New SX tracks vs. Old SX tracks

downard254
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downard254
Edited Date/Time 4/18/2013 12:41pm
Alright, some of you fellas have been posting links to some older 90's sx races, and I've been watching them (thank you). However, I'm noticing that the the tracks today, have a so so whoop section, and a fair number of jumps. Everything else in between seems to be smooth and fast. Just watching the older races, there doesn't seem to be hardly any flat smooth straights except when they cross the start area. That Seattle Ward/Chicken race showed a lot of small bumps, jumps, pretty much constant anything but smooth track. Anyone else notice this besides me. It's no wonder the racing was tighter in the earlier days, as there was no place to rest on the track. Looks like it took 100% focus.

What are your thoughts..........AAAANNNNNDDDDD GO!
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Thomas Jefferson 4/16/2013 11:46am
4/16/2013 11:46am
I think that in the mid-late 90s, they were building tracks to try and stop Jeremy from winning 12-15 races per season and he just kept elevating his game, and inadvertantly elevated track design in the process.
downard254
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downard254 4/16/2013 11:54am
4/16/2013 11:54am
I remember in '96 when Jeremy was on his streak, the San Diego round had a particular obstacle, I wan't to say a small or short dragons back, but I don't believe that's what it was. Anyway, Jeremy was the only one jumping it in an odd way. Kind of like he was slamming into the face of a large jump, and alowing the suspension preload to float him over the remainder. I've tried searching youtube for that race but no luck. If anyone has a link to it, please post it. I'd love to see it again.
Crash82
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Crash82 4/16/2013 12:01pm
4/16/2013 12:01pm
The old tracks were awesome, there will never be a SX track badder than the LA Coliseum.

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downard254
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downard254 4/16/2013 12:24pm
4/16/2013 12:24pm
Thanks TJ, that's what I wanted to see. Damn that McGrath could ride. Ryno was haulin the mail through the whoops in that race too.
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MrMJS 4/16/2013 2:49pm
4/16/2013 2:49pm
If I remember right , that was the race where Fro beat McGrath in the heat race. He made an aggressive pass at the end of the long whoop section... Great race for sure.
bd
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bd 4/16/2013 4:27pm
4/16/2013 4:27pm
I am blown away by how radical SX tracks changed from 1985 to 1986. Night and day difference
motomike894
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motomike894 4/16/2013 6:38pm
4/16/2013 6:38pm
I think the tracks in like 2000-2006 were better they were more technical then they usually are now
And whoops were always huge pretty much they should make the shit gnarly like it used to be.
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mototrader 4/16/2013 9:17pm
4/16/2013 9:17pm
they tried making the tracks more tough but the more tech they got, the better MC did

in a non disrespectful way, MC rode an SX track like a ballerina would...he danced around it while everyone else was stepping on their own feet.
Motocross83 4/17/2013 12:20am
4/17/2013 12:20am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2013 2:14am
I think the older tracks tended to be a little more abrupt. What I mean by that, is they were a little less smooth and the speed was interrupted more by some tighter, shorter and sharper obstacles. In other words it wasn't always possible to carry bags of uninterrupted momentum across everything out there.

The riders themselves also had less to aid them as far as shear horsepower goes. Nowadays the bikes can clear almost anything whereas back in the 90s especially, the tracks really rewarded a guy like McGrath who had the ability to somehow get a little "more" when necessary out of any obstacle.
Halfast816 4/17/2013 7:36am
4/17/2013 7:36am
Not to make this about Jeremy, thinking out loud is it possible familiarity with his bike helped him dominate. We all know he used the same chassis(93) until his switch to Suzuki. Just recently guys have been reverted back to last years setup with better results, air forks or non air...does more time on the "same" bike translate into less things to think about except going fast. Would a pro benefit from using the same bike setup for more than a year? Is newer always better?
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TDeath21 4/17/2013 7:47am
4/17/2013 7:47am
motomike894 wrote:
I think the tracks in like 2000-2006 were better they were more technical then they usually are now And whoops were always huge pretty much they...
I think the tracks in like 2000-2006 were better they were more technical then they usually are now
And whoops were always huge pretty much they should make the shit gnarly like it used to be.
Not to make this a 2 vs 4 thread, but I think it had a lot to do with the 4 stroke taking over. I remember in 06 and 07 the lap times were in the lower 40's at times. Maybe they had to make a change and adjust the tracks accordingly. It would be interesting to see how the 450s now would do on a 2000 track. That year was the most technical in my opinion.
SEE ARE125
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SEE ARE125 4/17/2013 9:24am
4/17/2013 9:24am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2013 9:25am
Anyone remember the retro races at Anaheim a few years ago where everyone wore retro gear and had retro graphics and stuff? I'd love to see that make a comeback and the race be held on a retro style track. Hay bales, Camel cigarettes and all.

On another note, the year they had the rider designed tracks were the best tracks yet, IMO. TP199 designed a killer track.
JJ4
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JJ4 4/17/2013 9:58am
4/17/2013 9:58am
I really liked this track. I remember watching everyone do the final jump before the finish in practice from the sears right next to it, and it just shot them up! Fun race that night.

http://youtu.be/nQRHtOXresk
Preston412
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Preston412 4/17/2013 1:47pm
4/17/2013 1:47pm
1988 through 1990, I rode Orlando, Miami, Tampa and Daytona SX and today's tracks are slices of a wedding cake compared to them.
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Park Boys 4/17/2013 1:58pm
4/17/2013 1:58pm Edited Date/Time 4/17/2013 2:00pm
The more technical the track the better James did, MC didn't need em in SX he was just better but James really used it to his advantage with ridiculous jumping his last win this year came because of something very similar to what MC did in San Diego.
Not saying he would beat RV with more technical tracks cause RV is on one but if they make tracks more technical you could almost guarantee James would be doing better. So this year basically sucks because all of the riders are way too good for these untechnical tracks!!
JJ4
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JJ4 4/17/2013 2:28pm
4/17/2013 2:28pm
I liked this one. Enjoyed watching practice from the seats right next to that last "wall" before the finish. That thing shot them up!
Was such a great race.

http://youtu.be/nQRHtOXresk

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JJ4
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JJ4 4/17/2013 2:28pm
4/17/2013 2:28pm
I liked this one. Enjoyed watching practice from the seats right next to that last "wall" before the finish. That thing shot them up!
Was such a great race.

http://youtu.be/nQRHtOXresk
Zaugg
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Zaugg 4/17/2013 4:43pm
4/17/2013 4:43pm
Would like to see 4 strokes on the old tracks. Might be interesting...or they might just jump over everything and it's just like today.

I guess we'll never know.
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JW381 4/17/2013 7:12pm
4/17/2013 7:12pm
Landonious217 wrote:
One of my favorite old tracks, super technical. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nsfEn-HDxEs
I think 1999-roughly 2002 had the best supercross tracks ever. This is a good'n!

To play the other side of the argument, I think today's tracks do a lot better job of providing a flow for the riders, which (hopefully) usually leads to better racing. There isn't some part of the track they rhythm thru, then some other half they have to ride a complete different style. So that let's them find a groove and really attack the track, and each other. It's something I've noticed and really enjoyed watching many of nights.
motov8tedcre8tor 4/17/2013 7:33pm
4/17/2013 7:33pm Edited Date/Time 4/17/2013 7:35pm
Seems like one of the biggest differences is the 4 strokes have so much power and the suspension is so much better now that the riders don't have to work nearly as hard to go fast. You can just blip the throttle coming out of a turn and pretty much jump anything but on the old 2 strokes riders had to work like crazy to stay "on the pipe" and keep momentum up. Also I think Feld is deliberately 'dumbing down' and making the tracks easier to artificially keep the racing close. Otherwise guys like RV and RD would dominate even more. It wasn't uncommon just a few years ago for guys like RC Reed or Stewart to be dead last coming out of the first turn and work their way up to seconds or thirds by the end of the race. Now days they would be lucky to get 15th because most of the tracks are one-lined and there's almost no place to make that time up anymore because everybody's pretty much doing the same things.
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The Rock 4/17/2013 9:36pm
4/17/2013 9:36pm
SEE ARE125 wrote:
Anyone remember the retro races at Anaheim a few years ago where everyone wore retro gear and had retro graphics and stuff? I'd love to see...
Anyone remember the retro races at Anaheim a few years ago where everyone wore retro gear and had retro graphics and stuff? I'd love to see that make a comeback and the race be held on a retro style track. Hay bales, Camel cigarettes and all.

On another note, the year they had the rider designed tracks were the best tracks yet, IMO. TP199 designed a killer track.
The retro track and TP199 track (St. Louis or Indy) you reference were the best tracks this century if you ask me.

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