So guess who won? 450 Shootout is live...

ML512
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ML512
http://www.vitalmx.com/features/2017-Vital-MX-450-Shootout,5128

So be warned, two things are missing. One, the data acquisition... Second, the 350 didn't make it to the dyno chart due to a glitch... Both should be fixed by this evening but I wanted to get the piece out for everyone to read, so there ya be!

Lastly, did anyone guess the results correctly? Wink
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jtiger12
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jtiger12 12/10/2016 7:11am
12/10/2016 7:11am Edited Date/Time 12/10/2016 7:12am
In first, didn't see that coming, but I figured the honda would finish where it did..
Ted722
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Ted722 12/10/2016 7:12am
12/10/2016 7:12am
Just refilled my coffee, let's do this.
S.Loyer
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S.Loyer 12/10/2016 7:25am
12/10/2016 7:25am Edited Date/Time 12/10/2016 7:28am
Also help me understand how the KTM 450 and Husq aren't the same? Does the gearing on a KTM come different than a Husq? Even then, I feel like it should be ruled as one and the same...

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JeepnMike
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JeepnMike 12/10/2016 7:44am
12/10/2016 7:44am
Considering how the Husky was ranked last year, I didn't see this one coming! Pretty cool though.
kkawboy14
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kkawboy14 12/10/2016 7:46am
12/10/2016 7:46am
Kawasaki builds champions! We don't care about high school book reports!

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Starcrossed
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Starcrossed 12/10/2016 7:49am
12/10/2016 7:49am
S.Loyer wrote:
Also help me understand how the KTM 450 and Husq aren't the same? Does the gearing on a KTM come different than a Husq? Even then...
Also help me understand how the KTM 450 and Husq aren't the same? Does the gearing on a KTM come different than a Husq? Even then, I feel like it should be ruled as one and the same...
For the 2016 models Husky uses a restrictive FIM-compliant muffler, composite subframe, slightly different airbox, Magura hydraulic clutch, different rims and Dunlop MX52 tires instead of MX32 tires. The Husky takes a little longer to get to its peak horsepower due to the muffler and more restrictive airbox, but essentially, one 450 is white, and one is orange. Not sure about 2017 yet.
davistld01
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davistld01 12/10/2016 7:50am
12/10/2016 7:50am
Amazing. You know...the results would have damn near been flip-flopped five years ago. Huge success story there.
swtwtwtw
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swtwtwtw 12/10/2016 7:56am
12/10/2016 7:56am
nicely done. a curious question though: Other than Robbie Bell and Manny, where do the other test riders RACE as I have not raced with them or noticed their names in SoCal results in their respective classifications.
Premix
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Premix 12/10/2016 8:00am
12/10/2016 8:00am Edited Date/Time 12/10/2016 8:58am
Nice write up! Results were totally inconsistent, which I am pleased to see because vital used a wide array of riders. I am coming off a YZ450 and am looking to pick up a new bike this year. I find it funny that some of the test riders commented on the wideness and weight of the Yamaha. I put the Cycra shrouds on mine and it made it significantly narrower! Also the Yamaha is only 3-4 pounds heavier than the Honda (Claimed wet weights). Would have been nice to see actual wet weights of the bikes!

For 2017, it comes down to the Honda or Yamaha for me. I checked out the Honda at the dealership last night and it feels like a 125 just sitting on it. (mind you I'm 6'1"). I dunno if that's for me or not.
ML512
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ML512 12/10/2016 8:02am
12/10/2016 8:02am
swtwtwtw wrote:
nicely done. a curious question though: Other than Robbie Bell and Manny, where do the other test riders RACE as I have not raced with them...
nicely done. a curious question though: Other than Robbie Bell and Manny, where do the other test riders RACE as I have not raced with them or noticed their names in SoCal results in their respective classifications.
Zach Peddie has tried West Coast SX the past two years and has done a couple Nationals. I don't know if he's regularly lined up at the local level in the last year. Micky Carter just broke his wrist, but did the Vet Nationals a few weekends ago. Shelby lives in Idaho, and I'm not sure when the last time was when Derrick raced.
S.Loyer
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S.Loyer 12/10/2016 8:05am
12/10/2016 8:05am
S.Loyer wrote:
Also help me understand how the KTM 450 and Husq aren't the same? Does the gearing on a KTM come different than a Husq? Even then...
Also help me understand how the KTM 450 and Husq aren't the same? Does the gearing on a KTM come different than a Husq? Even then, I feel like it should be ruled as one and the same...
Starcrossed wrote:
For the 2016 models Husky uses a restrictive FIM-compliant muffler, composite subframe, slightly different airbox, Magura hydraulic clutch, different rims and Dunlop MX52 tires instead of...
For the 2016 models Husky uses a restrictive FIM-compliant muffler, composite subframe, slightly different airbox, Magura hydraulic clutch, different rims and Dunlop MX52 tires instead of MX32 tires. The Husky takes a little longer to get to its peak horsepower due to the muffler and more restrictive airbox, but essentially, one 450 is white, and one is orange. Not sure about 2017 yet.
That is much more different than I knew. I can see how it would feel different to a test person or anyone.
I honestly just thought airbox was a different material and that was it. Even if it is close to same bike, different enough for me.
ML512
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ML512 12/10/2016 8:06am
12/10/2016 8:06am
Premix wrote:
Nice write up! Results were totally inconsistent, which I am pleased to see because vital used a wide array of riders. I am coming off a...
Nice write up! Results were totally inconsistent, which I am pleased to see because vital used a wide array of riders. I am coming off a YZ450 and am looking to pick up a new bike this year. I find it funny that some of the test riders commented on the wideness and weight of the Yamaha. I put the Cycra shrouds on mine and it made it significantly narrower! Also the Yamaha is only 3-4 pounds heavier than the Honda (Claimed wet weights). Would have been nice to see actual wet weights of the bikes!

For 2017, it comes down to the Honda or Yamaha for me. I checked out the Honda at the dealership last night and it feels like a 125 just sitting on it. (mind you I'm 6'1"). I dunno if that's for me or not.
My mistake, I forgot to hit save on my last update before publishing. Wet weights are in there.

KTM 350 SX-F: 232 lbs.
KTM 450 SX-F: 233 lbs.
Husqvarna FC 450: 235 lbs.
Kawasaki KX450F: 240 lbs.
Honda CRF450R: 244 lbs.
Suzuki RM-Z450: 246 lbs.
Yamaha YZ450F: 248 lbs.
ML512
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ML512 12/10/2016 8:07am
12/10/2016 8:07am Edited Date/Time 12/10/2016 8:07am
S.Loyer wrote:
Also help me understand how the KTM 450 and Husq aren't the same? Does the gearing on a KTM come different than a Husq? Even then...
Also help me understand how the KTM 450 and Husq aren't the same? Does the gearing on a KTM come different than a Husq? Even then, I feel like it should be ruled as one and the same...
Starcrossed wrote:
For the 2016 models Husky uses a restrictive FIM-compliant muffler, composite subframe, slightly different airbox, Magura hydraulic clutch, different rims and Dunlop MX52 tires instead of...
For the 2016 models Husky uses a restrictive FIM-compliant muffler, composite subframe, slightly different airbox, Magura hydraulic clutch, different rims and Dunlop MX52 tires instead of MX32 tires. The Husky takes a little longer to get to its peak horsepower due to the muffler and more restrictive airbox, but essentially, one 450 is white, and one is orange. Not sure about 2017 yet.
Swingarms are different, seats, bodywork, and fuel tank.... Along with a subframe and airbox that are of a different material and design.
ob
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ob 12/10/2016 8:11am
12/10/2016 8:11am Edited Date/Time 12/10/2016 8:12am
The Ktm must of not been broken in well or had some other issue. No way the identical motor in the husky but with a more restrictive air box would normally make more power. More torque maybe but it shouldn't have made more power. What maps were the bikes in, both in aggressive settings? Thanks for these shootouts
slipdog
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slipdog 12/10/2016 8:14am
12/10/2016 8:14am
How's the 250t shootout coming along?
Premix
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Premix 12/10/2016 8:19am
12/10/2016 8:19am
ML512 wrote:
My mistake, I forgot to hit save on my last update before publishing. Wet weights are in there. KTM 350 SX-F: 232 lbs. KTM 450 SX-F...
My mistake, I forgot to hit save on my last update before publishing. Wet weights are in there.

KTM 350 SX-F: 232 lbs.
KTM 450 SX-F: 233 lbs.
Husqvarna FC 450: 235 lbs.
Kawasaki KX450F: 240 lbs.
Honda CRF450R: 244 lbs.
Suzuki RM-Z450: 246 lbs.
Yamaha YZ450F: 248 lbs.
You that man ML! Keep up the good work.

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ML512
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ML512 12/10/2016 8:35am
12/10/2016 8:35am
ob wrote:
The Ktm must of not been broken in well or had some other issue. No way the identical motor in the husky but with a more...
The Ktm must of not been broken in well or had some other issue. No way the identical motor in the husky but with a more restrictive air box would normally make more power. More torque maybe but it shouldn't have made more power. What maps were the bikes in, both in aggressive settings? Thanks for these shootouts
As it mentions in the article, both are in standard. The aggressive maps are much closer, I'm still trying to get those.
TeamGreen
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TeamGreen 12/10/2016 8:40am
12/10/2016 8:40am
Premix wrote:
Nice write up! Results were totally inconsistent, which I am pleased to see because vital used a wide array of riders. I am coming off a...
Nice write up! Results were totally inconsistent, which I am pleased to see because vital used a wide array of riders. I am coming off a YZ450 and am looking to pick up a new bike this year. I find it funny that some of the test riders commented on the wideness and weight of the Yamaha. I put the Cycra shrouds on mine and it made it significantly narrower! Also the Yamaha is only 3-4 pounds heavier than the Honda (Claimed wet weights). Would have been nice to see actual wet weights of the bikes!

For 2017, it comes down to the Honda or Yamaha for me. I checked out the Honda at the dealership last night and it feels like a 125 just sitting on it. (mind you I'm 6'1"). I dunno if that's for me or not.
ML512 wrote:
My mistake, I forgot to hit save on my last update before publishing. Wet weights are in there. KTM 350 SX-F: 232 lbs. KTM 450 SX-F...
My mistake, I forgot to hit save on my last update before publishing. Wet weights are in there.

KTM 350 SX-F: 232 lbs.
KTM 450 SX-F: 233 lbs.
Husqvarna FC 450: 235 lbs.
Kawasaki KX450F: 240 lbs.
Honda CRF450R: 244 lbs.
Suzuki RM-Z450: 246 lbs.
Yamaha YZ450F: 248 lbs.
It's funny, the 350 & 450 SXF feel 10 pounds "different"...or more...
The 350 REALLY "feels" light.
mattyhamz2
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mattyhamz2 12/10/2016 8:42am
12/10/2016 8:42am
What's crazy is that everyone talks about how much wider the Yamaha is, especially in the shroud area, But I have measured my 14 yz against my dads 13, 15 and 17 rmz and the width is no different. I get that it looks wider due to the intake, but after measuring, it isn't.

ML I dig the variety of riders you guys use! You get all kinds of different opinions. I just wish more novices knew how to tell the difference between bikes, suspension etc. so we could have some opinions from an average Joe. Keep up the good work guys!
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bvm111 12/10/2016 8:51am
12/10/2016 8:51am Edited Date/Time 12/10/2016 8:52am
ML512 wrote:
http://www.vitalmx.com/features/2017-Vital-MX-450-Shootout,5128 So be warned, two things are missing. One, the data acquisition... Second, the 350 didn't make it to the dyno chart due to a glitch...
http://www.vitalmx.com/features/2017-Vital-MX-450-Shootout,5128

So be warned, two things are missing. One, the data acquisition... Second, the 350 didn't make it to the dyno chart due to a glitch... Both should be fixed by this evening but I wanted to get the piece out for everyone to read, so there ya be!

Lastly, did anyone guess the results correctly? Wink
Holy cow Michael.... that was so in depth that my feet fell asleep reading this on the shitter this morning!

Honestly though much better than the predictable MXA shootouts, interesting that the Husky was rated consistently higher than even the KTM. Now I'm even more confused than I was yesterday when I was sure I was getting the KX over the KTM 350 or 450.... maybe the husky would look better next to my KX250 in the garage than the KTM... ahhhh the first world problems we have! Tongue
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kkawboy14 12/10/2016 8:53am
12/10/2016 8:53am
Premix wrote:
Nice write up! Results were totally inconsistent, which I am pleased to see because vital used a wide array of riders. I am coming off a...
Nice write up! Results were totally inconsistent, which I am pleased to see because vital used a wide array of riders. I am coming off a YZ450 and am looking to pick up a new bike this year. I find it funny that some of the test riders commented on the wideness and weight of the Yamaha. I put the Cycra shrouds on mine and it made it significantly narrower! Also the Yamaha is only 3-4 pounds heavier than the Honda (Claimed wet weights). Would have been nice to see actual wet weights of the bikes!

For 2017, it comes down to the Honda or Yamaha for me. I checked out the Honda at the dealership last night and it feels like a 125 just sitting on it. (mind you I'm 6'1"). I dunno if that's for me or not.
ML512 wrote:
My mistake, I forgot to hit save on my last update before publishing. Wet weights are in there. KTM 350 SX-F: 232 lbs. KTM 450 SX-F...
My mistake, I forgot to hit save on my last update before publishing. Wet weights are in there.

KTM 350 SX-F: 232 lbs.
KTM 450 SX-F: 233 lbs.
Husqvarna FC 450: 235 lbs.
Kawasaki KX450F: 240 lbs.
Honda CRF450R: 244 lbs.
Suzuki RM-Z450: 246 lbs.
Yamaha YZ450F: 248 lbs.
Wow that is a huge difference in weights.
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Liebs138 12/10/2016 9:05am
12/10/2016 9:05am Edited Date/Time 12/10/2016 9:11am
Those dyno numbers are out to lunch. Last years bikes were so much different. The ktm and husky swapped horespower. Yamaha down 2.5ish. Kawi down 4ish. Suzuki down 2 ish. Honda up 6 which makes sense with the new package. You mean to tell me the husky has 9 more hp than the kawi. Haaaa. Did you use a different dyno than last year?
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dcg141 12/10/2016 9:05am
12/10/2016 9:05am
This year I'm riding a Husqvarna FX 350. I honestly feel like I can show up at any race, moto, hare scramble, enduro and put my best foot forward. Since I most likely will do all of the above at some point I'm feeling good about my choice. I raced the RFGP in Ft Smith AR a couple of weeks ago and it was 2 hours of high speed sand whoops. Could have been brutal but was a fun ride all afternoon. I feel like a 450 would have worn me down and the suspension was really spot on. The new Huskys are some kind of sweet ride.
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twotwosix 12/10/2016 9:18am
12/10/2016 9:18am Edited Date/Time 12/10/2016 9:18am
Dyno results don't add up, unfortunately. Other than that, great shootout!

I think the take away from these different mag's 2016 & 2017 shootouts is that these bike have come A LONG WAY (save for the Zook). I've ridden all of these chassis now and I can say that it's honestly up to personal preference in this era more now than ever in MX. None of the current 450s have glaring problems and you could make each one do what you want with a few tweaks.
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MX558 12/10/2016 9:22am
12/10/2016 9:22am
mattyhamz2 wrote:
What's crazy is that everyone talks about how much wider the Yamaha is, especially in the shroud area, But I have measured my 14 yz against...
What's crazy is that everyone talks about how much wider the Yamaha is, especially in the shroud area, But I have measured my 14 yz against my dads 13, 15 and 17 rmz and the width is no different. I get that it looks wider due to the intake, but after measuring, it isn't.

ML I dig the variety of riders you guys use! You get all kinds of different opinions. I just wish more novices knew how to tell the difference between bikes, suspension etc. so we could have some opinions from an average Joe. Keep up the good work guys!
At the widest point of both bikes yes but the Yammie starts to get wider earlier in the shroud - tanks area
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slipdog 12/10/2016 9:24am
12/10/2016 9:24am
ML512 wrote:
http://www.vitalmx.com/features/2017-Vital-MX-450-Shootout,5128 So be warned, two things are missing. One, the data acquisition... Second, the 350 didn't make it to the dyno chart due to a glitch...
http://www.vitalmx.com/features/2017-Vital-MX-450-Shootout,5128

So be warned, two things are missing. One, the data acquisition... Second, the 350 didn't make it to the dyno chart due to a glitch... Both should be fixed by this evening but I wanted to get the piece out for everyone to read, so there ya be!

Lastly, did anyone guess the results correctly? Wink
bvm111 wrote:
Holy cow Michael.... that was so in depth that my feet fell asleep reading this on the shitter this morning! Honestly though much better than the...
Holy cow Michael.... that was so in depth that my feet fell asleep reading this on the shitter this morning!

Honestly though much better than the predictable MXA shootouts, interesting that the Husky was rated consistently higher than even the KTM. Now I'm even more confused than I was yesterday when I was sure I was getting the KX over the KTM 350 or 450.... maybe the husky would look better next to my KX250 in the garage than the KTM... ahhhh the first world problems we have! Tongue
The FC 450 would look even better next to a TC 250 in your garage. WoohooSillyLaughing
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TheGetFresh 12/10/2016 9:24am
12/10/2016 9:24am
Premix wrote:
Nice write up! Results were totally inconsistent, which I am pleased to see because vital used a wide array of riders. I am coming off a...
Nice write up! Results were totally inconsistent, which I am pleased to see because vital used a wide array of riders. I am coming off a YZ450 and am looking to pick up a new bike this year. I find it funny that some of the test riders commented on the wideness and weight of the Yamaha. I put the Cycra shrouds on mine and it made it significantly narrower! Also the Yamaha is only 3-4 pounds heavier than the Honda (Claimed wet weights). Would have been nice to see actual wet weights of the bikes!

For 2017, it comes down to the Honda or Yamaha for me. I checked out the Honda at the dealership last night and it feels like a 125 just sitting on it. (mind you I'm 6'1"). I dunno if that's for me or not.
Of the three riders 6 feet or taller, the Honda ranked 2,1,1. The bike is small and even looks a little silly under a tall rider, but it sounds like it works well for the bigger guys.
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GuyB 12/10/2016 9:27am
12/10/2016 9:27am
Ted722 wrote:
Just refilled my coffee, let's do this.
You may need a potfull.

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