Light weight KTM?

ob
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2/1/2016 1:45pm Edited Date/Time 5/12/2018 1:52pm
How much weight do you guys think you could lose off of a 16 KTM 450? With another 3 pounds coming off next year with the air forks, that already makes for a very light bike. What else and how light do you think it could be? Light seat base and foam? Battery less electronics? Muffler of course. I know the teams run super light weight harnesses and battery's. How much weight would a Ti bolt kit take off? Ti rear spring, 50mil cone valves are supposed to be very light I'm not sure if they are lighter than the AERs. I'm sure you can lose weight from the motor internals. Ceramic bearings for wheels etc? Ti subframe, mods to the frame like losing brackets etc? Light weight brake calipers with Ti pistons? Most of that stuff is easy to come by but not all of it would be that cheap. But not crazy expensive . So a normal guy could probably get his bike way way under the AMA limit not that it means anything to most people. Seems like 10lbs would be easily doable. Would it be worth it if money was growing in the back of your van?
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NotCore
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2/1/2016 2:30pm
Eat less and you can lose 10 lbs and and save money.
bh84
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2/1/2016 2:37pm
Don't forget you can get those Anti-Gravity Li Batteries now, lose a pound right there
kiwifan
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2/1/2016 2:43pm
Depends on your budget, I did look to do that to a KTM before switching brands back in 2013...but the cost was massive and couldn't justify it.

I would only be guessing as to how much weight you could save, perhaps an email to MXA might get you an answer as they know a lot about KTM's.
CarlinoJoeVideo
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2/1/2016 2:58pm
I bet you can loose 8 lbs really easy. Not cheap but easy...
-3 AER Fork
-2 Full Ti exhaust
-1 light seat base and foam
-1 Ti pegs, random Ti bolts
-1 lightweight wheel set
You'd be in another $5,000 for that if the bike comes with AER fork.

If you realllyyyy had the money, and took weight off/out of the engine it would actually feel much lighter. DCR said he took 5lbs off a KTM 250SX-F motor.

The Shop

loftyair
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2/1/2016 3:00pm
Get rid of the cams, call it a 2-stroke! Haha
Motofinne
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2/1/2016 3:04pm
Well the EU 2016 450 and the FE 450 weighs about 221 pounds and the 250s 217 because of the AER48 forks.
Crush
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2/1/2016 3:07pm
I bet you can loose 8 lbs really easy. Not cheap but easy... -3 AER Fork -2 Full Ti exhaust -1 light seat base and foam...
I bet you can loose 8 lbs really easy. Not cheap but easy...
-3 AER Fork
-2 Full Ti exhaust
-1 light seat base and foam
-1 Ti pegs, random Ti bolts
-1 lightweight wheel set
You'd be in another $5,000 for that if the bike comes with AER fork.

If you realllyyyy had the money, and took weight off/out of the engine it would actually feel much lighter. DCR said he took 5lbs off a KTM 250SX-F motor.
What are you doing to the motor, replacing everything with ti haha?
Phillip_Lamb
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2/1/2016 3:16pm
with TI exhaust, shock springs, air forks, TI bolts, lightweight seat.....probably about 6-7lbs. but your gonna spend a couple grand.
ob
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2/1/2016 3:54pm
AER forks -3lbs light exhaust -2lbs battery -1lb. That's an easy six right there. 5lbs out of a 450 motor should be easy. So with the obvious stuff 10lbs no problem. Could you get it to 200lbs without to many issues? I think so
bvm111
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2/1/2016 4:04pm
NotCore wrote:
Eat less and you can lose 10 lbs and and save money.
Bingo!!!!!
ob
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2/1/2016 4:07pm
NotCore wrote:
Eat less and you can lose 10 lbs and and save money.
bvm111 wrote:
Bingo!!!!!
Not everybody here can loose 10lbs. But besides that that just isn't the point. It's not worth it if I have to give up Wendys !
NotCore
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2/1/2016 4:13pm
NotCore wrote:
Eat less and you can lose 10 lbs and and save money.
bvm111 wrote:
Bingo!!!!!
ob wrote:
Not everybody here can loose 10lbs. But besides that that just isn't the point. It's not worth it if I have to give up Wendys !
You may be right...but i certainly could.
Motofinne
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2/1/2016 4:20pm
Eating less and dropping bodyweight is not the point. The other bikes would still be heavier and a lighter bike can make a huge difference when it comes to handling and feel.
newmann
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2/1/2016 4:54pm
ob wrote:
AER forks -3lbs light exhaust -2lbs battery -1lb. That's an easy six right there. 5lbs out of a 450 motor should be easy. So with the...
AER forks -3lbs light exhaust -2lbs battery -1lb. That's an easy six right there. 5lbs out of a 450 motor should be easy. So with the obvious stuff 10lbs no problem. Could you get it to 200lbs without to many issues? I think so
5 pounds out of the 450 engine should be easy? Please explain in detail. I would be interested in that read.
2/1/2016 4:56pm
ob wrote:
AER forks -3lbs light exhaust -2lbs battery -1lb. That's an easy six right there. 5lbs out of a 450 motor should be easy. So with the...
AER forks -3lbs light exhaust -2lbs battery -1lb. That's an easy six right there. 5lbs out of a 450 motor should be easy. So with the obvious stuff 10lbs no problem. Could you get it to 200lbs without to many issues? I think so
newmann wrote:
5 pounds out of the 450 engine should be easy? Please explain in detail. I would be interested in that read.
X2

And if you can figure out battery-less electric start that would be sweet.
NotCore
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2/1/2016 5:13pm
Motofinne wrote:
Eating less and dropping bodyweight is not the point. The other bikes would still be heavier and a lighter bike can make a huge difference when...
Eating less and dropping bodyweight is not the point. The other bikes would still be heavier and a lighter bike can make a huge difference when it comes to handling and feel.
While differences in body weight and bike weight may possibly make a huge difference in handling and feel, the variations apparently have a negligible effect on the sense of humor.
GrapeApe
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2/1/2016 5:30pm
ob wrote:
AER forks -3lbs light exhaust -2lbs battery -1lb. That's an easy six right there. 5lbs out of a 450 motor should be easy. So with the...
AER forks -3lbs light exhaust -2lbs battery -1lb. That's an easy six right there. 5lbs out of a 450 motor should be easy. So with the obvious stuff 10lbs no problem. Could you get it to 200lbs without to many issues? I think so
newmann wrote:
5 pounds out of the 450 engine should be easy? Please explain in detail. I would be interested in that read.
Remove the transmission and run it single speed, obviously.
ob
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2/1/2016 5:33pm Edited Date/Time 2/1/2016 5:57pm
ob wrote:
AER forks -3lbs light exhaust -2lbs battery -1lb. That's an easy six right there. 5lbs out of a 450 motor should be easy. So with the...
AER forks -3lbs light exhaust -2lbs battery -1lb. That's an easy six right there. 5lbs out of a 450 motor should be easy. So with the obvious stuff 10lbs no problem. Could you get it to 200lbs without to many issues? I think so
newmann wrote:
5 pounds out of the 450 engine should be easy? Please explain in detail. I would be interested in that read.
X2

And if you can figure out battery-less electric start that would be sweet.
I know the teams use very light battery's or some kind of capacitor that will only start a couple times. But I don't know exactly how their systems work. I do know it's nothing like the stock KTM electrical system, everything is different including the ECU, harness, and starter and battery system. I also don't know if the Ktm teams get as serious anymore because the stock bike is so very light now.
As far as light weight motor, just a rough guess at a 5lb savings but kind of backed up by what CarlinoJoe mentioned. Light cleaned up cases, fly wheel, valve train system, piston, rod, crank, bearings, the head and cylinder themselves, light weight starter. All those grams from port work and polishing everything. Not to mention losing whole gears, and all the other ways to drop weight from a transmission.
I'm not exactly sure how much weight it is possible to lose but it seems like a lot is possible. I haven't even mentioned high dollar things like magnesium cases, throttle bodies, brake calipers, carbon gas tank, carbon air box etc, etc.
For me it's just interesting to think about, nothing serious just bullshitting with you guys. Cheers!!!!!
ob
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2/1/2016 5:34pm
Motofinne wrote:
Eating less and dropping bodyweight is not the point. The other bikes would still be heavier and a lighter bike can make a huge difference when...
Eating less and dropping bodyweight is not the point. The other bikes would still be heavier and a lighter bike can make a huge difference when it comes to handling and feel.
NotCore wrote:
While differences in body weight and bike weight may possibly make a huge difference in handling and feel, the variations apparently have a negligible effect on...
While differences in body weight and bike weight may possibly make a huge difference in handling and feel, the variations apparently have a negligible effect on the sense of humor.
Lol
ob
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2/1/2016 5:45pm
loftyair wrote:
Get rid of the cams, call it a 2-stroke! Haha
Funny that now KTM 450s are very close to the weight of a KTM 250 2t. But I do agree the 2t feels even lighter. I love two strokes but got tired of having to ride twice as hard to go the same speed as the guys I was racing that were on heavy ass 450s. So I gave up on the two stroke dream a couple years ago, and went back to 4 strokes. They are just to good now adays.
CarlinoJoeVideo
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2/1/2016 5:54pm
I bet you can loose 8 lbs really easy. Not cheap but easy... -3 AER Fork -2 Full Ti exhaust -1 light seat base and foam...
I bet you can loose 8 lbs really easy. Not cheap but easy...
-3 AER Fork
-2 Full Ti exhaust
-1 light seat base and foam
-1 Ti pegs, random Ti bolts
-1 lightweight wheel set
You'd be in another $5,000 for that if the bike comes with AER fork.

If you realllyyyy had the money, and took weight off/out of the engine it would actually feel much lighter. DCR said he took 5lbs off a KTM 250SX-F motor.
Crush wrote:
What are you doing to the motor, replacing everything with ti haha?
WhistlingWhistlingWhistling


CarlinoJoeVideo
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2/1/2016 5:55pm
The new battery is really really light already. Do they make something lighter?
ob
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2/1/2016 5:58pm Edited Date/Time 2/1/2016 6:00pm
Thanks Joe, good info.
Of course they always make something lighter. I think Anti gravity has an even lighter battery plus a few other high end battery companies. I think the teams use some sort of RC battery.
Crush
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:whistle: :whistle: :whistle: [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2016/02/01/122319/s1200_Screen_Shot_2016_02_01_at_5.52.51_PM.jpg[/img]
WhistlingWhistlingWhistling


5 lbs in cams?!

I'd really like an engine nerd to chime in to what they do or can do... We've all seen the usual exterior bits and bobs but I'd have kinda thought the engine was a bit more no go for this sort of thing...
Grizz
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2/1/2016 6:32pm
kiwifan wrote:
Depends on your budget, I did look to do that to a KTM before switching brands back in 2013...but the cost was massive and couldn't justify...
Depends on your budget, I did look to do that to a KTM before switching brands back in 2013...but the cost was massive and couldn't justify it.

I would only be guessing as to how much weight you could save, perhaps an email to MXA might get you an answer as they know a lot about KTM's.
Couldn't get a free or discounted KTM in 2013 being an ex-pro and all?
BobPA
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2/1/2016 6:32pm
I'm sure they run a total loss ignition system, so all that is needed is the pickup....and no stator. I ran that system in my jet ski and the weight savings was fairly large...think no magnets needed in the flywheel either..
MotoMalyDad
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2/1/2016 6:56pm Edited Date/Time 2/1/2016 6:57pm
Remove the engine and fork oil and replace with helium
endurox
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2/1/2016 7:02pm
go tubeless like mtb bikes. Also Motion Pro rim locks are lighter. Ti axles and bolts.
bish153
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2/1/2016 7:14pm
kiwifan wrote:
Depends on your budget, I did look to do that to a KTM before switching brands back in 2013...but the cost was massive and couldn't justify...
Depends on your budget, I did look to do that to a KTM before switching brands back in 2013...but the cost was massive and couldn't justify it.

I would only be guessing as to how much weight you could save, perhaps an email to MXA might get you an answer as they know a lot about KTM's.
Grizz wrote:
Couldn't get a free or discounted KTM in 2013 being an ex-pro and all?
You dealer didn't want you on one or what?

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