date/Time 8/1/2014 5:06pm
TripleFive wrote:
According to some members here, there is "no evidence" that riders are using IVs between motos.

I guess noting should be done.
Then there's some members who want to speculate and guess what riders are doing in between motos by filling in blank spaces. I've still seen zero evidence that James Stewart was using an iv between motos.
implicate order 8/1/2014 5:04pm
8/1/2014 5:04pm
Crisp BRAAAP! wrote:
It's clear that there is a major incentive to have an IV between motos. It's not clear how to stop it. Why not force riders to...
It's clear that there is a major incentive to have an IV between motos. It's not clear how to stop it.

Why not force riders to stay in view between moots? I know it's hot outside of their RVs but if everyone has to do it, it's the same for everyone. Maybe they have to take a leak at a common bathroom or a porta potty. This would make it much harder to sneak the IV.
Now we've come to a place where fans want the riders to have a baby sitter?
Crisp BRAAAP! 8/1/2014 5:36pm
8/1/2014 5:36pm
I didn't say a baby sitter - just want them where their competitors and officials can see them. I thought this could be one solution to a problem that seemed to have little solutions. If you don't like it, that's fine.

If you want everyone to have them (or access to them), I think that's a solution too. There could be practical problems about getting enough medical personnel around, particularly for the privateers.

Also, I didn't say anything about James. He might have accidentally brought the issue up but it's been discussed to death before this and riders like JT and others are on record saying they've seen it done. That's plenty of evidence to me, and it should be pretty obvious that this would be going on behind closed doors. Why wouldn't you under current conditions?
plowboy
Profile picture for user plowboy
Posts
11664
Joined
1/3/2010
Location
Norwich, KS US
plowboy 8/1/2014 5:43pm
8/1/2014 5:43pm
'M confused (my normal state)...I thought the rules said your day is done unless the "medical" authority that administered the IV "released" you to race? Straighten me out fellas.
Crisp BRAAAP! 8/1/2014 5:52pm
8/1/2014 5:52pm
If you bring your own "medical authority" then you could receive an IV with others being none the wiser. Thus, my idea is to keep the riders from going into their motorhomes between motos so no one could receive an IV without the "authorities" (or your competitors, or worse yet Matthes Laughing ) from knowing about it. There is receiving an IV for medical reasons, then there's getting one because your tongue is on the ground and you still have another moto to race. This theoretical rule would attempt to stop the latter from happening. Make sense?
bvm111
Profile picture for user bvm111
Posts
9329
Joined
7/1/2008
Location
Las Vegas, NV US
bvm111 8/1/2014 5:57pm
8/1/2014 5:57pm
This is even a bigger non issue than the PED mumbo jumbo.

The solution should be that asterisk administers 1 500ml saline IV to every rider after the first moto.... I don't know what the harm would be other than ensuring the riders don't dehydrate.
TripleFive 8/1/2014 6:23pm
8/1/2014 6:23pm
TripleFive wrote:
According to some members here, there is "no evidence" that riders are using IVs between motos.

I guess noting should be done.
implicate order wrote:
Then there's some members who want to speculate and guess what riders are doing in between motos by filling in blank spaces. I've still seen zero...
Then there's some members who want to speculate and guess what riders are doing in between motos by filling in blank spaces. I've still seen zero evidence that James Stewart was using an iv between motos.
Because it makes perfect sense to hire a nurse and fly her to the track each weekend to perform a service that the mobile medical unit provides for free.
plowboy
Profile picture for user plowboy
Posts
11664
Joined
1/3/2010
Location
Norwich, KS US
plowboy 8/1/2014 6:28pm
8/1/2014 6:28pm
TripleFive wrote:
According to some members here, there is "no evidence" that riders are using IVs between motos.

I guess noting should be done.
implicate order wrote:
Then there's some members who want to speculate and guess what riders are doing in between motos by filling in blank spaces. I've still seen zero...
Then there's some members who want to speculate and guess what riders are doing in between motos by filling in blank spaces. I've still seen zero evidence that James Stewart was using an iv between motos.
TripleFive wrote:
Because it makes perfect sense to hire a nurse and fly her to the track each weekend to perform a service that the mobile medical unit...
Because it makes perfect sense to hire a nurse and fly her to the track each weekend to perform a service that the mobile medical unit provides for free.
But if
I understand this correctly...if Doc Bodnar gives the IV he "might" not release you to race. If you provide your own "medical professional" they can legally release you to continue competition.? I am confused.

Pit Row

See All »
MxKing809
Profile picture for user MxKing809
Posts
6380
Joined
10/13/2013
Location
Big Sand Whoops, MI US
Fantasy
334th
MxKing809 8/1/2014 6:30pm
8/1/2014 6:30pm
The purpose of the nurse is to have your own 'medical official' that can deem an IV necessary and then subsequently clear you to race afterwards... Which technically satisfies the rules.
TripleFive 8/1/2014 6:33pm
8/1/2014 6:33pm
implicate order wrote:
Then there's some members who want to speculate and guess what riders are doing in between motos by filling in blank spaces. I've still seen zero...
Then there's some members who want to speculate and guess what riders are doing in between motos by filling in blank spaces. I've still seen zero evidence that James Stewart was using an iv between motos.
TripleFive wrote:
Because it makes perfect sense to hire a nurse and fly her to the track each weekend to perform a service that the mobile medical unit...
Because it makes perfect sense to hire a nurse and fly her to the track each weekend to perform a service that the mobile medical unit provides for free.
plowboy wrote:
But if I understand this correctly...if Doc Bodnar gives the IV he "might" not release you to race. If you provide your own "medical professional" they...
But if
I understand this correctly...if Doc Bodnar gives the IV he "might" not release you to race. If you provide your own "medical professional" they can legally release you to continue competition.? I am confused.
IV bags can only be provided to riders during the event for a "medical emergency."

There is almost no room to argue that James was treating "medical emergencies" each weekend between the motos.

implicate order 8/1/2014 6:36pm
8/1/2014 6:36pm
TripleFive wrote:
According to some members here, there is "no evidence" that riders are using IVs between motos.

I guess noting should be done.
implicate order wrote:
Then there's some members who want to speculate and guess what riders are doing in between motos by filling in blank spaces. I've still seen zero...
Then there's some members who want to speculate and guess what riders are doing in between motos by filling in blank spaces. I've still seen zero evidence that James Stewart was using an iv between motos.
TripleFive wrote:
Because it makes perfect sense to hire a nurse and fly her to the track each weekend to perform a service that the mobile medical unit...
Because it makes perfect sense to hire a nurse and fly her to the track each weekend to perform a service that the mobile medical unit provides for free.
It doesn't matter what makes sense to you or not since your being skeptical does not amount to evidence against Stewart. There are plenty of reasons why Stewart would have his own nurse at the races, one of which could be to administrator iv's after the race and to monitor Stewart's condition before, during, and after the races. Stewart has always had his own people at the races and I know that if I had the means, I'd feel more comfortable with my own nurse as opposed to one provided by someone else.

You've filled in the blanks when in fact you have zero evidence of what goes in the blank spaces.
implicate order 8/1/2014 6:37pm
8/1/2014 6:37pm
TripleFive wrote:
IV bags can only be provided to riders during the event for a "medical emergency." There is almost no room to argue that James was treating...
IV bags can only be provided to riders during the event for a "medical emergency."

There is almost no room to argue that James was treating "medical emergencies" each weekend between the motos.

There's even less evidence that he was being administered iv's between motos, but that hasn't stopped you from filling in the blanks.
TripleFive 8/1/2014 6:40pm
8/1/2014 6:40pm
implicate order wrote:
It doesn't matter what makes sense to you or not since your being skeptical does not amount to evidence against Stewart. There are plenty of reasons...
It doesn't matter what makes sense to you or not since your being skeptical does not amount to evidence against Stewart. There are plenty of reasons why Stewart would have his own nurse at the races, one of which could be to administrator iv's after the race and to monitor Stewart's condition before, during, and after the races. Stewart has always had his own people at the races and I know that if I had the means, I'd feel more comfortable with my own nurse as opposed to one provided by someone else.

You've filled in the blanks when in fact you have zero evidence of what goes in the blank spaces.
Do you realize that you are working harder to "fill in the blanks" than I am?
MxKing809
Profile picture for user MxKing809
Posts
6380
Joined
10/13/2013
Location
Big Sand Whoops, MI US
Fantasy
334th
MxKing809 8/1/2014 6:40pm
8/1/2014 6:40pm
TripleFive wrote:
IV bags can only be provided to riders during the event for a "medical emergency." There is almost no room to argue that James was treating...
IV bags can only be provided to riders during the event for a "medical emergency."

There is almost no room to argue that James was treating "medical emergencies" each weekend between the motos.

implicate order wrote:
There's even less evidence that he was being administered iv's between motos, but that hasn't stopped you from filling in the blanks.
C'mon man.... You don't actually believe he was paying a nurse and flying her around the country to do something to totally legit, do you?
TripleFive 8/1/2014 6:41pm
8/1/2014 6:41pm
"We can't prove that he was taking IVs between motos, but we all know he was" - Matthes
implicate order 8/1/2014 6:43pm
8/1/2014 6:43pm Edited Date/Time 8/1/2014 6:49pm
TripleFive wrote:
Do you realize that you are working harder to "fill in the blanks" than I am?
No, I'm not. I'm happy saying I don't know, you've gladly said you do know without actually knowing. What amazes me about individuals like you, is how you can convince yourself of something without any hard evidence, and continue on as if it is a fact, even at the peril of a rider's reputation.
implicate order 8/1/2014 6:47pm
8/1/2014 6:47pm
TripleFive wrote:
"We can't prove that he was taking IVs between motos, but we all know he was" - Matthes
Well that settles it. Matthes said it so it must be so.





TripleFive 8/1/2014 6:50pm
8/1/2014 6:50pm
implicate order wrote:
No, I'm not. I'm happy saying I don't know, you've gladly said you do know without actually knowing. What amazes me about individuals like you, is...
No, I'm not. I'm happy saying I don't know, you've gladly said you do know without actually knowing. What amazes me about individuals like you, is how you can convince yourself of something without any hard evidence, and continue on as if it is a fact, even at the peril of a rider's reputation.
I've never said that I knew what happened.

The circumstantial evidence points towards cheating.

When you make up a bunch of benign reasons for why a nurse would explicitly state that she is there to give James IVs then you are the one making up hypothetical justifications.
TripleFive 8/1/2014 6:54pm
8/1/2014 6:54pm
Why wouldn't the nurse simply say, "I am James' nurse" or "I oversee his health?"

Does it really make sense for James to hire a nurse to oversee his condition on race day? It's like hiring a receptionist at a gym to create your workouts instead of a trainer.
implicate order 8/1/2014 6:56pm
8/1/2014 6:56pm
TripleFive wrote:
I've never said that I knew what happened. The circumstantial evidence points towards cheating. When you make up a bunch of benign reasons for why a...
I've never said that I knew what happened.

The circumstantial evidence points towards cheating.

When you make up a bunch of benign reasons for why a nurse would explicitly state that she is there to give James IVs then you are the one making up hypothetical justifications.
What circumstantial evidence points towards cheating? There is none!

What I've done is provide possible reasons why Stewart could have a private nurse.

What you've done is fill in those blanks, which you are now calling "circumstantial evidence", accusing Stewart of cheating.

Post a reply to: The IV issue